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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: 1234go]
    #26678483 - 05/18/20 08:55 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Do you think all of Sweden is lacking compassion. I heard their numbers are bad. Seen their approach called a disaster.

As a whole they don't seem too upset with their response.


--------------------
:whyyy:


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Invisible1234go
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: bodhisatta] * 4
    #26678520 - 05/18/20 09:15 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Your behavior has nothing to do with how Sweden is responding to covid-19.


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Invisiblepirate-blues
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: 1234go] * 3
    #26678556 - 05/18/20 09:33 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Also there are plenty of Swedes who take issue with the government measures.


...Notably all the ones who are researchers and experts in this very subject!


https://forbetterscience.com/2020/04/07/swedish-scientists-call-for-evidence-based-policy-on-covid-19/


What a coincidence, right?


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Offlinejoodasgasoline
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: pirate-blues]
    #26678592 - 05/18/20 09:52 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

That article is such BS. Even the first sentence is a lie and exaggeration.


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Invisiblepirate-blues
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: joodasgasoline] * 2
    #26678609 - 05/18/20 10:01 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Fine disregard the article. Doesn't change the fact that 2000 Swedish researchers and scientists still signed the petition.


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InvisibleJokeshopbeard
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: joodasgasoline]
    #26678621 - 05/18/20 10:06 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

joodasgasoline said:
That article is such BS. Even the first sentence is a lie and exaggeration.



Which line please?

I don't see what you're referring to.


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe


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Offlinejoodasgasoline
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
    #26678633 - 05/18/20 10:14 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

"Sweden’s separate way of dealing, or rather of not dealing with coronavirus"


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InvisibleJokeshopbeard
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: joodasgasoline] * 4
    #26678636 - 05/18/20 10:17 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

LOL. Riiiiiiiight.

Such ambivalence, the rest of the article must be trash!!!

Meanwhile, in America..


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe


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Offlinejoodasgasoline
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
    #26678642 - 05/18/20 10:19 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

What's the point of that article if even the first sentence is a lie?


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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: bodhisatta] * 2
    #26678644 - 05/18/20 10:20 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:
Do you think all of Sweden is lacking compassion. I heard their numbers are bad. Seen their approach called a disaster.

As a whole they don't seem too upset with their response.




To be fair, Swedes had more trust of their government going in to their (light) lockdown measures
than US citizens tend to have with regards to their government


https://www.thelocal.se/20200511/coronavirus-survey-what-do-swedes-really-think-of-the-countrys-approach

Quote:

There have been some exceptions. Secondary schools and museums have been closed, sport fixtures cancelled and gatherings of more than 50 people banned. Swedes have been asked to stay at home if they are over 70 or are feeling unwell. Social distancing has been requested in public places. And on Thursday, the government urged Swedes to avoid unnecessary international travel and to limit car journeys within the country to two hours.



https://www.france24.com/en/20200517-sweden-s-covid-19-strategy-has-caused-an-amplification-of-the-epidemic

Quote:

Sweden has taken the rap for its handling of the coronavirus pandemic. Pictures taken from a certain angle of busy parks and bars, showing Swedes basking in the sunshine after a long, wet winter, suggest many people, especially the young, are carrying on as usual. Nothing could be further from the truth.

"There is a view in the British tabloids and some other media that life in Sweden is normal, and that Sweden is pursuing a coronavirus strategy based on developing herd immunity, but this is wrong," says James Savage, CEO, and Publisher of The Local, the English digital newspaper in Europe. "Life in Sweden is absolutely not going on as usual."

"Sweden is simply trying to flatten the curve and avoid a second spike," he observes. "The authorities' message can be muddled at times, but herd immunity is spoken of as a possible side-effect of the strategy, not the primary aim."

The aim is to limit the spread of the disease by making recommendations, rather than quarantines. The hope is that by keeping large parts of society open and following scientific advice, the country may avoid some of the worst social, economic, and medical consequences of the coronavirus pandemic.



https://www.forbes.com/sites/heatherfarmbrough/2020/05/14/why-swedens-approach-to-coronavirus-may-not-be-what-you--think/#2216329a2464

apparently the people who do not observe the guidelines are causing problems there as well
:shrug:

people are people wherever they are


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InvisibleJokeshopbeard
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: joodasgasoline] * 2
    #26678649 - 05/18/20 10:22 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

joodasgasoline said:
What's the point of that article if even the first sentence is a lie?



Would you care to break down how that sentence even can be a lie?

It is clearly purposefully ambivalent, and self contradictory.

I call shenanigans on your claim of it being 'a lie'.


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe


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Offlinejoodasgasoline
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
    #26678672 - 05/18/20 10:29 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Some retards who do not do any research might actually think that Sweden is not doing anything about the virus and allowing the virus to run rampant.


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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: pirate-blues]
    #26678684 - 05/18/20 10:34 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

pirate-blues said:
Also there are plenty of Swedes who take issue with the government measures.


...Notably all the ones who are researchers and experts in this very subject!


https://forbetterscience.com/2020/04/07/swedish-scientists-call-for-evidence-based-policy-on-covid-19/


What a coincidence, right?




Doctors are apparently also not pleased
and it is argued the high mortality rate in care homes has to do with lack of PPE

Quote:

Many Swedish experts have lambasted the government’s response to the pandemic. Twenty-two doctors and scientists demanded a change of tack in an editorial piece in the newspaper Dagens Nyheter, published on April 14. “The approach must be changed radically and quickly,” they implored. “As the virus spreads, we need to increase social distance […] Politicians must intervene, there is no alternative.”

As in many other countries, nursing homes have been a particular source of anguish. Although visits were banned on March 31, half of those 70 and older in Sweden who have died from Covid-19 were living in nursing homes, according to figures released at the end of April. Staff have warned that they lack personal protective equipment.

“They didn’t have time to take care of my mother,” one Stockholm resident – who claims his mother died of neglect in a nursing home while more than a third of its residents succumbed to the virus – told Agence-France-Presse last week.

“There are things which could have been done, and should be done, that would have altered the picture radically,” said Lena Einhorn, a Swedish virologist and critic of the government’s policy. If Sweden had implemented “a broad testing programme, and especially in elder care”, she continued, the authorities would have “known who is infected, and now, with antibody testing, who was infected”.

Einhorn said two further policies would have made a significant difference, without necessitating a full-blown lockdown: “If Sweden mandated a 14-day quarantine for all household members of someone sick with Covid-19, we would not have had this picture”, and if the country “closed restaurants, there would have been less possibility of aerosol spread (airborne transmission) of the virus”.



Quote:

Figures compiled by data analysis website Statista show that the total number of confirmed Covid-19 cases in Sweden has been increasing steadily since the beginning of April – and now stands at more than 29,000.

Statistics suggest that Sweden has performed poorly compared to its Scandinavian neighbours, which imposed strict lockdowns. Experts say the other Nordic countries are the most apt points of comparison, given their similar healthcare systems, socio-political cultures and levels of connectedness.

Reported coronavirus deaths per million in Sweden stand at 358, according to Statista – even higher than the hard-hit US, at 267. The Swedish figure is dramatically worse than those of Denmark (93), Finland (53) and Norway (44). In Sweden, “we’re seeing an amplification of the epidemic, because there’s simply more social contact”, said Lynn Goldman, dean of the Milken Institute School of Public Health at George Washington University in the US.

In response to a comment in late April hailing Sweden’s performance, Nicolas Nassim Taleb – a professor of risk engineering at New York University, famous for his book on probability and uncertainty The Black Swan – tweeted back: “Stop the bullshit. Sweden did HORRIBLE [sic] compared to Norway Denmark Finland.”



https://www.france24.com/en/20200517-sweden-s-covid-19-strategy-has-caused-an-amplification-of-the-epidemic

appear to have accidentally closed the article about PPE distribution in care homes
think it got closed due to finding a more recent story regarding improved practices being since put in place
Quote:

Finland has performed far better than Sweden with regard to protecting the elderly from the novel coronavirus outbreak, according to Anders Tegnell, Sweden's state epidemiologist.

"In this matter, we in Sweden can learn from Finland so that we could be just as effective," said the face of the country's unique response to the coronavirus pandemic.

As of Friday, Sweden had recorded 3,646 deaths from Covid-19, the disease caused by the virus and public health officials have not been able to bring the numbers down. The death toll in Finland on Friday was 287.

In Sweden, deaths from the disease among nursing home residents have been far higher than in other Nordic countries, with the capital region in Stockholm leading the count.

Tegnell was speaking in Stockholm during an update on the coronavirus situation in the world and in Sweden earlier this week. International media representatives, including Yle, were present at the press conference.

Tegnell told Yle that in recent weeks Sweden has been paying close attention to nurses' training and hygiene practices, as part of efforts to improve the situation at senior care homes.

The epidemiologist said that he hopes that the virus will not rampage through nursing homes in Finland in the future. He added that if that were to happen the death toll would also rise in Finland.

Tegnell said that it will only be possible to tell which country's approach to handling the crisis worked in a year or two. He added that until a vaccine is ready, people should be allowed to live a reasonably normal life.



https://yle.fi/uutiset/osasto/news/finland_better_at_protecting_seniors_from_virus_says_swedish_state_epidemiologist/11356014


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InvisibleJokeshopbeard
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: joodasgasoline] * 4
    #26678685 - 05/18/20 10:34 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Like how some retards might judge an entire article/essay because its first line shows a tiny, ironic, ambiguous jibe?

FYI - research involves more than just reading a single sentence.


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe


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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: joodasgasoline]
    #26678694 - 05/18/20 10:41 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

joodasgasoline said:
Some retards who do not do any research might actually think that Sweden is not doing anything about the virus and allowing the virus to run rampant.




ehhh,
anyone who reads past the first line will be exposed to knowledge of such
they provide a pretty detailed list within the article:
Quote:

Many countries have taken enormous measures to stop the spread of this pandemic, and have prepared themselves for large surges of COVID-19 patients. Measures taken already since mid-March include countries entering lockdown, banning gatherings, closing schools, banning visitors from early care homes, and enforcing social distancing policies in society.

In Sweden, a different direction is being taken in that rather than introducing strict bans, instead recommendations were formulated by the Public Health Authorities (Folkhälsomyndighet, FHM). These include:

    A proposal to the government to restrict public gatherings with more than 500 participants (March 11).
    Recommending staying at home when one is sick to avoid close contact with other people, and washing hands carefully to slow infection spread (March 16).
    For elderly (70+) to limit social contacts, and for employers who can, to let employees work from home (March 16).
    Recommending that colleges and upper secondary schools move to distance education _(March 17)
    To reconsider if the trip one plans to take is really necessary (March 19).
    To introduce new rules that restaurants, bars and cafés across the country avoid crowding at tables, buffets and counters, and that all service should occur at the table. Patrons are allowed to order and pick up their food and drink themselves only in so far as it is possible to do so without crowding (March 24).
    A further reduction of public gatherings from 500 to 50 participants (March 27).

As of April 1st, the most recently updated guidelines are that those who are symptomatic should stay home, to be careful with hand hygiene, and to follow social distancing practices. All operations in Sweden are responsible to, following FHM guidelines, take action to reduce the risk for infection spread. This can be informing the public, avoiding large gatherings, marking distances in queues, and offering the opportunities to wash hand with soap and water. Specific guidance is provided to shops, sports clubs, non-profit clubs and organizations, employers, and public transport, to follow guidelines for avoiding crowding, and to postpone unnecessary meetings and events.




the line, which in its complete form appears as "Sweden’s separate way of dealing, or rather of not dealing with coronavirus and COVID-19 pandemic has been widely criticised." is opening the article with a flippant opinion, but still at least doing journalistic due dilligence in providing contrasting information


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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: HamHead]
    #26678701 - 05/18/20 10:42 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)



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Offlinejoodasgasoline
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: Tantrika]
    #26678724 - 05/18/20 10:50 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Sweden should not change anything in their strategy. They are doing just fine. Their hospitals are not even close to being overwhelmed. Putting stricter rules will not change anything.


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: joodasgasoline]
    #26678772 - 05/18/20 11:12 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Sweden has a very high proportion of single person households apparently.


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InvisibleShroomerInTheRye
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: joodasgasoline] * 1
    #26678779 - 05/18/20 11:16 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)



--------------------
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Offlinejoodasgasoline
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Re: Viral outbreak in China - Coronavirus 2020 [Re: ShroomerInTheRye]
    #26678801 - 05/18/20 11:31 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Other countries will get those deaths once lockdowns are lifted and they get new spikes of infections. Pretty much everyone will get this relatively mild disease.


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