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OfflineMoses_Davidson
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Registered: 05/21/20
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What is wealth? * 1
    #26691983 - 05/24/20 07:25 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

After being financially obliterated, I had some time to sit and think. "Was all of the work even worthwhile?" Here are some of the thoughts I pondered as I asked myself if I was nothing more than a packrat accumulating useless but shiny objects.

1. An old lady passed away, and upon cleaning out her apartment, we found thousands of old grocery bags and bread bags, neatly stored. I thought, "Why would anyone want to keep a bunch of garbage?"

2. My grandparents passed away some years ago. Very few of their possessions were wanted by anyone, and most went right into a dumpster. As I looked at various items that they had purchased, sitting in the dumpster, I thought, "Maybe it is tough to discern what my heirs will say is a bunch of garbage. Am I keeping a bunch of garbage?"

3. At one point I worked very hard to become a prodigious accumulator of wealth. I worked very hard to amass equity in various forms, especially using leverage. This all became a cash-flow nightmare, a ball-and-chain obligation of payments to make. So, I concluded that equity (in and of itself) was not worth anything at all if you couldn't eat it. Neither was revenue (in and of itself) worth anything to me, if you couldn't keep enough of it. Owning any equity which requires work is not profit, it is a job that requires the trade of time for money. A big job is not wealth, it is a just a job, trading time for money. (You can always get more money, but you can never get your time back... therefore time is more valuable than money, in my opinion.)

4. When my mother passes away, I will someday be a trust fund recipient. When split between my siblings, cousins, second cousins, third cousins, and fourth cousins, I will be almost able to purchase a sandwich every month. The attorney who administrates it earns a lot for writing all the checks. Some old patriarch of my family (whose name I do not even know) was jumping for joy to have his wealth, and went so far as to set up a trust, which today distributes very small checks to a large group of individuals who don't even know each other. He probably went to the grave feeling smug about it. If I won the lottery, would I want to give it to a bunch of strangers who don't even know my name or care about me? Like a 501(c)(3) donation to an organization that gives $50 annually to some random people?

5. At one point, I lived in and owned a really cool place. Now, not so much. When I was out for a walk, out away from town among the trees and grass following an old deer trail through the woods, I sat by a little pond and thought, "Man this is cool. I wish I owned this land." Then I remembered Thoreau said something similar while sitting somewhere, that he wished he lived there. He commented, for a few hours he did live there. So, I thought, can any human own land, or is it akin to a flea claiming to own part of a dog? So really, by sitting there, was I exerting "ownership" of that land for a few moments, by occupying space there?

6. After my financial clusterfudge, I had time to think in retrospect about each transaction. Nearly every item where I allocated capital amounted to jack squat, except the money I gave away. I feel like that giving is still mine, and I still own those donations.

Is "wealth" then just cash-flow without work attached? Is it better to just divest it all while living since you can't take it with you? Is "saving" money akin to saving perishable food?

If any of you have had some insights or thoughts on wealth, however crazy, they might make more sense than what I believed about wealth. I don't really know what to think anymore and would love to hear your thoughts.


--------------------
"In finance, everything that is agreeable is unsound and everything that is sound is disagreeable." --Sir Winston Churchill

"The world may not only be stranger than we suppose, it may be stranger than we can suppose."
J.B.S. Haldane

"Truth is stranger than fiction, but it is because fiction is obliged to stick to possibilities; Truth isn't."
Mark Twain


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OfflineBuster_Brown
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Re: What is wealth? [Re: Moses_Davidson]
    #26692085 - 05/24/20 08:28 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

I sat by a little pond and thought, "Man this is cool.-

Variety- Can the living sit still all their lives? Should we be confined by ownership?


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OfflineForresterM
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Registered: 02/05/13
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Re: What is wealth? [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #26692146 - 05/24/20 08:53 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

I agree, and have come to the same conclusions from mostly the same situations you typed up, especially as it relates to going through others stuff when they pass...

We had half of everything we own stored in our garage the last few years.  Mice and other critters have ruined it all, and what isn't ruined we can't use because we are so allergic to the mouse stuff.

Strangely, neither my wife nor I saw it as a loss, in any way whatsoever.  All it did was make it easier for us to let go and not have to sort through it all.  Now we fill a dumpster every 2 weeks until it is gone. 

Amazingly freeing.  Wealth, stuff of any sort is worthless, other than the bare necessities really.  In fact it's less than worthless as the more value you assign to it, the more it weighs you down.  When you ain't got nothin', you ain't got nothin' to lose.

How I see it anyway.  True happiness comes from a position of "no need".


--------------------
Repugnant is a creature who would squander the ability to lift an eye to heaven, conscious of his fleeting time here.
-------------------

Have some medicinal mushrooms and want to get the most out of them?  Try this double extraction method.


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OfflineMoses_Davidson
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Registered: 05/21/20
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Re: What is wealth? [Re: Forrester]
    #26692352 - 05/24/20 10:34 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

So owning necessary stuff can help us to have no need, but we can be confined by ownership of so-called wealth when it takes away from the ability move about, and constrains our time.

I need to let go and sort through a bunch of stuff. I think I will go do that this afternoon.


--------------------
"In finance, everything that is agreeable is unsound and everything that is sound is disagreeable." --Sir Winston Churchill

"The world may not only be stranger than we suppose, it may be stranger than we can suppose."
J.B.S. Haldane

"Truth is stranger than fiction, but it is because fiction is obliged to stick to possibilities; Truth isn't."
Mark Twain


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OfflineForresterM
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Registered: 02/05/13
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Re: What is wealth? [Re: Moses_Davidson]
    #26692378 - 05/24/20 10:45 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Moses_Davidson said:
So owning necessary stuff can help us to have no need, but we can be confined by ownership of so-called wealth when it takes away from the ability move about, and constrains our time.




Good way to put it, agreed!  Just filled another dumpster.  The neighbors love us, anything useful gets left in a pile labelled free...


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Repugnant is a creature who would squander the ability to lift an eye to heaven, conscious of his fleeting time here.
-------------------

Have some medicinal mushrooms and want to get the most out of them?  Try this double extraction method.


Edited by Forrester (05/24/20 01:12 PM)


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: What is wealth? [Re: Moses_Davidson]
    #26692440 - 05/24/20 11:11 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

I hate stuff, but am paying 400$/month to store what does not fit in our apartment, and I only want to keep the paintings, which I think I can sell.

haven't bought a new car for 13 years, but I do like real estate, and I would like to flip and move when corona is over.

I think I am going to let the storage go next month or the one after.

a few of our furnishings will make some people happy for a few hundred years but most stuff is not worth it.

as for achieving and losing wealth, I hear ya. been there, trying not to lose my shirt, I still need that even if nobody wants it.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


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OfflineMoses_Davidson
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Re: What is wealth? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26692596 - 05/24/20 12:45 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Right on... case in point.

I just cleared out a good sized pile of junk from the basement. Feels good.


--------------------
"In finance, everything that is agreeable is unsound and everything that is sound is disagreeable." --Sir Winston Churchill

"The world may not only be stranger than we suppose, it may be stranger than we can suppose."
J.B.S. Haldane

"Truth is stranger than fiction, but it is because fiction is obliged to stick to possibilities; Truth isn't."
Mark Twain


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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Registered: 08/16/16
Posts: 26,731
Loc: The Primordial Mind
Re: What is wealth? [Re: Moses_Davidson]
    #26692601 - 05/24/20 12:46 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Time to do some Masonry & landscaping.  Feels good.


--------------------
Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps


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InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male


Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,247
Re: What is wealth? [Re: Moses_Davidson]
    #26692747 - 05/24/20 01:57 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

I like working.

I like taking breaks when I feel like taking breaks.

Therefore, I like working for myself rather than someone else.

I work more now than when I worked for someone else.

I like making more than I need.

This allows me to help others and/or save for when I don't like working as much.

Wealth is an abundance. Could be money, could be love, friends, health, intelligence, etc.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Registered: 04/08/04
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Re: What is wealth? [Re: Rahz]
    #26692888 - 05/24/20 03:15 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

sounds great, I forgot what kind of work you do


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


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InvisibleRahz
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Re: What is wealth? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26693037 - 05/24/20 04:23 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

I own a lawn care and landscaping company, going on three years now. I'll be full time in another year or two. I work with a friend who owns a HVAC company helping him when his workload is high and with things where he needs an extra person. I have several hobbies that produce income.

I get up at 8am, get ready and start working. I'm usually finished around 11pm. I take one day off a week.

Nothing necessarily wrong with having a boss. Lots of jobs working for others afford a large degree of autonomy. It depends on the job, and the boss. Some jobs just suck though, for me personally. Some people like sitting at a desk all day. I did that for several years and hated it. So it's just a matter of figuring out what you like doing, not as a matter of "helping the children" or "making a difference" but how your body and mind respond to the work.

I have a friend my age, late 40s who works for county government doing tier 3 tech support. We were supposed to play tennis this weekend. I drive an hour to his house and he's all hung over and can't play. We reschedule for today and now it's too hot for him. It was about 85 degrees. He's got a pot belly. Honestly I don't think any of that bothers him that much, just not for me.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


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OfflineCory Duchesne
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Re: What is wealth? [Re: Moses_Davidson]
    #26693177 - 05/24/20 05:20 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

False-Wealth is covetousness (ownership).  The moment you think of yourself as the owner / controller, then your mind will start creating thieves, and you'll find yourself accusing people of fraud and theft. 

True wealth is Good-Character. A person of good character will covet nothing. 

"To live is to borrow. And if we borrow to live, then life must be a pile of trash. Life and death are day and night. You and I came to watch the process of change, and now change has caught up with me. Why would I have anything to resent?"


--------------------
C.G. Jung: "Please remember, it is what you are that heals, not what you know."

"I shall not commit the fashionable stupidity of regarding everything I cannot explain as a fraud." - Carl Jung

Krishna, as his friends called him, freely admitted his compulsive lying. He blamed it on simple fear of having his deceptions detected." NOTES OF A FRINGE-WATCHER MARTIN GARDNER on J Krishnamurti

"All your questions are born out of the answers you already have. Any answer anybody gives should put an end to your questions. But it does not." [UG-K]


Edited by Cory Duchesne (05/24/20 05:20 PM)


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InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
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Registered: 11/10/05
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Re: What is wealth? [Re: Cory Duchesne]
    #26693233 - 05/24/20 05:38 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

So you don't mind if someone takes all your stuff?


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


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OfflineMoses_Davidson
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Registered: 05/21/20
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Re: What is wealth? [Re: Cory Duchesne]
    #26693272 - 05/24/20 05:52 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

That's pretty hard core. So how does one cultivate this good character?


--------------------
"In finance, everything that is agreeable is unsound and everything that is sound is disagreeable." --Sir Winston Churchill

"The world may not only be stranger than we suppose, it may be stranger than we can suppose."
J.B.S. Haldane

"Truth is stranger than fiction, but it is because fiction is obliged to stick to possibilities; Truth isn't."
Mark Twain


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Registered: 04/08/04
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Re: What is wealth? [Re: Moses_Davidson]
    #26693319 - 05/24/20 06:08 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

you have oversimplified wealth by casting a kind of agency to it, basically making it into an evil entity.

re-examine the habit of that.
of demonizing...
it could be from  lingering superstition


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OfflineJackboy10
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Registered: 05/24/20
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Re: NEED HELP IDENTIFYING. Are they Psilocybin?? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26693356 - 05/24/20 06:24 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Hey I found mushrooms in a front lawn, here are some pictures could some one tell me what kind and if they are psilocybin mushrooms. Thankyou


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OfflineBuster_Brown
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Re: NEED HELP IDENTIFYING. Are they Psilocybin?? [Re: Jackboy10]
    #26693412 - 05/24/20 06:50 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

No blueing bruises? Forget them, but I'm no expert.


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OfflineBuster_Brown
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Re: What is wealth? [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #26693430 - 05/24/20 06:55 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

There's karmic wealth and proprietorship wealth. Proprietorship wealth can avoid karmic debt. Karmic wealth can side-step proprietorship shenanigans.


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InvisibleDividedQuantumM
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Re: NEED HELP IDENTIFYING. Are they Psilocybin?? [Re: Jackboy10]
    #26693537 - 05/24/20 07:37 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Jackboy10 said:
Hey I found mushrooms in a front lawn, here are some pictures could some one tell me what kind and if they are psilocybin mushrooms. Thankyou






Try the Mushroom Hunting and Identification forum.


--------------------
Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: What is wealth? [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #26693634 - 05/24/20 08:16 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Buster_Brown said:
There's karmic wealth and proprietorship wealth. Proprietorship wealth can avoid karmic debt. Karmic wealth can side-step proprietorship shenanigans.



I really tried to wrap my mind around karma and all I get is a cross between, luck and self worth, such that you may treat yourself to experience you feel you deserve.

otherwise I think it is superstition.

how can you explain what you mean other than that?


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


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