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morrowasted
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Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions 5
#26604362 - 04/15/20 10:54 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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I'll keep this succinct and readable as possible.
I am not a vegan or vegetarian. I have been in the past. I've always gone back to eating meat simply because it is easier to eat a diverse amount of food when you do, and diversity is less boring.
Quote:
Argument 1: "Veganism is unhealthy because vegans tend to be deficient in certain essential vitamins and minerals like B12 and iron, which makes them more susceptible to getting anemia and dementia."
Why it's wrong: Stating that X is a risk factor for developing Y does not mean that X is unhealthy. For example, being black in America is a risk factor for having diabetes. However, being black is not unhealthy. Awareness of risk factors enables you to address them. Just like a black person can eat a diet rich in fibrous vegetables, fruits, and legumes to prevent diabetes, vegans can eat a diet rich in foods with supplemental B12, or can simply take B12 supplements. Quote:
Argument 2: "[I/one or more of my friends] went vegan and got sick/weak/cloudy-headed."
Why it's wrong: This is blame shifting. For every anecdote you can provide about a vegan who supposedly got sick "because of veganism", I can provide one of a person whose health is more robust than yours, one of a person who is stronger and more athletic than you are even though you eat meat, and one of someone who is more intellectually accomplished than you are. Being vegan doesn't make you sick, weak, or dumb. Being deficient in nutrients, failing to exercise, and/or failing to learn makes you sick, weak, or dumb. There are people who adhere to any kind of diet you can image who are nutrient deficient, fail to exercise, and fail to learn. Quote:
Argument 3: "Humans evolved to be omnivores, therefore it is the more healthy diet."
Why it's wrong: The implication of this argument is behaving in a way that does not reflect the context in which your physiology develops will always have suboptimal results. This is patently false- driving a car does not reflect the context in which your physiology developed. It is nevertheless a far more efficient use of the cellular machinery you possess, if your goal is to travel quickly.
The reason the argument fails is actually very simple: the way that you measure the which diet is the "most healthy" is by correlating data about what people eat with their health outcomes. As it turns out, over half a century of such data reveals a clear picture: eating meat increases your risk of developing problems that will reduce your lifespan, and eating plants decreases those risks. Long term data on veganism is still emerging, but vegetarians live longer on average than those who eat meat. Thus, even if your body did not evolve in a context of surviving on plants, surviving on plants is a more efficient use of your cellular machinery, if your goal is to live a longer life.
Before you find yourself attacking veganism or defending your own diet against it, ask yourself: "Why? Is this person hurting me?" If the answer is no, then saying something may be counterproductive, because- shocking as it may seem- your compulsion to spread misinformation and/or fallacious arguments may be unintentionally hurting other people. If your diet works for you, that's great. There's no need to try and discourage people from going vegan. Medical personnel are aware of the risk factors associated with a vegan diet and will assess for them during the yearly physical and treat them accordingly, in the same way that medical personnel are aware of the risk factors associated with eating meat will assess for them and treat them accordingly.
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dk-1

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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: morrowasted] 1
#26604423 - 04/15/20 11:30 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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"The reason the argument fails is actually very simple: the way that you measure the which diet is the "most healthy" is by correlating data about what people eat with their health outcomes. As it turns out, over half a century of such data reveals a clear picture: eating meat increases your risk of developing problems that will reduce your lifespan, and eating plants decreases those risks. Long term data on veganism is still emerging, but vegetarians live longer on average than those who eat meat. Thus, even if your body did not evolve in a context of surviving on plants, surviving on plants is a more efficient use of your cellular machinery, if your goal is to live a longer life."
This isn't necessarily true. There is a lot of evidence and good arguments for eating a purely animal-product based diet and those who do seem to be very healthy. Like in a vegetable based diet, the cause of diet-based disease for those who eat meat is usually over-consumption of processed food.
In saying that, there are quite a few harmful compounds (insoluble fibers, phytic acid etc) in plants that make them less beneficial (more inflammatory) for humans to eat long-term than a diet containing both meat and animal products. Vegans/vegatarians are healthier than average because someone who decides to go on a specific diet at least has some interest in what they're putting into their body compared to someone on the SAD (standard American diet). I'm not saying that you can't be healthy on a vegan diet, only that it is much more impractical for the average person.
I think for the average person who isn't overly invested in their diet, they're likely going to be worse off on a vegan diet than if they were to eat meat.
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koraks
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: dk-1]
#26604470 - 04/15/20 11:55 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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In my opinion, the main problem with the whole 'which diet is the most healthy' debate is the likely presence of confounders that are very difficult to control for and in practice never truly are controlled for in extant research, inherently casting a shadow of doubt on the outcomes of these studies or at least making them vulnerable to criticism that virtually cannot be mitigated.
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morrowasted
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: koraks]
#26604490 - 04/16/20 12:10 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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The fact that people who decide to be vegans also tend to be healthy in other ways does reduce the STRENGTH of the epidemiological data but it certainly doesnt do anything like allow you to reverse the conclusions you draw, which us what youd have to do to conclude that veganism is unhealthy from data
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Unknown error


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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: koraks]
#26604540 - 04/16/20 12:44 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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I think both diets can be healthy or unhealthy to a certain extent depending on how you go about it. Although i do believe plant based is better for you done right. While I was still eating meat I thought was eating a good well balanced diet and would regularly argue with one of vegan friends about how important eating a balanced diet including meat is.
But since going plant based I have actually felt great, more energy, less fatigue and generally better all round. I have been putting more thought and effort in to my food now to make sure it’s got the right nutrients and tases good but that’s only a good thing, I can’t see any reason to go back to eating meat.
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morrowasted
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Unknown error]
#26604554 - 04/16/20 12:52 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Yes, I am personally conscientious about the nutrients I ingest even though I eat meat. Unsurprisingly, people who reflect on their health behaviors tend to be healthier.
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koraks
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: morrowasted]
#26604698 - 04/16/20 02:40 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
morrowasted said: The fact that people who decide to be vegans also tend to be healthy in other ways does reduce the STRENGTH of the epidemiological data but it certainly doesnt do anything like allow you to reverse the conclusions you draw, which us what youd have to do to conclude that veganism is unhealthy from data
That's true. However, if conclusions are not firm as a result of methodological problems, the issue of reversing them also becomes sort of moot.
Another problem is that 'healthy' is a rather complex construct and if you look at the gazillions of studies done about diet vs. health, the problem is that you need to distinguish between many dimensions and indicators of both diet and health, with the resulting outcomes being much more nuanced than 'healthy or not'. You end up with a rather vague 'it depends on the specifics of the diet and which outcomes are focused on'.
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susurrador
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: koraks] 1
#26604754 - 04/16/20 03:38 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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I just feel better when I eat nothing but meat and animal products.
Never bloated.
The tiny whisp of gas I may have doesn't smell bad. Compared to lots of raunch farting on the grains and beans and veggies.
My poops are solid and small, barely requiring tp and not stinky. Compared to when I ate mostly veggies and little meat.
I eat until I'm satisfied, not full.. that means a lot less food in your stomach so working or exercising after a satisfying meal is not in the least uncomfortable.
Plant based foods take a lot more volume and you're passing a lot of totally unnecessary nonfood through your guts.
Eating only meat means you never eat sugar of any form and it drastically reduces your chances of type 2 diabetes.
Plants have adapted to predators using chemicals and toxins as they are largely inanimate in the sense of being able to move and defend themselves.
Animals as food are mobile and have other means of surviving so they never developed these largely chemical defenses to ward off predators and keep from being eaten.
Humans also have the highest functioning minds of the entire animal kingdom and our brains need high octane fuel like fat to fire on all cylinders.
Meat is also a complete protein by itself which is a huge testament to the benefits of eating only meat. The explosion of human's cognitive abilities is largely due to the wider availability of higher quality animal based foods due to advances in the technology that made hunting easier or more successful.
Bet.
But mostly I can feel in the way my body works and functions now that the people that think they know are possibly contributing to shit like diabetes and alzheimers.
Most of the inflammatory issues people have are plant based food related.
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: susurrador]
#26604761 - 04/16/20 03:44 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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When you are getting everything you need from your food, it doesn't get boring.
If the food is boring perhaps it is incomplete not just simply lacking excitment.
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koraks
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: susurrador]
#26604795 - 04/16/20 04:21 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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>My poops are solid and small, barely requiring tp If anything, that's a sign of not enough dietary fiber. Of course; if it works for you, that's fine. Just pointing out that solid poops are not necessarily a good thing. Soft is better, of course not runny/too soft. Just very malleable and moist. Should pass easily without being fluid, and certainly not requiring effort to pass.
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susurrador
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: koraks]
#26604829 - 04/16/20 04:45 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Not true.
You won't know what I mean until you try it.
I don't mean compacted or hard just solid and dense. Not smeary.
Takes no effort, comes right out.
Seriously pooping is so much more pleasant on just meat and fat.
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Distorted Vision
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: susurrador]
#26604843 - 04/16/20 04:53 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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I completely disagree 200%. I've been a vegetarian most my life and my shits are so much less messy and time consuming when I don't eat meat. When I eat mostly meat, I have to keep wiping.
Right now I am hardly eating meat and on the first wipe there's hardly anything there.
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Distorted Vision]
#26604846 - 04/16/20 04:54 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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I'm saying eating all meat and animal products. Not just mostly.
Zero plant matter.
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LeningradCowboy
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: koraks]
#26604852 - 04/16/20 05:01 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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your gut bacteria is based on what you consume. So if you consume mostly veggies your system has hard time with meat. And vice versa if you consume mostly/only meat your system has no problem with it but when fed veggies it has to adjust the bacteria levels to efficiently consume them.
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susurrador
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: LeningradCowboy]
#26604855 - 04/16/20 05:03 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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For sure. The gut flora do take a few weeks to reset. That's why some people get bad shits for a week or so when they start eating only meat.
I never even got that, but I have still been drinking beer so my gut bugs probably aren't even in pure meat ketosis mode.
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koraks
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: susurrador]
#26604899 - 04/16/20 05:43 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
susurrador said: You won't know what I mean until you try it.
No, thanks. I gave up meat years ago and I love vegetables, legumes, beans, rice, etc. Plus, I poop fine
Again, if this works for you, that's fine. I'm not here to try and convince you or anyone of changing their diet, nor do I expect others to try and do the same for me. I was just pointing out that the description of 'solid and small' poops is consistent with mild to severe constipation (type 1-2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bristol_stool_scale) and thus not a good indicator of healthy poop.
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susurrador
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: koraks]
#26604913 - 04/16/20 05:53 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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LeningradCowboy
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: koraks]
#26604928 - 04/16/20 06:06 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
koraks said:
Quote:
susurrador said: You won't know what I mean until you try it.
No, thanks. I gave up meat years ago and I love vegetables, legumes, beans, rice, etc. Plus, I poop fine
Again, if this works for you, that's fine. I'm not here to try and convince you or anyone of changing their diet, nor do I expect others to try and do the same for me. I was just pointing out that the description of 'solid and small' poops is consistent with mild to severe constipation (type 1-2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bristol_stool_scale) and thus not a good indicator of healthy poop.
When you look at animals poop that dont eat meat it is quite solid usually.
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susurrador
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: LeningradCowboy] 1
#26604933 - 04/16/20 06:09 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Like cow plop or horse plop?
Lol
Deer and antelope have hard little scat around here. Mostly juniper berries it seems.
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LeningradCowboy
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: susurrador]
#26604948 - 04/16/20 06:16 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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most wild animals dont have diarrea type shit. Most farm animals do. Something to do with diet and/or supplements like antibiots?
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susurrador
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: LeningradCowboy]
#26604953 - 04/16/20 06:19 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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I think grass is just pure fiber.
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koraks
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: LeningradCowboy] 1
#26604963 - 04/16/20 06:29 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
LeningradCowboy said: When you look at animals poop that dont eat meat it is quite solid usually.
I don't spend a lot of time looking at animal poop, and particularly not with the intention to derive a norm of healthy human bowel movements from it.
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susurrador
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: koraks] 1
#26604978 - 04/16/20 06:40 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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When you spend a lot of time in the bush, animal scat is something you'll begin to take note of.
There's a lot you can discern from it.
Dogs and people have been side by side for ages.
Part of the partnership came from the scraps that people didn't eat from their kills, the dogs would consume.
From ruminants, the intestines, stomachs, and bones probably went to the dogs. The people consumed the flesh and fat.
I feed my dogs green (unwashed) beef tripe and they fucking love it.
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: susurrador] 1
#26605119 - 04/16/20 08:07 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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My partner and I have been plant based for the last 6 months - she's a healthcare dietitian and i've been a professional Chef for the last 15 years - so it's safe to say we didn't make the descision lightly.
I was a huge meat eater before then, every single meal and snack - it wasn't until switching away from animal products that i realised how shit i felt most of the time, especially after meals - all those years i'd equated being "full" with actually being bloated, sluggish and feeling generally quite ill after a large meal - has totally changed for me now.
You need to know what to eat, most the plant milks, yeasts etc. are fortified with B12 and Choline, and Selenium you can get from a few brazil nuts or great quanitity of other stuff - they're the main 3 deficiencies.
We eat very well, considering our backgrounds i'd concede we are definitely not 'usual' people and it's easy for us to eat a well rounded, cheap and exciting diet - i wouldn't suggest veganism for a lot of other people who don't have time/money/skills, that's when you get people just eating quorn and fries and yellow shit and getting aenimic. Cutting out some or all meat is totally reachable and sensible for a vast majority of people though.
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Piaseski]
#26605223 - 04/16/20 08:45 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Another problem is that 'healthy' is a rather complex construct
the way I define it is "likelihood to experience imminent death from something other than an accident, homicide, suicide etc." I think most people would buy into that definition
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Nymphaea
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: morrowasted] 2
#26605327 - 04/16/20 09:39 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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I'm doing pretty well on a vegan diet. I think your gut flora has everything to do with this subject and I find that I eat a larger variety of foods as a vegan because I am motivated to learn and find more diverse foods, although I am limited not to have some things so if you look at the totality of all foods it is less diverse but for your average person I think they are going to end up eating a lot more of a variety eventually....as long as they are motivated and it takes motivation.
Over time everything changes about your body and once you've done it it for over half a decade your so adapted that you basically are an herbivorous animal. lol.
I personally believe humans are one of the more adaptable creatures.
Since we are talking about this subject, when I was growing up I always had a rough time with my poops when I drank sodas, ate sweets, or just had a lot of heavy food...now I still drink sodas, eat sweets, and eat at taco bell but the poops are perfect. lol.
I think this is heavily based on your mindset though, mind creates body. The gut flora in your gut literally effects how you think and it's going to make you crave what it wants and as long as you believe what you are eating is the solution to the question of "what should we eat" then you are going to focus on it's benefits as you eat it gratefully....and that's gonna make you happier than any nutrient.
I believe in peace, love, truth, justice, life, and beauty and that heavily, heavily plays in to why I choose to eat what I eat.....I know if I eat pure meat I might feel good sometimes or all the time in my health but I feel good almost all the time in my health and when I don't it's because I overate or didn't exercise or just ate way to much oil or soda or sweets or fast food.....
.....so I'm gonna choose to eat what I eat based on others, not myself, while remaining as healthy as possible in the process. I don't understand why people want to debate on that topic....there's not nearly enough land in the world for everyone to eat meat all the time....got any sources to the contrary?
There seems to be B12 in several different plants...I'm not gonna debate over that because there would be no point, but it also comes fortified all over the place as well as being in energy drinks. I'll much on hemp or chai seeds or walnuts all the time for Omega-3's....plus we got oils for that and greens and all sorts of things. There are so many phytonutrients that are great for ya in common weeds...let alone full-grown veggies, fruits, nuts, seeds, mushrooms, grains, etc etc.
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: morrowasted]
#26748783 - 06/16/20 11:47 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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I think if you are trying to discern if a vegan diet is more healthy, you have to compare it to a carnivore diet,or at least a keto diet, if you compare it to a SAD vegan is always going to come out more healthy then someone eating a hamburger on a carby white bread bun and a sugar dessert
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Unknown error]
#26748803 - 06/16/20 11:59 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
I have been putting more thought and effort in to my food now to make sure it’s got the right nutrients and tases good
And is probably the real reason you feel better
-------------------- Ach en wee ben ik de klos, met mijn boog schoot ik een albatros... A philosopher is a person who knows less and less about more and more, until he knows nothing about everything.

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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Tripsurfer]
#26753249 - 06/18/20 02:20 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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not to say vegan diets can't work or anything, but pretty much all vegans i've met tend to be... crazy. like, super crazy eco-terrorist anti-vaxxer crazy.
every vegetarian ive met on the other hand tends to be perfectly rational and eco-friendly hippies whos perfectly fine to get along with. <_<
JUST SAYIN.
the real question is though, will vegans go for lab-grown meat? after all, no animals were harmed in the making - it's just a cell scraping and cells cultured in a lab, pretty much. o-o
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susurrador
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Psion]
#26761959 - 06/21/20 12:51 AM (3 years, 7 months ago) |
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Cutting out meat is a huge mistake. Why do all the extra work of figuring out all the various combinations of plants you need to get all your nutrients when eating mostly meat and fat will cover everything?
It's taking the difficult road unnecessarily.
2 lbs of meat a day, swimming in fat and heavily salted, and I'm feeling better than ever. No carbs, no plants, no complicated combinations to make up for incomplete food.
Meat and fat has 100% of what you need. Eating plants sparingly along the way when in season is ok.
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: susurrador]
#26785744 - 06/26/20 08:59 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
susurrador said: Cutting out meat is a huge mistake. Why do all the extra work of figuring out all the various combinations of plants you need to get all your nutrients when eating mostly meat and fat will cover everything?
It's taking the difficult road unnecessarily.
2 lbs of meat a day, swimming in fat and heavily salted, and I'm feeling better than ever. No carbs, no plants, no complicated combinations to make up for incomplete food.
Meat and fat has 100% of what you need. Eating plants sparingly along the way when in season is ok.
I beg to differ. There is really not a simple way to make sure you get everything you need in your diet...but eating mostly plants makes it easier not to get too much fat and a lot easier to get enough fiber and vitamin C.
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Plant Trees
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mendocino_beano
Registered: 11/05/17
Posts: 1,074
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Nymphaea] 1
#26785753 - 06/26/20 09:02 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Our bodies are made of protein. Meat and fat. It is good for you. Vegetables are too. Eat a varied diet.
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LeningradCowboy
Yes, my name is you?



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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: mendocino_beano] 1
#26786224 - 06/27/20 02:05 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Would really like too see results from trials where we put vegetarian diet side by side with HEALTHY diet with meat. Not vegetarian diet vs normal american diet wich is the case in most studies.
-------------------- From tundra with love!
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gopher
Coffee Bean Extraordinaire


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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Nymphaea]
#26786481 - 06/27/20 06:35 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Nymphaea said:
and a lot easier to get enough fiber and vitamin C.
for vitamin C you need a lot more vitamin C if you eat carbs, fresh meat has enough vitamin C if you are only eating meat, thats why theres decade long carnivores who dont get scurvy, sailors got scurvy cause they were eating dried and preserved meat which destroys the little vitamin C in the meat
-------------------- For most of the normies out there, an operating system is just a bootloader for Google Chrome. Since Disney has obtained tremendous value from the public domain, knows how important the public domain is, and is firmly determined to never contribute anything to it. My pronouns are He and Him, and my adjectives are Fat and Jazzy
Edited by gopher (06/27/20 06:35 AM)
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ChinChiller



Registered: 07/03/10
Posts: 3,270
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: morrowasted]
#26790241 - 06/28/20 04:14 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Do you find yourself eating larger quantities of food as a vegan? My significant other is vegan and some nights I will eat a vegan meal, usually just replace the meat protein with whatever protein she is eating (soy, oat, pea based for example) + whatever carb and veggies. I find I have to stuff myself, and usually will eat more later. Just curious if anyone has experienced that as well?
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LeningradCowboy
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: ChinChiller]
#26790317 - 06/28/20 04:38 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Yep. its kilos of veggies for me if vegan/vegetarian day.
-------------------- From tundra with love!
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Pecheur
sinner and soulful savage


Registered: 07/05/18
Posts: 330
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: LeningradCowboy] 1
#26792912 - 06/29/20 06:39 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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I’m newly plant based: I was cycling two to five vegetarian days into my life before- now I am mostly plant based unless I can feel I’m missing something (occasionally I crave rare meat/fish and I will have it because I have had low iron etc in the past) or it’s a special occasion. My partner has been nearly vegan (he wears leather shoes/this is an exemption to some people’s definition of vegan) for the majority of the last decade or so. It was a big shock trying to re learn intuitive/ creative cooking skills without dairy or meat and I have done/still do my research. I bought maybe 200 dollars worth of cook books and read eye bleeding amounts of articles to understand the health portion/balanced diet needs.
I think to be sustainable long term as a lifestyle for myself there will still be milk for my coffee and maybe real cheese squirreled away in the fridge because good ice coffee and a celebratory charcuterie now and then makes me happy. I agree with Morrowasted. You need diversity sometimes. I think I can get nearly everything from being plant based but I enjoy diversity at my discretion.
My skin is healthier eating this way even for a short period, my sugar levels feel more consistent, and it’s a healthy option to stay leaner for me. I eat with the same frequency as before personally.
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gopher
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Pecheur]
#26792923 - 06/29/20 06:48 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Pecheur said:
my sugar levels feel more consistent
beware of oatmeal,or maybe its canned fruit, I have been taking my blood sugar after every meal and twice I have gotten a high reading, and both times I ate basically the same thing
the first time was 2 servings of rolled oats, with a can of apricots and a little maple syrup, my blood sugar was 8
the second time I had 2 serving of rolled oats with a can of peaches and a little maple syrup and my sugar was 7.5
I dont think it was the maple syrup cause I can eat pure sugary junk food and my reading dosnt go that high
every other meal I ate the last few weeks my sugar was under 7
-------------------- For most of the normies out there, an operating system is just a bootloader for Google Chrome. Since Disney has obtained tremendous value from the public domain, knows how important the public domain is, and is firmly determined to never contribute anything to it. My pronouns are He and Him, and my adjectives are Fat and Jazzy
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LeningradCowboy
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Pecheur] 1
#26792927 - 06/29/20 06:51 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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You have healthy attitude to your diet imho.
KUDOS!
-------------------- From tundra with love!
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Pecheur
sinner and soulful savage


Registered: 07/05/18
Posts: 330
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: LeningradCowboy]
#26792993 - 06/29/20 07:21 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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@gopher I eat so many chick peas and mushrooms in everything right now- I’m not sure what I’ll do when I get sick of curried chick peas or chick peas on salad but so far so good. I was going to start having oats instead of Vega protein shakes for snack/occasional breakfast but maybe I’ll avoid it for now. I’ve been managing roasted a stone fruit with a drizzle of diluted agave nectar over the top with dinner which still hasn’t pushed me into malaise territory yet but it’s shortly after something protein dense to balance it out.
Quote:
LeningradCowboy said: You have healthy attitude to your diet imho.
KUDOS!
If I eat healthier I get to do more drugs without guilt right?
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gopher
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Pecheur]
#26793027 - 06/29/20 07:33 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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i dont know, I think its the canned fruit now cause I googled it after writing that and it says oats are are good choice, I dont know whats going on
-------------------- For most of the normies out there, an operating system is just a bootloader for Google Chrome. Since Disney has obtained tremendous value from the public domain, knows how important the public domain is, and is firmly determined to never contribute anything to it. My pronouns are He and Him, and my adjectives are Fat and Jazzy
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Pecheur
sinner and soulful savage


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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: gopher]
#26793131 - 06/29/20 08:11 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Yeah the corn syrup from canning can be pretty woah. If I drink premade juices too often it jacks up my sugar- but I’m never really reading labels in depth for sugar anymore. Sautéed fresh peaches with a bit of cinnamon might be right up your alley if you’ve never had them before? After you said peaches I was like damn I have one that might finally be ripe!
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bio_alchemist
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Pecheur]
#26793202 - 06/29/20 08:37 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Just look at any Public Vegan Content Producers early videos 7+ years to how they look today and it tells you all you need to know!  Veganism is the Epitome of malnourishment.
Its a Death Cult.
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Brian Jones
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: bio_alchemist]
#26794131 - 06/30/20 09:55 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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I didn't read the whole thread, so this might not be an original argument, but I'm going to say THE most common anti-vegan opinion is, meat tastes good.
-------------------- "The Rolling Stones will break up over Brian Jones' dead body" John Lennon I don't want no commies in my car. No Christians either. The worst thing about corruption is that it works so well,
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gopher
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Brian Jones]
#26794141 - 06/30/20 09:57 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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one of the anti-vegans I used to follow on youtube one of his arguments is that meat has vitamins in more bio-available forms, that with veggies its all precursers or something the body has to convert
-------------------- For most of the normies out there, an operating system is just a bootloader for Google Chrome. Since Disney has obtained tremendous value from the public domain, knows how important the public domain is, and is firmly determined to never contribute anything to it. My pronouns are He and Him, and my adjectives are Fat and Jazzy
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feevers


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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: gopher]
#26794234 - 06/30/20 10:40 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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People spend way too much time over-analyzing what they shove into their face and turn into poop
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Nymphaea
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: feevers]
#26802226 - 07/03/20 08:24 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Oatmeal is a really good choice for breakfast, canned fruit is nasty to me...bunch of syrup and the fruit seems way less nutritious in general every time I see it.
That video of "malnourished vegans" is hilarious so I hope you are trolling. 
Bunch of skinny crazy people who obviously don't eat enough and a couple healthy YouTubers thrown in there for good measure.
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Plant Trees
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