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ubersuperduper
The Boss

Registered: 09/25/13
Posts: 16
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
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Cultivating Panaeolus cinctulus BRF/spore print?
#18888175 - 09/25/13 08:00 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Hey.
I am new to growing, but I want to give it a go!
Ive been searching around the forum and Ive seen most people cultivating their BRF cakes with syringes that contain the spore in liquid form. Is it possible to cultivate the BRF cakes with a dry spore print? Or maybe make a syringe containing the spores myself?
If its possible with dry spores, how would I go about doing it? One more Question: What temperatures is ideal for growing Panaeolus cinctulus/subbalteatus?
Thanks!
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Esmash
aye Pan Cyan!!!



Registered: 10/13/11
Posts: 558
Loc: the Hot Desert
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Re: Cultivating Panaeolus cinctulus BRF/spore print? [Re: ubersuperduper]
#18888199 - 09/25/13 08:09 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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hello, I think I have heard you need sterile grass seed as spawn. If the spores are wild, you need to use Agar first. I need to find another cinctulus soon so I can attempt growing some indoor cincts too
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MacMerdin
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Re: Cultivating Panaeolus cinctulus BRF/spore print? [Re: ubersuperduper]
#18888572 - 09/25/13 10:07 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
ubersuperduper said: Is it possible to cultivate the BRF cakes with a dry spore print? Or maybe make a syringe containing the spores myself?
The only way I know of to start with dry spores is to use agar. Look up and research agar work if you plan to use dry spores.
You can make a syringe from the spores if you were careful about cleanliness when you took the spore print. Look up and research syringe teks (it's basically just shooting some water over spores and then sucking the water/spore solution back up).
If your spores aren't clean, then you need to work with agar to clean them up. Again, research agar work.
Quote:
One more Question: What temperatures is ideal for growing Panaeolus cinctulus/subbalteatus?
Lower 80's like other pan species would be my guess.
It is possible to make a spore syringe from wild spores if you are clean about it. Here is a pin grown from a wild multispore syringe per my method in my signature.

Unfortunately it aborted because I made the casing too hot (too much lime). I am currently trying to recase them but also am going to start a few new cakes since I know it is possible to at least pin them with my method.
Keep checking my thread in my signature for updates.
Good luck.
Edited by MacMerdin (09/25/13 10:16 AM)
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ubersuperduper
The Boss

Registered: 09/25/13
Posts: 16
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
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Re: Cultivating Panaeolus cinctulus BRF/spore print? [Re: Esmash]
#18890450 - 09/25/13 05:42 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Esmash said: hello, I think I have heard you need sterile grass seed as spawn. If the spores are wild, you need to use Agar first. I need to find another cinctulus soon so I can attempt growing some indoor cincts too 
Would that be the RGS method? Whats the best way to grow Panaeolus cinctulus/subbalteatus? Is it not possible to use the BRF cakes to cultivate with?
MacMerdin, I think ill go for the syringes, seems like the better solution overall. Ill check that link when I can access it (14 days it says).
Thanks!
Edited by ubersuperduper (09/25/13 05:49 PM)
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ubersuperduper
The Boss

Registered: 09/25/13
Posts: 16
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
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Re: Cultivating Panaeolus cinctulus BRF/spore print? [Re: ubersuperduper]
#18892566 - 09/26/13 03:46 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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bump
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MacMerdin
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Re: Cultivating Panaeolus cinctulus BRF/spore print? [Re: ubersuperduper]
#18892675 - 09/26/13 05:06 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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ubersuperduper said: MacMerdin, Ill check that link when I can access it (14 days it says).
Here is the OP so you don't have to wait:
Quote:
I have been successful with the following species: Panaeolus cambodginiensis, Panaeolus cyanescens and Panaeolus tropicalis using the method below. Next up I am going to try Panaeolus cinctulus.
Panaeolus cambodginiensis
 
Panaeolus cyanescens
   
Panaeolus tropicalis
   
I have used both half pint jars and Ziploc half pint plastic bowls.

Both have worked but the Ziploc bowls have more surface area to fruit. One thing about the plastic bowls though. The color of the lids makes it hard to see the holes that you made. How I combat this is to add colored tape (electrical black tape works well) and then poke the holes through the tape.
Mac's Modified PF Recipe:
1 full bowl of dry vermiculite 1 full bowl of store bought manure/humus mix (I bought the Scott's brand) 1 full bowl of water 1 full bowl of whole brown rice (ground to flour with a coffee grinder after measuring) 1/2 bowl of worm castings 1 Tablespoon used Duncan Donuts coffee 1 teaspoon gypsum
* Makes 5 cakes with enough room for a dry verm layer
Top them off with a dry vermiculite layer as usual.
Here are photos of a colonizing Ziploc.
Day 9 after inoculation (it usually takes around 7 days to start seeing good growth for Pans IME):

2 weeks (14 days) after inoculation.
3 to 4 weeks (21-28 days) after inoculation.
As you notice, I keep the foil on the lids for an extra protection sometimes (not needed). I poke air holes (after inoculation and when growth is seen) in the foil that are offset from the inoculation holes in the lids. Plus there is a dry vermiculite layer so it's probably overkill but it works.
Once colonized...wait the week of consolidation time and then comes the fun part.
Take the top off the jar/Ziploc and scrape the dry vermiculite layer out. Don't worry if some myc has grown up into it. It will recover pretty quickly. Just get out what comes out without hurting it too much.
Then, case the cake with 50/50 + pasteurized mix at a thickness of just enough to cover the mycelium and try to even it out as best as you can. Don't worry too much about how even it is....it's not a big deal breaker.
Casing Recipe:
1/2 cup Vermiculite 1/2 cup Peat 1/2 teaspoon Organic Hydrated Lime 1 teaspoon Gypsum
* Makes enough for 5 cakes with some left over
I then place them directly into the SGFC after casing. I have seen people wait 48 hours for recovery but I find it not needed.
Here is the MacMerdin twist: I bury the jars/Ziploc bowls up to the top in the perlite. I figured that since a SGFC works from fresh air coming up through the bottom, I would use this fresh air as my FAE source.
3 days after placing in the FC.
 
5 days after placing in the FC.
 
6 days after placing in the FC.
 
7 days after placing in the FC.
 
As for maintenance of the casing layer and misting/fanning:
Maintenance:
I use a water dropper (child medicine dropper) to drip water on the casing layer to keep it moist (you can directly mist the casing until pins appear if you so choose). Just drop water until it starts to glisten a little and then don't moisten until you see that it has dried a bit more. Usually 1 or 2 times a day is sufficient.
Misting and Fanning:
I mist upwards towards the lid of the SGFC so that only a very fine mist gets blown down around the chamber. Then I fan and mist the same way again.
I have heard misting the pins directly will abort them but they like the fine mist in the air.
Have fun and please feel free to ask questions or comment on how I can improve. 
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ubersuperduper
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Registered: 09/25/13
Posts: 16
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Re: Cultivating Panaeolus cinctulus BRF/spore print? [Re: MacMerdin]
#18893693 - 09/26/13 11:50 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Very nice guide, thaks! I am a total noob tho, please dont bash me! I have some questions on the lingo and other things I dont understand:
1. All pans are the same growing wise? Will this work with Panaeolus cinctulus/subbalteatus?
2. "Mac's Modified PF Recipe", do I have to pressure cook it like the BRF cakes? Or do I just mix it together and its done, put it in jars, top it off with a dry verm layer?
3. No sterilization of the ziplocs?
4. "Day 9 after inoculation" - Inoculate as in put them in a black garb. bag and put it somewhere dark? And for how long do I keep them in the dark for? 3 to 4 weeks (21-28 days)?
5. Case the cake with 50/50 + pasteurized mix, this really confused me. what is the 50/50s made of, and what is the pasteurized mix? I suppose I have to cover the cakes with 2 different types (50/50 coverage) of something, but what? Confused... Follow the recipe, and just smear the cakes with it?
6."I then place them directly into the SGFC after casing", what is SGFC?, is SGFC the case/environment?
7. "FAE source" - What is this?
8. "Maintenance" - u mention a water dropper, Misting and Fanning. Doesn't the perlite take care of all this? Hydrate the perlite and it keeps the environment moist and misted? I just saw that in a shroom grower video, I dont know...
9. Do I need a grow light or any kind of light at all?
Thanks a lot guys!
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MacMerdin
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Re: Cultivating Panaeolus cinctulus BRF/spore print? [Re: ubersuperduper]
#18894019 - 09/26/13 01:25 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
1. All pans are the same growing wise? Will this work with Panaeolus cinctulus/subbalteatus?
Not all pans. So far, I have had 2 cinctulus pins but they aborted. I am still learning if this method works for cincts. But pinning is a good indicator that it will.
Quote:
2. "Mac's Modified PF Recipe", do I have to pressure cook it like the BRF cakes? Or do I just mix it together and its done, put it in jars, top it off with a dry verm layer?
Pressure cook it.
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3. No sterilization of the ziplocs?
The Ziplocs get sterilized when you pressure cook the substrate.
Quote:
4. "Day 9 after inoculation" - Inoculate as in put them in a black garb. bag and put it somewhere dark? And for how long do I keep them in the dark for? 3 to 4 weeks (21-28 days)?
Inoculation means when you shoot the spores into the substrate from your syringe. No need to keep them in the dark. Let them colonize until they are 100% colonized. There is no set time period.
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5. Case the cake with 50/50 + pasteurized mix, this really confused me. what is the 50/50s made of, and what is the pasteurized mix? I suppose I have to cover the cakes with 2 different types (50/50 coverage) of something, but what? Confused... Follow the recipe, and just smear the cakes with it?
50/50+ is just the slang for this specific casing material. It is 50% vermiculite and 50% peat + a little bit of other things. The recipe for the mix is in my OP.
There are a couple ways to pasteurize it......I just use boiling water and soak it until it cools overnight.
Quote:
6."I then place them directly into the SGFC after casing", what is SGFC?, is SGFC the case/environment?
SGFC = Shot Gun Fruiting Chamber
A tub with 1/8-inch holes drilled 2-inches apart on all six sides filled with moist perlite to 4-5 inches.
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7. "FAE source" - What is this?
FAE = Fresh Air Exchange
Quote:
8. "Maintenance" - u mention a water dropper, Misting and Fanning. Doesn't the perlite take care of all this? Hydrate the perlite and it keeps the environment moist and misted? I just saw that in a shroom grower video, I dont know...
Yes and no. The main pinning trigger is evaporation off the casing. This is why we moisten the casing (or mist the casing) and then fan. The misting (or for pans....we drip water on it) re-moistens the casing while the fanning draws the humid, stale air out of the chamber and replaces it with fresh air which will cause the casing to evaporate more.
Quote:
9. Do I need a grow light or any kind of light at all?
A simple 13 watt CFL (compact florescent light) 6500k on a 12/12 cycle will do the job.
Hope this helps.
Edited by MacMerdin (09/26/13 01:28 PM)
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36fuckin5
Alchemycologist


Registered: 08/11/03
Posts: 12,081
Loc: Diving into Mystical Territori...
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Re: Cultivating Panaeolus cinctulus BRF/spore print? [Re: MacMerdin]
#18894244 - 09/26/13 02:17 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Is there something wrong with your search function? Why do you want us to do the searching for you? All your questions have been answered a million times.
I can't stand people who won't read for 5 minutes before asking a question.
-------------------- Redd Foxx said: If you're offended I don't give a shit and don't come see me no more. Pat The Bunny said: A punk rock song won't ever change the world, but I can tell you about a couple that changed me. bodhisatta said: i recommend common sense and figuring it out. These are the TEKs I use. They're all as cheap and easy as possible, just like your mom.
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ubersuperduper
The Boss

Registered: 09/25/13
Posts: 16
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
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Re: Cultivating Panaeolus cinctulus BRF/spore print? [Re: 36fuckin5]
#18899231 - 09/27/13 03:34 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
36fuckin5 said: Is there something wrong with your search function? Why do you want us to do the searching for you? All your questions have been answered a million times.
I can't stand people who won't read for 5 minutes before asking a question.
Thanks a bunch Mac! Really appreciate it!
Sorry u feel that way 36fuck: I have been searching around a lot and trying to find information, but there is so insanely many small things that needs to be perfect for this to work it seems.
Sure I could have searched for those lingo words, and I did do that. I thought there might have been a lingo post on here, but I could not find any... That is why I asked while I was asking a bunch of other questions.
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FaceInHole


Registered: 09/13/11
Posts: 7
Last seen: 5 years, 11 months
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Re: Cultivating Panaeolus cinctulus BRF/spore print? [Re: ubersuperduper]
#19168871 - 11/21/13 07:50 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Yea ubersuperduper Don'r worry about it ... I was glad you asked some of those questions .. knowing that there might be other folks not completely familiar with some of these procedures and/or use of search functions their all a little different .. I seems its protocol around here to bash nobs LOL
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dusttodust


Registered: 11/26/12
Posts: 491
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Re: Cultivating Panaeolus cinctulus BRF/spore print? [Re: ubersuperduper]
#19169317 - 11/21/13 10:30 AM (10 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
ubersuperduper said:
Quote:
36fuckin5 said: Is there something wrong with your search function? Why do you want us to do the searching for you? All your questions have been answered a million times.
I can't stand people who won't read for 5 minutes before asking a question.
Thanks a bunch Mac! Really appreciate it!
Sorry u feel that way 36fuck: I have been searching around a lot and trying to find information, but there is so insanely many small things that needs to be perfect for this to work it seems.
Sure I could have searched for those lingo words, and I did do that. I thought there might have been a lingo post on here, but I could not find any... That is why I asked while I was asking a bunch of other questions.
Than ask where you can find those information. What you are doing is asking people to do work (your work) for you.
http://www.shroomery.org/11324/General-Cultivation http://www.mushroomvideos.com/
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mindchimp
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Re: Cultivating Panaeolus cinctulus BRF/spore print? [Re: MacMerdin]
#26826357 - 07/16/20 05:46 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Im going to try this tek for cyans using the modified PF tek, just found this thread here but its from 6 years ago, just wanting to know if anyone has followed this or made any adjustments in the last few years or this is good to still use this ? Appreciate any pointers
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jcm4620
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Re: Cultivating Panaeolus cinctulus BRF/spore print? [Re: mindchimp]
#26826399 - 07/16/20 06:48 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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you cant go wrong with asuras,jakes, blue helix mary fairchilds and a few others write ups. i also offer a very easy low maint. method that works great also. you can find that linked in my signature belowπ just find one u like that will best suit your environment and your supplies that u may have or u may have to get. but whatever u decide to do just make sure u share all of it hereπππππ
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