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Invisiblepaddoholland
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Registered: 02/14/01
Posts: 317
Loc: the Netherlands
Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!!
    #266635 - 03/07/01 02:02 AM (16 years, 6 months ago)

It's easy to make 80% alcohol out of 96%, just add some demineralised water and you will get a 80% concentration!
I'm not that big a grower yet but I have some microbiological bac background and will try to keep you updated if some interesting is happening in that world!!
Just trying to make this community work!
Peace



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Invisiblepsilocybe cubensis
Blood, guts, andbroken teeth.

Registered: 08/10/00
Posts: 1,220
Loc: Lost Angels
Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! *DELETED* [Re: paddoholland]
    #267389 - 03/07/01 06:17 AM (16 years, 6 months ago)

Post deleted by psilocybe cubensis


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OfflineSubmob
Freak of freaks

Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 48
Loc: here
Last seen: 10 years, 6 months
Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: psilocybe cubensis]
    #267883 - 03/08/01 12:06 AM (16 years, 6 months ago)

Interesting, thanx for the tip, btw where can 80% alchohol be purchased? Grocery stores just have the watered down isopropyll crap, is there a convenient place to purchase the good stuff?

De Omnibus Dubitandum


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Invisiblepaddoholland
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Registered: 02/14/01
Posts: 317
Loc: the Netherlands
Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: Submob]
    #267976 - 03/08/01 04:21 AM (16 years, 6 months ago)

80% alcohol can be made out of 96%!!!
Just add demineralised water in calculated proportions) to the 96%.
If not possible to purchase 96% it's a problem!!
peace:)



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Invisiblepaddoholland
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Registered: 02/14/01
Posts: 317
Loc: the Netherlands
Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!!
    #268490 - 03/09/01 02:02 AM (16 years, 6 months ago)

In reply to:

Originally posted by: Tygyrtoo
The best solution, and the one that is sold as U.S.P, is 70% ethanol to 30% water. This appears to have the ideal mix.



I have to comment that recent studies have found out that 80% is doing more damage than 70%. I have found out this fact at a microbiological company (examination of foods) wich I've worked for. And in college, a microbiological education they also teach us this fact!! :smile:PEACE:)



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OfflineSmurfy
journeyman
Registered: 11/17/00
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Loc: Canada
Last seen: 16 years, 4 months
Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: paddoholland]
    #269100 - 03/10/01 01:25 PM (16 years, 6 months ago)

Ok then whats the benefits of the 97% stuff over the 70%? In any uses.



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InvisibleSoup
enthusiast
Registered: 12/13/98
Posts: 29
Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: Smurfy]
    #269536 - 03/11/01 11:00 AM (16 years, 6 months ago)

9x% burns a lot better than 70%. Before I got my bacti-cinerator, very sweet by the way, I used 9x% for my alcohol lamp and you could really see the difference. 70% barely burns, it will, but it can be really inconsistent.



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OfflineKast
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Registered: 12/01/00
Posts: 222
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Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: Soup]
    #269744 - 03/11/01 05:31 PM (16 years, 6 months ago)

Why were you burning rubbing alcohol to begin with?

heh, soup, you always seem to get all of the good toys. You must have a lot of funds to play with. I'm jealous.




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Invisibleslither
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Registered: 02/03/01
Posts: 365
Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: Kast]
    #269751 - 03/11/01 05:49 PM (16 years, 6 months ago)

I know this is sort of off topic, but what kind of alcohol do most people use in alcohol lamps? Denatured, 96%, or everclear?



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InvisibleSoup
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Registered: 12/13/98
Posts: 29
Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: Kast]
    #269811 - 03/11/01 07:37 PM (16 years, 6 months ago)

I was burning the rubbing alcohol so that I could flame sterilize scalpels and what not. It's a lot easier than a lighter or fiddling around with a gas stove.

Now even easier is a bacti-cinerator. Needs no explanation. I don't have much money, just find relatively inexpensive ways to do things. I got my bacticinerator for $90 through E-bay. Not cheap, but not $300.



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OfflineShroomzilla
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Registered: 02/04/01
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Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: Soup]
    #269880 - 03/11/01 10:03 PM (16 years, 6 months ago)

I made my alcohol lamp from a small glass bottle, a strip of cotton material for the wick, bit of aluminum foil for the lid to hold the wick in place [original cap was plastic]. Works just fine and cost nothing. Burns cheap 70% rubbing alcohol at $0.89 cents per quart.



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OfflineKast
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Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: slither]
    #269944 - 03/11/01 11:28 PM (16 years, 6 months ago)

Well, until now I've never heard of anyone burning rubbing alcohol. Everyone I know, including myself, uses denatured alcohol which is extremely cheap and can be found in the paint section of hardware stores.




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Invisiblerebelmoon
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Registered: 04/05/00
Posts: 204
Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: Kast]
    #269967 - 03/11/01 11:54 PM (16 years, 6 months ago)

is the 80% alcohol ratio using isopropyl rubbing alcohol from drug stores or the denatured alchol that you use in your lamp? i am confused. i always just use 70% isopropyl straight outta the bottle. spray it and let dry. seems to work for me.
-daniel.




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Invisiblepaddoholland
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Registered: 02/14/01
Posts: 317
Loc: the Netherlands
Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: rebelmoon]
    #270045 - 03/12/01 02:05 AM (16 years, 6 months ago)

I have never said that 70% didn't work!
70% has been standard concentration in laboratories until they found out that 80% was doing more damage. 96% burns a lot better but it are only the flames wich kill the m.o.'s.
That's effective, but without burning, like cleaning the surface of the table your working on! I haven't seen anyone burning burning the surface of a table!!!


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OfflineShroomzilla
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Registered: 02/04/01
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Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: paddoholland]
    #270066 - 03/12/01 03:00 AM (16 years, 6 months ago)

70% iso or pure denatured..doesn't matter, as long as it burns clean it will work, its just a matter of what you have on hand.

Surface disinfection is another matter all together. Alcohol is actually a rather poor at killing spores. Other chemicals like chlorine bleach, iodine, or ammonium chloride are better for surface disinfection. 80% iso alcohol requires 10 minutes contact time to kill 99% of encysted spores...simply wiping don't cut it.

I use tamed iodine [like Betadine] to clean any mixing containers, jars, syringes, anything where you want it clean with ZERO residue. You can get Betadine brand at the drug store, brew shops sell the same stuff under various brands. This is the orange stuff they scrub your skin with before surgery or inserting an IV, also used for cleaning and soaking instruments. Kills 'bout everything but is safe enough to apply to the skin, only drawback is that it will stain any porus surface unless wiped off very well, stains will wash out of clothes.

For countertops/ floors/ sinks I use a quaternary ammonium chloride solition. It comes as a dry powder, used in hospitals to clean surfaces in the operating room, ER, anywhere you need it really clean. This stuff is a bit harder to find, I usually get it from a surplus dealer when I can [cheaper]. You can get it online from medical supply co's for about $20 for a 4lb tub [which will mix up about 120 gallons]. It kills everything [better than bleach] yet doesn't have any nasty choking fumes. It also rinses off pretty well leaving little residue, but if you leave it on, it will continue to disinfect the surface for about two weeks. I use it once a month in the shower and NEVER have a mildew problem, or that funky red basteria that can grow in areas that don't drain completely.

Most people use bleach because its cheap and readily available, but there are tons of problems with bleach. First is the smell/ fumes, it is very bad to breath this stuff at all, much less spraying it in the air like some grow guides suggest. It eventually leaves an impossible to remove residue on anything regularly cleaned with it, and is quite corossive to metal. It can also ruin some vinyl floors, and does a hasty number on any clothing it comes in contact with. It will also release poision gas if mixed with most any common household cleaners.

A note on Lysol: This stuff has been around for ages because it does work...to a point. It is quite safe on most surfaces and and does a good job of general cleaning/ disinfecting bacteria, but there are many types of mold spores it will not touch, and as we know mold spores are the #1 enemy. To be really effective [for what it will kill] it needs to be sprayed on heavy and allowed to set for at least 10 min. Spraying the air is useless, the FTC even made them remove the claim that it "disinfects the air" years ago. The only way to kill any airborne bacteria/spores is with a concentrated vapor of very, very deadly chemicals, nothing you or I could lay our hands on or would ever consider using.



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OfflineMNmyc
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Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 175
Loc: MN
Last seen: 10 years, 6 months
Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: Shroomzilla]
    #270195 - 03/12/01 11:04 AM (16 years, 6 months ago)

Eau contraire, Shroomzilla. Germicidal lamps sterilize air, and quite effectively too. You just can't expose your skin (or shroooms for that matter) because it shreds nuclear dna to turn mold, bacteria and viruses into microscopic scrambled eggs.

Also shadows and otherwise clear containers may provide a sort of 'bomb shelter' for cantams. to survive the exposure.

There is an ozone issue too, but waiting to enter the space for a 1/2 hour after a 10 minute exposure eliminates the risk from what I understand. Check out the 'heat and chem free sterilization' post. GE sells the bulbs for $25 for a 25w and they run in a standard ballast 18 in. fixture.

Of course, this is all speculation to me for now (I don't own one), but I am getting one and I hopefully will have some comparative results by June.

Help... I'm typing and I can't shut-up!


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OfflineKast
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Registered: 12/01/00
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Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: Shroomzilla]
    #270258 - 03/12/01 01:29 PM (16 years, 6 months ago)

I know what I'll do, I'll start doing all of my sterile procedures in space. That will solve the problem.

Of course nothing is going to be 100% effective, but mycologists around the world have used diluted bleach and Lysol for years with success so I see no reason to debate its effectiveness. HAZMAT teams even use a 10% bleach solution and tons of Lysol when they disinfect areas. 10% bleach will kill any living organism on the planet (volume relative to size of course). There's no way to achieve 100% sterility, especially outside of laboratory conditions.



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Invisiblepaddoholland
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Registered: 02/14/01
Posts: 317
Loc: the Netherlands
Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!!
    #270709 - 03/13/01 04:13 AM (16 years, 6 months ago)

80% is best when applied without burning, burns better than 70%. 96% burns best but doesn't kill the m.o.
It's better to sterilize all equipment in a pc, and for surface desinfection you should use as said above:
- quater ammonium
- bleach


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OfflineMNmyc
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Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 175
Loc: MN
Last seen: 10 years, 6 months
Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: paddoholland]
    #270713 - 03/13/01 04:28 AM (16 years, 6 months ago)

I absolutely agree, but I want a lab... How much do you spend on lysol and bleach before it is cost effective to find something else?

Help... I'm typing and I can't shut-up!


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Invisiblepaddoholland
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Registered: 02/14/01
Posts: 317
Loc: the Netherlands
Re: Alcohol 80% better than 96%!! [Re: MNmyc]
    #270716 - 03/13/01 04:41 AM (16 years, 6 months ago)

I have my own minilab. It is a flowhood on a table. I always desinfect before turning the flowhood on, after this I work under the flowhood so there is no microbiological contamination. The flowhood has a microfilter.
But I want to make a room with white floor and table. Sterile air circulation and a lockage before entering!!
Cost: a lot



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