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 Loaded Shaman
Psychophysiologist
 
Registered: 03/02/15
Posts: 8,011
Loc: Now O'Clock
Last seen: 7 days, 20 hours
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 Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask.  [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
#26642677 - 05/02/20 02:33 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Jokeshopbeard said:
Quote:
CookieCrumbs said:
Some people fear death more than they fear wasting their life. I understand that. But you should understand too that some people are afraid of some things more than death.
This is what grinds my gears about people who take the stance of OP. He say's he's not scared - great, neother am I - I'm actually excited about the adventure that is death, but you can't take ones own feelings on any aspect of the human experience and apply them to all. It's just sheer hubris to not take into account that some may feel the oppostite of you; especially when acting on your feelings (like refusing to wear a mask because... urr why?) has potential to cause suffering.
I.e you are asymptomatic and pass it to a person who passes it to seven people, three of which die. Think of the grief the families of said people will feel.
I'm all for freedom, it's the most imporant thing in the world to me, but not when it comes at the cost of innocent lives and avoidable suffering.
You're not wrong, but everything you just said can literally be flipped the other way.
You'd never know who infected who or caused who to die, just like daily life. You might have done so many things that catalyzed someone else dying, butterfly effect style. We can infinite regress that all day. The difference here is the government is relying on you to reason out of irrational caution, despite the science and numbers proving the opposite of what political officials are insisting is happening.
I'm not claiming anything is fake at all. I'm saying people in positions of power will gladly lie to you to make you think you're smart for doing what you're told, vs thinking for yourself, even if you still end up going along to get along.
If tomorrow the government "revealed" that standing on 1 foot for 109.5 seconds every 3 hours reduced infections by 10%, while providing little to no actual data to support this - or worse, contradict their own data - guess what you'd see everyone and their mom doing the next day?
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"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one’s ignorance." — Confucius
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 Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student
Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system 
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: Loaded Shaman] 1
#26642684 - 05/02/20 02:40 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Of course. That is all obvious. But FFS; it's just wearing a mask.
It's not like they're coming for your guns.
I find often, American people are so obsessed with freedom (I think, as it's such a huge part of the cultural identity) that to anyone not born and raised here they really do act in the most ridiculous (and often childish/unreasonable) ways when they perceieve said freedoms as under even the slightest attack. This is a classic example of that. So you have to be - midly uncomforable - in public, to save a few lives (potentially).
Big fucking deal man. Stressing over something so minor just makes people look like uncaring, only thinking of themselves, assholes.
I'll be right on the front lines with you if they really try to take freedom, but pick you battles, you know?
Still, with as many friends here as I have who are ardent gun owners, I've come to know what the likely response is in these situations.
It is, IMHO, very, very irrational and emotional.
I probably would be too if much of my indentity were based on cultural, rather than personal freedom.
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Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe
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Loaded Shaman
Psychophysiologist
Registered: 03/02/15
Posts: 8,011
Loc: Now O'Clock
Last seen: 7 days, 20 hours
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
#26642696 - 05/02/20 02:55 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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I don't disagree at all brother. Simply stating the logistics lol. BANADA just got rid of guns, so IMHO people have just as much reason to get upset over that as they do masks, etc.
For the record I think ALL of this is ridiculous, but I absolutely wear a mask when grocery shopping because as you said being VIOLENTLY FREE is counterproductive. As a true libertarian I realize not wearing a mask is a violation of the NAP. My question is why the government gets to decide we need masks LOL; are people too stupid to use common sense, that if the government doesn't tell them to wear a mask, they won't figure out that it's a good idea...?
I guess that's my position here.
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"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one’s ignorance." — Confucius
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student
Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: Loaded Shaman] 2
#26642708 - 05/02/20 03:05 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Loaded Shaman said:
are people too stupid to use common sense, that if the government doesn't tell them to wear a mask, they won't figure out that it's a good idea...?
LOL you seem like a very intelligent guy, I'm surprised you even ask this.
Common sense is, amongst the masses, a rare commodity indeed, IME. Very rare. Like skilled driving, I'm always surprised to find it and notice it.
I'm all for liberty and letting people do what they want to their own bodies, but this is not that. There is huge potential to harm others here.
I wish we lived in a world where such things didn't have to be enforced, and I don't like it, and it won't make THAT much difference.
But at the same time I can see why they do it. Many people are incredibly callous when it comes to the wellbeing of others.
The state of this society is a shitty clusterfuck. My friends here desperately want collapse and chaos and overthrow.
I don't want that, but I can see why they can. But getting uppity about wearing masks does not help that cause.
Just like the last big riots in London where people were looting sneakers and televisions, I wanna shout;
'YOU DO REALISE THAT YOU'RE UNDERMINING YOUR MAIN CAUSE HERE, YOUNGSTER??
Stop. Fight the power for real. Arguining over reasonable rules is for teenagers.
Maturity and solidarity is what's needed here. Intelligence and wisdom.
Not knee jerk reactions because someone took away your lollipop.
Or that you have to wear a nappy rather than shitting anywhere.
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Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe
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Loaded Shaman
Psychophysiologist
Registered: 03/02/15
Posts: 8,011
Loc: Now O'Clock
Last seen: 7 days, 20 hours
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
#26642715 - 05/02/20 03:10 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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It was honestly more of a rhetorical question, lol.
The average IQ is 100.
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"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one’s ignorance." — Confucius
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student
Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: Loaded Shaman] 1
#26642726 - 05/02/20 03:17 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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I hear ya man. I think we're on the same page, and I think you're one of the NE guys that can see past your cultural programming.
However I have spent hours today on WhatsApp with my friend group here discussing a silght change in gun ownership requirements, and I have been amazed at the mental gymnastics peope who've been raised with that privilege will go through if you even suggest for a secon that it may be a double endged sword. Hell, they said it's just as bad in Australia - last year it was 2 mass shootings there for 435 here, with 1/10th of the population. Oh and the 'we should ban cars then' argument.
So I may be a little salty over American 'freedom' right now. A couple of additional background checks in MI had them melting like fuck.
Forgive me if I come across as too wordy and jaded, did a little coke fonight for the first time all year. Needed a release after this week.
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Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe
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oculodextro
Registered: 04/10/13
Posts: 1,205
Loc: Space is the Place
Last seen: 2 years, 30 days
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
#26642954 - 05/02/20 06:43 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Here every park says wear a mask if you are out in public.
I'm the only one wearing one and get death stares. I was in a high risk job and could be an asymptomatic carrier, I took an oath to do no harm.
Guess what I have to uphold that oath even if my feelings say this is stupid. Feelings are from the old dumb part of your brain, this is an enemy you can't see.
The average person doesn't understand virology, pathogensis, or mutation. This is a novel virus aka, wtf is this!
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HamHead
Hard Ass Motherfucker
Registered: 03/17/15
Posts: 6,107
Loc: Galactic sector ZZ9 Plura...
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: oculodextro]
#26643007 - 05/02/20 07:14 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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When I wore a mask, I physically felt stressed out. Walking through my local grocery store, I would be concerned about how many people were not wearing mask and I got upset. This happened a lot those few times I did.
I could smell my mask. I would look down at my nose to see how well my mask was sealing and would adjust, multiple times a day. I felt uptight and worried that even though I was masked, I would still catch the virus.
Then, information from medical professionals with many years dealing with epidemiology began coming out. Discussing how viruses have been around for as long as we have walked on this planet, and our best defenses have been herd immunity.
Locking people down disrupts nature.
5 minute video there, talking about mask.
What this guy talks about, makes sense. Don't listen to me anymore.
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The Italian researchers’ findings, published by the INT’s scientific magazine Tumori Journal, show 11.6% of 959 healthy volunteers enrolled in a lung cancer screening trial between September 2019 and March 2020 had developed coronavirus antibodies well before February.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-italy-timing-idUSKBN27V0KF
This online first version has been peer-reviewed, accepted and edited, but not formatted and finalized with corrections from authors and proofreaders
https://www.icandecide.org/
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TheFakeSunRa
Bitch Splitter
Registered: 03/01/05
Posts: 16,449
Loc: Dirdy SOUF
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: HamHead] 2
#26643023 - 05/02/20 07:20 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Yeah. Nature is all about killing you though. Didn’t watch video. Too stupid.
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[quote]Asante said:
You constantly make posts thatr fling middle school insults at people you don't like mixed in with maladjusted psychopathic comments about wanting to beat up the other poster with a crowbar.
You know how shit you are, you just don't give a fuck for precisely that reason.
I disendorse you.[/quote]
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oculodextro
Registered: 04/10/13
Posts: 1,205
Loc: Space is the Place
Last seen: 2 years, 30 days
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: TheFakeSunRa]
#26643037 - 05/02/20 07:28 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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We are definitely at a point where astroturfing, misinformation, propganda, and narratives are changing quicker then the average person can handle.
While this video raised great points, there's too little evidence regarding anything. We really won't know til the future if we took the right steps.
The point of social distancing/masks is to flatten the curve. Hospitals can't deal with the amount of sick people right now.
Some states/countries are counting 1 person as infected and failing to count the 4 other people that were infected by them in the numbers.
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HamHead
Hard Ass Motherfucker
Registered: 03/17/15
Posts: 6,107
Loc: Galactic sector ZZ9 Plura...
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: oculodextro]
#26643094 - 05/02/20 08:02 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
TheFakeSunRa said:
Didn’t watch video. Too stupid.
It's this mindset that is keeping lockdowns in place. Let's disregard any information that I deem, stupid.
Sounds like something Trump would say.
Quote:
oculodextro said:
We are definitely at a point where astroturfing, misinformation, propganda, and narratives are changing quicker then the average person can handle.
Yeah, mass media and internet have made this easier to spread digitally worldwide.
While this video raised great points, there's too little evidence regarding anything. We really won't know til the future if we took the right steps.
What history has shown, as evidence, humans have delt with viruses without locking down or flattening any curves, just fine without mask. So, why all this hype about something with such little evidence in preventing spread and other evidence that mask impede airflow and may be causing more harm to those most at risk, simply because of trouble breathing, which increases stress levels, which is not good for those at risk.
The point of social distancing/masks is to flatten the curve. Hospitals can't deal with the amount of sick people right now.
And because we have intervened and flattened that curve, we will have to manage even more people for an even longer timeframe. Longer time nursing homes locked down. Longer time schools shut down. Longer time to allow viruses to linger in homes that one person has become immune to but has not had any chance to share it with anyone else, which have their own viruses they develop immunity to. Breeding a second wave as once we are released, our immune systems will have been on vacation to what we would otherwise be exposed to on a day to day basis, year after year.
Some states/countries are counting 1 person as infected and failing to count the 4 other people that were infected by them in the numbers.
Which raises alarms. If there has been more infected than what we believe numbers say, why is it that we are not seeing a relative amounts of death? If numbers are 3x-4x higher than what is being posted, why are we not still seeing huge death numbers?
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The Italian researchers’ findings, published by the INT’s scientific magazine Tumori Journal, show 11.6% of 959 healthy volunteers enrolled in a lung cancer screening trial between September 2019 and March 2020 had developed coronavirus antibodies well before February.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-italy-timing-idUSKBN27V0KF
This online first version has been peer-reviewed, accepted and edited, but not formatted and finalized with corrections from authors and proofreaders
https://www.icandecide.org/
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TheFakeSunRa
Bitch Splitter
Registered: 03/01/05
Posts: 16,449
Loc: Dirdy SOUF
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: HamHead]
#26643151 - 05/02/20 08:27 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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I’m sick of this bullshit that every bit of idiocy deserves a chance to be heard.
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[quote]Asante said:
You constantly make posts thatr fling middle school insults at people you don't like mixed in with maladjusted psychopathic comments about wanting to beat up the other poster with a crowbar.
You know how shit you are, you just don't give a fuck for precisely that reason.
I disendorse you.[/quote]
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InfiniteDreams
Registered: 10/25/19
Posts: 1,224
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: TheFakeSunRa]
#26643163 - 05/02/20 08:30 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
TheFakeSunRa said:
I’m sick of this bullshit that every bit of idiocy deserves a chance to be heard.
Sure except arbitrary censorship on what one person judges as stupid is in itself stupid.
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Double
AB
Registered: 05/03/19
Posts: 817
Loc: 
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: Eminence]
#26643177 - 05/02/20 08:35 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Eminence said:
Quote:
Double said:
i hate it. everywhere i go, its fucking fear, fear, fear. people get offended at me for wanting to live my life without fear. like im expected to be worried all of the time like the rest of them. its like, theyve been hypnotized, brain washed, fear fear fear and more fear.
i dont even wanna say to much because here come the "if you had corona, you wouldnt be saying this, you wouldnt be saying that..."
Part of it, I think, is they want to not be afraid either. Makes them mad that they're paranoid and you're not.
I get it man, and I'm trying to be understanding. Perhaps I'm not too emphatetic? But I'm trying to understand that their fear is real and that people are suffering psychologically more than physically (and as a consequence, psychologically becoming somatic).
It's crazy man, never in all of these years have I seen the shroomery so divided on an issue lol
like those here who claim to work in healthcare and are upset at those of us who want to be back to work and not be self-quarantined (btw, its not self-quarantine since theyre forcing us to stay home, its a lockdown), I come from the social services field and can testify as well that people are getting closer to death because they cant generate means anymore due to the lockdown.
they cant buy their babies diapers, they cant buy the insulin they need to survive, THEY CANT BUY FOOD, these people are getting sick.. FROM HUNGER, hell, they cant even go onto streets to beg for money.
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theRealrollforever
I DID-DENT
Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 14,741
Loc: Bada-Bing!
Last seen: 6 hours, 31 minutes
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: Double]
#26643192 - 05/02/20 08:44 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Fuck this lockdown
I wear a mask when I go into peoples homes but not public stores. They can wear their own mask at that point. I will comply if they pass a law but I think it’s stupid AF and the whole thing is overblown. Don’t wanna die from a flu? Then STAY home
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sunshine said:
The order has to be secret and no one is sure.
Edited by theRealrollforever (05/02/20 08:45 AM)
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InfiniteDreams
Registered: 10/25/19
Posts: 1,224
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: Double]
#26643194 - 05/02/20 08:45 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Double said:
Quote:
Eminence said:
Quote:
Double said:
i hate it. everywhere i go, its fucking fear, fear, fear. people get offended at me for wanting to live my life without fear. like im expected to be worried all of the time like the rest of them. its like, theyve been hypnotized, brain washed, fear fear fear and more fear.
i dont even wanna say to much because here come the "if you had corona, you wouldnt be saying this, you wouldnt be saying that..."
Part of it, I think, is they want to not be afraid either. Makes them mad that they're paranoid and you're not.
I get it man, and I'm trying to be understanding. Perhaps I'm not too emphatetic? But I'm trying to understand that their fear is real and that people are suffering psychologically more than physically (and as a consequence, psychologically becoming somatic).
It's crazy man, never in all of these years have I seen the shroomery so divided on an issue lol
like those here who claim to work in healthcare and are upset at those of us who want to be back to work and not be self-quarantined (btw, its not self-quarantine since theyre forcing us to stay home, its a lockdown), I come from the social services field and can testify as well that people are getting closer to death because they cant generate means anymore due to the lockdown.
they cant buy their babies diapers, they cant buy the insulin they need to survive, THEY CANT BUY FOOD, these people are getting sick.. FROM HUNGER, hell, they cant even go onto streets to beg for money.
And it will get worse. They don't get money from the government because they aren't in those systems. Grey and black markets are shut down too. Food shortages will only increase from here.
Hospital after hospital is empty. I thought they were all going to be overwhelmed, yet many sit vacant.
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theRealrollforever
I DID-DENT
Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 14,741
Loc: Bada-Bing!
Last seen: 6 hours, 31 minutes
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: InfiniteDreams]
#26643199 - 05/02/20 08:47 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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I just went to Colorado and I am pretty sure I got it. It was like a 2 day thing for me and I didn’t even stop smoking weed. I really doubt I made it across the country and back smoking weed that gets passed around without contracting this “deadly illness”
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sunshine said:
The order has to be secret and no one is sure.
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HamHead
Hard Ass Motherfucker
Registered: 03/17/15
Posts: 6,107
Loc: Galactic sector ZZ9 Plura...
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: Double] 1
#26643210 - 05/02/20 08:51 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Wow, homeless people can't even beg for money.
Yet, rich people with access to all sorts of resources, who have no problems locking themselves away, are pushing for lock downs to continue.
It's all over media. No wonder people are scared shitless.
But lets ignore history and science and follow along with what CDC and WHO has planned.
Again, I strongly urge people to follow money and look into who funds these organizations.
I am not denying there are others who want to help.
Though we cannot deny history of propaganda and corruption.
--------------------
The Italian researchers’ findings, published by the INT’s scientific magazine Tumori Journal, show 11.6% of 959 healthy volunteers enrolled in a lung cancer screening trial between September 2019 and March 2020 had developed coronavirus antibodies well before February.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-italy-timing-idUSKBN27V0KF
This online first version has been peer-reviewed, accepted and edited, but not formatted and finalized with corrections from authors and proofreaders
https://www.icandecide.org/
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sedimalko
Stranger
Registered: 05/02/20
Posts: 11
Last seen: 1 year, 3 months
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: HamHead]
#26643256 - 05/02/20 09:07 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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obey the rules without drinking bleach !!!
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feevers
Registered: 12/28/10
Posts: 8,662
Loc:
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Re: I am now being told I have to wear a mask. [Re: sedimalko] 1
#26643430 - 05/02/20 10:51 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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A few people in this thread comprise a perfect case study of exactly why the government needs to mandate things like masks.
Some people are just too entitled and uneducated to understand how simple sacrifices can make huge differences that benefit everyone.
This is not the flu. We've essentially shut down the country and this thing has somehow still killed more people, in like a month, than the flu kills a year. Again, with a shutdown and extreme measures in place to stop the spread.
As far as the devastation that would've happened if we didn't shut down and it all happened at once, I'm not going to waste my breath because anyone who's capable or willing to grasp the concept already has, a month ago. Many people simply don't actually care
Opening things up as quickly as possible means making sacrifices along the way. If you don't make those sacrifices you're directly a part of the problem from both the health/human life side and the economic side.
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