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Psion
Sage
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Re: What is Love? [Re: Psion]
#26654226 - 05/07/20 01:28 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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i should probably mention i've had this sort of dilemma myself with wondering if everyone else is just a figment of my imagination, whether it's worth bothering to interact with other people, etc etc - it feels really weird as heck arguing from the other side.
like... now i'm talking to someone else, having to point out that even if i'm just a figment of someone elses imagination, i'm still myself as an individual and worth cultivating a relationship to. what a weird twist this has turned out to be! 
i guess in the end it really doesn't matter if we're "physical" beings, many beings, many personalities of one schitzophrenic being, all artificial intelligences in a simulation, or ghosts in an astral plane. the exact nature of what we are doesn't really matter so much as what we make of life.
what matters is - are you happy? does your view on life make you happy? if not, why are you bothering with it?
life has no meaning except what you make of it. it's a giant sandbox. you can make yourself miserable, or you can have fun! there's no sin in doing so, and so much joy in learning from others points of view, regardless if they're "real" or not.
I for one, choose to enjoy myself!
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oculodextro

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Re: What is Love? [Re: Psion] 1
#26654631 - 05/07/20 08:15 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Psion, beautifully said in your past two posts.
We are also full of viruses and bacteria, but yet we exist. Roughly 8% of our genome is viral DNA from our ancestors. Yet we still function.
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The Blind Ass
Bodhi



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A nod to interdependent origination and interconnectedness to me.
-------------------- Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps
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oculodextro

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I'm a man of science, but slowly getting into spirituality/Buddhism. Thanks for the topics to look into!
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AroundtheSon
Learning to See



Registered: 01/11/07
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Quote:
The Blind Ass said: Link?
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/16007021#16007021
Apollypheion (I won't bother to spell it)
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lifeiswhatyoumake
Sake Psychic sig


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Quote:
lifeiswhatyoumake said: I assume you've never tried shrooms.
Quote:
Thanatos10 said: shrooms are just a scrambling of reality, not detachment.
Have you actually tried shrooms?
-------------------- Check out my new psytrance track "Sake Psychic": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xyEPGfiDrA ;
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Psion
Sage
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i thought that way before i tried shrooms too, but now i realize what many scientists are coming to realize - there is no objective reality. reality is a multifaceted, multidimensional thing, with many perspectives. you cannot perceive the truth with just one viewpoint, or even just a couple - you have to take in many different perspectives to get just the faintest glimmer of "reality" in its true form.
only to realize that you can never really truly grasp reality, just as you can never truly "understand" art - because it's infinity piled upon infinity. reality isn't some static thing - it's constantly expanding, growing, improving on itself. new worlds, new laws, new ways of doing things. and just like everyone has a different opinion of what music is the "best" kind of music, everyone would have a different idea of what the "best" kind of reality is. and that's fine! there's room enough in the multiverse for everyone to be happy, if not in this life, than in another.
i guess thats why art calls to people so much - it's an act of creating of new possibilities, of communicating those new possibilities to others, just as reality is constantly doing so as time goes forward.
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LogicaL Chaos
Ascension Energy & Alien UFOs




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Detachment from Reality is totally possible with psychedelics. Take DMT for example. When you smoke a high dose of DMT, that is Reality detachment because it feels nothing like reality. You literally travel to another place within your own mind.
Just like fictional books. Are fictional books "Reality"? Sure, they based on real things like people, objects, animals, places, words, concepts, emotions, etc BUT the events of the fictional book are not real. The people in the fictional book are Not real. The creatures in a Fantasy book are Not real. Its a Creative outlet for the Mind to enjoy. They exist only in our minds as "real". Based on reality but NOT reality itself. Does that make sense?
And thats the Wisdom of Truth, knowing the difference between what is Real within Reality and what only exist inside the Mind thats based on real things.
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Oceanshorex
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true love - something u really like or love yourself.
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oculodextro

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Re: What is Love? [Re: Psion]
#26655600 - 05/07/20 05:06 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Also anyone who thinks too much about the past or future, tends to be anxious. You are not present, not that being present really shows you the true reality.
But most of us are too busy living in the past (what could of been), or worrying about the future (what could be)
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Thanatos10
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Re: What is Love? [Re: Psion]
#26655644 - 05/07/20 05:30 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Psion said:
Quote:
Thanatos10 said:
Quote:
oculodextro said: Check out the Midnight Gospel. Kinda a crash course in Buddhism, Occultism, and various other philosophical problems, animated with some dark trippyness.
That show gets a lot wrong about life and existence.
But the point Psion made is incorrect. The problem I have is that I’m scared of there being evidence of it because then I truly couldn’t forget about solipsism and I would be alone and life wouldn’t be worth living at that point. Right now it’s not having evidence for either and not knowing how to react. Basing the foundation of your whole life on pure belief isn’t very strong.
Your character evaluation of me is also wrong, it’s like you haven’t even read this entire thread or what is being said.
if there's no evidence, then it's not real. it's as simple as that. if evidence shows up, then you can change your mind and life won't be worth living at that point. key word: AT. THAT. POINT. you can have that existentialist crisis AT. THAT. POINT.
you're freaking out over vampires and mindflayers, here. and consider this - your body is made up of billions upon billions of cells, each that seems individual but works together to form one being. even if somehow everyone was somehow figments of your imagination, it would still be akin to that analogy - each of those "figments" would be like a cell, each making up part of a greater whole. in other words, despite being "imaginary" they still are part of something "greater", and therefore are not "nothing". because you cannot be a part of something greater and be worthless.
you cannot build a house with bricks that don't exist, after all. even if you are the only being, those figments that would theoretically make up part of you are still individual pieces with their own boundaries, their own lives. in other words, they may be you, but they are also themselves. cultivating relationships with them would, therefore, be the same as cultivating a deeper relationship with yourself.
however, what you perceived is really just a warped sense of the All made One, the fact that everyone and everything is tied together in subtle and obvious relationships. the whole food chain, web of life thing? that's sort of a very, VERY simplistic way of seeing it. just a small action, like you throwing away a piece of trash, influences countless organisms, in ways neutral, beneficial, and negative, which ripples to more living things yet, whether it's bacteria breaking down the crumbs for food, creatures choking on the plastic waste and dying, some taking shelter in it, or others eating the dead carcass that died on the waste.
and that's just one tiny action you took.
it's not that you're the only being in the universe - it's just that you perceived how in a sense, everything is One, that we are all God. i compare it as something akin to a crystal, one with many facets - each of us a face that reflects its own light, but all connected. or like a melody, each of us our own note to play at the right time, but part of a greater song. it can also be seen as a dance, each of us a different position, constantly shifting and moving.
You are getting away from solipsism. The problem is that I can not verify the existence of any of those externalities you mention. It could all just be figments of my mind, being utterly meaningless. I could believe your words but the word here is belief. I (according to solipsism) cannot truly know such things to be so.
-------------------- As lightless oblivion devours you, drown in the ever-blooming darkness.
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Thanatos10
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Quote:
oculodextro said: Also anyone who thinks too much about the past or future, tends to be anxious. You are not present, not that being present really shows you the true reality.
But most of us are too busy living in the past (what could of been), or worrying about the future (what could be)
Anxiety can be in the present as well, especially since it’s only in the present. You’re talking about a rather blithe phrase of mindfulness.
-------------------- As lightless oblivion devours you, drown in the ever-blooming darkness.
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LogicaL Chaos
Ascension Energy & Alien UFOs




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I learned a new word today!
blithe - "showing a casual and cheerful indifference considered to be callous or improper."
A rather depressing meaning but i do Love to learn new things 
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Psion
Sage
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Quote:
LogicaL Chaos said: Detachment from Reality is totally possible with psychedelics. Take DMT for example. When you smoke a high dose of DMT, that is Reality detachment because it feels nothing like reality. You literally travel to another place within your own mind.
Just like fictional books. Are fictional books "Reality"? Sure, they based on real things like people, objects, animals, places, words, concepts, emotions, etc BUT the events of the fictional book are not real. The people in the fictional book are Not real. The creatures in a Fantasy book are Not real. Its a Creative outlet for the Mind to enjoy. They exist only in our minds as "real". Based on reality but NOT reality itself. Does that make sense?
And thats the Wisdom of Truth, knowing the difference between what is Real within Reality and what only exist inside the Mind thats based on real things.
i think we have a different definition of reality here. when i say reality, i mean Reality. as in, reality in terms of the multiverse, not reality in terms of the local reality. it's entirely possible to detach from the local reality thanks to psychedelics. getting outside the entire box of the multiverse, on the other hand, is an entire different box of shrodinger kittens.
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LogicaL Chaos
Ascension Energy & Alien UFOs




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Re: What is Love? [Re: Psion]
#26655707 - 05/07/20 06:13 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Good point! I reference Reality as what your mind precieves locally: Smells, sights, sounds, tactile, heat, cold, u get the idea....
But yeah, escaping the Multiverse, impossible. From what Ive read in my Pleiadian Spirituality books, even Souls cannot escape the Universe they are born in. We are "stuck" but stuck in a beautiful place full of Wonderful things
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Psion
Sage
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Quote:
Thanatos10 said:
You are getting away from solipsism. The problem is that I can not verify the existence of any of those externalities you mention. It could all just be figments of my mind, being utterly meaningless. I could believe your words but the word here is belief. I (according to solipsism) cannot truly know such things to be so.
of course i'm getting away from solipsism. it's a divide by 0 problem, one of those things in math that you right NS as the answer for. you do not try to solve such a problem because there's no way of solving it, and there's no point in trying to solve it.
and i already pointed out that even if we were figments of your mind, it still isn't meaningless to cultivate such relationships, any more than it is to get to know yourself better. an martial artist does not get better at combat by netflix and chill - they do it by practice and attuning to the various parts of their body, by getting to know the individual pieces of themselves. that's not pointless at all! that's self improvement, and by improving their bodies health, they also improve their mental health as well!
what affects one part affects all.
and stop trying to pretend that some almighty brainiac that invented every science invention that ever existed. you know better than that. you're just a person. we're all just people, each with our own flaws and talents. all imperfect, seeking each other out, helping each other up to grow stronger and improve ourselves.
at least in an ideal world.
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The Blind Ass
Bodhi



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Posts: 26,732
Loc: The Primordial Mind
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Re: What is Love? [Re: Psion]
#26656010 - 05/07/20 08:43 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Mindfulness is a faculty of the mind, and it translates more so into “Rememberance” or the capacity or ability to remember - Aka “Memory”.
It can be cultivated, sharpened, honed, or it can diminish and become dull and in extreme cases essentially lost (dementia etc)
I dont know why anyone thinks mindfulness is anything else.
-------------------- Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
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Quote:
Thanatos10 said: You’re talking about a rather blithe phrase of mindfulness.
I love you man. You're annoying as shit, you really are, but you have a childlike innocence that it is so sweet.
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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Thanatos10
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Re: What is Love? [Re: Psion]
#26656298 - 05/07/20 11:11 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Psion said:
Quote:
Thanatos10 said:
You are getting away from solipsism. The problem is that I can not verify the existence of any of those externalities you mention. It could all just be figments of my mind, being utterly meaningless. I could believe your words but the word here is belief. I (according to solipsism) cannot truly know such things to be so.
of course i'm getting away from solipsism. it's a divide by 0 problem, one of those things in math that you right NS as the answer for. you do not try to solve such a problem because there's no way of solving it, and there's no point in trying to solve it.
and i already pointed out that even if we were figments of your mind, it still isn't meaningless to cultivate such relationships, any more than it is to get to know yourself better. an martial artist does not get better at combat by netflix and chill - they do it by practice and attuning to the various parts of their body, by getting to know the individual pieces of themselves. that's not pointless at all! that's self improvement, and by improving their bodies health, they also improve their mental health as well!
what affects one part affects all.
and stop trying to pretend that some almighty brainiac that invented every science invention that ever existed. you know better than that. you're just a person. we're all just people, each with our own flaws and talents. all imperfect, seeking each other out, helping each other up to grow stronger and improve ourselves.
at least in an ideal world.
Again you keep missing the point. Also it is meaningless to cultivate relationships with figments because they aren’t real. They don’t feel and don’t feel for you. Also I can attest that improving the body doesn’t help with mental health.
Again you are still using terms that cannot be validated to be true or exist lie other people or just others. Why assume additional entities? Isn’t solipsism the simplest explanation?
And what of my dreams of “seeing the future”? Could that not be a case for shaping reality? How else could I dream of something and having it happen later on?
-------------------- As lightless oblivion devours you, drown in the ever-blooming darkness.
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Quote:
Thanatos10 said: Also I can attest that improving the body doesn’t help with mental health.
Right. Because of all the six million studies out there that disagree with you?
Along with all the anectdotal evidence from people on this forum?
Along with all the masses of physical exercise you do?
Stirling detective work there Shirlock. Tally-ho!!
-------------------- Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not. --Jac O'keeffe
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