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 Ythan
ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ
 
Registered: 08/08/97
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 Psychedelic DMT to Enter Clinical Trials   1
#26776487 - 06/23/20 11:12 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Psychedelic DMT to Enter Clinical Trials
www.labroots.com
Neuro-pharmaceutical company, MindMed, has announced that it will begin a double-blind placebo-controlled Phase 1 clinical trial to understand how N, N-Dimethyltryptamine (DMT), the primary psychoactive ingredient in Ayahuasca, works in the body. The company ultimately hopes to create therapeutics with the substance to treat mental health conditions like depression and addiction.
“There is a growing trend in Western society to use Ayahuasca and DMT to facilitate a healing process for one’s mind. However, there is very limited safety data and clinical trials evaluating DMT as a potential medicine so we are going to double down on understanding the therapeutic opportunity and more effective ways to administer DMT in a controlled setting to achieve this healing process.” says JR Rahn, cofounder of MindMed.
There are currently no approved clinical uses for DMT. The substance has nevertheless been used for centuries, if not longer, by various civilizations and tribes around the world for both its mentally restorative and explorative effects. In the first clinical trial of its kind, the researchers want to establish whether the substance could be engineered for future drug development programs to treat conditions like addiction.
In partnership with the University Hospital Basel’s Liechti Lab, the researchers from MindMed thus plan to conduct experiments in which patients receive DMT intravenously. Quickly metabolized if taken orally, taking DMT intravenously means that the researchers will both be able to ensure continuous application of the substance, and thus a prolonged DMT experience.
It also means they will be able to stop administration of the substance and the ensuing DMT experience quickly should anything go wrong. In this way, the researchers hope to establish proper dosing during the trial with the goal of inducing a stable DMT experience of between an hour and two hours among patients.
The study is expected to begin in late 2020, from which the researchers hope to lay the foundations for a future Phase II clinical proof of concept trials.
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 tyrannicalrex
Strange R
Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 38,332
Loc: subtropics
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 Re: Psychedelic DMT to Enter Clinical Trials [Re: Ythan]
#26776652 - 06/23/20 12:41 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Yaaasss biznitch! I  it!
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openmind
curious
Registered: 08/03/07
Posts: 13,963
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Re: Psychedelic DMT to Enter Clinical Trials [Re: Ythan] 2
#26776666 - 06/23/20 12:48 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ythan said:
The company ultimately hopes to create therapeutics with the substance to treat mental health conditions like depression and addiction....
...In the first clinical trial of its kind, the researchers want to establish whether the substance could be engineered for future drug development programs to treat conditions like addiction.
There is no need to create/engineer a totally new/different substance. Psychotria viridis and Banisteriopsis caapi and their extracts work just fine, and likely better than anything that could ever be "engineered" in a lab.
It is pretty well known and established that ayahuasca, or DMT taken orally with an MAOI, has tremendous potential to help with addiction and other mental health issues.
More like..."We already know about the huge potential this substance has, but we can't make money off a plant so we're going engineer it into a "medicine/pill" and patent it". ......And only folks with $$$$$ will have "legal" access to it.
Quote:
In partnership with the University Hospital Basel’s Liechti Lab, the researchers from MindMed thus plan to conduct experiments in which patients receive DMT intravenously.
I feel that DMT by itself doesn't really offer much potential to help with mental health issues and addiction, regardless of the ROA used....DMT by itself is more of a visual-show than anything, and can be rather chaotic and rapid, and can be pretty alien/strange/bizarre by itself. There just isn't much "substance" to the experience of DMT by itself...I feel the true healing power & potential comes from using DMT in combination with the harmala alkaloids/caapi vine. DMT by itself with out the harmala alkaloids just doesn't have much to offer.
I mean I'm all for research into these things, I fully support it....but this is basically just trying to turn a plant/substance into something that can be patented so profit can be made. And only those with $$$$$ will be able to have access to it.
The plants themselves and their constitutes work just fine. The plants and their compounds should be legal to possess/consume and everyone should have access to them, not only those that have the $$$$ to afford it.
-OM
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nooneman
Registered: 04/24/09
Posts: 14,700
Loc: Utah
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Re: Psychedelic DMT to Enter Clinical Trials [Re: Ythan]
#26777043 - 06/23/20 03:05 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Not going to work. They picked the wrong chemical. DMT is not known for having good outcomes for stuff like this. Even Shulgin wasn't a fan and believed that he wasn't progressing through his use of DMT. Previous trials (not to mention people online) have shown that DMT can cause delusions and bizarre beliefs that are difficult to talk the person out of. Even the native peoples who used it for centuries used to call it "the great liar." DMT is not known for helping with mental health problems, and a lot of people go to ayahuasca resorts and end up finding that it didn't have much impact on their mental health.
It's just the wrong chemical for this sort of thing, and these trials are going to end in disappointment.
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tyrannicalrex
Strange R
Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 38,332
Loc: subtropics
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Re: Psychedelic DMT to Enter Clinical Trials [Re: nooneman]
#26777053 - 06/23/20 03:09 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Yeah, mushrooms are probably better, and mdma.
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sk8fast
Tripping skater
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Re: Psychedelic DMT to Enter Clinical Trials [Re: tyrannicalrex]
#26777235 - 06/23/20 04:27 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Rick Strassman already did this study
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Holybullshit
Stranger
Registered: 01/06/19
Posts: 1,576
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Re: Psychedelic DMT to Enter Clinical Trials [Re: openmind]
#26777779 - 06/23/20 08:40 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
openmind said:
More like..."We already know about the huge potential this substance has, but we can't make money off a plant so we're going engineer it into a "medicine/pill" and patent it". ......And only folks with $$$$$ will have "legal" access to it.
Welcome to capitalism.
Quote:
Not going to work. They picked the wrong chemical. DMT is not known for having good outcomes for stuff like this.
Sans any outcomes DMT is the wrong substance for this pursuit because of its degradation by MAO alone, it just unnecessarily complicates things...I say that from the perspective of both conducting trials, bringing a product to market, or just developing a therapeutic method. Even if DMT or DMT+MAOI had better outcomes than other psychs it's not well suited for the way western medicine operates.
I think a lot of people who take Ayahuasca are expecting it to act like a magic bullet or miracle drug, and they aren't putting the work in(or any work in). They just think they can dose and all their problems will be solved, no drug is going to work like that(for mental health). I'm sure there are better tryptamines, or depending on your therapeutic regimen and goal lysergamides or phens might be better...but I certainly wouldn't write DMT off as useless or think they won't have mostly positive results with it, especially if they are going to experiment with different dosing regimens or pair it with actual therapy.
It's just if your goal is to bring something to patients outside of trials, its not a great candidate, but it will definitely push the research forward and I'd like to see how the length of infusion affects outcomes and how different the results are for DMT alone infused over time vs DMT+MAOI vs protected DMT analogs.
But I don't know if they are looking for something that works like ketamine, where patients just come get infused once a month and aren't asked to do a whole lot more than that, or if they are looking to employ it like MDMA is used for guided therapy, or what....personally what I'd like to see go through the rigor of clinicals and peer review is micro-dosing, preferably with a lysergamide but I'd be happy to see it with a 4 substituted tryp.
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Eatshroomsoften
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Re: Psychedelic DMT to Enter Clinical Trials [Re: tyrannicalrex]
#26778231 - 06/24/20 12:47 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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This shits bananas B! an an as!
SHIT IS BANANAS B A N AN AS.
but for real how do we exist.
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May light from burning bridges behind me guide the way
Before I post with a question I check some links
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Nature Boy
Stranger than most
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Re: Psychedelic DMT to Enter Clinical Trials [Re: nooneman]
#26778417 - 06/24/20 05:00 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
nooneman said, in part:
Not going to work. They picked the wrong chemical. It's just the wrong chemical for this sort of thing, and these trials are going to end in disappointment.
I tend to agree with this. If the pharmaceutical companies are looking to treat addiction as the article suggests, they would be much better off looking to Ibogaine as a starting point.
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All submitted posts under this user name are works of pure fiction or outright lies. Any information, statement, or assertion contained therein should be considered pure unadulterated bullshit. Note well: Sorry, but I do not answer PM's unless you are a long-time trusted friend. If you have a question, ask it in the appropriate thread.
 
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LosTresOjos
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Re: Psychedelic DMT to Enter Clinical Trials [Re: openmind]
#26779486 - 06/24/20 02:01 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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This system already exists...
I've seen many people of wealthier backgrounds spend thousands to take a trip to south america for an authentic experience. How is it going to effect you? Or me? I can say it will not effect me and my ability to acquire any substances I would want.
By the simple fact that we are willing to think for ourselves means that shit is not for us. It's for those who are too afraid to go against what they are told.
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Ancient Mariner
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Re: Psychedelic DMT to Enter Clinical Trials [Re: LosTresOjos] 1
#26780031 - 06/24/20 06:14 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Good ol' fuckin' capitalism at work here, folks. But yeah, please explore this chemical and let me know when you figure it out. I do not think this one can be mastered. It's been a help in my individual recovery but going to the psychiatrist to "inject" this untameable substance was not necessary. I doubt anyone, maybe a true sage, would be prepared for the experience.
I think it would be interesting to learn more about the nature of DMT. As of now, I think everyone is just confounded by the mystery so any studies on it should spark interesting discussion. I don't believe the approach of Western medicine is applicable for a substance that elicits so many variables in individual and incomprehensible experience.
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Holybullshit
Stranger
Registered: 01/06/19
Posts: 1,576
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Re: Psychedelic DMT to Enter Clinical Trials [Re: LosTresOjos] 1
#26781224 - 06/25/20 05:58 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
LosTresOjos said:
This system already exists...
I've seen many people of wealthier backgrounds spend thousands to take a trip to south america for an authentic experience. How is it going to effect you? Or me? I can say it will not effect me and my ability to acquire any substances I would want.
By the simple fact that we are willing to think for ourselves means that shit is not for us. It's for those who are too afraid to go against what they are told.
So people who are too afraid to break the law deserve to suffer from mental illness and not have access to the most effective treatments?
Not caring about something for the sole reason that it doesn't affect you on a personal level displays a real lack of empathy. Selfish modes of thought such as this have become far too pervasive in our society and everyone is suffering because of it. Believe it or not, consistently operating with only your best interests in mind will lead to worse outcomes for you as well, "what goes around comes around" is practically a universal truth.
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