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OfflineSockadin
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2020 Friggin shroom nerds thread * 1
    #26692711 - 05/24/20 01:33 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

So I will come back later and make this post fancy, but the intention of this post is to get a new update on everything revelant to the new updated way of doing things and also for a discussion board to bring over general discussion topics like renaming FAE to PAE (something capsmcgee mentioned).

Please feel free to post new ideas or reworked processes here.

A simple example is that Caps said we should start renaming Frequent Air Exchange Passive Air Exchange. I like it and and running with the idea, but it can be confusing especially since I always thought FAE stood for fresh air exchange.

I plan on coming back to clean up this post and make it pretty. But get your thoughts and commentary in. Also post links to new methods that have emerged like Bodhisatta unmoded tubs or Natedawgs SSLI if you would like the links added to the OP.


Updated 5/25/20. I like Ladysknight Verizon better so let's just leave it at that.


Edited by Sockadin (05/25/20 01:05 PM)


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Offlinelateforthafuture
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: Sockadin] * 1
    #26692882 - 05/24/20 03:13 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Not so sure I agree with the "Passive Air Exchange" thing. FAE in my mind means "Fresh Air Exchange"...in that we are introducing fresh air...of course frequently. To me the term "passive" means not actively involved/automatic/automated...think passive income.

So, by renaming it to "Passive Air Exchange"...it is emphasizing the passive or automated idea to much. Of course if  you can automatically or "passively" introduce fresh air that's ideal...but you can manually introduce fresh air and that is fine too...think opening up a monotub to mist and fan.

It's not how we introduce fresh air...just that we do it. There are many ways to skin a cat. If you start calling it passive... newcomers might think that it has to be automated or passive or it is inadequate...and that is not necessarily the case.

I feel the emphasis should remain on "fresh"...not "frequent" or "passive"...IMHO.


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"Not what could have been, or what should have been, but what will be" -Self
:superbanana::mjdance::dancer:


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InvisibleRoger Clemency
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: lateforthafuture] * 1
    #26692917 - 05/24/20 03:26 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Passive is the exact opposite of automation by strange machines though. FAE has always been fresh air exchange for me and everyone else I’ve known to spell it out but I can dig the PAE. Passive means just letting it happen naturally by the way things are set up.

Misting and fanning is not a substitution for constant, passive fresh air which is what you should be after so I think it does more accurately convey the correct idea.


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Offlinelateforthafuture
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: Roger Clemency]
    #26692940 - 05/24/20 03:36 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Good point about the passive vs automatic (ah semantics)..but that further proves my point. Many growers use automated systems to introduce fresh air..such as fans and humidifiers to introduce and remove air. While others use passive systems such as monotubs or SGFC fruiting chambers that passively introduce fresh air.

It's not a huge deal..I just think fresh air exchange is more appropraite..because it doesn't matter if we are manually..passively or automatically introducing fresh air...we just need to do it.

Maybe I'm just over thinking these terms haha !!!


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"Not what could have been, or what should have been, but what will be" -Self
:superbanana::mjdance::dancer:


Edited by lateforthafuture (05/24/20 03:38 PM)


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Offlinepoisoned
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: lateforthafuture] * 1
    #26692943 - 05/24/20 03:39 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

I don't think we should confuse anyone even more. They will start wondering what's FAE and what's PAE when they would be the same thing.


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OfflineBedgus
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: poisoned]
    #26692951 - 05/24/20 03:43 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

poisoned said:
I don't think we should confuse anyone even more. They will start wondering what's FAE and what's PAE when they would be the same thing.




Exactly. If it ain't broke don't fix it


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I'll take the organised patterns of chaos over the chaotic organisations of man any day


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Offlinelateforthafuture
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: Bedgus]
    #26692957 - 05/24/20 03:45 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Bedgus said:
Quote:

poisoned said:
I don't think we should confuse anyone even more. They will start wondering what's FAE and what's PAE when they would be the same thing.




Exactly. If it ain't broke don't fix it




100% agree !!!


--------------------
"Not what could have been, or what should have been, but what will be" -Self
:superbanana::mjdance::dancer:


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OfflineSockadin
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: lateforthafuture]
    #26692965 - 05/24/20 03:49 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Well I guess we should just let this die. Lock it down! Cron, who I haven't seen on in a while. I guess people are being nice for a change.


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InvisibleModularMind
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: Bedgus]
    #26692967 - 05/24/20 03:49 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

:threadmonitor:


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InvisibleRoger Clemency
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: lateforthafuture]
    #26692987 - 05/24/20 03:59 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

I’m also for simplicity especially considering we’re on the internet and people read an offhand comment or joke or typo and sometimes go doing crazy things with their grow. Like covering a tub lid with foil : ) sorry if you’re reading this now, no malice bro :hug: :noargument:

But for growing cubes in the ways we’re most often talking about, it does matter how you get your fresh air. You want PAE not just fresh air any way you can get it. I’ve seen mad grows messed up by automation attempts. Only in a Martha or other grow tent type would PAE not be the thing to say.

I don’t know if the plebs can handle two different acronyms for different styles of growing though. Up here, where the air is crisp, I have no problems differentiating.

I like this thread idea sock, don’t be calling for lock artists


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OfflineBedgus
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: Roger Clemency]
    #26693081 - 05/24/20 04:43 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

A complete newbie will immediately understand when you tell him what fresh air exchange is and it is much more correlated to what you are actually doing in your tub (reducing CO2, introducing oxygen). People make monos because it passively exchanges air through the poly at a rate comfortable for the myc, just as the air gaps in unmodded tubs do, which is by itself already passive. It's not that people can't handle 2 acronyms, it's just that this one is completely unnecessary imo and would just do more harm than good. I'm all for innovating and making this stuff better for everyone and I like the idea of this thread, but if something already works why fix it?


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I'll take the organised patterns of chaos over the chaotic organisations of man any day


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Invisibleeatyualive
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: Bedgus]
    #26693113 - 05/24/20 04:58 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

I think saying passive just means you are not using anything to push air. So for instance, I don’t have a fan running in my setup using micropore tape holes. Comparatively friends may use micropore and use an active system where they use fans directing airflow into the setup. While my setup would be passive in the sense that I’m not doing that. I don’t think the term applies to the fact that there is still fresh air exchange In each method. It just means One is  active and one is passive. I’ve run both many different times over the years. I like passive more because I don’t have to tinker with any fans or anything.

1) coir doesn’t need to be boiled. If you culture is clean, you are fine
2) fans are not necessary in a grow room but you do need airflow. Passive systems work as good as active systems.


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OfflineSockadin
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: eatyualive]
    #26693134 - 05/24/20 05:06 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Well are we really encouraging PAE or FAE for Oxygen induction and CO2 displacement? Nope, we are doing it to remove humidity from the surface of the sub. The real goal for PAE or FAE in my opinion is to remove moisture through wicking. I just don't believe a tub will build enough CO2 to starve out a culture. The mycelium spends more time in a jar in grain form than it ever does in a tub, (Unless your Eats or Nate doing LI or SSLI).


  I guess my point of this thread was for ever one to post what is working for them and we can create a new list of things that are current. We could also make a note of things that are old news and don't work, like scratching a sub with a fork or cold shocks. I know I saw a noob post a cold shock question today.


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OfflineBedgus
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: Sockadin]
    #26693166 - 05/24/20 05:16 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

That's true, evaporation is actually a bigger role of air exchange, my bad. But still, changing up already well established terms is unnecessary if you ask me. As for the thread, it's a great idea that can benefit everyone and you should definitely give it a go!


--------------------
I'll take the organised patterns of chaos over the chaotic organisations of man any day


Edited by Bedgus (05/24/20 05:18 PM)


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InvisibleApples in Mono
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: eatyualive]
    #26693169 - 05/24/20 05:17 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Yeah, I think of it as passive FAE or active FAE(so I guess PFAE or AFAE). Ultimately, what the mushrooms need is FAE


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InvisibleCaps McGee
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: Apples in Mono]
    #26693200 - 05/24/20 05:28 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Ultimately what they need is AE: Air Exchange lol... when I set, i forget: no misting, no fanning... just wait: extremely passive... the air in my house is far from fresh if I had to imagine lol... I'm not sure where I saw frequent air exchange, but I've read it in an acronym thread or something somewhere as such... fresh air exchange makes as much sense as calling AA+ an albino:  its just an accepted misnomer... You'll not catch me, they're LA+ in my mind lmao...


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OfflineSockadin
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: Caps McGee]
    #26693214 - 05/24/20 05:32 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Haha I have said it before LA+. Or I guess AL+ since it was Avery albino+ right?


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InvisibleCaps McGee
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: Sockadin]
    #26693223 - 05/24/20 05:34 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

No... totally different animal... Avery's albino is a true albino Cambodian


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InvisibleMateja
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: Caps McGee]
    #26693246 - 05/24/20 05:44 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

May I confuse the boards some more? :typing:

I feel it's neither fresh air exchange nor stale air exchange its basically just 'enabling evaporation off the substrate'. Or how about this? When growers say the substrate needs more FAE or when they say the substrate is 'choking' do they mean the colony needs more oxygen or do they mean it needs to evaporate more? Exactly :lol: #confused


But I really like the PFAE/AFAE term :bongload:


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Edited by Mateja (05/24/20 05:45 PM)


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InvisibleCaps McGee
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Re: 2020 Updated Cultivation Methods, Tools Technqiues [Re: Mateja]
    #26693261 - 05/24/20 05:47 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Evaporation is kind of a byproduct of air exchange... EAE: Evaporatory Air Exchange ... I think you're onto something for pinning stage though... increased air exchange brings with it increased evaporation: well timed increase will noticeably make a difference in fruit count IME/O
:hyperlol:

Dryer subs dont pin as well: or have as much moisture for evaporation...
:rollsafe:


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