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InvisibleInfiniteDreams
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Registered: 10/25/19
Posts: 1,224
Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: Tripsurfer] * 1
    #26625409 - 04/24/20 06:41 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Tripsurfer said:
If I must kiss a man, I prefer the total experience. A real man, with a beard and leather chaps :snub:




:manofapproval:


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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: Thanatos10]
    #26625416 - 04/24/20 06:44 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Thanatos10 said:
Quote:

The Blind Ass said:
I once read part of a book that was about 1 persons sexual relationship with a dolphin, they had a relationship for almost a year.

Found it when doing research for an abnormal psychology class, and it was pretty out there, so I checked it out.

I wish I could remember the title of it.  Absolutely fascinating, and a bit strange by all accounts.  :lol::shrug:


Edit- 

  Wet Godess




Considering animals can’t give consent then such acts seem to be rape.

I’m just trying to argue against Cookiecrumbs and the “design” argument. Nature doesn’t design anything in an intelligent sense, it’s more like shit happens. It could be argued that our current state is the result of thousands of years of evolution.

As for the constructs it could be argued that every species has them to some extent.

Gender and sex do exist for humans though, but the sad thing is that long ago religion decided what’s what and that’s what we went with rather than understand that sexuality and gender are extremely complex. I took a college course on it and was kind of blown away by how different cultures exhibited it.

Alas I get conservatives in this country with an outdated view of what it means to be human telling me how I ought to be rather than understand how I am. I’m not sure about my gender per se but sexuality seems pretty set, but maybe not.

I can agree with Crumbs that it does not matter. Just let people be and focus on the shit that actually harms other people, like climate change





Still, it’s come a long way.  Long ago, those who were like you hit it and denied themselves and practiced self deception for fear of torture and death and all kinds of horrible ignorant things.  Fast forward through history and you can see that gradually the human spirit triumphs in little way.  Starting off like 2 spores, gradually consolidating a hold upon a substrate and then finally growing strong and emerginginto the fruiting stage.  Now ,  in our country - although people can and do still do some horrible shit ,  it’s so much so less than before.

Not to mention that now it’s mostly people just being disapproving or voicing their own ignorant views ,  but not having the power to do anything about it -  not in a way that effects your life majorly.

Now you can be who you wanna be, even flaunt it, whatever you want.  People in general overall have become more understanding and compassionate towards gay and lesbian individuals -  imagine if the majority still held such an ignorant ire towards them?


Yeah.   


--------------------
Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps


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OfflineThanatos10
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: The Blind Ass] * 1
    #26625466 - 04/24/20 07:11 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

The Blind Ass said:
Quote:

Thanatos10 said:
Quote:

The Blind Ass said:
I once read part of a book that was about 1 persons sexual relationship with a dolphin, they had a relationship for almost a year.

Found it when doing research for an abnormal psychology class, and it was pretty out there, so I checked it out.

I wish I could remember the title of it.  Absolutely fascinating, and a bit strange by all accounts.  :lol::shrug:


Edit- 

  Wet Godess




Considering animals can’t give consent then such acts seem to be rape.

I’m just trying to argue against Cookiecrumbs and the “design” argument. Nature doesn’t design anything in an intelligent sense, it’s more like shit happens. It could be argued that our current state is the result of thousands of years of evolution.

As for the constructs it could be argued that every species has them to some extent.

Gender and sex do exist for humans though, but the sad thing is that long ago religion decided what’s what and that’s what we went with rather than understand that sexuality and gender are extremely complex. I took a college course on it and was kind of blown away by how different cultures exhibited it.

Alas I get conservatives in this country with an outdated view of what it means to be human telling me how I ought to be rather than understand how I am. I’m not sure about my gender per se but sexuality seems pretty set, but maybe not.

I can agree with Crumbs that it does not matter. Just let people be and focus on the shit that actually harms other people, like climate change





Still, it’s come a long way.  Long ago, those who were like you hit it and denied themselves and practiced self deception for fear of torture and death and all kinds of horrible ignorant things.  Fast forward through history and you can see that gradually the human spirit triumphs in little way.  Starting off like 2 spores, gradually consolidating a hold upon a substrate and then finally growing strong and emerginginto the fruiting stage.  Now ,  in our country - although people can and do still do some horrible shit ,  it’s so much so less than before.

Not to mention that now it’s mostly people just being disapproving or voicing their own ignorant views ,  but not having the power to do anything about it -  not in a way that effects your life majorly.

Now you can be who you wanna be, even flaunt it, whatever you want.  People in general overall have become more understanding and compassionate towards gay and lesbian individuals -  imagine if the majority still held such an ignorant ire towards them?


Yeah.   





It's still and adjustment period for me. For the longest time I have thought it to be something wrong and immoral based on what I saw on TV and hearing people say "that's so gay". It's only recently that I'm working past all of that.


--------------------
As lightless oblivion devours you, drown in the ever-blooming darkness.


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OfflineBabylon
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: Tantrika]
    #26625576 - 04/24/20 07:52 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Tantrika said:
Quote:

spirit_shadow said:
... Trust me I would love to be gay but I cant. ...




in my experience, the gay community refers to this as a closet-case, often they will be in a (frequently ineffectual or infrequent contact) straight relationship
and has a 10-15 year timeline from making such comments to actually coming out

good luck:heart:




Some of em.  I'm about 20 years out, tried kissing, sucking a dick, no anal, but whatever.  I tried enough to know it doesn't do anything for me.  I'll still make out with a guy to turn a girl on, but it's the girl watching that turns me on.  I'd probably get turned on sucking a girl's dick, dunno, haven't been with any trans women.


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Invisiblepoke smot!
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: Thanatos10] * 2
    #26625580 - 04/24/20 07:53 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Thanatos10 said:
It's still and adjustment period for me. For the longest time I have thought it to be something wrong and immoral based on what I saw on TV and hearing people say "that's so gay". It's only recently that I'm working past all of that.




I grew up in a conservative town and internalized a lot of the things I heard (including "gay" being synonymous with "bad.") What can I say, I was a sensitive guy and just thought way too fucking much. I caused so much damage in my life because I hated myself and couldn't get on with it. At the same time I was accepting of the few gay people I knew.

I had a girlfriend at 22, and it was intimate but only got so far because she had her own stuff. But I was into it, or at least got aroused from the physical contact. If she didn't have issues of her own I might have ended up with her for awhile, who knows.

But instead I went on to lead a self-destructive life, failing to find an adult frame of mind and never taking responsibility. When the pain became great enough I recognized that there was one thing I needed to do to get right with myself. Because only I knew who I noticed walking down the street, or who I dreamed about. That was eight years ago.

All of the work I did culminated in meeting someone and, for the first time at age 36 (!) finding love. By the time love came and smacked me in the face I had believed I was incapable of it.

Quote:

“Happiness is like a butterfly, the more you chase it, the more it will evade you, but if you notice the other things around you, it will gently come and sit on your shoulder.”




Through my super closeted fearful life I saw straight couples holding hands out in public and believed that wasn't a reality I would ever experience. I think I was subconsciously subscribed to that delusion, until one day earlier this year.

I met him at a club and we hit it off. No grindr, app, etc required. The universe put us together in the same place.

Fast forward, walking about in public holding hands cause fuck all'yall and whatever you think, it's MY turn to feel good, and be with someone I want to be with, someone who wants to be with me.

To think I denied myself that, because I couldn't believe. Every experience in the past 8 years since that change in life direction, prepared me to be in the right place and mind to find love naturally. Holy fuck, I have arrived. And there is light at the end of the tunnel :sun:


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Offlineichugwindex
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: poke smot!]
    #26625635 - 04/24/20 08:14 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

While I do wish the trans peeps would stop stealing all the bisexual girls from my wife and I... I respect the game


--------------------
Only hope can give rise to the emotion we call despair. But it is nearly impossible for a man to try to live without hope, so I guess that leaves Man no choice but to walk around with despair as his companion.


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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: spirit_shadow]
    #26625696 - 04/24/20 09:08 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

spirit_shadow said:
...
Edit: @tantrika I still dont understand WHY they feel that way. I've been made fun of when I was younger for being so skinny but I have never felt self conscious. I think I have an understanding block.




Yeah, and now that I have some sleep behind me will hopefully be able to help somewhat
but do fairly understand that it may not be possible for me to properly explain the why so much as give a better comprehension of the what and how
because there is not, to my knowledge, information available to the trans community as to why it happens -- the most we have right now is evidence that hormone therapy or gender affirming genital surgeries can alleviate the effects

it is not "just" self conscious tho, and will come back to this in a second post discussing some of my more severe issues of dysphoria and my almost complete recovery from them as isolated examples
but the ridicule and stuff makes things much worse

and while not presuming you to be an actual transphobe
am just going to get out in front of the bus and point out that the study that people like to quote claiming that trans women commit suicide at the same rate before and after surgery
is recognized by the scientist who lead the study as being a misrepresentation of the work:
Quote:

Williams: Before I contacted you for this interview, were you aware of the way your work was being misrepresented?

Dhejne: Yes! It’s very frustrating! I’ve even seen professors use my work to support ridiculous claims. I’ve often had to respond myself by commenting on articles, speaking with journalists, and talking about this problem at conferences. The Huffington Post wrote an article about the way my research is misrepresented. At the same time, I know of instances where ethical researchers and clinicians have used this study to expand and improve access to trans healthcare and impact systems of anti-trans oppression.

Of course trans medical and psychological care is efficacious. A 2010 meta-analysis confirmed by studies thereafter show that medical gender confirming interventions reduces gender dysphoria.




Quote:

The story references your 2011 study. This study states, “The overall mortality for sex-reassigned persons was higher during follow-up (aHR 2.8; 95% CI 1.8–4.3) than for controls of the same birth sex, particularly death from suicide (aHR 19.1; 95% CI 5.8–62.9). Sex-reassigned persons also had an increased risk for suicide attempts (aHR 4.9; 95% CI 2.9–8.5) and psychiatric inpatient care (aHR 2.8; 95% CI 2.0–3.9).” However, those citing your work never seem to note that your study also includes the following very large caveat:

It is therefore important to note that the current study is only informative with respect to transsexual persons health after sex reassignment; no inferences can be drawn as to the effectiveness of sex reassignment as a treatment for transsexualism. In other words, the results should not be interpreted such as sex reassignment per se increases morbidity and mortality. Things might have been even worse without sex reassignment. As an analogy, similar studies have found increased somatic morbidity, suicide rate, and overall mortality for patients treated for bipolar disorder and schizophrenia. This is important information, but it does not follow that mood stabilizing treatment or antipsychotic treatment is the culprit.

Moreover, people using your study to support spurious anti-trans fact claims also seem to not understand that your study findings aggregate two chronological groups. In simple language, would you please explain what the above paragraph means and what your study findings show for those trans people transitioning after 1989?

Dhejne: The aim of trans medical interventions is to bring a trans person’s body more in line with their gender identity, resulting in the measurable diminishment of their gender dysphoria. However trans people as a group also experience significant social oppression in the form of bullying, abuse, rape and hate crimes. Medical transition alone won’t resolve the effects of crushing social oppression: social anxiety, depression and posttraumatic stress.

What we’ve found is that treatment models which ignore the effect of cultural oppression and outright hate aren’t enough. We need to understand that our treatment models must be responsive to not only gender dysphoria, but the effects of anti-trans hate as well. That’s what improved care means.



https://www.transadvocate.com/fact-check-study-shows-transition-makes-trans-people-suicidal_n_15483.htm

possibly the most interesting part of the above is the relationship that is drawn to treatment of bipolar and schizophrenia having issues of increased risk of suicide
and while it is not mentioned there, will make just a brief reminder that it is well known anti-depressants often increase suicidal ideations
but they are still prescribed -- just their use is monitored and controlled by health professionals to try and maximize the good effects and minimize the bad

and even more recent data shows that issues of suicide are strongly alleviated by having a supportive family network



will come back to make a second post 'shortly,' (dunno how long typing up my rambling will take) but this just helps to recognize that at least one part of the "why"
is because of broader social treatment
and this is likely where some of your girlfriend's issue comes in
it is important to recognize that dysmorphia and dysphoria are related but not the same thing
but very much any issues of appearance are going to be exacerbated by social conditions


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Offlineichugwindex
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: Tantrika]
    #26625735 - 04/24/20 09:40 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

I just want a legit mff threesome again and you peeps aren't helping my cause.


--------------------
Only hope can give rise to the emotion we call despair. But it is nearly impossible for a man to try to live without hope, so I guess that leaves Man no choice but to walk around with despair as his companion.


Edited by ichugwindex (04/24/20 09:41 PM)


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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: Tantrika]
    #26625807 - 04/24/20 10:17 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

alright, so, being a pain in the ass about this
breaking straight into discussing the "how" of dysphoria

first and formost, let's ironically talk straight cis men
specifically, let's look at bodybuilders who use steroids for faster and larger gains
for body builders, it is recognized as being dysmorphia rather than dysphoria:
Quote:

muscle dysmorphia (redirected from Adonis Syndrome)
A specific type of body dysmorphic disorder in which a person—usually male, average age 20—becomes obsessed with building muscle to the point where it impacts on his/her interactions with others, employment and his self-image. It is regarded as a treatment-resistant mental disorder, which typically occurs in bodybuilders who, while very muscular and physically fit, see a '97-pound weakling' in the mirror
Risk factors Bullying during primary, secondary school, family dysfunction, perfectionism, severe stress, aesthetic focus and negative influence of mass culture that promotes an idealised Arnold Schwarzenegger-type body
Management Antidepressants



https://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Adonis+Syndrome

this shows dysmorphia as more severe in its psychological effects than dysphoria
also note that this is very clearly not cis men pursuing an ideal of a more feminized body
but of perceptions of their own male body not being sufficiently masculine to be a good representative of the male body

to be clear: working out and improving physical image and health is natural and healthy for humans
it can just take really severe turns where you get guys injecting their muslces with cement mixes to look bigger and "more manly"

so now for touching on dysphoria in trans women (and hopefully can at least touch on trans men, because they get under represented everywhere)



let's talk about the imagery used in this comic
she takes a picture of herself, and sees a photo that makes her look like she looks to us as the outside viewer
dysphoria shows up, and changes how she sees the image
but even after that change, we the viewer see her as a sad version of what she looked like in the first appearance of the photo, not the second

so if she looks like she does and not like dysphoria tells her "he" does, why is there the issue?
well, a big part of it is she knows there are social expectations of what women look like, and what men look like
and as a woman, she wants to be recognized as a woman
think this is not even too incomprehensible to cis men -- no cis dude particularly likes being told he needs to get off his period and man up, it is taken as an insult to question just how manly he is
this also feeds back into the above mentioned issues of dysmorphia that can develop -- someone with psychological insecurities may make himself outwardly hyper masculine to stop people treating him as non-male

what happens, for me, in instances like the comic portrays
is I don't have a beard, I went through a year of lasers to the face to ensure that
but if I don't shave for a week, will notice a hair or three of stubble poking up because laser is not perfect
and my mind fixates on that, and goes "anyone who notices that is basically like seeing you with a beard"

same goes for the "unfeminine" hair
a bad hair day for me is not that I can't quite get it combed into place
it's looking in the mirror and seeing that the structure of my facial bones and the raggedness of my hair have me looking like this fuck:


as a side caveat -- noticed when trying to live a male life and presenting male that men with ponytails are basically the second most stereotyped hairstyle after the criminality associations of dreadlocks :lol:

then there are the shoulders
shoulder dysphoria is among some of the worst for me
people assure me my shoulders are not even that broad
but they feel enormous because of their relative size to my hips
and the idealized image that is built into most of us born since the 80s
is that of the hourglass figure for women -- and the lozenge figure for men
women with big baby-feeding tits and baby-carrying hips
and men with big broad shoulders for doing manly physical labour

the problem of shoulder dysphoria for me is so much worse because it has to do with the body's silhouette -- one of the first subconcious prompts for how we try to classify individuals we see from a distance
this is mitigated somewhat by carrying a purse in public; a visual cue that interrupts the lines of the body and is heavily gendered towards being representative of female

likewise, as my transition gets further along my voice dysphoria actually gets worse
because it is in my awareness that people visibly view me as a woman first, then take a shock and uncertainty in response to first hearing my voice

so, shoulder dysphoria; hair dysphoria; facial hair dysphoria; voice dysphoria
why the fuck isn't any of these examples "gender dysphoria"?
well, they are; and you prolly did not actually pose the question to yourself because you recognized that
but any one of these will typically trigger a cascade effect where all of them end up being felt
and the resulting outcome is an episode of full-blown gender dysphoria -- severe discomfort with not fitting with my own(convoluted, far too societally-informed than inner-strength)view of what feminine presentation pertains to

however, this is prolly a good point in this diatribe to insert a back-reference to the dna factor
do not personally get "dna dysphoria"; do not think that is even a big thing, compared to trans people rolling their eyes over having recently dealt with such an argument and memeing it to the rest of us
so did not per se take any offense to your earlier statements
but called you out on it a bit because it cultivates a negative, and in a number of parts of the world dangerous, view of trans people
and sure, as a Canadian on the Shroomery am not personally at much risk from such things
but trans people through Russia and Eastern Europe have their lives endangered by such things
and that was "just" starting with some white skinned folk that still do it; get outside of the Western world and it is publicly the popular thing to inflict suffering on us and other minorities

but also fully recognize no one is actually attracted to dna, that would be dumb

I find brunettes more attractive than blondes, and typically redheads more attractive than both
but I don't look at a hot blonde and go "oh wow, she must actually be born a brunette because she's hotter than most blondes"
and if meeting a brunette girl and finding out 4-6 months after the fact that she is a redhead who dyes her hair
will tell her of my attraction to red heads, but never expect her to stop dyeing it if that's how she prefers to appear
and likely won't start making a bunch of ginger jokes at her about how black hair can't cover up a lack of soul

who knows tho, maybe on one of my future difficult trips I will shrink down to microscopic level and be trapped exploring my own strands of dna until coming to peace with it


but in terms of gender dysphoria, my actual most difficult issues have been with genital dysphoria
would get stuck at the toilet for an average of 15 minutes after every time of going pee
just ruminating on suicide as a result of this big gross floppy thing hanging off me, reflecting on being a freak of a woman because only an extreme minority of women have penises
and hated, absolutely hated awkward erections in public and around women I am attracted to
felt like it made me exposed as being a man rather than a woman, and as a perverse creep unable to control sexual urges around a pretty woman
despite neither of those being true -- women (even straight women) are far more likely to recognize me as a women in spite of the penis than men are
and it is natural for the male organism to be aroused to the point of erection throughout the day
none of my urges were prompted by kids or anything strange, so was at a worst case scenario a sex-driven man

this has actually been almost entirely eliminated since going on hormone therapy tho
no longer get awkward or unwanted erections -- still become 95%-100% erect when really aroused or with a partner
it just takes more foreplay to get me where we are going, and no woman ever really objects to more foreplay :lol:

so yeah, now am going to try to look at the above and come to a conclusion of "why" this all happens
and, honestly, if having to provide an answer, would likely say it primarily comes down to social issues
you may never have developed the Adonis Syndrome that other skinny ridiculed boys do, but it does happen

but it is obviously a lot more complex than that
and prolly coloured heavily by matters associated with individual psychology
but it then becomes a question of what is healthy or not
working out is physically and mentally healthy; popping large amounts of steroids or injecting muscles with cement is not
transitioning with supports and professional medical input is healthy and maximizes the positive effects; the sorts of people who end up cutting their testicles off with scissors because their father beat into them that they had to grow up and continue the family line, are clearly not


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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: ichugwindex]
    #26625810 - 04/24/20 10:19 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

ichugwindex said:
I just want a legit mff threesome again and you peeps aren't helping my cause.




I just want to get back in touch with the girls who gave me a mff threesome in high school and convince them to try an fff at this point in their lives
but they are each married to dudes now, so out the window


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InvisibleTantrika
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: Tantrika]
    #26625818 - 04/24/20 10:22 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Tantrika said:
...(and hopefully can at least touch on trans men, because they get under represented everywhere)
...




.........................................

:justfuck:


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Offlinespirit_shadow
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: Tantrika]
    #26625822 - 04/24/20 10:27 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Jesus. I read all that and so far get that society is the main reason? But also when you said you hate your genitals that is fucked(not that you have a penis) just the fact that it makes you feel so bad you want to die :/  but is it also a mental issue? Cos nobody has to say anything and my gf always beats herself up for no reason. As I said it has to be a hardware issue and not a software issue because I still dont get it. I'm the type of person that says fuck what others think(if it is in the context of negativity) but others like my gf  get fixated on the smallest things and the reason still eludes me.  So to summarize it is mainly from societies expectations and your own expectations(influenced by society)?


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Those content with the least have the most.....(this account is automated, all posts related to illegal activities or advice thereof are strictly from numerous online sites and are for informational purposes only)- Circa 2011
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Offlineichugwindex
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: Tantrika]
    #26625826 - 04/24/20 10:29 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

:mad2:

Perhaps a trade is in order so we can both do our thing.


--------------------
Only hope can give rise to the emotion we call despair. But it is nearly impossible for a man to try to live without hope, so I guess that leaves Man no choice but to walk around with despair as his companion.


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OnlineNorthernerM
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: spirit_shadow]
    #26625830 - 04/24/20 10:31 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

The Blind Ass said:
I hear they have teeth.

Anyone remember that movie?  “Teeth” .... Man, the lead role actress is a bombshell.  Had a crush on her back in the day so hard.

Also, the actor that gets his dick bitten off (1st guy to get chomped, not the 2nd one).  in that lagoon scene went on to play the character
“Elliot” from the hit show “The Magicians” (great fucking show - it’s on Netflix now, 4-5 seasons based on books) , it’s trippy and I love it,



Yeah, I remember. Bonkers film.

Actually enjoyed it.


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The nearest we ever come to knowing truth is when we are witness to paradox.


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Offlinewatermelon mon
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: ichugwindex] * 1
    #26625832 - 04/24/20 10:32 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Everthing is cool.
We just are. This just is.
Life is pretty short. So it's good to chill.


--------------------
    :dazedandconfused:


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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: Northerner]
    #26625839 - 04/24/20 10:34 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

yeah it was really pretty good.  The lead actress became my ideal type of woman, regarding appearances,  and I mainly ended up dating woman that had that look for several years after .  :lol: .  Ahh youth.    I think that actress has been in some big name movies, but she looks fairly different nowadays.  Good times good times.


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Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps


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InvisibleTantrika
Miss Ann Thrope
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: spirit_shadow]
    #26625841 - 04/24/20 10:37 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

spirit_shadow said:
Jesus. I read all that and so far get that society is the main reason? But also when you said you hate your genitals that is fucked(not that you have a penis) just the fact that it makes you feel so bad you want to die :/  but is it also a mental issue? Cos nobody has to say anything and my gf always beats herself up for no reason. As I said it has to be a hardware issue and not a software issue because I still dont get it. I'm the type of person that says fuck what others think(if it is in the context of negativity) but others like my gf  get fixated on the smallest things and the reason still eludes me.  So to summarize it is mainly from societies expectations and your own expectations(influenced by society)?




Think the most important take away is to recognize that some people internalize society's input a lot more than others, and a lot of this is personal psychological factos such as childhood upbringing
nobody has to say anything, but your girlfriend quite probably has memory of a million little public comments, commercials with women with idealized bodies being happy, and so forth

and just to be clear with regards to the above
was not and am still not one of the people who found:

to be in any way offensive

but do recognize that messaging like that sinks into the mind and colours how we perceive ourselves
and, even heavier than that, is that we can (and do) also formulate ideas that since that is what is publicly applauded, that is the minimum necessity to be taken seriously in public
just like guys who think they have to look like Ahnuld to be taken seriously as someone who can do manly things


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Offlinespirit_shadow
Feature not a bug
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: Tantrika] * 1
    #26625845 - 04/24/20 10:38 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

That is so crazy. Yeah and I never once thought about body builders. That kinda has me like :mindblown:


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Those content with the least have the most.....(this account is automated, all posts related to illegal activities or advice thereof are strictly from numerous online sites and are for informational purposes only)- Circa 2011
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OfflineThanatos10
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: spirit_shadow] * 1
    #26625874 - 04/24/20 11:13 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

It's easy to discount it when it doesn't happen to you, just like it's easy to take for granted how smooth straight people have it than gay people.


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Offlinesusurrador
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Re: Homosexuality is cool yo [Re: CookieCrumbs]
    #26626569 - 04/25/20 08:31 AM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

CookieCrumbs said:
The only absolute to me is that it really does not fucking matter.

None of social constructs really matter. We are all human beings, a type of animal, trying to function in a way nature did not design for us. At every level.

We literally made everything up. All the words I'm typing now, the keyboard I'm typing it on, this thing that exists as 0s and 1s on a virtual database connected via cables and signals we call the internet, and each and every little definition or logic we invented to define different aspects of life.

Someone made that shit up. We're constantly finding that for all the shit we made up, alot of it's fucking made up, and alot of it's incomplete or wrong. Because we're human.

And we're functioning in a way that hasn't been defined by several hundred million years of evolution.

If you want to go live in a cave without clothes or sanitized water and eat bugs and shit I say more power to you. And you should probably limit your vocal communications too. But if you want to live in the world constructed by human beings... you have to accept that human beings had to make up constructions to deal with that world.




Social constructs have everything to do with history. Things that actually happened.

People didn't just randomly decide their traditions, rituals, laws, customs, etc. Even if it seems as such looking back in time from our current position.

Ideas are usually brought forth as a solution to a problem or question.

Unfortunately, much of history has been lost, destroyed, forgotten, written off as unimportant, or misrepresented through bias of the victors. We're not working with the whole picture here as you indicated.

But it is no coincidence or random event that we ended up like this.

The problem with believing that these things don't matter is you never see the relationship between the social constructs and how society is actually doing. If you can't identify the relationship, you can't assess how things are going and take corrective measures when things go awry. You not only don't know the real nature of the problem, but you also don't know how to fix it.

I believe the root reason that being anything but hetero and having kids is a negative is that it means you aren't giving your special gift back to the society that gives you everything. It is an action that states you're only out for yourself and personal pleasures and preferences and refuse to give children back to the world -completing the circle of life and are literally shirking natural responsibilities.

At the micro level of one's personal life... this may not have any perceivable negative consequences- but at the macro level there are many.

Any and every single form of organized humans that ever existed have relied on men and women partnering up to make children to ensure the survival of the group since the dawn of humanity. Ranging from multinational empires all the way down to the familial level.

Each and every group relies on as many people reproducing as possible. The more, the merrier.

You can't build a Rome or New York or Tokyo without lots and lots of people.

Can't grow and build if people aren't having more than 1 child per person on average.

Deep down I think it is a natural reaction for people to feel negatively about lifestyles, actions, etc that do not contribute to this most basic need of civilizations- to grow.

At the micro level, I don't give a shit what you all are putting in or on your genitals and it has had zero perceivable impact on my personal life that people exist that wander from the typical path. But at the macro level, there are real negative consequences to people feeling free to abandon hetero child-having relationships for alternatives that don't positively yield children. If nothing else, if your group isn't growing, it eventually reaches a state where more people need care than there are people to provide that care- be it healthcare, providing food, working the jobs, etc.

Society is already going to have a certain number of people that don't have children for a wide variety of reasons outside their control- death, disease, infertility, miscarriage, genetic issues, low reproduction value or unable to attract a mate, infant death... the list is long. Then for it to also become socially acceptable and even encouraged in some circles to explore these alternative lifestyles that do not yield children- we're compacting the problem. If it becomes mainstream enough, it could become a serious societal problem. Then we're relying on the importation of people who don't necessarily share our collective values to make economic ends meet and our society weakens and splinters as a result.

This helped lead to the fall of the old Roman Empire. Not people being gay or alt, but importing people who didn't share Roman values to bolster the society that was no longer growing enough to keep the coffers full of coin.

But as we all know, it is an extremely difficult task getting people to behave on a personal level in a way that is good for the group overall, particularly today and especially if the desired behavior or action itself is difficult.

We're all very connected today, but not in a tribal sense. Not in the sense that we're all on board for whatever is best for the group- for our survival. And that is a result of the fact that you can survive mostly alone today without any difficulty other than psychological issues that can develop out of isolation.

So we're largely no longer concerned with survival- just pleasure, (in first world countries at least) resulting in fewer people being willing to accept real responsibilities that are good for the survival of the group (like having a family and providing food and knowledge for them).

There are other ways one can contribute to society other than having kids, but no other way of contributing that has anywhere near the potential impact and reach of your DNA echoing through time. Having one child could lead to millions and billions of people contributing to the survival of humanity across the universe. Even a contribution to humanity like the invention and implementation of the internet is tiny compared to what making babies can do.

Today's society also has less ammo than ever before to convince people to do this chore that is very necessary for the continuation of our respective groups- seeing as how the survival argument is weak amidst so much pleasure seeking and plenty.

When people are eating hot cheetos and playing Wii golf in the air conditioning, a serious thought on survival and the merits of doing something difficult and at times unpleasant are becoming a rarity. Even for straight people, so this isn't just a qualm with alternative lifestyles.

The difference is there is nothing that will fix alternative couples' inability to have biological children and raise them in a manner that will be conducive to the children growing up and living a hetero, childbearing lifestyle that continues contributing to the survival of the group. You can't deliver the entirety of the parental experience with 2 moms, 2 dads, f to m dad or m to f mom (or whatever non-traditional arrangement) in a manner that will communicate all the secrets that are supposed to be passed down from straight real male dad and straight real female mom to the children so they grow up to do the same.

So sure, homosexuality is cool for homosexuals. Heterosexuality and childbearing is cool for everyone. Hopefully there are enough buffers out there to keep the abandonment of this truth from fucking our society in the ass... metaphorically.

Again, no personal-life-level qualms with alternative lifestyles, but there is no getting around the fact that if you are not hetero and having kids, you are a net drain on society in the end. It is excusable if there is no choice involved, but I think people have convinced themselves and others lately that there is no choice, when for most people it is in-fact a conscious choice that rapidly becomes difficult to backpeddle on because people become so entirely submerged and intertwined in the culture of the various alternative lifestyles. And once you make the switch, you're rarely welcomed back to where you started without things being different or extremely difficult.

Same way that it is difficult for some people to come out of the closet in the first place. They're so submerged in hetero culture that revealing a different self and being accepted can seem impossible or at least very difficult and stressful.

And I don't think much of this will change until science reaches a point where men and women are no longer needed in the process of creating more humans and that unnatural process becomes widely embraced by society.

Or perhaps we figure out how to survive and continue and prosper without growth... but just the fact that science and technology steady fractals out in ever more numerous and specialized fields... we will never run out of things for people to do, no matter how many people exist.

TL;DR 

*Not having kids is generally bad for society and survival of the group.
*Society today is losing awareness of history.
*History shapes today's social constructs.
*Some of today's accepted social constructs have a net drain on society.
*The negative impact is not really perceivable on an individual level and therefore most people will never take the initiative to hold themselves personally responsible for the solution.
*If you are mentally and physically capable of having kids, you should be hetero and make babies and do your damndest to raise them well. It was done by others to permit you your chance at life and to build everything you see around you. Now pass it down.

And sorry for the essay, the coffee is really good this morning.

:poststress:


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"If it doesn't work, you can always hit him with it."



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