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Offlinegabbk
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Improving genetics by cloning clones
    #26651713 - 05/05/20 09:04 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Hi guys. I'm sure you've already discussed this topic at least once. I tried to search by submitting in the search engine the following video link and trying "home mycology" (the YouTube channel) and nothing.

Basically he says you can improve your yields and genetics by cloning a clone repetitively. The idea exposed on the video is to start from MS, choose the best clone, agar it, spawn the clone, choose the best clone from that spawn, and then again and again until you hit the fifth clone; the idea is to narrow down the genetics by selecting the better clones that appear in each spawn run, and by the time you hit the fifth clone, you would print it to save the work, to get a checkpoint of those genetics you've been narrowing down all this time and also prevent senescense.
In theory it sounds cool, but does this really work?
Thanks, and sorry again for bothering with a repetitive topic, I really tried searching.
Appreciate the responses.


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Offlinemushpunx
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Re: Improving genetics by cloning clones [Re: gabbk]
    #26651755 - 05/05/20 09:26 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

There is no point in cloning a clone.
Also, when you take a spore print from a clone, you are basically hitting the reset button.

If you were to say, start from MS, clone, fruit that clone, spore print it, grow that out as MS, clone, fruit, spore print + keep repeating this process, you could get a variety that is more likely to display the cosmetic traits you chose when grown from spores. It is my understanding that this is how wild mushrooms eventually become domesticated varieties.


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Edited by mushpunx (05/05/20 09:35 PM)


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Offlinemushpunx
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Re: Improving genetics by cloning clones [Re: mushpunx]
    #26651769 - 05/05/20 09:32 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

If you want to find good fruiting cultures, just keep taking clones and fruiting them out until you find a keeper, which you would store as a live culture.

You could also do strain isolations and test them until you find good fruiting cultures.
I prefer to clone.


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Edited by mushpunx (05/05/20 09:36 PM)


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Offlinegabbk
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Re: Improving genetics by cloning clones [Re: mushpunx]
    #26651784 - 05/05/20 09:38 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Well I think I misspoke or I don't get what you are saying (English is not my native language), but the dude is saying the latter paragraph of your first post. He says within that method "start from MS, clone, fruit that clone, spore print it, grow that out as MS, clone, fruit, spore print + keep repeating this process" you could get a really good set of genetics.
What you are saying is what I referred to 'cloning a clone', that whole process you described


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Edited by gabbk (05/05/20 09:40 PM)


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Offlinegabbk
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Re: Improving genetics by cloning clones [Re: gabbk]
    #26651799 - 05/05/20 09:45 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

So the "accumulative" process of selecting the best fruit in each spawn is doable?
I see it like 'upgrading' the first clone, so to speak. At your first grow you pick the nicest one, you agar it, then with that sample you make another spawn, then pick the best fruit out, agar, spawn, select, agar... Am I getting the idea right?


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Offlinemushpunx
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Re: Improving genetics by cloning clones [Re: gabbk]
    #26651810 - 05/05/20 09:58 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

gabbk said:
So the "accumulative" process of selecting the best fruit in each spawn is doable?
I see it like 'upgrading' the first clone, so to speak. At your first grow you pick the nicest one, you agar it, then with that sample you make another spawn, then pick the best fruit out, agar, spawn, select, agar... Am I getting the idea right?





If you do what you are describing, you would just be cloning the same clone over and over again.
You are leaving out an entire step.

Start from MS, choose a fruit to clone to agar, then grow this clone.
At this point, you would choose a fruit with traits you like and spore print it.

Then you start from MS that new spore print , clone a fruit to agar, grow that clone out, and then again choose a fruit with traits you like and spore print that.

Then MS again from the next new spore print and repeat..


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Offlinegabbk
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Re: Improving genetics by cloning clones [Re: mushpunx]
    #26651815 - 05/05/20 10:03 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Ohhhhh now I got you.. so THAT is the way to go and get progressively better fruits, right? Not by cloning a clone as I were saying
Thanks a lot!!


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Edited by gabbk (05/05/20 10:04 PM)


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Offlinemushpunx
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Re: Improving genetics by cloning clones [Re: gabbk] * 1
    #26651827 - 05/05/20 10:13 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

gabbk said:
Ohhhhh now I got you.. so THAT is the way to go and get progressively better fruits, right?
Thanks a lot!!





Well no. That is only how you start a variety that is more likely to have certain cosmetic traits when you grow it from spore print.


The way to clone for better fruits is easy.

1. Clone a fruit to agar.

2. Grow out your clone to test how it fruits. Eat your clone to test how potent it is.

3. Save clone culture in the refrigerator.

You just keep cloning and testing out your clones until you find a good one.


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OfflineA.k.aM
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Re: Improving genetics by cloning clones [Re: mushpunx]
    #26651866 - 05/05/20 10:51 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

As soon as spores are involved it’s no longer cloning basically, just an ms grow that happened to be spores from a cloned culture.


The whole process is pretty interesting and complicated.

The thread where rusty whyte was made and stabilized is by far the best reading about this I’ve come across.


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InvisiblePiptheGreAtest
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Re: Improving genetics by cloning clones [Re: A.k.a]
    #26651918 - 05/05/20 11:58 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

So in turn the best way to capture a highly desirable characteristic is from cloning the fruit that displays trait and just keep cline culture. From what I understand cloning a clone is not improving your position by any? Another question if you were to tragedy something ambiguous like colonization speed or yield, how do you select the fruit to clone, variety through out tub? Than taking the spore print of the clone grow would eliminate your previous work and you’d have to begin the selection process over? Final question here little off topic, using LC best practice is keeping a master culture to bro g just one generation about verse expanding 1 to2nd etc, so farther away from master you get weakens potency or viability? Great topic OP!


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: Improving genetics by cloning clones [Re: gabbk]
    #26651958 - 05/06/20 01:00 AM (3 years, 9 months ago)

That sounds like it would be a decent technique for "domesticating" a wild print.


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