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OfflineKmacmo
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Registered: 08/14/19
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Drugs, government and fear
    #26791329 - 06/29/20 04:03 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Why does the western society's make drug laws based on money and corporations interests instead of how dangerous/addictive the drug can be...
For example cannabis was used mainly by the African Americans in America, then the rich white guys come in and decide they need a free workforce so what better way then to portray them as pshycotic weed smoking criminals... We stop people from growing their own medicine and making their own clothes/tools and get a large free workforce... Sounds beneficial to a government.

Shrooms are also another medicine the people could easily grow or pick themselves, and it really changes the way you process fear.
That's bad for a system that relys on fear, seems counter intuitive.

In my country we have this job seekers program where the government pay £90 a week for you to look for jobs, if you are an alcoholic you recicve an extra £100 per week to cover your booze expenses... Incentivising people to actually start drinking or drink more, just for the extra cash.
They make so much money from alcohol tax here it's beneficial to have as many alcoholics as possible and In turn it creates crime wich the government needs petty crime and alot of it... To keep people's mind off of the real criminals at play here.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Registered: 04/08/04
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: Kmacmo]
    #26791355 - 06/29/20 04:46 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

humans have minds that can create and perceive systems.
some are really there, some are perceived after digesting propaganda.

there is some truth to the OP, but to bring it forth needs more imagination, so maybe it's not really the motivation, just some mess we are still in.


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OfflineKmacmo
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Registered: 08/14/19
Posts: 1,680
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26791500 - 06/29/20 07:08 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Yeah it's much more difficult to search and learn from a variety of sources, rather most just watch the news or take what the government says as truth.

I should have put more thought into my rant lol, missed alot of points... And the problem is far too complex


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: Kmacmo]
    #26791760 - 06/29/20 10:06 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

One doesn't need to read the whole post - you look for a rational answer ... possibly some sort of conspiracy theory- but of course "the answer" - or rather those partial answers that can be found, must lie within history, which takes much more time to study. But history often seems to show that many things we are stuck with (like the electoral college, for example) are to some degree sort of random.

And then that history would have to be compared to those cultures, that have different laws, beliefs, histories, and so on, which again takes much more time to study, than just saying something like: "capitalism depends on subjugating the masses".


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InvisibleYellow Pants
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: laughingdog]
    #26791909 - 06/29/20 11:44 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

If you take the statement “anarchy is the ideal” seriously then I doubt we the people could grow a dominator agency that risks highly negative behaviors like the drug war because people simply wouldn’t play along.


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: Yellow Pants]
    #26794982 - 06/30/20 04:38 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Yellow Pants said:
If you take the statement “anarchy is the ideal” seriously then I doubt we the people could grow a dominator agency that risks highly negative behaviors like the drug war because people simply wouldn’t play along.




I'f you take the statement “anarchy is the ideal” seriously then I doubt [there is any] "we the people" .

.    And no one takes the idea  "  “anarchy is the ideal” seriously ..."    anyway.

.  Without some sort of fairly objective analysis of a society as a whole and its history, I doubt any particular isolated phenomenon can be satisfactorily explained. If we look at military expenditure vs education expenditure, then we might have a start. But how did the military industrial complex become so big? Simply blaming 'capitalism' does not tell the whole story.


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InvisibleYellow Pants
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: laughingdog]
    #26795111 - 06/30/20 05:49 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Well for starters it’s not like people voluntarily fund the US military.  People have a tendency to miss the fact that their relationship with the state is a non-voluntary one. 

In the pedo thread consent seems to be a big deal.  I don’t understand why it loses its spark in regards to the state.  :confused:


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: laughingdog]
    #26795148 - 06/30/20 06:06 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

delighted to say nothing makes any sense to me.


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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Registered: 08/16/16
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26795620 - 06/30/20 09:18 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: The Blind Ass]
    #26796249 - 07/01/20 05:02 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

hashish made me type that


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: Yellow Pants]
    #26796521 - 07/01/20 08:38 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Yellow Pants said:
Well for starters it’s not like people voluntarily fund the US military.  People have a tendency to miss the fact that their relationship with the state is a non-voluntary one. 

In the pedo thread consent seems to be a big deal.  I don’t understand why it loses its spark in regards to the state.  :confused:




.    You both oversimplify, and cherry pick what part of my statement to respond to. As regards military support, you oversimplify, when you ignore both the volunteer nature of the army, navy, marines, seals, special forces, Guantanamo bay operation, & the CIA etc., and when you disregard the huge number & surprising percentage of americans employed by the vast military industrial complex. Folks are not as innocent as you seem to want to believe. Then we have insane notions as regards gun ownership & possession (to a degree no other country has), along with mass shootings. And US movies are predominantly violent. Its actually a very violent country; of course if one as never traveled much, one can't know this from personal experience.

.  And americans, don't just volunteer for the military, they actually go abroad and kill and torture people, and if that isn't enough they murder foreign civilians from drones, while in their safe bunkers in the USA, and call it 'collateral damage'. Why wasn't Guantanamo bay closed? because the US politicians, knew they wouldn't get re-elected if they voted for closing it!
.  So the torture continues. If a person could escape the US, but chooses to remain here, due to the nice standard of living (compared to the rest of the world), they are to some degree complicit, in the doings of the military empire, that is their home. But of course its always easier to blame "The MAN", or 'capitalism', or 'the government', or 'the elite', or some other vast vague but supposedly cohesive entity.
.  America is also responsible for starting wars, conducting illegal operations (such as the 'bay of pigs', & getting Manuel  Noriega by invading Panama), and installing puppet governments & supporting dictators world wide.
.  Just as working for a tobacco company implicates one (to some degree) in the death of one's neighbor who dies of lung cancer, just so working for Raytheon or Lockheed Martin, or owning their stock, (or any involvement in the MIC) implicates one (to some degree), in all the horrible crimes for which America is responsible.
.  Back in the day there was a psychological price to pay for being a Roman, today there is one just for being an American, if one has any choice in the matter.


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InvisibleYellow Pants
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: laughingdog]
    #26796791 - 07/01/20 11:05 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

I see several points to respond to.  On the one hand yes people volunteer for the various branches of the US military.  I’ve wondered why people are so eager.  Then I remember that the state peddles the education system in the US.  “I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America.  And to the Republic....”. Twelve or so years of that.  So the innocence of people is a slippery thing in my mind. 

On the other hand it isn’t solely the US that engages in aggression with its own defined people.  Seems all first world nation states do it.  And in the unlikely case that I find a spot without it then it’s probably in a violently contested third world area that is essentially the same thing but without the big toys and organization.


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: Yellow Pants]
    #26797602 - 07/01/20 07:03 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

.  Indeed the whole world is a mess as you say
.
.  One reason (I think), people volunteer is due to poverty, bad neighborhoods, and the promise of 'free' training--and a failure to calculate the odds of serious injury correctly, and of course this is aided and abetted by the great income inequality in the US. Sure seems intentional.

.  And as you say not only did we do saluting the flag, we did "the lord's prayer", and several psalms at the start of every day, where I went to elementary school.


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InvisibleYellow Pants
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: laughingdog]
    #26798963 - 07/02/20 10:09 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

It’s that intentional word that I would hit on.  You are saying then that the state institutes or helps institute poverty and social violence.  Then out of that they hook some into fighting for “the country” which it could be argued rn in the US benefits those at the top of the financial pyramid.  The education propaganda that’s drilled for years only makes this easier. 

If this is what you are saying then I am would agree.  The point I am trying to make is that the state is violent from the start.  We give lordship to the state apparatus through taxation, printing, and the free exercise of law enforcement.  No other institution is granted this yet in the name of “patriotism” or something like that we go with it.  Anarchy as an ideal I take to mean freedom from this abusive relationship.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: Yellow Pants]
    #26799115 - 07/02/20 11:40 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

maybe,

but anarchy quickly turns into an abusive relationship of a different kind.

a middle ground should be possible.


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InvisibleYellow Pants
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26799691 - 07/02/20 03:36 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Does it?  How do you know that?


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: Yellow Pants]
    #26799762 - 07/02/20 04:14 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

some of my relatives are anarchists


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InvisibleYellow Pants
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26799859 - 07/02/20 05:01 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Well I guess that settles it.  :shrug:


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Offlinegreenladel

Registered: 05/27/20
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Re: Drugs, government and fear *DELETED* [Re: Kmacmo]
    #26799874 - 07/02/20 05:07 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Post deleted by greenladel

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InvisibleYellow Pants
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Re: Drugs, government and fear [Re: greenladel]
    #26801284 - 07/03/20 11:16 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

I take anarchy to mean deconstruction.  To bring anarchy onto something is to dissemble it.  Idk the history of the word and how it’s usage has changed over time but I imagine what it means to people in terms of ideology is fairly variant.  Hence I try to keep it simple and start from basic assumptions which to me means the above.  For instance what does it mean to be an anarchist in today’s world?  Well I think that’s a complex and extensive answer like you said but certainly to be an anarchist is to believe in deconstruction which today usually is minimally in reference to the state.

Where it goes from there I think is where the variance comes into play.  And perhaps something that extends beyond the concept of anarchy and into other ideological concepts.  Capitalist or communitarian hippy or something in between for example.

On the other hand to use the simple above definition makes anarchy a versatile word.  And so it’s difficult to untangle in a short space.


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