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Rumpleforeskin
Scientist new to mycology


Registered: 07/05/20
Posts: 82
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Build out plan for basement production
#26804529 - 07/05/20 01:52 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Hi folks.
I have a basement with three rooms.
Planned lab space is ~8'x10' Incubation space is ~12'x12' Fruiting space is ~12'x10'
Questions I currently have are:
General: Is one pressure cooker (21-23 qt) enough to make this work? Two?
Incubation: -Mason jars vs spawn bags? -Will humidity in the room be quite high (I have laminate flooring down)? -Will it need heating or will the mycelium be enough? -Should I be using totes for making larger mycelium mats (see fruiting ideas)? -Plan on using a 4" exhaust fan on negative pressure to manage CO2 levels for safety.
Fruiting: -If the entire space is wrapped in poly and i use a larger built out humidifier, do I need totes at all, or can i just lay mycelium lats down on some black poly (related to incubation question)? -Required lumens per square foot? If I have racks with three levels, would led light strips be best on each level? -Size of humidifier? Does a 12 disk ultrasonic humidifier be sufficient if an exhaust fan (8"?) is running for 1-2 total exchanges every 5 min? -Does this sound like room much space if I'm just using one or two pressure cookers and then pasteurizing in a tote connected to a pressure cooker (Willy Myco Tek)?
Thanks for any input. Most of the comments and design plans I'vefound are for smaller closet style builds. I'd like to produce more than that and I'm trying to find a practical and relatively cost effective approach.
Mush Love.
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Spirit-Crusher
DOOM HIPPIE


Registered: 04/24/19
Posts: 358
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Rumpleforeskin]
#26804569 - 07/05/20 02:50 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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ha one pressure cooker. Maybe you should start a little smaller and get a system down before going all in on something that you obviously have not researched all that well.
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pablokabute
Hari ng Amag



Registered: 11/22/11
Posts: 5,173
Loc: rural ghetto
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Spirit-Crusher]
#26804600 - 07/05/20 04:24 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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All I can say is. Yes 21-23qt PC can fill all that space with tonnage of mushrooms.
Before you start diving headfirst, the only thing I wanna advise you of is MASTER YOUR AGAR skills.
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Fermented Mushrooms!! --- https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23378638/fpart/1/vc/1 'The second seal: “All CONTAMINATED things and events are unsatisfactory.”' "I envy you. You North Americans are very lucky. You are fighting the most important fight of all - you live in THE HEART OF THE BEAST." --Anonymous Guerilla, or is he..
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Je77Ce11ar



Registered: 01/09/19
Posts: 244
Last seen: 4 months, 5 days
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Spirit-Crusher]
#26804605 - 07/05/20 04:36 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Spirit-Crusher said: ha one pressure cooker. Maybe you should start a little smaller and get a system down before going all in on something that you obviously have not researched all that well.
Seriously, what you're talking about building and to the extent that you're talking about is easily a several thousand dollar project...take 6-9 months first and run through a bunch of tubs and learn your craft
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redhandmat
Dude


Registered: 05/09/19
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Je77Ce11ar]
#26804610 - 07/05/20 04:53 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Whats your experience level on shrooms anyways?
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,890
Loc: Milky way
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: redhandmat]
#26804690 - 07/05/20 06:34 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Don't even bother building a space until you do really good at growing mushrooms out of your kitchen and living room
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Rumpleforeskin
Scientist new to mycology



Registered: 07/05/20
Posts: 82
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Spirit-Crusher]
#26805174 - 07/05/20 12:31 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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I'm totally open to ramping the space up. I'm here looking for guidance more than mockery though. I'll take that as a no then. Thanks for the response.
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Rumpleforeskin
Scientist new to mycology



Registered: 07/05/20
Posts: 82
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Je77Ce11ar]
#26805192 - 07/05/20 12:39 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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I'm aware of this. I can ramp up production slowly. The planned fruiting rom is currently being utilized for cannabis cutting production. I'e got a budget of ~20k if needed but would like to manage costs reasonably.
If you guys are suggesting phased approach, then perhaps dividing the planned incubation room in half?
I'm a scientist with a strong biological background. I haven't produced mushrooms before, but tend to pick up on things fairly quickly. I understand that there will be growing pains and fails along the way. I've got extensive experience in indoor cannabis production on a fairly high tech scale. I understand climatic control etc.
Based on what you're saying, I should use tubs. I was watching a Willie Myco video and when he was talking about a tenth build, he suggested that you could take the whole mycelial mat and lay it out on the rack.
To me, it's appealing as buying 100 totes seems crazy and I thought there must be a better way. However, contamination on a mat (pardon my terminology) in an open area seems like it could trash the whole fruit room.
Thanks for your concern man.
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Rumpleforeskin
Scientist new to mycology



Registered: 07/05/20
Posts: 82
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: pablokabute]
#26805200 - 07/05/20 12:43 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Thanks. Yes, the agar skills are a key component of this. I'm pricing out a laminar flow hood tomorrow and then determining whether to buy or build. I figure I can build out the lab first and then sort that out before moving to the incubation space.
So you're saying that one 21-23 qt pressure cooker will so enough spawn grain to support that space on a consistent cycle? It'd be nice to be not running a PC all day every day. I intended on using if for pasteurization as well.
Cheers.
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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,623
Loc: Canada
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Rumpleforeskin] 1
#26805209 - 07/05/20 12:46 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Don't pay attention to anything Willie myc has to say about cultivation. Bod wasn't mocking you he was giving good advice. Run some tubs before you get carried away, you don't even need a special space to grow many pounds of cubes, all you need is a bedroom.
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Rumpleforeskin
Scientist new to mycology



Registered: 07/05/20
Posts: 82
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
#26805219 - 07/05/20 12:50 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Mushrooms, I pick outside and have consumed a lot.
As mentioned earlier, I'm a scientist not a myclologist), with extensive experience cultivating indoor cannabis.
Yes its a big move, yes there will be fails.
Looking for information and support everywhere. This build isn't going into full swing tomorrow, but I'm interested in doing something more than a tote in my closet.
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Rumpleforeskin
Scientist new to mycology



Registered: 07/05/20
Posts: 82
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: bodhisatta]
#26805230 - 07/05/20 12:53 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Thanks for the feedback.
This doesn't all need to happen at once, so any advice on phasing in production would be awesome. I have a good friend that has been producing ~5lb a week for the last 20 years. He's just so busy that I can't get in to see him and have a look.
As i suggested earlier, I can pause in production and divide my incubation room in half and do everything in there. I just sense a challenge in managing temps in the same room and keeping the ~10 degree spread. I thought a separate space would be more efficient and have two separate exhausts running to manage CO2 and heat.
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Rumpleforeskin
Scientist new to mycology



Registered: 07/05/20
Posts: 82
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
#26805235 - 07/05/20 12:55 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Thanks.
Any advice is welcome. I'm coming into this humbly but nonetheless ambitiously. So a buildout on the lab space first and divide the incubation room up? Maybe insulate a closet and incubate in there and then fruit in the rest of the space? That way my partner can keep the clone space going.
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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,623
Loc: Canada
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Rumpleforeskin]
#26805239 - 07/05/20 12:56 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Do whatever you want but if you're asking the kind of questions posted here you likely won't be able to even pull off a single tub. Mock the tub system all you like but there are cultivators on this site who grow 100s of pounds in tubs in no special space other than a room that will house them and maintain temperature.
Plant cultivation skills have zero correlation to mush cultivation, you might as well say that you're an experienced shoe shiner and you just know that as a result you'll be pulling of an industrial grow in no time
You started this thread for advice and received the same advice from multiple people including a moderator who is also a trusted cultivator. Sounds like you don't like the advice so go ahead and do it your own way like every noob that ever noobed and you'll find out for yourself, it's the best way to learn anyways.
Edit* You may be an intelligent guy, you may have a knack for sterile technique and have some lab experience that will have overlap, that being said you have to develop an entirely unique set of skills that require experience and failure to hone. You may have the most expensive facilities and the nicest gear but they won't tell you when to increase or decrease FAE,nor will you know when your plates or grains are ready for expansion while being certain that there aren't any hidden contamination. There are so many different skills that need to be developed that it's just not reasonable to pursue such a large project without having developed that sense that comes from exposure to these experiences.
Now if you had of said "hey, I grow gourmet's and would love to get into large scale production of actives" well that would be entirely different for obvious reasons. Coming in here claiming to be something as painfully vague as a "scientist" while asking to be spoon fed the wealth of knowledge required to be an effective cultivator... for an average noob it's typical however for a "scientist"....well it's lame.
Edited by Stipe-n Cap (07/05/20 01:22 PM)
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Rapjack
Oat Soakin' Toker


Registered: 05/15/17
Posts: 483
Loc: Elsewhere
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Rumpleforeskin]
#26805280 - 07/05/20 01:17 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Rumpleforeskin said:. So you're saying that one 21-23 qt pressure cooker will so enough spawn grain to support that space on a consistent cycle? It'd be nice to be not running a PC all day every day. I intended on using if for pasteurization as well.
Cheers.
You'll want a lot more sterilizer space and some way to control them automatically. I've seen builds for Raspberry Pi DIY controllers on the gourmet boards for both Prestos (via hotplate) and 55 gal low pressure drum sterilizers as well as prebuilt drum sterilizers for sale online. Roger Rabbit has blueprints as well on his website. Many people here use All American 75x's plugged into a digital timer which in my opinion is the simplest solution albeit lower capacity than a drum. I'd recommend hitting up Youtube and checking out some of the small scale commercial gourmet growers that have channels on there. You can see the different ways people do things as well as what's pretty standard.
As for the skepticism from initial posters... The mush cult board is full of newbies trying to run before they walk so folks are wary. It might be better to ask build questions on the gourmet board because of that. That being said Bod has a great point in that it's best to start with just a few tubs at first. You seem a lot more serious than a regular newbie so I'm sure you'll meet your goals after not too long.
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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,623
Loc: Canada
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Rapjack]
#26805291 - 07/05/20 01:25 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Lol, all of that and he hasn't even surpassed the "hey is this blue spot on my cake contamination?" Phase yet. Much lelz.
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redhandmat
Dude


Registered: 05/09/19
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
#26805303 - 07/05/20 01:32 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Hmm yes no one is mocking you mate, and no one wants you to fail just for the hell of it. We have nothing to win by you losing or the other way around. I think that it is a sound strategy to have a few growth under your belt before going all in, and Im a total noob. Actually, when I was writing my original comment (before you gave any info on your cannabis experience) I started describing how I had some experience with cannabis grows but then I didn't want to say much before hearing on your experience level first. What I wanted to say was that I too had some thoughts that it would be like weed. But its not. Its truly not.
One, and maybe more, of the guys replying to you in this threads have hundreds if not more grows and are giving you some really good advice. You can still grow a lot of mushrooms without taking to the scale you are thinking about. You can grow from prints to spawning to shoeboxes or monos within 2 months. As an example this is a nice thread on how to run 9-10 set and forget shoeboxes that dont take much space and weekly harvests (SFF Factory Tek). Seems to my noob self to be a good way to get a feeling on running an operation like thins and get some needed experience under your belt.
But dude, to be frank I think you should take the humble road and listen to people that know so you may learn. Would suck for you to post here and be like: all my tubs are dead, what to do?
Edited by redhandmat (07/05/20 01:38 PM)
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AtmozFear
just a shade of myself


Registered: 01/25/19
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
#26805316 - 07/05/20 01:42 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
p9hu7 said: Plant cultivation skills have zero correlation to mush cultivation
So true. Plant kingdom - fungi kingdom... split down two paths of nominclature from the first tier of classification. Like raising a dog and raising a python.
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Rumpleforeskin
Scientist new to mycology



Registered: 07/05/20
Posts: 82
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
#26805322 - 07/05/20 01:46 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Hey Man,
I'm not upset or mocking anything. I have basic lab skills and understand that science behind mushroom cultivation. I do not claim to be a know it all. I'm happy to start with a few tubs and go from there. I'm well aware that mushroom cultivation and cannabis cultivation are completely different.
The advice I'm getting is of course valuable, and helpful for me. I'm in early planning stages of this project, and have time to work on it. I'm and environmental scientist that has working in biological field for 13 years. I"m not telling you this because I think I'm a know it all, I"m doing this to provide you with some background of my skill set.
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Rapjack
Oat Soakin' Toker


Registered: 05/15/17
Posts: 483
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Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
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Re: Build out plan for basement production [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
#26805325 - 07/05/20 01:48 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
p9hu7 said: Lol, all of that and he hasn't even surpassed the "hey is this blue spot on my cake contamination?" Phase yet. Much lelz.
A lot of the Youtube channels I mentioned went from no farming experience to making a living growing gourmet in less than a year. Just because there's 100 overambitious noobs on here a day doesn't mean there aren't serious beginners either. It's better to steer people towards knowledge and give sound advice rather than mock them. Just makes the Shroomery look bad, in my foolish opinion.
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