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Invisibletrippymang69
Trippy Mang

Registered: 03/26/19
Posts: 11
Loc: PNW
Electrically stimulating mycelium for increased fruiting yields
    #26805723 - 07/05/20 06:14 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

I was going to respond to ZOMan on this thread: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5052909/fpart/3/vc/1#5052909
but i decided to just start a new one.

ZOMan posted this link to a paper about applying various bursts of electrical shocks to logs, sawdust blocks, and agar to increase fruiting yields. The idea comes from lighting strikes which have been reported to increase mushroom yields in the surrounding area.

Paper: https://www.intechopen.com/books/physical-methods-for-stimulation-of-plant-and-mushroom-development/high-voltage-methods-for-mushroom-fruit-body-developments

"This result indicates that the mushroom species employed in the experiment usually does not develop fruit bodies. However, the yield from the first season increased from 2 to 73 g when a 50 kV pulsed voltage is applied. The yield increased from 73 to 153 g when the number of pulses increased from 1 to 50."

So the yield goes from non existent that season to big when you apply one shock of 50kv and triple that when you apply that voltage 50x over time. And later it says over 4 seasons the harvest was double for the groups with electricity applied- 500 and 100kv.



Here is an awesome graft depicting what they found.

Caption:

"Total weight of cultured L. edodes for various electrical stimulation conditions. The total yield are 167, 322, 319, 243 and 317 g for control, 50 kV-1 time, 100 kV-1 time, 125 kV-1 time and 50 kV-50 times, respectively [3]."

It seems the damage from the shock promotes rapid fruiting as a result, with bigger fruits accompanying more frequent shocks, but a faster burn out over 4 seasons.

Whats most exciting to me is that some of the best results are from a single shock. Im thinking you could do a soak and run the electricity through the water for fast large (or small) scale application. It could work for all kinds of substrates. They also mention a variety of positively effected mushrooms in the paper, including P. Microspora which is known to eat polyurethane.

It looks like people already sell these devices, the authors suggest they cost $5000 but i cannot find anything like it for sale with a simple google search. Im not great with electricity, does anyone have any idea how realistic a DIY rig would be to test that kind of voltage?


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InvisibleShroomymancer
Copy Cat
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Registered: 10/20/17
Posts: 485
Re: Electrically stimulating mycelium for increased fruiting yields [Re: trippymang69]
    #26805943 - 07/05/20 08:41 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Interesting read. Made me think about stun guns as a cheap testing solution. Would those work? Most of them are wildly exaggerated but several can reach 25,000 volts which is half of what was tested in the article.

Does the mycelium carry the current through its network? Could you just shock your sub with a taser?:lol:


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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Registered: 04/30/13
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Re: Electrically stimulating mycelium for increased fruiting yields (moved) [Re: trippymang69]
    #26806219 - 07/06/20 04:59 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

This thread was moved from Advanced Mycology.

Reason:
Brought up once a week. If the post is going in advanced it should be because you're trying it.


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Invisibletrippymang69
Trippy Mang

Registered: 03/26/19
Posts: 11
Loc: PNW
Re: Electrically stimulating mycelium for increased fruiting yields [Re: Shroomymancer]
    #26807174 - 07/06/20 02:30 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Thats a great idea and exactly what im looking for. Ill check out taser voltages and think about the best way to test it. Its really weird (and sketchy) that this idea seems old as time but has been implemented on a large scale across the industry- definitely tempers my expectation. Ive found a bit about people talking about using tasers without great results on a brief test on one old forum post, and some other folks talking about it, but nobody that i can find has done solid testing with it. If anyone has seen that id love to take a look. Im also curious what might be even stronger but still usable/affordable for this application.


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InvisibleShroomymancer
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Posts: 485
Re: Electrically stimulating mycelium for increased fruiting yields [Re: trippymang69]
    #26807898 - 07/06/20 08:44 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

I'm not much of an electrician first off but one thing that really transfers a lightning strike through the ground is roots. In a forest they all criss cross and intertwine and the mycelium is in there too. My first guess is that shocking the sub literally by touching the taser wouldn't simulate the desired effect but I could be wrong.  Something that carried the current throughout ( metal mesh or small wires) that simulated the root/lightning effect maybe. Electricity always looks for a ground so the sub or sub wires might have to have a ground somewhere. This could be an area where people have tried and failed or didn't get results.


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Offlinemcnugget
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Registered: 06/22/13
Posts: 261
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Re: Electrically stimulating mycelium for increased fruiting yields [Re: Shroomymancer]
    #26809025 - 07/07/20 12:51 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Saw this guy on IG hitting a cubensis tub with an electric cattle prod. :facepalm:

At least 2/3rds of the tub had already been cut away from contams and the fruits that were left on it were almost mature. :doublefacepalm:

I laughed so hard I cried.


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Invisibletrippymang69
Trippy Mang


Registered: 03/26/19
Posts: 11
Loc: PNW
Re: Electrically stimulating mycelium for increased fruiting yields [Re: Shroomymancer]
    #26809171 - 07/07/20 01:56 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

mcnugget said:
Saw this guy on IG hitting a cubensis tub with an electric cattle prod. :facepalm:

At least 2/3rds of the tub had already been cut away from contams and the fruits that were left on it were almost mature. :doublefacepalm:

I laughed so hard I cried.




Yeah im not surprised they didnt get amazing results lol. That sounds pretty stupid, and a cattle prod is similar to a taser with less voltage and amperage so essentially worse when comparing to what ive read that allegedly 'works'. By the way, nice meme/emoji thing there. double facepalm lol...

Quote:

Shroomymancer said:
I'm not much of an electrician first off but one thing that really transfers a lightning strike through the ground is roots. In a forest they all criss cross and intertwine and the mycelium is in there too. My first guess is that shocking the sub literally by touching the taser wouldn't simulate the desired effect but I could be wrong.  Something that carried the current throughout ( metal mesh or small wires) that simulated the root/lightning effect maybe. Electricity always looks for a ground so the sub or sub wires might have to have a ground somewhere. This could be an area where people have tried and failed or didn't get results.




Considering electricity is conductive through water and that makes up a majority of mycelium and its surrounding substrate im not really worried about the electricity penetrating. Having a ground may be important though, and is probably very important for safety reasons.

My understanding is that the voltage is what allows it to penetrate a non conductive material ei. tasers have very high voltage so they can zap someone even if they are wearing a thick leather jacket that would prevent a low voltage shock from penetrating. Its the amps that generally provide the intesity of shock, and tasers have very low amperage, like 500mA or less than one amp. cattle prods have lower volts cause there is less resistance to penetrate and lower amps because its supposed to be a less intense shock.

Lightning has 300,000,000 volts and 30,000 amps if i remember correctly, so obviously we are talking two completely different ballparks, and no one in their right mind is trying to zap their shit with that much power. 50,000kV-100,000kV (and higher) is what is reported as effective, but i cant figure out the associated amps to attempt to replicate it. In the paper there is a section that is about the electrical system used but its over my head. As you can tell i dont have a deep understanding of electricity. I would love to ask someone who knew more about it but unfortunately none of my friends are accomplished electricians.


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