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SirTripAlot
Semper Fidelis



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Re: The Minimum Wage Machine [Re: Vahn421]
#26809450 - 07/07/20 04:48 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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A large section of the economy consists of excess capital and "wasteful" spending, without it = smaller economy (that is, if nothing to scale were to replace it i.e. "smart purchases "). Say goodbye to investments.
Owed? What obligation are you referring to? Would it be wrong for me to collect a tax refund.... or are there certain exceptions?
-------------------- “I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
Edited by SirTripAlot (07/07/20 04:54 PM)
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R.I.P.Zappa
Myco Melyco


Registered: 03/30/18
Posts: 1,212
Loc: In Between Space and Time
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Re: The Minimum Wage Machine [Re: SirTripAlot]
#26809560 - 07/07/20 05:48 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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People gonna be hating but,,,,,
It is not how much you make, it is how you spend it and yeah, when one of your 5 employers bitch, "shit,,, I only got 60k back in taxes this year", mean while all us meat cutters look at each other then laugh in his face and and remind him that's twice of what we make in a whole fucking year and we only get 1.5k back in taxes!!! Lets just say the old man had to remind him to keep his fucking mouth shut around us employees, it's pretty neat working side by side with your employers; you get to learn how essential you really are to them.
There is a fucking problem with the income disparity in this country and more importantly financial illiteracy because that guy claims hes broke all the time.
There is a good logical reason home economics was taken out of high school instead of sports, america's elite don't want financially literate consumers.
How many irresponsible businesses got bailed out again this year?? What ever happened to having a 6 month emergency fund!?!? Oh yeah that's right, that football jersey, gucchi cock ring, that cabin on the lake or yacht was more important. 
I would love to see minimum wage raised, more cash for me to invest, but here lies the problem,,, what good is having more money if you don't know how to use it in the first place?
It's like giving a dope fiend money for food.
-------------------- -The heaviest thing one will ever carry is a thought- -"Like a Blind man In an orgy you gotta feel things out.".- -When we agree about our hallucinations, we call it “reality".- -If you defy authority because your told to, that's no better than blindly trusting authority.- psychonautwiki.org How it should & shouldn't look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE BOD's Easy AF OAT prep tek. Principles of mushroom growing for beginners
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qman
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Re: The Minimum Wage Machine [Re: R.I.P.Zappa] 1
#26809595 - 07/07/20 06:08 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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So instead of addressing low wage workers with real solutions, this thread has turned into how to manage living in dire poverty in the US (richest nation in human history). Talk about giving up on the concept of providing a livable wage in short order. 
Here's a solution- bring back manufacturing jobs from the slave labor nations that US relocated the past 40 years!!!!
How about controlling our immigration?
How about providing universal health care like every other developed nation does in the world?
Instead, it's learn to live like a third world migrant in your own homeland to manage yourself for the benefit of the very wealthy.
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MightyWhite

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Re: The Minimum Wage Machine [Re: Asante]
#26810202 - 07/08/20 02:35 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Asante said:
Should minimum wage stay put, be raised or should basic income for all be realized?
A higher wage isn't just given, it's earned. People seem to overlook this. By starting at a high wage, it takes away the incentive to be more productive or advance.
UBI only for physically or mentally disabled people that can't work like the rest of us
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The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


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Re: The Minimum Wage Machine [Re: bodhisatta]
#26810474 - 07/08/20 07:03 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
bodhisatta said:
Quote:
The Ecstatic said:
Quote:
Vahn421 said: Minimum wage exists for 16 year olds.
If you're still making minimum as an adult, you haven't developed any actual life skills, so go stop playing video games and learn a talent.
What an ignorant statement.
[image]https://external-preview.redd.it/E0Pu_yZ6wlQSwkh9R46xOTf_fFSI6BEiuA0cVAY0hv8.png?auto=webp&s=2c015d3b37c09ff6e038fc6e9f]
Not ignorant at all. Those 35 year olds suck. They're the kind of people that quit day one because putting bottles in a box and then onto a pallet is too hard. Meanwhile people who don't speak English that are twice that age happily do it. I can afford to give those people raises because the 35 year old deadbeat fuck gets the floor wage.
You ask most people that make 7.25 if they want to have more responsibilities at work and they say NO 
What does any of that have to do with the minimum wage?
We should keep wages low because there are lazy people out there?
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Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
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As much as I'm against minimum wage, his argument seems to ignore the fact that if someone is lazy, an employer can simply fire him/her and pay zero.
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The Ecstatic
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Re: The Minimum Wage Machine [Re: Enlil]
#26810527 - 07/08/20 07:50 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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The minimum wage is analogous to welfare for some.
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Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
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Loc: Uncanny Valley
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I'm not against welfare. I'm against minimum wage. The key difference between the two is that welfare is a government funded program created by the government to promote stability of the society. Minimum wage is the government forcing terms on the contract between two citizens.
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The Ecstatic
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Re: The Minimum Wage Machine [Re: Enlil] 1
#26810536 - 07/08/20 07:55 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Eh, if you accept the necessity of state coercion you should be alright with the state mandating labor standards imo.
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Savantfou
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I live in mama basement and minimum wage is good. I think rising it is not a long term solution only a short term one. UBI is a long term solution.
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Enlil
OTD God-King




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By that logic, I should accept concentration camps.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: The Minimum Wage Machine [Re: Vahn421]
#26810925 - 07/08/20 12:27 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Vahn421 said: ...hiking the minimum wage is just going to once again raise the cost of living. It always does.
According to various studies (this article is also referenced by the libertarian Cato Institute):
Quote:
Despite the different methodologies, data periods and data sources, most studies found that a 10% US minimum wage increase raises food prices by no more than 4% and overall prices by no more than 0.4%.
A 10% minimum wage increase for an overall 0.4% price increase seems VERY reasonable to me.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: The Minimum Wage Machine [Re: MightyWhite]
#26810926 - 07/08/20 12:29 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
MightyWhite said: A higher wage isn't just given, it's earned. People seem to overlook this. By starting at a high wage, it takes away the incentive to be more productive or advance.
So you're saying people who earn their companies more than their minimum wage co-workers won't get paid more? Of course they would.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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nooneman


Registered: 04/24/09
Posts: 14,561
Loc: Utah
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Re: The Minimum Wage Machine [Re: Asante]
#26810994 - 07/08/20 01:31 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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We should make the production of all necessary goods and services so cheap that the current minimum wage is an absolute fortune and can easily buy everything that anyone would need.
If you drove the cost of housing down to near zero, and the cost of food and electricity, then minimum wage would become a fortune just by staying put. In fact, if you lowered the cost of all goods in an extreme amount then you could actually lower minimum wage and still provide everyone with a higher standard of living than they have now. Eventually, if you lowered the cost of goods enough, you could provide everyone with everything they need for such a small amount of money that even the tiniest universal income guaranteed by the government would be a fortune.
In order to do that, you'd have to build absolutely massive automated factories that can produce arbitrary goods in extremely large quantities, and also automate the mining/production of the necessary materials that the goods require on a large scale, and likewise automate the construction of buildings and houses at scale. By automating the entire production chain from collection of raw materials all the way through house construction, and by making that automation work on a vast scale, you could drive the cost of all goods and housing into the ground.
That's currently a bit beyond our technology level, but it's not that far beyond it. If people worked at it seriously, you could make some real progress. It's not totally science fiction, you could realistically build all the things required to do something like this. It'd just take a hell of a lot of work and engineering.
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The Ecstatic
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Re: The Minimum Wage Machine [Re: Enlil] 1
#26811206 - 07/08/20 03:40 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: By that logic, I should accept concentration camps.
I mean maybe for some people.
My point being if you’re of the opinion that the state’s monopoly on violence is necessary to promote a functional society, mandating labor standards isn’t such a wild leap outside of that scope.
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oculodextro

Registered: 04/10/13
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What about all the people who went to college, hold worthless degrees?
You're told as a kid you have to go to college, when you get there you better choose the right degree or your gonna be sitting on debt you'll never pay off at your minimum wage job.
I think some of you older guys don't realize how different the world is.
My parents generation could work at a factory and afford a home, cars, and luxury goods. Now you need to live somewhere with low cost of living to maybe get some of the luxuries the generations did before us?
I'm financially sound and in a great situation, but I know if I was in the same situation 20 years ago, I would of retired by now.
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Kryptos
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Re: The Minimum Wage Machine [Re: nooneman] 1
#26811481 - 07/08/20 06:16 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
nooneman said: We should make the production of all necessary goods and services so cheap that the current minimum wage is an absolute fortune and can easily buy everything that anyone would need.
It already is.
The only reason shit is expensive is because there's a long chain of paper pushers taking their cut along the way. And I don't mean regulations, I mean literal bullshit paper pushers. The guy that takes numbers from one excel file, copies them into another excel file, and takes a 60k a year salary because they're a "professional".
Oh, and shareholders. Shareholders need their cut too. And they need a big cut, we're talking like 50%.
This is why the actual farmer only gets 6% of the price that you pay at the store. Another 5-10% of the price is transportation costs, depending on factors like refrigeration, and then 50% goes to the shareholders that sit on their ass and make money by virtue of having enough money, and 30% goes to the 40 year old dude that fights tooth and nail against hiring a college student because they know the college student can figure out how to automate their job in a single afternoon. Maybe there's a 5% off sale at the end to get your ass in the door.
Artificial scarcity is a way of life in the US.
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Asante
Mage


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Re: The Minimum Wage Machine [Re: MightyWhite] 1
#26812108 - 07/09/20 05:14 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
MightyWhite said:
Quote:
Asante said:
Should minimum wage stay put, be raised or should basic income for all be realized?
A higher wage isn't just given, it's earned. People seem to overlook this.
Minimum wage correcting for inflation isn't just a given, its a right. America seems to overlook this.
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
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oculodextro

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Re: The Minimum Wage Machine [Re: Asante]
#26812330 - 07/09/20 08:21 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Is the minimum wage, currently keeping up with inflation?
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: The Minimum Wage Machine [Re: oculodextro] 1
#26812402 - 07/09/20 09:11 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Not even close. It used to be the equivalent of over $12/hr in 1968:
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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