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Offlinesusurrador
Psychedelic Cowboy


Registered: 03/31/19
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: LeningradCowboy]
    #26604953 - 04/16/20 06:19 AM (3 years, 9 months ago)

I think grass is just pure fiber.


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"If it doesn't work, you can always hit him with it."



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Invisiblekoraks
Registered: 06/02/03
Posts: 26,670
Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: LeningradCowboy] * 1
    #26604963 - 04/16/20 06:29 AM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

LeningradCowboy said:
When you look at animals poop that dont eat meat it is quite solid usually.



I don't spend a lot of time looking at animal poop, and particularly not with the intention to derive a norm of healthy human bowel movements from it.


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Offlinesusurrador
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: koraks] * 1
    #26604978 - 04/16/20 06:40 AM (3 years, 9 months ago)

When you spend a lot of time in the bush, animal scat is something you'll begin to take note of.

There's a lot you can discern from it.

Dogs and people have been side by side for ages.

Part of the partnership came from the scraps that people didn't eat from their kills, the dogs would consume.

From ruminants, the intestines, stomachs, and bones probably went to the dogs. The people consumed the flesh and fat.

I feed my dogs green (unwashed) beef tripe and they fucking love it.


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OfflinePiaseski
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: susurrador] * 1
    #26605119 - 04/16/20 08:07 AM (3 years, 9 months ago)

My partner and I have been plant based for the last 6 months - she's a healthcare dietitian and i've been a professional Chef for the last 15 years - so it's safe to say we didn't make the descision lightly.

I was a huge meat eater before then, every single meal and snack - it wasn't until switching away from animal products that i realised how shit i felt most of the time, especially after meals - all those years i'd equated being "full" with actually being bloated, sluggish and feeling generally quite ill after a large meal - has totally changed for me now.

You need to know what to eat, most the plant milks, yeasts etc. are fortified with B12 and Choline, and Selenium you can get from a few brazil nuts or great quanitity of other stuff - they're the main 3 deficiencies.

We eat very well, considering our backgrounds i'd concede we are definitely not 'usual' people and it's easy for us to eat a well rounded, cheap and exciting diet - i wouldn't suggest veganism for a lot of other people who don't have time/money/skills, that's when you get people just eating quorn and fries and yellow shit and getting aenimic.
Cutting out some or all meat is totally reachable and sensible for a vast majority of people though.


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Offlinemorrowasted
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Piaseski]
    #26605223 - 04/16/20 08:45 AM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:


Another problem is that 'healthy' is a rather complex construct



the way I define it is "likelihood to experience imminent death from something other than an accident, homicide, suicide etc." I think most people would buy into that definition


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OfflineNymphaea
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: morrowasted] * 2
    #26605327 - 04/16/20 09:39 AM (3 years, 9 months ago)

I'm doing pretty well on a vegan diet.  I think your gut flora has everything to do with this subject and I find that I eat a larger variety of foods as a vegan because I am motivated to learn and find more diverse foods, although I am limited not to have some things so if you look at the totality of all foods it is less diverse but for your average person I think they are going to end up eating a lot more of a variety eventually....as long as they are motivated and it takes motivation.

Over time everything changes about your body and once you've done it it for over half a decade your so adapted that you basically are an herbivorous animal.  lol.   

I personally believe humans are one of the more adaptable creatures. 

Since we are talking about this subject, when I was growing up I always had a rough time with my poops when I drank sodas, ate sweets, or just had a lot of heavy food...now I still drink sodas, eat sweets, and eat at taco bell but the poops are perfect.  lol. 



I think this is heavily based on your mindset though, mind creates body.  The gut flora in your gut literally effects how you think and it's going to make you crave what it wants and as long as you believe what you are eating is the solution to the question of "what should we eat" then you are going to focus on it's benefits as you eat it gratefully....and that's gonna make you happier than any nutrient.



I believe in peace, love, truth, justice, life, and beauty and that heavily, heavily plays in to why I choose to eat what I eat.....I know if I eat pure meat I might feel good sometimes or all the time in my health but I feel good almost all the time in my health and when I don't it's because I overate or didn't exercise or just ate way to much oil or soda or sweets or fast food.....


.....so I'm gonna choose to eat what I eat based on others, not myself, while remaining as healthy as possible in the process.  I don't understand why people want to debate on that topic....there's not nearly enough land in the world for everyone to eat meat all the time....got any sources to the contrary? 


There seems to be B12 in several different plants...I'm not gonna debate over that because there would be no point, but it also comes fortified all over the place as well as being in energy drinks.  I'll much on hemp or chai seeds or walnuts all the time for Omega-3's....plus we got oils for that and greens and all sorts of things.  There are so many phytonutrients that are great for ya in common weeds...let alone full-grown veggies, fruits, nuts, seeds, mushrooms, grains, etc etc.


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Offlinegopher
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: morrowasted]
    #26748783 - 06/16/20 11:47 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

I think if you are trying to discern if a vegan diet is more healthy, you have to compare it to a carnivore diet,or at least a keto diet,  if you compare it to a SAD vegan is always going to come out more healthy then someone eating a hamburger on a carby white bread bun and a sugar dessert


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For most of the normies out there, an operating system is just a bootloader for Google Chrome.

Since Disney has obtained tremendous value from the public domain, knows how important the public domain is, and is firmly determined to never contribute anything to it.

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OfflineTripsurfer
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Unknown error]
    #26748803 - 06/16/20 11:59 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

I have been putting more thought and effort in to my food now to make sure it’s got the right nutrients and tases good




And is probably the real reason you feel better


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OfflinePsion
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Tripsurfer]
    #26753249 - 06/18/20 02:20 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

not to say vegan diets can't work or anything, but pretty much all vegans i've met tend to be... crazy. like, super crazy eco-terrorist anti-vaxxer crazy.

every vegetarian ive met on the other hand tends to be perfectly rational and eco-friendly hippies whos perfectly fine to get along with. <_<

JUST SAYIN.  :hehehe:

the real question is though, will vegans go for lab-grown meat? after all, no animals were harmed in the making - it's just a cell scraping and cells cultured in a lab, pretty much. o-o


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Offlinesusurrador
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Psion]
    #26761959 - 06/21/20 12:51 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Cutting out meat is a huge mistake. Why do all the extra work of figuring out all the various combinations of plants you need to get all your nutrients when eating mostly meat and fat will cover everything?

It's taking the difficult road unnecessarily.

2 lbs of meat a day, swimming in fat and heavily salted, and I'm feeling better than ever. No carbs, no plants, no complicated combinations to make up for incomplete food.

Meat and fat has 100% of what you need. Eating plants sparingly along the way when in season is ok.


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OfflineNymphaea
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: susurrador]
    #26785744 - 06/26/20 08:59 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

susurrador said:
Cutting out meat is a huge mistake. Why do all the extra work of figuring out all the various combinations of plants you need to get all your nutrients when eating mostly meat and fat will cover everything?

It's taking the difficult road unnecessarily.

2 lbs of meat a day, swimming in fat and heavily salted, and I'm feeling better than ever. No carbs, no plants, no complicated combinations to make up for incomplete food.

Meat and fat has 100% of what you need. Eating plants sparingly along the way when in season is ok.




I beg to differ.  There is really not a simple way to make sure you get everything you need in your diet...but eating mostly plants makes it easier not to get too much fat and a lot easier to get enough fiber and vitamin C.


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Invisiblemendocino_beano
Registered: 11/05/17
Posts: 1,074
Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Nymphaea] * 1
    #26785753 - 06/26/20 09:02 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Our bodies are made of protein. Meat and fat. It is good for you. Vegetables are too. Eat a varied diet.


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OfflineLeningradCowboy
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: mendocino_beano] * 1
    #26786224 - 06/27/20 02:05 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Would really like too see results from trials where we put vegetarian diet side by side with HEALTHY diet with meat. Not vegetarian diet vs normal american diet wich is the case in most studies.


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Offlinegopher
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Nymphaea]
    #26786481 - 06/27/20 06:35 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Nymphaea said:

and a lot easier to get enough fiber and vitamin C.




for vitamin C you need a lot more vitamin C if you eat carbs, fresh meat has enough vitamin C if you are only eating meat, thats why theres decade long carnivores who dont get scurvy, sailors got scurvy cause they were eating dried and preserved meat which destroys the little vitamin C in the meat


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For most of the normies out there, an operating system is just a bootloader for Google Chrome.

Since Disney has obtained tremendous value from the public domain, knows how important the public domain is, and is firmly determined to never contribute anything to it.

My pronouns are He and Him, and my adjectives are Fat and Jazzy

:kratom:


Edited by gopher (06/27/20 06:35 AM)


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InvisibleChinChiller
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: morrowasted]
    #26790241 - 06/28/20 04:14 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Do you find yourself eating larger quantities of food as a vegan? My significant other is vegan and some nights I will eat a vegan meal, usually just replace the meat protein with whatever protein she is eating (soy, oat, pea based for example) + whatever carb and veggies. I find I have to stuff myself, and usually will eat more later. Just curious if anyone has experienced that as well?


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OfflineLeningradCowboy
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: ChinChiller]
    #26790317 - 06/28/20 04:38 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Yep. its kilos of veggies for me if vegan/vegetarian day.


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InvisiblePecheur
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: LeningradCowboy] * 1
    #26792912 - 06/29/20 06:39 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I’m newly plant based:  I was cycling two to five vegetarian days into my life before- now I am mostly plant based unless I can feel I’m missing something (occasionally I crave rare meat/fish and I will have it because I have had low iron etc in the past) or it’s a special occasion.  My partner has been nearly vegan (he wears leather shoes/this is an exemption to some people’s definition of vegan)  for the majority of the last decade or so.  It was a big shock trying to re learn intuitive/ creative cooking skills without dairy or meat and I have done/still do my research.  I bought maybe 200 dollars worth of cook books and read eye bleeding amounts of articles to understand the health portion/balanced diet needs. 

I think to be sustainable long term as a lifestyle for myself there will still be milk for my coffee and maybe real cheese squirreled away in the fridge because good ice coffee and a celebratory charcuterie now and then makes me happy.    I agree with Morrowasted. You need diversity sometimes. I think I can get nearly everything from being plant based but I enjoy diversity at my discretion.   

My skin is healthier eating this way even for a short period, my sugar levels feel more consistent, and it’s a healthy option to stay leaner for me.  I eat with the same frequency as before personally.


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Offlinegopher
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Pecheur]
    #26792923 - 06/29/20 06:48 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Pecheur said: 

my sugar levels feel more consistent





beware of oatmeal,or maybe its canned fruit,  I have been taking my blood sugar after every meal and twice I have gotten a high reading, and both times I ate basically the same thing

the first time was 2 servings of rolled oats, with a can of apricots and a little maple syrup, my blood sugar was 8

the second time I had 2 serving of rolled oats with a can of peaches and a little maple syrup and my sugar was 7.5

I dont think it was the maple syrup cause I can eat pure sugary junk food and my reading dosnt go that high

every other meal I ate the last few weeks my sugar was under 7


--------------------
For most of the normies out there, an operating system is just a bootloader for Google Chrome.

Since Disney has obtained tremendous value from the public domain, knows how important the public domain is, and is firmly determined to never contribute anything to it.

My pronouns are He and Him, and my adjectives are Fat and Jazzy

:kratom:


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OfflineLeningradCowboy
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: Pecheur] * 1
    #26792927 - 06/29/20 06:51 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

You have healthy attitude to your diet imho.

KUDOS!


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InvisiblePecheur
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Re: Debunking the three most common anti-vegan opinions [Re: LeningradCowboy]
    #26792993 - 06/29/20 07:21 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

@gopher I eat so many chick peas and mushrooms in everything right now- I’m not sure what I’ll do when I get sick of curried chick peas or chick peas on salad but so far so good.  I was going to start having oats instead of Vega protein shakes for snack/occasional breakfast  but maybe I’ll avoid it for now.  I’ve been managing roasted a stone fruit with a drizzle of diluted agave nectar over the top with dinner which still hasn’t pushed me into malaise territory yet but it’s shortly after something protein dense to balance it out.

Quote:

LeningradCowboy said:
You have healthy attitude to your diet imho.:lol:

KUDOS!




If I eat healthier I get to do more drugs without guilt right? :lol:  :wink:


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