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Onlinefeevers
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Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes * 2
    #26647740 - 05/04/20 10:27 AM (28 days, 7 hours ago)

Trump says next coronavirus relief bill has to include payroll tax cut

https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/495901-trump-says-next-coronavirus-relief-bill-has-to-include-payroll-tax


Quote:

The tax cut would disproportionately give more money to people with higher incomes, who typically have more savings to fall back on during a crisis like the coronavirus pandemic.

A payroll tax cut would also do nothing to help those who lost their jobs because of the crisis, especially lower-income people in industries like tourism, hospitality, and dining that have been especially hit hard by the pandemic and decline in demand from consumers.




Quote:

Payroll taxes include:

    Social Security, which takes out 6.2% of your income up to $132,900.
    Medicare, which takes out 1.45% of your income. Married couples filing jointly who make $250,000 or more, and people who make over $200,000, pay an additional 0.9%.

Employers also pay payroll taxes. They pay 6.2% of your income, so the government gets 12.4% of your total income, and they pay 1.45% of your income toward Medicare as well.





https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-what-is-payroll-tax-cut-explained-2020-3



So essentially people may be giving up an undetermined portion of their retirement income and healthcare, bailing out those who require no bailout, for a couple more $1200 checks.

While Mitch McConnell is demanding legal immunity for corporations that choose not to take precautions to protect employees from the virus.



It's almost like they don't care very much about the lower/middle class or something.


Edited by feevers (05/04/20 10:33 AM)


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: feevers]
    #26647792 - 05/04/20 10:55 AM (28 days, 6 hours ago)

Quote:

feevers said:
It's almost like they don't care very much about the lower/middle class or something.



Almost like that?  :rofl2:


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I am stupid for thinking feldman114 was wrong about the New York Times being a mainstream (non-establishment) paper.  I now clearly see that it is.

Note - This signature ended up as a badge of honor since the New York Times turned out to be  far more corrupt than either of us thought.


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Onlineqman
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 2
    #26648141 - 05/04/20 01:40 PM (28 days, 4 hours ago)

Where did Trump demand cuts to social security and Medicare payments?  It's a payroll cut, NOT a social service cut.


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Onlinefeevers
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: qman]
    #26648228 - 05/04/20 02:18 PM (28 days, 3 hours ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Where did Trump demand cuts to social security and Medicare payments?  It's a payroll cut, NOT a social service cut.




Where do you think funding for medicare, social security, and federal unemployment directly comes from?

So when an administration that has already put out budget proposals to drastically cut medicare and social security, demands cuts to the funding source for social security and medicare, that's not going to be a social service cut just because it's labeled as a "payroll tax cut"?

When Obama cut payroll taxes by 2%, social security lost $100,000,000,000/yr revenue. That cut had specific legislation in it to transfer losses from the fed's general fund to SS. Trump proposed a cut more than three times that amount, to 0%, with no mention of attempts to redistribute money into it. The Senate is run by someone who goes to sleep every night dreaming of these cuts, and the democrats in the house have mostly shown their unwillingness to go to bat for the lower/middle class in any meaningful way.

It seems like a pretty cut and dry agenda play. Even if the workers saw a 6.2% wage increase as a result of the tax break (which many companies would find ways to swallow up anyway), it'd only be the people who still have jobs and likely need the money the least as a result of COVID who get the benefit, with the wealthier seeing a larger benefit. It's not like anyone has a whole lot of places to spend it right now to stimulate the economy, whereas giving more to people who are out of work and can't even afford essentials right now would actually get money circulating again as many would have no choice but to spend it immediately.


Edited by feevers (05/04/20 02:34 PM)


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Onlineqman
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: feevers] * 2
    #26648291 - 05/04/20 02:38 PM (28 days, 3 hours ago)

I agree that fiscal austerity is coming, I have been suggesting that outcome in this forum for several years. As of right now, the cuts haven't been made. Yes, this crisis will be used to cut social entitlements, it's inevitable.

https://www.commondreams.org/news/2019/11/14/senate-democrats-join-gop-back-automatic-austerity-bill-would-gut-social-programs

It's up to the people to either accept the outcome or hit the streets in protest. I don't have much hope for the US population, we tend to just take the abuse and blame the "opposing" political party.

The Banksters on Wall Street demand 0% to negative interest rates, that means Main Street must live in a perpetual recession/depression. Demand must be reduced to maintain that outcome.


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Onlinefeevers
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: qman] * 1
    #26648327 - 05/04/20 02:57 PM (28 days, 2 hours ago)

Quote:

qman said:

It's up to the people to either accept the outcome or hit the streets in protest. I don't have much hope for the US population, we tend to just take the abuse and blame the "opposing" political party.





That's the ugliest part of it to me. The only people out there protesting right now are literally protesting for the status quo of society, in a way that's directly going to hurt them when there's a second outbreak, another shutdown, another "stimulus" handout to the elites, more job loss and small business closures, etc. Then on the other side you can't even mention how we'll eventually reopen to many democrats without them thinking you want to kill their grandmother.

It's a talking point battle between tunnel visioned ideologies. No one is focusing on the systems that collapse instantly when perfectly inevitable and predictable events like a viral outbreak occur. Meanwhile all the money is pouring into the pockets of those who sculpted many of these failing systems in the first place.


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OfflineKryptos
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: qman] * 3
    #26648623 - 05/04/20 06:11 PM (27 days, 23 hours ago)

Quote:

qman said:
I agree that fiscal austerity is coming, I have been suggesting that outcome in this forum for several years.




The day a democrat takes office is the day the deficit becomes the biggest problem in the world on fox news.


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Offlinemeltdowner
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: feevers]
    #26649275 - 05/04/20 11:53 PM (27 days, 17 hours ago)

Quote:

feevers said:
Quote:

qman said:
Where did Trump demand cuts to social security and Medicare payments?  It's a payroll cut, NOT a social service cut.




Where do you think funding for medicare, social security, and federal unemployment directly comes from?

So when an administration that has already put out budget proposals to drastically cut medicare and social security, demands cuts to the funding source for social security and medicare, that's not going to be a social service cut just because it's labeled as a "payroll tax cut"?

When Obama cut payroll taxes by 2%, social security lost $100,000,000,000/yr revenue. That cut had specific legislation in it to transfer losses from the fed's general fund to SS. Trump proposed a cut more than three times that amount, to 0%, with no mention of attempts to redistribute money into it. The Senate is run by someone who goes to sleep every night dreaming of these cuts, and the democrats in the house have mostly shown their unwillingness to go to bat for the lower/middle class in any meaningful way.

It seems like a pretty cut and dry agenda play. Even if the workers saw a 6.2% wage increase as a result of the tax break (which many companies would find ways to swallow up anyway), it'd only be the people who still have jobs and likely need the money the least as a result of COVID who get the benefit, with the wealthier seeing a larger benefit. It's not like anyone has a whole lot of places to spend it right now to stimulate the economy, whereas giving more to people who are out of work and can't even afford essentials right now would actually get money circulating again as many would have no choice but to spend it immediately.




Ah, so its fake news.  What your headline implies does not equal what happened.  Hence fake news.  Theres no point to read further because you lied in the headline alone.


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: meltdowner] * 3
    #26650666 - 05/05/20 02:42 PM (27 days, 3 hours ago)

The bizarre thing to me is that trump voters aren't crawling under a rock to hide in shame. No, they will try their best to re-elect this fuck.


must.. suck.. billionaire.. dick.. with.. dying.. breath...


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Onlinefeevers
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: Asante] * 1
    #26650692 - 05/05/20 02:50 PM (27 days, 2 hours ago)

Quote:

Asante said:
The bizarre thing to me is that trump voters aren't crawling under a rock to hide in shame. No, they will try their best to re-elect this fuck.


must.. suck.. billionaire.. dick.. with.. dying.. breath...




You'd be surprised how many people would rather be irreversibly fucked over than admit they were wrong or leave the "team" that they thought they were a part of.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: qman] * 2
    #26652704 - 05/06/20 12:49 PM (26 days, 4 hours ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Where did Trump demand cuts to social security and Medicare payments?  It's a payroll cut, NOT a social service cut.



It's a cut to paying into social security, so it runs out of money faster.

Trump is insisting on a payroll tax cut for workers. Why some experts say it’s a ‘terrible’ idea
Quote:

The $2 trillion CARES Act implemented by Congress gave employers a temporary reprieve from payroll taxes until the end of the year. That goes for Social Security and certain railroad retirement taxes.

Financial experts are generally not a fan of such a move. One big reason for that is the policy would help only the still employed and not those who are out of work and have been hardest hit by the coronavirus pandemic.



People who still have their jobs aren't the ones who need help right now, especially at the expense of social security.


--------------------
I am stupid for thinking feldman114 was wrong about the New York Times being a mainstream (non-establishment) paper.  I now clearly see that it is.

Note - This signature ended up as a badge of honor since the New York Times turned out to be  far more corrupt than either of us thought.


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Onlineqman
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #26652772 - 05/06/20 01:34 PM (26 days, 4 hours ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

qman said:
Where did Trump demand cuts to social security and Medicare payments?  It's a payroll cut, NOT a social service cut.



It's a cut to paying into social security, so it runs out of money faster.

Trump is insisting on a payroll tax cut for workers. Why some experts say it’s a ‘terrible’ idea
Quote:

The $2 trillion CARES Act implemented by Congress gave employers a temporary reprieve from payroll taxes until the end of the year. That goes for Social Security and certain railroad retirement taxes.

Financial experts are generally not a fan of such a move. One big reason for that is the policy would help only the still employed and not those who are out of work and have been hardest hit by the coronavirus pandemic.



People who still have their jobs aren't the ones who need help right now, especially at the expense of social security.




It's going to provide the perfect justification for entitlement cuts.  If Biden gets elected, he'll be the bearer of bad news. Never let a crisis go to waste.


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Onlineqman
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: qman] * 2
    #26652902 - 05/06/20 02:51 PM (26 days, 2 hours ago)

"Trump Pushes Tax Cut Designed To Crush Social Security"



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Onlinefeevers
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: qman] * 1
    #26652939 - 05/06/20 03:18 PM (26 days, 2 hours ago)

Quote:

qman said:
"Trump Pushes Tax Cut Designed To Crush Social Security"






Just a payroll tax cut. You know, a cut on payroll taxes. Nothing to see here.

:rolleyes:


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Onlinekoods
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: qman]
    #26652955 - 05/06/20 03:27 PM (26 days, 2 hours ago)

Quote:

qman said:
I agree that fiscal austerity is coming.




Yep. The moment a Democrat is elected president, the deficit will suddenly matter to republicans again.


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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: feevers]
    #26653024 - 05/06/20 04:05 PM (26 days, 1 hour ago)



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Onlineqman
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: Shenmue]
    #26653100 - 05/06/20 04:50 PM (26 days, 56 minutes ago)

Peter Schiff is stupid.


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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: qman]
    #26653164 - 05/06/20 05:28 PM (26 days, 18 minutes ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Peter Schiff is stupid.




First video I've seen of his lol. I was half way through it and thought I would post it just to see what people thought about him. He does make good points. I didn't agree with everything he said but for the most part he's right. I don't believe everyone in the 1% is like jeff Bezos or bill Gates. Some of them are evil but I highly doubt all of them are.


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Onlinefeevers
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: Shenmue]
    #26653169 - 05/06/20 05:31 PM (26 days, 15 minutes ago)

Quote:

Shenmue said:
Quote:

qman said:
Peter Schiff is stupid.




First video I've seen of his lol. I was half way through it and thought I would post it just to see what people thought about him. He does make good points. I didn't agree with everything he said but for the most part he's right. I don't believe everyone in the 1% is like jeff Bezos or bill Gates. Some of them are evil but I highly doubt all of them are.




What does that have to do with this thread though?


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Onlinefeevers
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Re: Trump demands cuts to social security and medicare, pandemic relief for people with higher incomes [Re: feevers]
    #26653191 - 05/06/20 05:44 PM (26 days, 2 minutes ago)

The only public congressman's comment on this I could find was:

“That's not the way I would tend to go,” Sen. Bill Cassidy, R-La., told CNN. “If you're not working, it's not going to benefit you. And I am very concerned about the shortfalls in the Medicare and Social Security trust funds. So for those two reasons, I would probably say no."

CNN and other media saying Pelosi said "No Way" about agreeing to the cut, but from the video it only looked like she just doesn't like being given an ultimatum.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2020/05/04/nancy-pelosi-payroll-tax-cut-trump-response-sot-tsr-vpx.cnn/video/playlists/this-week-in-politics/

If I were to guess at this point I'd say it slips through, and gets extended for a long time as COVID flares up and second and third waves come crashing down. Congress can just pass responsibility on to Trump once (or even if) any backlash starts since it was his ultimatum, and Trump will just absorb it and be unaffected as always.


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