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OfflineEntheoGod
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What are the benefits of soaking wbs in brewed coffee?
    #26784481 - 06/26/20 11:46 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Just a simple question that I cant seem to find an answer to. I keep seeing info from 6 or 7 years ago that says no one knows why it works but it just does. :cool:

My biggest question is would this be detrimental in any way to the seeds? I am also super curious about the science behind why it works but I am assuming no one knows this. I keep making posts in the cultivation forum and I am actually so afraid that any of my posts arent worthy of making. Hopefully I am not breaking any of the forum rules by posting such a simple question.

I have never used coffee in any of my soaks over the years but have recently ran into problems that I CANNOT narrow down to anything I am doing wrong. (Ill be making another post later and over the next few days with updates to my WBS prep just so I can get opinions about where the error could be happening). For now I really want to know what could coffee help if anything?

My wbs jars in the past few months have either completely stalled and didnt contaminate, just stopped growing entirely. Some of the batches have colonized fully then once I shake to see recovery rates, they just dont recover and nothing grows back. They smell like mushrooms completely, nothing bad. So when a few of them were fully colonized and shaken and smelled, I trusted them. Spawned them to CVG prepped exactly as most teks call for. And yet the colonization just stops after making it id say 80% of the way through the entire substrate. It starts producing mushies and then contams after a few days of making mushies while not fully colonized. I toss the tub and notice at the bottom of the tubs the seeds dont seem to be colonizing more than like a couple of centimetres around the seed itself, thus leaving much of the substrate uncolonized. Again though, I will post a more in depth look at exactly everything I am doing to prep the wbs over the next few days. Im currently starting another batch to see if maybe anything I have done could be causing this but I literally follow the teks to a t.

I have tried multiple different soak times, 24 hours, 15 hours, 60 minutes in 200F water, etc.. and nothing seems to be working. Yes I am using MS syringes but in the past they would at least colonize fully and work properly for me. I honestly cant seem to find the problem. I have agar inoculated at the moment and am waiting to see if any of the spores from the syringe grow in that, its only been a couple days since I did that though so I will have to update that more as I go as well. Im hoping that I can see if the spores were just dead or something but id have to have some pretty shit luck to be getting multiple syringes that are dead and full of dead spores. Just doesnt seem likely. Something makes me feel like its all boiling down to (no pun intended) my wbs soak times and hydration. :eek: I have honestly never noticed a difference in the bird seed size before and after a soak no matter how long I soak them. Maybe I need to do a few tests on soak times but I never want to go past 24 hours soaking then simmering for a few minutes at 200F.

Sorry for that rant, I've just gotten super de motivated lately because of the multiple failures in a row. I am absolutely willing to change anything that could be harming the process just let me know what it is. This post isnt for that really though, I just got carried away. I wanna know what the benefits of soaking WBS in coffee and regular water if anyone can tell me. Or hell if you can figure out what I have been doing wrong in the past thatd be great but Ill be posting my entire process in another post once completed. Thanks ahead of time and I sincerely apologize if these posts arent following the forum rules. I really want updated info and Im afraid to follow more information that I am finding from several years ago.  If I am leaving out any information just ask. I was typing this in the middle of rinsing the next batch of WBS. 👌


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OfflinePsilosopherr
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Re: What are the benefits of soaking wbs in brewed coffee? [Re: EntheoGod]
    #26784612 - 06/26/20 12:30 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

i do know this, if you're not having success coffee will not solve the problem

only time i've heard of people using coffee in grain is for stone producers. i'm guessing it helps because of nutrientssss


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OfflineEntheoGod
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Re: What are the benefits of soaking wbs in brewed coffee? [Re: Psilosopherr]
    #26784627 - 06/26/20 12:34 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Gotcha, I wont be doing the coffee soak until im able to get results without it. Still curious as to why it helps colonization times.  :ponder: Thanks for the response. 😊


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InvisibleRoger Clemency
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Re: What are the benefits of soaking wbs in brewed coffee? [Re: EntheoGod]
    #26784672 - 06/26/20 12:45 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

I read that it just increases the speed of colonization. I used half coffee half water to soak my oats back in the day. It worked fine but I never did any kind of tests on whether it was any faster or not.

For WBS prep I like Fooman’s method the best. I just tried no prep and it worked ok but I don’t have the ratios perfect for my seed yet. I filled qt jars up to 400ml mark and poured in about 7oz of water. They came out okay but the grain was nearly at the top so it was hard to get a decent shake after PC and that shake is real necessary doing no prep cuz the grain are initially stuck together.

There’s something wrong if you’re not getting full colonization, healthy myc won’t just stop. Either not enough GE, incorrectly prepped grain, bacteria from syringe, or introduced during inoculation, temp extremes up or down. Or any combination of those things, which could make it tough to figure out.

You’ve started using agar which is the first step to growing mushrooms in my mind so that’s good in general. If you have any grain jars colonizing you can also throw a grain on agar and see how clean it grows out.


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OfflineEntheoGod
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Re: What are the benefits of soaking wbs in brewed coffee? [Re: Roger Clemency]
    #26784696 - 06/26/20 12:52 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Funny thing is, placing a seed thats colonizing onto agar is what my next thought was. I figured if they are stalling or just not growing at all. That would be a way to find out if its ABLE to colonize at all. :smile:

I am about to type up my most recent agar prep and wbs prep so folks can scrutinize my every step and help me narrow it down. I am not willing to give up but it hurts the motivation when all I see is constant failure. Its not even like I'm having contaminations that are visible. I understand some contams arent visible to the naked eye. Ill continue to update the post that I am making in the next few hours with pics along the process. Hopefully I can get this narrowed down to something specific.

I just imagine the myc being caffeinated and growing quickly 🤣 definitely not whats happening...or is it... either way I plan to skip out on the coffee until I get a handle on things.

I hope I am making it clear that I really appreciate everyones help lately. 💖


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InvisibleRoger Clemency
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Re: What are the benefits of soaking wbs in brewed coffee? [Re: EntheoGod]
    #26784704 - 06/26/20 12:55 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Coffee enemas stimulate some nerve bundle that’s up your intestine. I thought the same way about caffeinated myc. Whom knows


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InvisibleLadysKnight
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Re: What are the benefits of soaking wbs in brewed coffee? [Re: Roger Clemency] * 2
    #26784928 - 06/26/20 02:29 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

He said whom


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Invisiblettching8475
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Re: What are the benefits of soaking wbs in brewed coffee? [Re: LadysKnight]
    #26784977 - 06/26/20 02:46 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Adding coffee to your grain soak adds nitrogen and helps ‘digest’ the shells of the seed to a degree, making them easier for the myc to colonize them. I got good results with RGS using a 24 hour soak with a cup of old coffee in it.

For WBS, Cap’s no prep method has worked pretty well for me.


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Invisiblemaxmush
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Re: What are the benefits of soaking wbs in brewed coffee? [Re: ttching8475]
    #26785498 - 06/26/20 07:01 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Some speculate it is:

- the nutrients
- caffeine
- pH/alkalizing
- added nitrogen
- all of the above

Unfortunately, personally haven't come across a good experiment that either proves or disproves any of it. It does instinctively it make sense to me.

I dont think its a bandaid fix however if you are having issues colonizing.


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OfflineEntheoGod
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Re: What are the benefits of soaking wbs in brewed coffee? [Re: maxmush]
    #26785504 - 06/26/20 07:03 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

I already stated I wont be doing the coffee in my wbs soak tonight. I was more or less just curious about what the benefits were. I will wait until I get clean spawn through agar before changing anything else.  :smile: Thanks for your replies!


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OfflinePsilosopherr
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Re: What are the benefits of soaking wbs in brewed coffee? [Re: EntheoGod]
    #26785781 - 06/26/20 09:15 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

jeepers, all the years I've been on this site and I'd never heard coffee sped things up.

Glad you posted entheo


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OfflineEntheoGod
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Re: What are the benefits of soaking wbs in brewed coffee? [Re: Psilosopherr]
    #26785803 - 06/26/20 09:28 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Psilosopherr said:
jeepers, all the years I've been on this site and I'd never heard coffee sped things up.

Glad you posted entheo





haha hey the way i see it, theres no such thing as a bad question so I just spouted this one out there. After looking through tons of old teks I seen a few mentioning soaking in 50% coffee 50% water. Some just toss a cup or two in.

I have to work on getting consistently clean spawn before I decide to spice things up a bit with brewed coffee. I am very glad that my inquiry helped get some more ideas in your head! Even if I have no idea why it works and have never tried it. Theres info out there about it, just seems like NO ONE knows why it works.


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OfflinePsilosopherr
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Re: What are the benefits of soaking wbs in brewed coffee? [Re: EntheoGod]
    #26785875 - 06/26/20 10:02 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Suppose somebody could try adding just nitrogen or caffeine or lime individually to different jars to see if any of those have a similar effect


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