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SHROOMSISAY01
Mr. Shrooms



Registered: 01/22/17
Posts: 3,849
Loc: Virginia, USA
Last seen: 2 days, 16 hours
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: Bsdgaou]
#26778225 - 06/24/20 12:44 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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I pay 0.08 cents 13 cents is expensive. No, a PID does not either run on or off. If you watch this video it shows the PID telling you how much power it is giving your element at about 9:30 and he tells you it will go down into the teens. So 100 would be 100 percent and say 15 would be 15 percent...
The PID tries to give your element just enough power to keep the water at the temperature you set. So once it reaches the temperature the PID only has to give it a little power every now and then to keep it at that temperature. A PID is much different than a temperature controller which is either on or off.
Edited by SHROOMSISAY01 (06/24/20 12:53 AM)
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SHROOMSISAY01
Mr. Shrooms



Registered: 01/22/17
Posts: 3,849
Loc: Virginia, USA
Last seen: 2 days, 16 hours
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: SHROOMSISAY01]
#26778248 - 06/24/20 01:02 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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If you want to know more watch his other videos he explains it more.
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bogdancev
Stranger
Registered: 09/01/17
Posts: 313
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: Bsdgaou]
#26778318 - 06/24/20 02:18 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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It uses "time proportioning control", a slow version of Pulse Width Modulation (PWM). You have a time window, lets say it is 1min. Then to work 10%, you switch heat element for 6s in total during that minute.
If you are technically inclined please see this link. It completely explains slow PWM for controlling relays.
The full technical tutorial on PWM with implementation is here.
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Martinsapin
no-mad



Registered: 09/12/16
Posts: 310
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 1 year, 7 months
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: bogdancev]
#26778488 - 06/24/20 06:09 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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So basically I plug my 1500w element and monitor when I reach 200f and then let it go for 16hours. And make sure I dont lack water.
I know Shroomsis youre a big advocate of PIDs and will install one eventually.
For now Im on a temporary locatikn.
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seagu

Registered: 03/03/18
Posts: 952
Last seen: 8 days, 8 hours
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: Martinsapin]
#26778567 - 06/24/20 07:06 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Yea. The thing I discovered about how much water is steamed off is if I used a grill grate for the false bottom more water is steamed off. But if I use a solid false bottom with roughly only 1/2" from the barrel wall around the edge a lot less water will steam off. And I stack the bags on top of each other and not like a brick wall so that there is room for the steam to go around all the bags and get up to the top of the steamer and not create a pressurized bottom section. Under my false bottom is also 2 bricks that for the most part completely fill 3.5 inches deep square where the corners of the square are basically touching the sides. So it displaces a lot of water right below the false bottom. Hardly any water steams off this way. Not sure how much the water displacement adds or takes away from how much water is steamed off. I haven't tried it without it yet. I kinda like not having to reach so far down into the barrel. But yea putting a PID on it will save you some money in the long run though. And you will either want a drain or wet shop vacuum or some way to get the water out each time.
-------------------- Plan to win or you are planning for failure. Don't let anyone tell you you can't do it. Just figure out the solution. Even if that means banging your head on a wall until the solution oozes out of you.
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Martinsapin
no-mad



Registered: 09/12/16
Posts: 310
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 1 year, 7 months
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: seagu]
#26778908 - 06/24/20 10:08 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Would it work to plug the heater element on a 12gauge extension cord?
I keep note of the solid false bottom instead of the grill.
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seagu

Registered: 03/03/18
Posts: 952
Last seen: 8 days, 8 hours
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: Martinsapin]
#26779020 - 06/24/20 10:45 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Martinsapin said: Would it work to plug the heater element on a 12gauge extension cord?
I keep note of the solid false bottom instead of the grill.
it can. Though make sure the heat and the rubber coating meshes well. I am currently using 10/2 wire usually used to run electricity in homes. Plugged into a 12gauge extension chord. So I am not sure if the rubber being so close to that high of heat for that long would melt or what. It being soft rubber and all. But 12 guage is usable for wiring 20 amp breaker applications. but I am not an electrician so... its all at your own risk. I officially know nothing.
yea and those grill grates rust... grrr. Stainless Steel 55 gallon barrel lids that are cut and filed to size works well.
-------------------- Plan to win or you are planning for failure. Don't let anyone tell you you can't do it. Just figure out the solution. Even if that means banging your head on a wall until the solution oozes out of you.
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Martinsapin
no-mad



Registered: 09/12/16
Posts: 310
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 1 year, 7 months
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: seagu]
#26779109 - 06/24/20 11:10 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Yeah get it. My idea is not to wire the heater on the extension cord but to have the heater wired own its own cord that I would plug in the extension.
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seagu

Registered: 03/03/18
Posts: 952
Last seen: 8 days, 8 hours
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: Martinsapin]
#26779190 - 06/24/20 11:36 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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That is how I have it right now until I rewire it soon. And it works on a 15Amp GCFI outlet.. make sure you run it on GCFI and have it grounded because of the water. And make sure you are not over heating your wires. if you didn't know.
-------------------- Plan to win or you are planning for failure. Don't let anyone tell you you can't do it. Just figure out the solution. Even if that means banging your head on a wall until the solution oozes out of you.
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SHROOMSISAY01
Mr. Shrooms



Registered: 01/22/17
Posts: 3,849
Loc: Virginia, USA
Last seen: 2 days, 16 hours
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: Martinsapin]
#26779307 - 06/24/20 12:31 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Martinsapin said: So basically I plug my 1500w element and monitor when I reach 200f and then let it go for 16hours. And make sure I dont lack water.
I know Shroomsis youre a big advocate of PIDs and will install one eventually.
For now Im on a temporary locatikn.
What I would do is make you you put the same amount of water in the drum and watch how long it takes to get to 200F How ever long it takes add 12 hours to the time. Mine took 6 hours to get to temp so I ran for 18 hours.
As I stated before I am only an advocate for a PID if you are running a high wattage element. Running a 1500 wat element there is really no need for a PID. If you want you can use a PID but it will act like a heat controller basically on or off and will not save that much on electricity.
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SHROOMSISAY01
Mr. Shrooms



Registered: 01/22/17
Posts: 3,849
Loc: Virginia, USA
Last seen: 2 days, 16 hours
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: Martinsapin]
#26779340 - 06/24/20 12:42 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Martinsapin said: Would it work to plug the heater element on a 12gauge extension cord?
I keep note of the solid false bottom instead of the grill.
It depends. If you look at my set up I have a Locking Extension Cord for my drum and a 12 gauge dryer cord for my PC. You have to make sure you get the right gauge cord to handle the amps or you will have a fire. Remember it has to be able to handle the amps for the specific length the cord is.
I use this as a false bottom it is expensive but awesome...
https://www.amazon.com/Onlyfire-Round-Outdoor-Campfire-Cooking/dp/B01HB8VP2K/ref=sr_1_3?dchild=1&keywords=22+inch+round+fire+grate&qid=1593024034&s=lawn-garden&sr=1-3
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SHROOMSISAY01
Mr. Shrooms



Registered: 01/22/17
Posts: 3,849
Loc: Virginia, USA
Last seen: 2 days, 16 hours
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: SHROOMSISAY01]
#26779343 - 06/24/20 12:45 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Please be careful guys I am really worried about you all having a fire if you do not make sure your wiring can handle the amps. I would suggest going one gauge lower on your wiring than you think you need. Doing this will also save you money on electricity because the electricity will flow easier.
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seagu

Registered: 03/03/18
Posts: 952
Last seen: 8 days, 8 hours
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: SHROOMSISAY01]
#26779399 - 06/24/20 01:17 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
SHROOMSISAY01 said:
Quote:
Martinsapin said: Would it work to plug the heater element on a 12gauge extension cord?
I keep note of the solid false bottom instead of the grill.
It depends. If you look at my set up I have a Locking Extension Cord for my drum and a 12 gauge dryer cord for my PC. You have to make sure you get the right gauge cord to handle the amps or you will have a fire. Remember it has to be able to handle the amps for the specific length the cord is.
I use this as a false bottom it is expensive but awesome...
https://www.amazon.com/Onlyfire-Round-Outdoor-Campfire-Cooking/dp/B01HB8VP2K/ref=sr_1_3?dchild=1&keywords=22+inch+round+fire+grate&qid=1593024034&s=lawn-garden&sr=1-3
well I do have to admit I have tried it on 14 and or 16 wire once or twice in a pinch with no issues over the years. I could feel a slight warmth but that was it. Though I recommend not to do that. Now my 12 gauge only gets warm where it is sitting right up near the steamer putting off all that heat so I can keep the connection out of the rain. And so is everything else right there warm. But if I don't have it near there it doesn't get warm.
Oh that looks like a nice false bottom. Though that will steam off more water than Those 2 bricks have 2 others below it on end lengthwise with the element going inbetween.
and as for wire sizes I was mentioning https://inspectapedia.com/electric/Electrical_Outlet_Wire_Size.php#:~:text=For%20a%2015%2DAmp%20circuit,copper%2Dclad%20aluminum%20wire).
-------------------- Plan to win or you are planning for failure. Don't let anyone tell you you can't do it. Just figure out the solution. Even if that means banging your head on a wall until the solution oozes out of you.
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Martinsapin
no-mad



Registered: 09/12/16
Posts: 310
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 1 year, 7 months
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: seagu]
#26779457 - 06/24/20 01:41 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Ok, thanks a bunch fellows. Ill get my barrel pretty soon and then start thw building part.
Dont worry I wont burn/destroy my body nor house .
Ill let you know further down the road how it goes.
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SHROOMSISAY01
Mr. Shrooms



Registered: 01/22/17
Posts: 3,849
Loc: Virginia, USA
Last seen: 2 days, 16 hours
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: Martinsapin]
#26779504 - 06/24/20 02:10 PM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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To figure out your amps you use watts/volts. So if you have a 1500 watt element and have 120 volts 1500/120 = 12.5 amps or if you have 110 volts 1500/110 = 13.63 either way it is well below 15 amps.
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Bsdgaou

Registered: 02/20/19
Posts: 340
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: SHROOMSISAY01]
#26791325 - 06/29/20 03:57 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Can you tell us which PID do you use @SHROOMSISAY01?
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SHROOMSISAY01
Mr. Shrooms



Registered: 01/22/17
Posts: 3,849
Loc: Virginia, USA
Last seen: 2 days, 16 hours
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: Bsdgaou]
#26791675 - 06/29/20 09:16 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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I use the MYPIN TA4 PID. It was cheaper than the inkbird when I bought mine. They all work basically the same so get the cheapest one you can find.
Watch some of this guys videos he is awesome he explains everything very well...
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Bsdgaou

Registered: 02/20/19
Posts: 340
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: SHROOMSISAY01]
#26793431 - 06/29/20 10:53 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Thank you. I wonder why is PID from bubba 550 USD then?
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SHROOMSISAY01
Mr. Shrooms



Registered: 01/22/17
Posts: 3,849
Loc: Virginia, USA
Last seen: 2 days, 16 hours
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: Bsdgaou]
#26793507 - 06/29/20 11:59 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Here is the same PID Bubba's barrels is using for $16.50 - $36.00 ...
https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/48mm-48mm-1alarm-microcomputer-temperature-controller_62280972670.html?spm=a2700.galleryofferlist.0.0.17e797479T6Aua
You should be able to build one for under $100 easily. Bubba's barrels must deal with a lot of suckers or people that just don't know any better.
I have been using a mypin pid for 3 years 1 or twice a week with no problems.
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Bsdgaou

Registered: 02/20/19
Posts: 340
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Re: 55 gallons sterilizer. PID controller alternative. [Re: SHROOMSISAY01]
#26793549 - 06/30/20 12:40 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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This is good for 4500 or 5500 W heating element? Inkbird ITC-106VH PID.
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