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Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,800
Loc: Uncanny Valley
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Re: Woman shot for saying “all lives matter” [Re: Amanita86] 5
#26823086 - 07/14/20 01:27 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Distorted Vision said: So you're saying people aren't actually different colors but society just sees them as black with something other than their eyes?
Skin color is genetic and environmental. Are you saying that skin color makes people violent? If I get a dark tan, will I become more violent?
Skin color isn't the same as race.
Quote:
Amanita86 said: It almost sounds like you’re saying people aren’t accountable for their own actions when you say it like that..
No, that's what racists say. Racists believe that a person is more likely to conduct himself a particular way based on race. That removes responsibility.
I'm saying something far less controversial: People become who they are based on the environment within which they grow up.
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Amanita86
OTD Keymaster


Registered: 09/26/12
Posts: 89,464
Loc: hades
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Re: Woman shot for saying “all lives matter” [Re: The Blind Ass] 1
#26823087 - 07/14/20 01:27 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Asante said:
Quote:
Distorted Vision said:
Did I say their culture is fucked. Yep. And I'll stick with it because it's true.
American white culture could use a touchup with New Car Scent too, just saying.
...
Is there anyone out there getting it right? Just one lone beacon of hope?
--------------------
Orange clock, pencil "They threw me off the hay truck about noon..."
*Mark 15:34  Gam zeh ya’avor...
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,957
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Re: Woman shot for saying “all lives matter” [Re: Enlil]
#26823114 - 07/14/20 01:39 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: Are you saying that skin color makes people violent? If I get a dark tan, will I become more violent?
Melanotan II, side effects may includes old ladies clutching their bags, people locking their cars when you walk by and security personnel following you around in stores.
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,957
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Quote:
Distorted Vision said:
Quote:
Asante said: Loud and clear: If crime statistics alter your attitude towards a race, you are being racist.
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Nonagon Infinity
Mycologist



Registered: 06/02/20
Posts: 756
Loc: Polygondwanaland
Last seen: 3 years, 11 days
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Quote:
Distorted Vision said: BLACK WHITE
POPULATION 13% 76% MURDERS 4,188 5,025
You make them equal 100% to see the difference.
So you 100/13 for blacks. = 7.69
And 100/76 for whites. =1.31
Multiple murders.
Black 7.69 x 4,188 = 32,205 White 1.31 x 5,025 = 6,582
32,205/6,582 = 4.89
No calculation errors.
Quote:
Distorted Vision said: So a black person is almost 5 times more likely to kill a man in the U.S. for that year.
That's where the error is happening. Your calculations do not compute the likelihood that a black person will murder compared to a white person. It's not a mathematical error: it's an error in interpreting the numbers that you're looking at and reasoning about your results. A black person isn't 5 times more likely to murder - the actual number is closer to 1.2 (I showed my math in the previous section).
== POINT 1 == For one matter, you're assuming that the percentage of murders would remain the same if the black population were to increase to the size of the white population. If you don't understand why this assumption is false, consider this hypothetical example:
Suppose there were 10 people in a group. 9 of them have five fingers on each hand, but 1 of them has six fingers on each hand (they're not common, but there are people with such genes). If you're in the group, there is a 10% chance you have six fingers. Now, suppose that we were to increase the total group size to 100 people, randomly selecting the others from all over the world. Could we assume that, since there was a 10% chance of having six fingers before, there will still be a 10% now and, therefore, that there are now 10 people in the group with six fingers? No, because we changed the group. What if all 90 of the new people you randomly added happened to have six fingers? There would then be a 91% chance you have six fingers by being in the group. What if none of the new people you randomly added happened to have six fingers? There would then be a 1% chance you have six fingers by being in the group. Increasing the size of the group by a factor of 10 will potentially change the ratio of six-fingered to five-fingered people.
In your calculations, you are inflating both the black and white populations (the black population by a factor of 7.69 and the white population by a factor of 1.31, so that both populations are the same size). In the case of black people, this means inflating the population from about 41 million to about 315 million. What if none of those 274 million hypothetical people were murderers? Wouldn't that change the overall distribution of murderers within the black population?
Changing the size of a population doesn't necessarily preserve the ratio of members with a certain property within that population. In fact, changing the size of a population can wildly change the distribution of that property, depending on the members added to the group. ====
== POINT 2 == Populations don't need to be the same size in order to compare them. Let's say I have two classes at a school. Class A has 10 students: 5 girls and 5 boys. Class B has 20 students: 5 girls and 15 boys. A student in class A has a 50% chance of being a girl. A student in class B has a 25% chance of being a girl.
In other words, if I randomly select a student from class A, I will have a 50% chance of picking a girl. If I randomly select a student from class B, I will have a 25% chance of picking a girl. The size of each class doesn't matter once I start randomly choosing.
If I randomly select a white American, there's a 44.2% chance they murdered someone in 2017. If I randomly select a black American, there's a 53.1% chance they murdered someone in 2017.
The size of two populations don't need to be the same in order for me to determine the probability of randomly selecting one with a given property from each group. ====
The difference in likelihood of being a murderer between black and white Americans is not nearly as statistically significant as you're saying it is.
-------------------- Nonagon Infinity Opens the Door
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budmanman
OTD Masterbater



Registered: 02/07/07
Posts: 17,982
Loc: PNW
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-------------------- Everything I have ever said is total bogus bs I am full of crud therefore everything I say should never be taken literal. And I am mentally unstable.
Edited by budmanman (07/14/20 01:59 PM)
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,957
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Re: Woman shot for saying “all lives matter” [Re: budmanman] 1
#26823154 - 07/14/20 02:00 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Arrests says nothing.
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
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Nonagon Infinity
Mycologist



Registered: 06/02/20
Posts: 756
Loc: Polygondwanaland
Last seen: 3 years, 11 days
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Re: Woman shot for saying “all lives matter” [Re: Enlil] 1
#26823155 - 07/14/20 02:01 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: Race is a social construct. Race has no biological basis. As a result, any difference between the races must be cultural/societal.
I'm glad someone finally brought this up. This is such an important point in this whole discussion to keep in mind.
There are, indeed, biological differences between people, but where we draw the line between one race and another within that ocean of differences is cultural.
I would also argue that gender is a social construct for pretty much the same reason, but now I'm getting off-topic.
-------------------- Nonagon Infinity Opens the Door
Edited by Nonagon Infinity (07/14/20 02:03 PM)
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budmanman
OTD Masterbater



Registered: 02/07/07
Posts: 17,982
Loc: PNW
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Re: Woman shot for saying “all lives matter” [Re: Asante]
#26823157 - 07/14/20 02:02 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Every body knows courts are racist and let white people off
-------------------- Everything I have ever said is total bogus bs I am full of crud therefore everything I say should never be taken literal. And I am mentally unstable.
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CookieCrumbs
Fucked off to the pub


Registered: 12/10/11
Posts: 14,151
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Re: Woman shot for saying “all lives matter” [Re: The Blind Ass]
#26823175 - 07/14/20 02:11 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
The Blind Ass said:
Quote:
Enlil said:
Quote:
Distorted Vision said:
Quote:
Asante said: Loud and clear: If crime statistics alter your attitude towards a race, you are being racist.
So facts determining things make me racist? Okey dokey.
I treat everyone the same. I might not tell black people that they're violent but that's the only thing different I'll do. And I won't say nigga around black people that I'm not cool with, is that racist too?
Help me Asante.
You're confused here. Race is a social construct. Race has no biological basis. As a result, any difference between the races must be cultural/societal. All your statistics prove is that people who are socially defined as being black are subjected to conditions that are more likely to lead to violent crime.
Finally. Took 8 pages for someone to point it out that important distinction p. It’s so elementary people often forget/miss it. Facts.
Enlils getting shrooms 
I gave him a 0 because he called me a pussy 
And to my credit I tried to make that point. I just worded it badly. Like always.
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Free time is the only time
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Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,800
Loc: Uncanny Valley
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Re: Woman shot for saying “all lives matter” [Re: CookieCrumbs]
#26823189 - 07/14/20 02:16 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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I like the white shrooms as much as the blue ones.
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,957
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Re: Woman shot for saying “all lives matter” [Re: Enlil] 1
#26823192 - 07/14/20 02:18 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Its an honor getting 0 shrooms from some people and highly disturbing if they gave you 5
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The Blind Ass
Bodhi



Registered: 08/16/16
Posts: 26,730
Loc: The Primordial Mind
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Re: Woman shot for saying “all lives matter” [Re: Enlil] 1
#26823194 - 07/14/20 02:18 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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APEs are the best
-------------------- Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps
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Distorted Vision
The best. Of the worst.



Registered: 07/30/09
Posts: 4,292
Loc: Indiana
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Your math is wayy off. You only divide percentages. You don't even factor in the population difference.
My math is correct. It actually factors in the population differences. You have to make the populations the same in the math to make it make sense at all.
I'm not assuming anything. I'm making them both equal to 100% so I can actually work with the numbers.
Your math literally only shows that there were 1.2 more murders in the U.S. done by black people compared to white people. Not the likelihood of either color committing murder.
--------------------
"Yo yo just here to spread my clit and show ya'll what a wonderful and free being we are all inside lets take the acid and turn inside into the outside come on over baby lets smell the roses ohh ohh come on we're about to get lit show my undies to your baby I'll hug it down three times go around frown come on we aint a nice clown kiss me upside down down down come on sorry if you cant handle my wokeness come on lets take her panties off write shroomery on my asshole and taste it lick it make if feel like we was 1978 come on baby lets do the locamotion"-Twig dude
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Distorted Vision
The best. Of the worst.



Registered: 07/30/09
Posts: 4,292
Loc: Indiana
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Re: Woman shot for saying “all lives matter” [Re: Enlil]
#26823257 - 07/14/20 03:01 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said:
Quote:
Distorted Vision said: So you're saying people aren't actually different colors but society just sees them as black with something other than their eyes?
Skin color is genetic and environmental. Are you saying that skin color makes people violent? If I get a dark tan, will I become more violent?
Skin color isn't the same as race. .
Nope. The skin color isn't what makes them violent, it's their culture that makes them violent. That's what I'm saying. Still.
--------------------
"Yo yo just here to spread my clit and show ya'll what a wonderful and free being we are all inside lets take the acid and turn inside into the outside come on over baby lets smell the roses ohh ohh come on we're about to get lit show my undies to your baby I'll hug it down three times go around frown come on we aint a nice clown kiss me upside down down down come on sorry if you cant handle my wokeness come on lets take her panties off write shroomery on my asshole and taste it lick it make if feel like we was 1978 come on baby lets do the locamotion"-Twig dude
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lowbrow
Paddy Time!!!!


Registered: 09/12/08
Posts: 9,711
Last seen: 2 hours, 26 minutes
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Everyone feigns ignorance when per capita comes into play.
-------------------- Amanita86 said: Sui is trying to mod right now. Kinda like a newborn calf tryin ta stand fer the first time ain’t it..
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Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,800
Loc: Uncanny Valley
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You're acting like their culture is different from yours. It's all one culture created by all Americans. A culture that has oppressed people based on arbitrary differences, which has led to people of certain status being more likely to resort to violence
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Distorted Vision
The best. Of the worst.



Registered: 07/30/09
Posts: 4,292
Loc: Indiana
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Re: Woman shot for saying “all lives matter” [Re: lowbrow]
#26823284 - 07/14/20 03:09 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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I understand it's harder for them, I also understand they make it harder on themselves.
--------------------
"Yo yo just here to spread my clit and show ya'll what a wonderful and free being we are all inside lets take the acid and turn inside into the outside come on over baby lets smell the roses ohh ohh come on we're about to get lit show my undies to your baby I'll hug it down three times go around frown come on we aint a nice clown kiss me upside down down down come on sorry if you cant handle my wokeness come on lets take her panties off write shroomery on my asshole and taste it lick it make if feel like we was 1978 come on baby lets do the locamotion"-Twig dude
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Distorted Vision
The best. Of the worst.



Registered: 07/30/09
Posts: 4,292
Loc: Indiana
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Re: Woman shot for saying “all lives matter” [Re: Enlil]
#26823299 - 07/14/20 03:12 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: You're acting like their culture is different from yours. It's all one culture created by all Americans. A culture that has oppressed people based on arbitrary differences, which has led to people of certain status being more likely to resort to violence
If you don't think they have a different culture then you definitely haven't hung out with too many black folks.
--------------------
"Yo yo just here to spread my clit and show ya'll what a wonderful and free being we are all inside lets take the acid and turn inside into the outside come on over baby lets smell the roses ohh ohh come on we're about to get lit show my undies to your baby I'll hug it down three times go around frown come on we aint a nice clown kiss me upside down down down come on sorry if you cant handle my wokeness come on lets take her panties off write shroomery on my asshole and taste it lick it make if feel like we was 1978 come on baby lets do the locamotion"-Twig dude
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Nonagon Infinity
Mycologist



Registered: 06/02/20
Posts: 756
Loc: Polygondwanaland
Last seen: 3 years, 11 days
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Quote:
Distorted Vision said: Your math is wayy off. You only divide percentages. You don't even factor in the population difference.
My math is correct. It actually factors in the population differences. You have to make the populations the same in the math to make it make sense at all.
I'm not assuming anything. I'm making them both equal to 100% so I can actually work with the numbers.
Your math literally only shows that there were 1.2 more murders in the U.S. done by black people compared to white people. Not the likelihood of either color committing murder.
You don't need both population sizes to be equal in order to compare the probability of a randomly selected individual from each population being a murderer, as I explained in detail in my last response to you.
1.2 is the relative likelihood that a black person committed a murder compared to a white person. The likelihood that a randomly selected black person from 2017 committed a murder is 53.1%, the likelihood that a randomly selected white person from 2017 committed a murder is 44.1%.
If you don't understand why you don't need to factor in differences of size in populations when comparing the probability of randomly selecting a murderer from each group, then I don't know how I can help you understand my perspective. We might just have to agree to disagree there.
Quote:
Distorted Vision said: The skin color isn't what makes them violent, it's their culture that makes them violent.
Hmm.. I wonder where one's culture comes from...
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