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InvisibleKmacmo
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: Vahn421]
    #26826685 - 07/16/20 10:25 AM (29 days, 20 hours ago)

That's genius 👩‍🏭👩‍🔬👩‍🔧


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OfflineFreedom
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: Kmacmo]
    #26833691 - 07/20/20 06:22 AM (26 days, 47 minutes ago)

Gender is just what we associate with penis bearing people and vagina bearing people

Like penis bearing people are tough
or vagina bearing people are receptive

its used to categorize people
has been used to organize societies

i think its mostly made up

the gender identity combined with reward and shaming can be used to make people into certain things

like blue collar workers or baby factories


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: Freedom]
    #26833857 - 07/20/20 09:08 AM (25 days, 22 hours ago)

the made up stuff is largely toxic when we forget it is made up


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InvisibleRahz
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: Freedom] * 1
    #26834696 - 07/20/20 05:58 PM (25 days, 13 hours ago)

Quote:

Freedom said:
Gender is just what we associate with penis bearing people and vagina bearing people

Like penis bearing people are tough
or vagina bearing people are receptive

its used to categorize people
has been used to organize societies

i think its mostly made up

the gender identity combined with reward and shaming can be used to make people into certain things

like blue collar workers or baby factories




Penis bearing people, who generally have more testosterone, are generally stronger, more likely to take risks, more likely to use physical violence. There are manipulative qualities that will vary by sex and biochemistry, though coming from very similar brains. Such manipulative behavior could be said to be immature, and certainly that is and has always been true, but same behavior can also be said to affect an individuals mating and material stability.

Through experience and maturity, other apparent qualities may arise where these physical and biochemical properties influence an expression of love and kindness. Males tend to be more protective while females tend to be more nurturing. There are always exceptions, which is why we describe penis and vagina as sexual male/female characteristics while gender is described as masculine/feminine. Masculinity is generally associated with males and vice versa because it's the most common expression. Trying to force sex and gender to be the same for all can traditionally be seen as a product of survival needs (males forcing each other to be tough, females being protected because of the value of their womb). However, when a female is as capable as a man it could be a mistake not to capitalize on it. At the same time, those who can, do, or at least attempt to and many women throughout history have been successful in traditionally male roles. There is less (but not zero) value in the feminine man since he does not have a womb.

But in today's world where technology and government is the "father" these traditional roles do not hold the same value. This could be seen as the reason sexual expression changes at the height of an empire even when technology was not as pronounced, where there are a plethora of wombs, few enemies and wealth has already been concentrated. Sexual expression becomes diverse while at the same time tilting towards a more feminine expression. Even at the height of such events I think males will generally be more masculine and females more feminine, simply because there is a genetic component that doesn't change with the seasons.


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rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


“Everyone's path is different, and that is fine. We either sit or walk.”


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: Rahz]
    #26834766 - 07/20/20 06:36 PM (25 days, 12 hours ago)

one of the big problems is that we jump to conclusions.

for now society needs us to be respectful of others in the way of how they love, which is not our business anyway.

hopefully this makes the complexity of mating more fun and not more problematic.


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InvisibleRahz
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26834807 - 07/20/20 07:12 PM (25 days, 11 hours ago)

I remember disagreeing with you in the needs-vs-wants thread so while I don't entirely agree with you, my personal belief is that love and kindness is a good idea. There are only wants. Needs are ancillary. Humans being human.

:heart:


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rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


“Everyone's path is different, and that is fine. We either sit or walk.”


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: Rahz] * 1
    #26834915 - 07/20/20 08:16 PM (25 days, 10 hours ago)

is this when we exchange numbers?


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OnlineThe Blind Ass
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26834973 - 07/20/20 08:40 PM (25 days, 10 hours ago)

The start to a PS&P love story!

:winning:


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Give me Liberty caps - or -  give me death caps


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InvisibleRahz
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26836565 - 07/21/20 04:51 PM (24 days, 14 hours ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
is this when we exchange numbers?




I only like girls. I'm a bigot. :shrug:


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rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


“Everyone's path is different, and that is fine. We either sit or walk.”


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: Rahz]
    #26836599 - 07/21/20 05:09 PM (24 days, 14 hours ago)

bring 'em!


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OfflineOldnameforgotten
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: Rahz]
    #26837370 - 07/22/20 12:28 AM (24 days, 6 hours ago)

Here is my issue.


I dont give two fucks of a shit who people fuck or what they want to pretend to be.


My issue is that gender and sex is the same word. These movements are changing the definitions of words. I do not like that. My sex is male. My gender is male.


Make a new word for what you want I say. Or just say my sexual preference is X. I think this change of definitions is just to be difficult. Just to have something to bitch about.


Its also going to make a lot of people not receptive to the movement. Because it doesnt make sense.




But it doesnt matter now does it? This movement now has to end with a re-defining of the words Sex and Gender. How stupid is that? Literal semantics being played out on a worldwide scale. And people taking it fucking super seriously like it means something to know the difference between sex and gender.



God I just fucking hate it.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: Oldnameforgotten]
    #26837524 - 07/22/20 04:34 AM (24 days, 2 hours ago)

you think?

you are just resisting understanding and want everyone else to change to your old understanding.

that rigidity is not going to hold up, so let go, it's bigger than any of us.

adapt. evolve.


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OfflineOldnameforgotten
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26837530 - 07/22/20 04:46 AM (24 days, 2 hours ago)

What am I holding on to? The definition of "sex" and "gender"? They are literally synonyms being changed so Trans people can argue semantics.

Its triggering grammar nazi's and making them seem like they are anti-trans. We are arguing semantics on a worldwide scale. Its madness. Absolute madness.



I know theres no backing up now. Because to say the words gender and sex mean the same thing is to be anti-trans. So we HAVE to change the definitions of these words.


They should have just came up with their own wording for shit that already existed in our lexicon.



No one rational is going to argue that trans people cant be trans. Or whatever else there is that people want to do. So we are stuck arguing semantics.


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InvisibleRahz
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: Oldnameforgotten]
    #26837688 - 07/22/20 08:19 AM (23 days, 22 hours ago)

To make it easy, consider a "girly man" as an effeminate male. Gender is never cut and dry, but in this case the gender is leaning toward the feminine while the sex is male.

Some men are more masculine than others. Some women are more masculine than others. It's pretty simple. The terminology has been complicated by making sex and gender synonymous.


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rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


“Everyone's path is different, and that is fine. We either sit or walk.”


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: Rahz]
    #26837725 - 07/22/20 08:50 AM (23 days, 22 hours ago)

I am much more bothered by people who spell badly and use grammar improperly.
however, if I sweat when I hear the subjunctive abused, I have learned to keep it to myself. usually.

it's not easy being green.  :catfrog:


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InvisibleKmacmo
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Registered: 08/14/19
Posts: 772
Loc: Upinthehills
Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26837950 - 07/22/20 10:33 AM (23 days, 20 hours ago)

I agree that we must adapt and evolve, that's what we've been doing all along.
Why can't people just be who they are without putting a label on themselves?
I'm sure there was many trans folk in the past, all be it they got shunned by society but no one ever has questioned the male/female system that Is a universal language.
They should make a new word instead of making gender and sex synonymous, as mentioned above.

We can choose any word we like and that's our gender, if everyone on the planet added their new unique title to their name it would be chaos. Having to learn a new unique word for every person and if you fuck up and call them wrongly then your ass is going to prison for being offensive.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: Kmacmo]
    #26838173 - 07/22/20 12:11 PM (23 days, 18 hours ago)

that's a mixed up interpretation - you do not go to prison for not knowing another person's sexual or gender or ability, and making the wrong assumption, what you do go to court for, is if you step on another person's rights to fair access to goods and services.

so if you are selling advice you have to use the right terms when you do know what they are. and if you keep forgetting you may get interest charges to boot.


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OfflineOldnameforgotten
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: Rahz]
    #26838607 - 07/22/20 03:25 PM (23 days, 15 hours ago)

Quote:

Rahz said:
To make it easy, consider a "girly man" as an effeminate male. Gender is never cut and dry, but in this case the gender is leaning toward the feminine while the sex is male.

Some men are more masculine than others. Some women are more masculine than others. It's pretty simple. The terminology has been complicated by making sex and gender synonymous.





Do you not see how what youre arguing is the definition of a word and not any context?

You are arguing semantics. Also youre wrong on them. In 1950 Sex and Gender meant the same thing.

The girly mans sex is male. The girly mans gender is male.




I am fully aware though that in this society we live in... the outrage from this simple change of definition.... will end with a reconstruction of what the words sex and gender mean. This bowing down and doing whatever offends less people is silly when it comes to literally re-defining words.

Sex MEANS Gender. They are literally the same.


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OfflineVahn421
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: Oldnameforgotten]
    #26838615 - 07/22/20 03:30 PM (23 days, 15 hours ago)

I had a transgender woman once ask me to explain any differences between a man and a woman. Any one specific thing.

You point to the basics like "women can have children, they have breasts and ovaries."

The common rebuttal is "not ALL women can have children does it make them less of a woman?"

This kind of got me confused... "less of a woman?"

So then I asked him/her: "Ok you tell ME. What makes a woman a woman then, because YOU want to BE one... so what IS the difference? Clearly there IS one to you SOMETHING defines it, right? Otherwise you wouldn't want to BE a woman.... right?"

They had no answer beyond feelings like "it feels like me."

I'm still trying to figure it out.


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Edited by Vahn421 (07/22/20 03:32 PM)


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OfflineKickleM
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Re: Transgenders, genders, sex... what's it all about? [Re: Oldnameforgotten]
    #26838880 - 07/22/20 05:29 PM (23 days, 13 hours ago)

Quote:

Oldnameforgotten said:
Quote:

Rahz said:
To make it easy, consider a "girly man" as an effeminate male. Gender is never cut and dry, but in this case the gender is leaning toward the feminine while the sex is male.

Some men are more masculine than others. Some women are more masculine than others. It's pretty simple. The terminology has been complicated by making sex and gender synonymous.





Do you not see how what youre arguing is the definition of a word and not any context?

You are arguing semantics. Also youre wrong on them. In 1950 Sex and Gender meant the same thing.

The girly mans sex is male. The girly mans gender is male.




I am fully aware though that in this society we live in... the outrage from this simple change of definition.... will end with a reconstruction of what the words sex and gender mean. This bowing down and doing whatever offends less people is silly when it comes to literally re-defining words.

Sex MEANS Gender. They are literally the same.




Just FYI since you think what language has represented in the past is important:

"In Old English they have 3 genders (masculine, neuter, feminine). [...] Note that the so-called "genders" were purely grammatical genders - they very often did not correspond to natural gender. For example the word ƿīf - "woman" is actually of the neuter (grammatical) gender, not the feminine (natural gender)."

https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Old_English/Nouns

This is referring to, similarly to how modern romance languages still maintain, a gender identity for nouns. It's confusing on many fronts and a matter of memorization as opposed to something that can be seen or identified otherwise. The word for woman is not itself a feminine word in old english? A bit confusing isn't it? At one point that had some significance. Now it just seems so bizarre IMO. Some probably found it bizarre sooner than others. And there's probably someone out there who wants to maintain those standards because they think they are critical for understanding while the rest have moved on to understanding our current words with context.


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