|
LSA Woodrose
Stranger

Registered: 02/05/20
Posts: 708
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: LogicaL Chaos]
#26639670 - 04/30/20 06:19 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
LogicaL Chaos said: Time to prep more jars. Its time 
No definitely not yet. Even if these 24 cakes are cooked, which I’m really hoping they’re not, then I don’t wanna try growing during the summer months when the temperatures get into the 90s, and I’m not home a lot. I’m not going to waste a ton of electricity and leave my AC on all day while I’m not home. Not when I can just wait until September, maybe inoculate 24 jars in mid August or something, that should dial in the more preferable temperature, right?
Also, I have five jars I inoculated the second week in April, they are starting to look really nice! I intend to try the Water HC Tek, pioneered in this forum by Mateah. Either way, even if I get nothing more from my current 24 cakes, which I don’t think is going to be the case but we’ll see, I’ll have plenty to last me way past the end of the summer anyway, just in what I’ve dried already.
By the way, I took your advice, I haven’t misted my cakes since yesterday at 12 PM, which is basically 32 hours ago. I’m hoping that you’re right, and they just need to dry a little bit more. So is 48 hours in total good before I start misting again? Or should I start doing it a little sooner, like tonight?
|
LogicaL Chaos
Ascension Energy & Alien UFOs




Registered: 05/12/07
Posts: 69,333
Loc: The Inexpressible...
Last seen: 13 minutes, 25 seconds
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: LSA Woodrose]
#26639708 - 04/30/20 06:36 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Misting should depend on the cake itself. If it looks moist on the surfscr then dont mist, if it looks very wet, let it dry out some (but not bone dry). If it looks dry, then mist and bottom water more often till its all good again.
Does it really get into the 90's in your house? Thats nutz.
|
Mateja


Registered: 07/14/16
Posts: 7,948
Loc: Here
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: LogicaL Chaos] 1
#26639752 - 04/30/20 06:59 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
He was advised in another thread to stop misting the cakes for a couple of days I think thats what he's referring to, tho I'm not sure why he was supposed to do that, cakes are inside a SGFC and the pics weren't clear enough to see what was going on with the microclimate (didn't look too wet to me) now idk if he felt personally like his cakes were too wet or something but from the conversation him and Sockadin were having it seemed to imply the cakes needed 'drying out a bit' or something to that effect.
-------------------- Cakes inside Water Tub
|
Sockadin



Registered: 01/03/10
Posts: 7,244
Last seen: 2 months, 20 days
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: Mateja] 1
#26639809 - 04/30/20 07:32 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
OMG what to respond to first.
Spore drop comment: spores don't drop and they don't drift up due to air currents. I feel like someone was inferring this. Spores pop when the caps discharge so they will lift and float. You can have an unmodded tub deposit spores on the top of a canopy because of that popping action.
I recommend to let the cake dry out to creat a pinning response. But cakes do take a week to recolonize and so I agree with LC. If they look dry give them a mist. If they look overly wet, let them be for a day or two.
I hope that helps and I haven't created more confusion. The real trick to this hobby is learning when to mist or fan or do nothing. It depends on your fruit chamber, air flow and RH outside the tub.
|
bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: Sockadin] 1
#26639828 - 04/30/20 07:46 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Spores do pop. But not out of the gills and onto the caps. They pop to between the gills. Then drift down. Then air carries them. No air currents and you won't get spores on the tops of your caps or anywhere else but directly straight down.
Ever get a petri dish pin. It never gets spores on its cap. It leaves a perfect spore print.

The discharge mechanism is sorely to escape the gills.

https://www.anbg.gov.au/fungi/spore-discharge-mushrooms.html
|
LSA Woodrose
Stranger

Registered: 02/05/20
Posts: 708
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: Sockadin]
#26639829 - 04/30/20 07:47 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Oh, crQuote:
Sockadin said: I hope that helps and I haven't created more confusion.
No, I did that all by myself. For some reason I cross-referenced the conversation you and I were having in the other thread with what Logical Chaos was saying, and I responded to him, as if he were the one who advised me to lay off misting the cakes for 1-2 days. But that was you.
That said, I haven't misted for coming up on 34 hours. Last time I did was yesterday around 12:00PM EST. I took a second while writing this post, and checked in my closet, and the cakes still feel moist to the touch. None of them seem to be dry. I also checked all three of my cheap, dime-store hygrometers inside the 2 SGFCs, and they report (however inaccurate they may be) that my humidity is still 80-90 in the large chamber and about 70 in the smaller one.
A word about cakes "looking" dry, moist, or wet. I have to be honest, I simply can't tell by looking at them. Unless they are so wet that water is dripping off them, or I misted like two seconds ago, they look exactly the same to me. I look at them now, and they look exactly the same to me as they always do. Meaning, unless I touch them, I have no Earthly idea how wet or dry they are.
All that said, I will wait until tomorrow before I even think of misting again.
You think I should wait a little longer, maybe until the cakes actually "feel dry" to the touch? If evaporation is a pinning trigger and/or the 24 cakes are all just kind of recharging their mycelium batteries while they gear up for more flushes, then so much the better. But I haven't a clue what's going on in there right now, other than to check all my floor plans to see which cakes haven't flushed in how long, and some seem to my n00b eye to be stalled out. But I don't know whether they are stalled or just resting up for future flushes.
|
Sockadin



Registered: 01/03/10
Posts: 7,244
Last seen: 2 months, 20 days
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: bodhisatta]
#26639925 - 04/30/20 08:40 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Spores 100% can pop on a cap and the difference between a pin in a dish 1/4 of an inch off of the surface of the sub vs fully grown 3-5 inches off the substrate layer will make a difference.
Just a good old debate with the godfather of cultivation.
Spores will discharge up in a humid environment and land on the caps of the mushrooms all the time. I'm sure if I dug into this conversation I could find examples of this happening in sealed environments. But I really don't have the time or energy to try and prove it. So you are a TC I am not. And that means your opinion should have more merit than mine I guess
Woodrose: if they feel heavy like they did when your birth them then yes they are hydrated. If they feel light like styrofoam you should dunk. Everything else is just evaporation of the surface to induce pinning. Misting doesn't replace moisture it gives a surface layer of moisture to allow evaporation to induce pinning. Which is a survival response to stress.
|
bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: Sockadin]
#26639932 - 04/30/20 08:45 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
The only way to get spores to go anywhere but straight down after they're flung from the basidium in an environment absent of air currents is with static electricity.
There's techniques to achieve axenic spore prints using static to attract spores and prevent them from having a gravity influenced trajectory.
Brownian motion won't make spores move against gravity. Find a in-vitro mushroom grown in place that keeps it from having convection from heating with spores anywhere but straight down from the gills and ill change my mind
Air currents in a fruiting chamber do though.
|
LogicaL Chaos
Ascension Energy & Alien UFOs




Registered: 05/12/07
Posts: 69,333
Loc: The Inexpressible...
Last seen: 13 minutes, 25 seconds
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: bodhisatta]
#26639940 - 04/30/20 08:51 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Cool pic. A perfect shadow of the cap. Its my understanding that spores are "flung" out the shroom cap at "high velocities". However, since spores are so tiny, they can drift away from the cap when theres a draft from FAE.
|
Sockadin



Registered: 01/03/10
Posts: 7,244
Last seen: 2 months, 20 days
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: bodhisatta]
#26639945 - 04/30/20 08:56 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
I hear what your saying. But I disagree that spores in a sealed environment will float straight down. I have seen it before in a time lapse where the force created by the pooping ejects the spores higher than then cap and they float down and print on the top of the cap.
So I think we are probably arguing the same point, but I think the difference is between the ejected spore release vs a short pop and float down.
I have seen, (and really don't have time or energy to find and repost) the mushroom ejection of spores flow up and above the level of a cap. I think it was NAT Geo, and they then floated on to the cap.
Either way I don't have the need to justify my position. I got to much shit going on, so there is that.
But yes air currents do have alot to do with spore deposits on the top of canopies.
Also if all the mushrooms are sporelating at the same it will create its own air current Ina sealed environment. So show me a dish with 20 mushrooms popping at the same time and your results would be completely different.
|
LSA Woodrose
Stranger

Registered: 02/05/20
Posts: 708
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: Sockadin]
#26639993 - 04/30/20 09:28 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Sockadin said: Woodrose: if they feel heavy like they did when your birth them then yes they are hydrated. If they feel light like styrofoam you should dunk. Everything else is just evaporation of the surface to induce pinning. Misting doesn't replace moisture it gives a surface layer of moisture to allow evaporation to induce pinning. Which is a survival response to stress.
All right, so I was literally about to roll my eyes in frustration and bitch at you, on the grounds that, if I can't tell visually if a cake is "wet" or "damp" enough without touching it, how in the hell am I supposed to know what the F*** a cake is supposed to feel like, in terms of weight and density. But, sure enough, when I stopped for a second and started picking up cakes to feel how heavy or dense they felt, most felt kind of weighty and substantial, while 8 of the 24 felt light, as you described, like styrofoam. So I dunked all 8 cakes, and will leave them soaking in water, covered and weighted down, for 24 hours. As if they had just flushed.
I honestly don't know what else to do other than waiting and twiddling my thumbs or just bailing on these cakes as "spent," which obviously I have no intention of doing unless a few more weeks pass and its obvious they're cooked.
One more thing, and I believe its coming from the Perlite, because its only in the large tub, which has had cakes and Perlite in it for at least 2 weeks longer than the smaller tub. I noticed yesterday something that was a little disturbing. I am getting a slight mildewy smell when I open the lid, which goes away when I fan for just a few seconds. The cakes all smell "mushroomey" though, so I am forced to wonder if this is coming from the huge perlite layer under the cakes, which has been sort of collectively marinating in a lot of water from the initial wetting of it, about 5 weeks ago, and the misting and irrigation I have done since.
I am thinking that if the light smell doesn't go away by tomorrow, maybe its time to take the cakes out, along with the tin foil trays they sit atop, and set them aside. Then I could bring the SGFC into the bathroom and thoroughly wash the shit out of the Perlite in my bathtub with my shower head. Just really rinse and wash out that Perlite layer, while rigorously stirring it around with my open hands.
Thoughts?
Edited by LSA Woodrose (04/30/20 09:34 PM)
|
Sockadin



Registered: 01/03/10
Posts: 7,244
Last seen: 2 months, 20 days
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: LSA Woodrose]
#26640074 - 04/30/20 10:29 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Good idea. A little cleaning if the tub on high heat never hurt anything.
|
fahtster
Now With 33%More Faht



Registered: 06/17/06
Posts: 9,268
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: Sockadin] 1
#26640175 - 04/30/20 11:47 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
I always think of the weight of a baseball for the a good weight on a well hydrated cake.. but that was usually with a thick casing layer that was wet.. maybe a little less than a baseball
Faht
|
LogicaL Chaos
Ascension Energy & Alien UFOs




Registered: 05/12/07
Posts: 69,333
Loc: The Inexpressible...
Last seen: 13 minutes, 25 seconds
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: fahtster]
#26640262 - 05/01/20 12:51 AM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Thats a good rough estimate. It does feel like a baseball too
|
LSA Woodrose
Stranger

Registered: 02/05/20
Posts: 708
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: LogicaL Chaos] 1
#26640535 - 05/01/20 05:36 AM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Actually, the ones that felt the densest, to me at least, felt more like golf balls than baseballs. I don't think that even the first cakes I birthed over a month ago, before a single shroom developed, felt like baseballs right out of the jars. The ones I have immersed in water, 8 cakes in total, all felt like styrofoam, as Soackadin described above, though.
|
bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: Sockadin]
#26640689 - 05/01/20 07:39 AM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Sockadin said: I hear what your saying. But I disagree that spores in a sealed environment will float straight down. I have seen it before in a time lapse where the force created by the pooping ejects the spores higher than then cap and they float down and print on the top of the cap.
So I think we are probably arguing the same point, but I think the difference is between the ejected spore release vs a short pop and float down.
I have seen, (and really don't have time or energy to find and repost) the mushroom ejection of spores flow up and above the level of a cap. I think it was NAT Geo, and they then floated on to the cap.
Either way I don't have the need to justify my position. I got to much shit going on, so there is that.
But yes air currents do have alot to do with spore deposits on the top of canopies.
Also if all the mushrooms are sporelating at the same it will create its own air current Ina sealed environment. So show me a dish with 20 mushrooms popping at the same time and your results would be completely different.
Yes and those pics are not in an airtight chamber they're in an environment with air flow. They're outdoor timelapses. Everyone ive ever seen.
|
LSA Woodrose
Stranger

Registered: 02/05/20
Posts: 708
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: LSA Woodrose]
#26640745 - 05/01/20 08:23 AM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
On a side note, only tangentially related to this thread topic, I decided to order the set of videos RogerRabbit has on his site. I purchased and downloaded the entire series yesterday and am going to start diving in this weekend. Since I don't intend another full grow until late Summer/early Fall, when the weather is a little cooler, this gives me almost FOUR full months to learn, study, and digest all the stuff he has to teach, and decide what Tek I want to use next. I am leaning toward at least ONE more grow of mostly PF Tek, or at least using a fuckload of 1/2 pint BRF jars as my starting point, maybe with some full pint jars mixed in, as has been also suggested for a little variety. But I'm starting to wonder about the classic SGFC, at least in the ambient environment I am trying to grow in here.
On a side note, I just previewed a couple of these vids briefly and all I can say is WOW. I mean, seriously what a deal for $8.99 USD.
|
Tormato  
The Goddess Kali Meh 😛




Registered: 07/01/17
Posts: 6,067
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: LSA Woodrose] 1
#26641215 - 05/01/20 12:20 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Pretty sure RRs videos are free on YouTube
-------------------- Helpful Threads The Shroomery Store Tormato's Q&A Thread Post Questions Here or PM me! "Lately it occurs to me what a long, strange trip it's been." ~ Grateful Dead Before you start...Do you have a Pressure Cooker and a Dehydrator? I highly recommend getting both!
|
LSA Woodrose
Stranger

Registered: 02/05/20
Posts: 708
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: Tormato] 1
#26641277 - 05/01/20 12:52 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Tormato said: Pretty sure RRs videos are free on YouTube 
That's not the point. I wanted to buy them anyway. The price for the series is a very small thank you to the man, given that the 4 PF Tek videos he posted on his site are free, and they helped me immeasurably for my first n00b grow. The thing is, as far as I'm concerned, these videos more than paid for themselves weeks before I actually paid for them.
|
LogicaL Chaos
Ascension Energy & Alien UFOs




Registered: 05/12/07
Posts: 69,333
Loc: The Inexpressible...
Last seen: 13 minutes, 25 seconds
|
Re: Weakness of SGFC? I May Have Found a Workaround [Re: LSA Woodrose] 1
#26641280 - 05/01/20 12:53 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Roger Rabbit could use the cash anyway.
Brings back great memories. I remember when he used to post a ton on the boards. Man, that was fun.
|
|