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LSA Woodrose
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Space Between Shroom Trips 1
#26599072 - 04/13/20 09:07 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Okay, so I am in the middle of my initial harvesting for my very first n00b grow. The Saturday that just passed, I ate a mere 16.9 gram fresh mushroom, and an hour later took another 5 grams. It was a relatively mild trip, as expected, but I wanted to test the waters as before then, I hadn't done shrooms in a long time and wasn't sure what to expect. My next trip I want to go up by about 33%, meaning either 22 grams fresh or 2.2 grams dry. I have heard different reports, but most people say a week between trips is the way to go without losing effect due to tolerance.
Also, since I am growing my own now, is the experience with dry different than the experience with fresh? Other than the obvious of having to chew raw, full mushrooms, I mean. Okay, so since I am growing now, and am getting some level of abundance, what if there are some weeks I want to do more than one trip? Is there any sort of a decent formula for how much to go up to get the same effect? I assume tripping two days in a row, one would have to maybe even double the dose for the same effect? What about 2 days between trips? 3, 4, or 5? Is there some sort of a sliding scale that's known for those who don't want to wait until tolerance goes back down all the way to baseline?
Thanks all, happy trails!
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Socrateshroom
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: LSA Woodrose] 2
#26599088 - 04/13/20 09:13 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Congrats man I knew you could do it!!
I've been doing it every week for the last month and have no issues with tolerance. I'd recommend 1-2 weeks, better to wait at least 2 weeks to regain the "magic" feeling of mushrooms.
Fresh is more potent, drying mushrooms is mainly for storage purposes. I always dry my entire flushes because I don't intend to eat them then and there.
Some people have success tripping two days in a row without increasing dosage much. I'd always recommend at least a week because it will guarantee you'll be at least close to baseline.
Can't wait to hear all your trip reports, told you growing was easy
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malfenderson
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: LSA Woodrose] 2
#26599161 - 04/13/20 10:02 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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One week and you will def. trip, two weeks and you might, I dunno, like, it depends what you want. If you have grown a bunch of mushrooms, you might as well experiment yourself, no two bodies are exactly the same.
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CountHTML
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: malfenderson] 2
#26599273 - 04/13/20 11:29 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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I haven’t tripped shrooms in a year and fine with that. Back when I was doing it I was probably going in once every 3 weeks or so over the course of a good year. No issues with that frequency; but, bigger reality shattering doses should probably be spaced out more for purposes of reflection and integration.
In terms of physical tolerance, you should be good in 7-10 days.
I tripped sporadically before that intensive year. Plan when return to it when work-related and social routines become conducive to it again. There is definitely something to be said for having active and inactive phases with this stuff.
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DJ Ed
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: LSA Woodrose] 2
#26599318 - 04/14/20 12:04 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Awesome, great work. 
Weekly intervals are fine to remove “most” tolerance, two weeks as Socrateshroom says, will allow “the magic” back. But there are many factors, nd a lot is personal. I have been tripping at two week intervals for over six months now, and I’m starting to think I have some tolerance. “Magic” trip’s are becoming more sporadic.
I have noticed in the past tripping at one week intervals, that by the 3rd week, the magic has more or less completely gone.
You can still trip, but those “magical” elements are missing.
That’s alright once in a while, but for profound meaningful trips, I need the magic. You and your brain and body can be the judge of this,
Wait for PrimalSoup to comment; he regularly trips days after day after day; he talks about day 2 = 1.5x the dose of day 1, day 3 = 1.5x the dose of day 2, up to a maximum of about 250g fresh.
Oh and your question on fresh over dry: fresh is always 10x a nicer trip than from dry, as the drying process destroys at least 50% of the psilocin. Psilocybin does not seem as badly affected by the drying process (hence why liberty caps are a great candidate for drying).
Take care DJ Ed
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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DJ Ed
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed] 2
#26599323 - 04/14/20 12:05 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Should have also added; that’s why I’m trying to perfect a technique to freeze mushroom tea made f4om fresh mushrooms, to keep the bulk of the psilocin, and retain those fast, visual, exciting trips....
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26599587 - 04/14/20 05:57 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Socrateshroom said: Congrats man I knew you could do it!!
Thanks, brother!
Quote:
Socrateshroom said: I've been doing it every week for the last month and have no issues with tolerance. I'd recommend 1-2 weeks, better to wait at least 2 weeks to regain the "magic" feeling of mushrooms.
Great advice thanks. There is another variable here, though. I know I asked the question about potency versus tolerance, which you answered. But something else occurred to me, reading your post. How much should I really care about tolerance?
I think that if I were copping shrooms off some random dealer, or at one of the shows my Grateful Dead cover band plays, I would be paying...what, about $10.00 to $15.00 per gram? So, assuming I wasn't buying an ounce, which would usually net me a nice discount, a trip would essentially cost me about $30.00 or more? But my situation has completely changed in the past couple of weeks, or the past week since even an initial harvest has yielded 10 ounces of fresh, which dried to almost a full ounce. I also have about 120 grams of fresh in the fridge, and I think today I will end up picking well over 100 grams. And only HALF my 24 cakes have either completed their first flush or are about to in the next day or three. I'm having difficulty even imagining what kind of a haul I will end up with for long term storage.
I mean, I know I asked a tolerance question, but I think my current situation literally changes everything. Once I get a handle on what doses are good for me for mild trips, moderate trips, and microdosing, then I think I will just say screw the tolerance, and try to figure out how much I need to up the doses for the effect I am searching for. At least if I am looking to go through phases of dosing more often, to one degree or another.
Quote:
Socrateshroom said: Fresh is more potent, drying mushrooms is mainly for storage purposes. I always dry my entire flushes because I don't intend to eat them then and there.
I have been reading up on this since I posted this thread, and it appears that most people generally agree that the low heats of your typical dehydrators like mine don't appreciably effect the psilocybin in the shrooms; but what they do seem to effect is the psilocin, which is apparently a lot more heat labile than the psilocybin.
I haven't scientifically verified this by reading any research, so since I just got it off the intrawebs, I take it with some mild skepticism.
Quote:
Socrateshroom said: Can't wait to hear all your trip reports, told you growing was easy 
Yes, you most certainly did. Don't get me wrong, I am making my share of mistakes. Over-misting is most asssuredly my biggest. Something Logical Chaos was able to point out to me just by looking at my last pics I posted in the Cultivation forum.
Quote:
DJ Ed said: Should have also added; that’s why I’m trying to perfect a technique to freeze mushroom tea made f4om fresh mushrooms, to keep the bulk of the psilocin, and retain those fast, visual, exciting trips....
This I may be very interested in over the coming weeks/months.
Quote:
DJ Ed said: Oh and your question on fresh over dry: fresh is always 10x a nicer trip than from dry, as the drying process destroys at least 50% of the psilocin. Psilocybin does not seem as badly affected by the drying process (hence why liberty caps are a great candidate for drying).
I just need to clarify something. When you say 10x you are being extremely hyperbolic, right? I get the feeling that what you mean to say is that you like fresh somewhat better? I just want to be clear. Because I have taken dried shrooms in the past, and I took fresh for the first time this past weekend. And while I can't yet comment on which is better, since I took dried shrooms literally decades ago, I can say with an absolute certainty that my experience with fresh was most definitely not 10x better.
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DJ Ed
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Haha you caught me out; common fault of mine is hyperbole! What I should have said was that, subjectively speaking, I much prefer the trip from fresh to dry. It is quicker onset, much more visual, more magic, and seems to take me much further, in a less scary way!
Regarding your comments back to Socrateshroom, it is not the dehydrator heat that causes the dg\egradation, it is the length of time exposed to air. So the dehydrator is the best method BY FAR of drying mushrooms. I can dry an entire flush, uncut, within 4 hours at 70 degrees Celsius (approx 170 F). I previously used to spend a week drying mushrooms with a fan then a desiccant chamber, and with those didn’t notice a drop in potency... Also note recently I threw away 2 flushes worth of frozen tea ice cubes, as I hadn’t sealed them once frozen. The psychoactives, notably the psilocin, has basically disappeared in around a week,while in the freezer, exposed to freezer oxygen!!
Check out the shroomery Doseage calculator; you will note it has approx figures for loss of psychoactives while drying; you will lose approx 50% psilocin, but only 20% psilocybin.
I am still drying some flushes, for the convenience of say if I wanted to trip on a camping expedition, or hike. But I am starting to store tea from fresh, to retain those “nicer elements” of the trip.
Final comment now you are self-sufficient in mushroom stocks; you’ll work out the tolerance aspects personal to you through trial and error. Once you have had a few trips where “the magic” was lacking, you’ll build your own picture of what works or not.
Mush love DJ Ed
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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The Mycologist
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26599645 - 04/14/20 06:49 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Im curious how accurate those calculators are.
I thought dehydration did not effect potency, the calculator seems to contradict that.
-------------------- "That you are here—that life exists, and identity; That the powerful play goes on, and you will contribute a verse.” ― Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass

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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26599977 - 04/14/20 09:49 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
The Mycologist said: Im curious how accurate those calculators are.
I thought dehydration did not effect potency, the calculator seems to contradict that.
I hate to say it, but when I consult multiple sources around the web, hell even different threads in this forum, there really seems to be no definitive answers I can find. Some people will quote scientific evidence that psilocybin is not even close to heat labile enough to degrade at all with drying via fan and heat at or around the 170s Fahrenheit. I think one thing universally agreed upon is that heat (well, actually I think its the oxygen) will definitely degrade the psilocyn.
Here's the thing, though. How much degradation? Is it 10%? 30? 50? More? I'm not sure that there is any evidence other than anecdotal from many varied trip reports. I'm sure the information is out there somewhere. I can only say I haven't seen anything definitive. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, because I am learning as I go here.
Quote:
DJ Ed said: Haha you caught me out; common fault of mine is hyperbole!
Nah, lol not at all. I was definitely NOT calling you out, brother! I may be a total n00b, but I'm not stupid. I was 99% sure that you were using hyperbole as a tool to make your point. The only reason I didn't just let it go, and decided to ask, was because this forum very often has people posting a wealth of very detailed, empirical information. My intent was only to make sure I was right, not to criticize your posting style.
lol I never honestly believed my parents intended murder when I was a kid and my Mom ran after me with the dreaded wooden spoon yelling, "I'm gonna kill you!"
Hyperbole is a natural part of our vernacular, not a flaw in your conversational style.
Just saying.
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DJ Ed
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: LSA Woodrose] 1
#26600045 - 04/14/20 10:20 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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It is clear in the guidelines that it is an approximation. Best thing you can do is alter the figures as per your particular grow setup and findings. If you check the source data, there can be wild variances in potency; reckon 1-4x on home grown, 1-10x difference on wild.
It’s giving the approximate average values, but is a great guide for beginners.
Mush love DJ Ed
Edited by DJ Ed (04/14/20 10:46 AM)
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Socrateshroom
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: LSA Woodrose] 1
#26600554 - 04/14/20 01:31 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
LSA Woodrose said: Great advice thanks. There is another variable here, though. I know I asked the question about potency versus tolerance, which you answered. But something else occurred to me, reading your post. How much should I really care about tolerance?
Well, there are a couple reasons to care.
1) Tolerance builds quickly. And if you are taking them, say daily, you'll find it hard to sustain that unless you grow A LOT more. Weekly, you won't need to up the dose much if at all BUT after a while that tolerance will build up.
2) You don't want to start abusing mushrooms. Not that you shouldn't do them everyday or a few times a week, if you have a purpose. That's why I like mushrooms. They have a built in "chill out on taking so much" mechanism. It's easy to get into the romantic phase of tripping after your first grow and think "I want to trip ALL THE TIME now"
3) These are powerful substances. You can get psychologically burnt out from taking too often if you aren't prepared/experienced. I've been tripping every week this past month and I can feel the weight on my psyche. However, everyone is different so, for some, they have no issue tripping daily or weekly.
The amazing thing is now YOU get to experiment. You get to see what works for you and doesn't. Want to try micro dosing? Go for it. Want to try a heroic dose? Do it! Maybe just a nice mid dose of 1.5g? Why not! You get to find out what works for you. Super happy that you have joined us in the dark side. My cult brothers and sisters will soon be at your house to drag you into the woods and initiate you 
Also, if heat degraded the actives in mushrooms, Tea wouldn't be a thing. There is some consensus that they oxidize in the presence of oxygen and/or light. I don't know if that's true but, to be on the safe side, I keep mine in an airtight container in the dark. I've yet to have a problem with dehydrating mine in a dehydrator. I guess I'll take the possible loss in potency for ease of storage.
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The Mycologist
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Quote:
Socrateshroom said:
Quote:
LSA Woodrose said: Great advice thanks. There is another variable here, though. I know I asked the question about potency versus tolerance, which you answered. But something else occurred to me, reading your post. How much should I really care about tolerance?
Well, there are a couple reasons to care.
1) Tolerance builds quickly. And if you are taking them, say daily, you'll find it hard to sustain that unless you grow A LOT more. Weekly, you won't need to up the dose much if at all BUT after a while that tolerance will build up.
2) You don't want to start abusing mushrooms. Not that you shouldn't do them everyday or a few times a week, if you have a purpose. That's why I like mushrooms. They have a built in "chill out on taking so much" mechanism. It's easy to get into the romantic phase of tripping after your first grow and think "I want to trip ALL THE TIME now"
3) These are powerful substances. You can get psychologically burnt out from taking too often if you aren't prepared/experienced. I've been tripping every week this past month and I can feel the weight on my psyche. However, everyone is different so, for some, they have no issue tripping daily or weekly.
The amazing thing is now YOU get to experiment. You get to see what works for you and doesn't. Want to try micro dosing? Go for it. Want to try a heroic dose? Do it! Maybe just a nice mid dose of 1.5g? Why not! You get to find out what works for you. Super happy that you have joined us in the dark side. My cult brothers and sisters will soon be at your house to drag you into the woods and initiate you 
Also, if heat degraded the actives in mushrooms, Tea wouldn't be a thing. There is some consensus that they oxidize in the presence of oxygen and/or light. I don't know if that's true but, to be on the safe side, I keep mine in an airtight container in the dark. I've yet to have a problem with dehydrating mine in a dehydrator. I guess I'll take the possible loss in potency for ease of storage.
 Take it easy, but take it
-------------------- "That you are here—that life exists, and identity; That the powerful play goes on, and you will contribute a verse.” ― Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass

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PrimalSoup
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Quote:
LSA Woodrose said: Okay, so I am in the middle of my initial harvesting for my very first n00b grow. The Saturday that just passed, I ate a mere 16.9 gram fresh mushroom, and an hour later took another 5 grams. It was a relatively mild trip, as expected, but I wanted to test the waters as before then, I hadn't done shrooms in a long time and wasn't sure what to expect. My next trip I want to go up by about 33%, meaning either 22 grams fresh or 2.2 grams dry. I have heard different reports, but most people say a week between trips is the way to go without losing effect due to tolerance.
Also, since I am growing my own now, is the experience with dry different than the experience with fresh? Other than the obvious of having to chew raw, full mushrooms, I mean. Okay, so since I am growing now, and am getting some level of abundance, what if there are some weeks I want to do more than one trip? Is there any sort of a decent formula for how much to go up to get the same effect? I assume tripping two days in a row, one would have to maybe even double the dose for the same effect? What about 2 days between trips? 3, 4, or 5? Is there some sort of a sliding scale that's known for those who don't want to wait until tolerance goes back down all the way to baseline?
Thanks all, happy trails! 
You can take them as often as you can stand to but you usually have to up the dosage. Experiment you'll find out what works. Seems to differ for different people.
Don't eat raw or dry, make tea. Unless you really like nausea and puking.
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if you stand too close to the machine it'll start to eat youPrimal's simple tested teks and projects: Wheat Prep 2.0 Acidic Tea Tek Potency Project!
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Vibe_Enthusiast
Mushroom Technician



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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: PrimalSoup] 1
#26601631 - 04/14/20 09:22 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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 I've found that I only really need like 4 days between trips to be fully vulnerable to the next dose (ime). I don't dose this often anymore though. I like to space them about a month or two apart. Just brings a different headspace opposed to dosing more frequently - again (ime).
You'll learn your tolerances the more you take them and the more frequent you do as well. Glad you had yourself a nice little trip there though brother! At least you're taking the baby steps. I took 2g of PE for my first time and that blew my socks off (we just thought they were standard mushrooms) - was a noobie at the time haha. Never had another trip like that since then.
PE trips are completely different than cubes
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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: PrimalSoup]
#26602227 - 04/15/20 07:14 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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To respond to both of you simultaneously:
Quote:
Socrateshroom said:
Well, there are a couple reasons to care.
1) Tolerance builds quickly. And if you are taking them, say daily, you'll find it hard to sustain that unless you grow A LOT more. Weekly, you won't need to up the dose much if at all BUT after a while that tolerance will build up.
2) You don't want to start abusing mushrooms. Not that you shouldn't do them everyday or a few times a week, if you have a purpose. That's why I like mushrooms. They have a built in "chill out on taking so much" mechanism. It's easy to get into the romantic phase of tripping after your first grow and think "I want to trip ALL THE TIME now"
3) These are powerful substances. You can get psychologically burnt out from taking too often if you aren't prepared/experienced. I've been tripping every week this past month and I can feel the weight on my psyche. However, everyone is different so, for some, they have no issue tripping daily or weekly.
The amazing thing is now YOU get to experiment. You get to see what works for you and doesn't. Want to try micro dosing? Go for it. Want to try a heroic dose? Do it! Maybe just a nice mid dose of 1.5g? Why not! You get to find out what works for you. Super happy that you have joined us in the dark side. My cult brothers and sisters will soon be at your house to drag you into the woods and initiate you 
Also, if heat degraded the actives in mushrooms, Tea wouldn't be a thing. There is some consensus that they oxidize in the presence of oxygen and/or light. I don't know if that's true but, to be on the safe side, I keep mine in an airtight container in the dark. I've yet to have a problem with dehydrating mine in a dehydrator. I guess I'll take the possible loss in potency for ease of storage.
Quote:
DJ Ed said: It is clear in the guidelines that it is an approximation. Best thing you can do is alter the figures as per your particular grow setup and findings. If you check the source data, there can be wild variances in potency; reckon 1-4x on home grown, 1-10x difference on wild.
It’s giving the approximate average values, but is a great guide for beginners.
Mush love DJ Ed
Agreed. There are so many variables in this. One of the many reasons I intend to keep the doses on the low side. Not just while experimenting, but in perpetuity. I don't need to take what people call heroic doses to have my fun and gain my insights. But the beauty of having so much shrooms from a grow like even my n00b grow is that I can experiment without throwing hundreds of dollars down the toilet.
That was sort of my point. I wasn't trying to make light of the power of these drugs by saying that tolerance wasn't as big of an issue to me right now. Only that given how much I'm harvesting, I am incredibly healthy, work out like a maniac with weights and on my bicycle rides, diet, and keep my bodydat under 10%, which isn't bad for a guy in his 50s, that I have a lot of wiggle-room for experimentation.
Hahaha, to address Socrateseshroom's point, I have non intention of locking myself in my house and becoming some hallucinogen-incel. 
Quote:
PrimalSoup said: You can take them as often as you can stand to but you usually have to up the dosage. Experiment you'll find out what works. Seems to differ for different people.
Don't eat raw or dry, make tea. Unless you really like nausea and puking. 
Thanks for the info! I intend to experiment with them.
As for nausea and vomiting, honestly that's not an issue. I took a small 1.7 grams of fresh last Saturday, then followed it up with about 5-6 grams more of fresh. I simply chewed them up until they were the consistency of baby food, swallowed, and washed them down with a liter or so of water. Honestly, I don't get sick from organic hallucinogens.
I used to, but not anymore. I remember decades ago having a really hard time eating some Hawaiian Baby Woodrose seeds and some dried shrooms. The indigestion and nausea, almost to the point of vomiting, nearly ruined my trips. These days, however, as part of my health and fitness regimen, I use intermittent fasting.
Since getting back into tripping, I have gotten to the point where I have completely eliminated the need or desire for LSA extraction with Woodrose seeds and MG seeds. The reason is that I am already fasting a lot anyway. GREAT way to lose weight, by the way. But whenever I have tripped since starting up again a few months ago, I fast for a minimum of 12 hours. I think once I did 8 or 10, but I forget.
It also completely prevents any real nausea. The most I have EVER felt since starting tripping again is a little intestinal bloating for a little while. No nausea, no vomiting, no cramps, or digestive problems.
So no need to jump through hoops with this stuff, I just eat what I want and that's pretty much that. If it becomes an issue, then yeah, I will do teas or extractions of whatever. For now, though, no need.
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Socrateshroom
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I have no problem with Nausea up to 3.5g. However, I get a ton of gas 
So if you have the capability, I would make tea. I still eat mine dry.
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LSA Woodrose
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Quote:
Socrateshroom said: I have no problem with Nausea up to 3.5g. However, I get a ton of gas 
So if you have the capability, I would make tea. I still eat mine dry.
Can you clarify what you mean by this? You said if I have the capability to make the tea, but I got the feeling that you were going to say if I have the capability, I should just eat them whole. Because you followed that up after we were talking about me not getting nausea, and you not getting nausea on the 3.5 g.
Are you suggesting that, other than nausea, there are advantages to making tea, over eating either dried or fresh? Because if it’s just about the nausea, and that isn’t an issue to me, why would I bother going through the extra effort?
Edited by LSA Woodrose (04/15/20 09:19 AM)
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Socrateshroom
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Quote:
LSA Woodrose said:
Quote:
Socrateshroom said: I have no problem with Nausea up to 3.5g. However, I get a ton of gas 
So if you have the capability, I would make tea. I still eat mine dry.
Can you clarify what you mean by this? You said if I have the capability to make the tea, but I got the feeling that you were going to say if I have the capability, I should just eat them whole. Because you followed that up after we were talking about me not getting nausea, and you not getting nausea on the 3.5 g.
Are you suggesting that, other than nausea, there are advantages to making tea, over eating either dried or fresh? Because if it’s just about the nausea, and that isn’t an issue to me, why would I bother going through the extra effort?
The gas can be absolutely annoying. Perhaps we adapt to it since, as I trip more often, the gas doesn't seem to be as much of an issue. But after a long break, my return to mushrooms always comes with intense gas in the middle of the trip.
Benefits of tea?
Helps with nausea and/or gas for those who experience it. Comes on faster (So less of the "come up" anxiety experienced) Generally lasts shorter (good if you don't have time for a 4-6 hour experience) Generally more intense (this could simply be a perceptual effect due to shorter come up)
Benefits of dry/fresh (in my opinion) Slower come up can be a benefit as the anxiety can be a time to work through and face fears Lasts longer Less "intense" (as above maybe simply because of the longer come up. More of a smooth journey rather than 0 to 90mph when doing tea/lemon tek)
Tea is just better on the stomach. Personally, I like to eat mine dry because it doesn't give me any issues.
(Although I hate eating them fresh. I rather make tea if I'm eating fresh mushies)
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DJ Ed
Mushroom Engineer


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It’s the beauty of growing your own healthy, organic, loved mushrooms, LSA 
I rarely get nausea, though I vomited once. But that was from mixing with really strong cannabis! My “problem” symptoms are the excessive yawning, and the frequent urination! I’ll tend to go to the loo quite a few times on the come up, then it seems to slow down (a little bit ). I have been considering buying a camping toilet for the downstairs trip room, but on reflection, probably not the most sensible idea to have what is effectively a bucket of urine in your trip space
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26602879 - 04/15/20 12:33 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Socrateshroom. as for the gas, I get what you're saying. I get a little bloated, both on LSA and the one time I ate the fresh last weekend, but nothing out of control. I never get gas pains or intestinal distress. So that's not really an issue to me. Plus it really doesn't last very long anyway. From what I can see, it seemed to last much longer with the Woodrose/MG seeds than it did with the shrooms. But nothing more than a very minor, even inconsequential annoyance.
I may try tea then, just for the different experience since I am going to be all about experimentation this coming late Spring and summer. But without knowing one way or the other, I have the feeling I am not going to like the tea as much as just eating them. I like the duration of shrooms. Not too long, not too short. I also like the slow buildup. I was never a big fan of One minute you're straight as the Pope, the next...WHAM! You're peaking. I had that experience once, and it was the strangest experience of my life. It was also quite terrifying at fist, as it happened like 10 hours later, out of nowhere, long after I thought I had eaten fake acid at a Dead show in Madison Square Garden and never got off on it.
I'll try the tea, though, if for no other reason, just for shits and giggles.
One more thing. As far as hating eating them fresh, lol I could care less how I eat them. I can't tell you the horrible, malignant-tasting protein shakes, meal replacement powders, energy and nutrition bars I choked down in the 90's. Now they make these things taste a helliuva lot better than they used to, I can tell you that for damn sure! But as someone who is a sort of hobbyist bodybuilder, and fitness nut, I got so used to eating and drinking the most foul tasting, albeit nutrient dense concoctions that shrooms are nothing, fresh or dried. Hell, even scoffing down a teaspoon of Hawaiian Woodrose seeds, powdered by my coffee grinder, was no biggie. And LMAO that seed powder tastes a helluva lot worse than fresh shrooms. 
Quote:
DJ Ed said: It’s the beauty of growing your own healthy, organic, loved mushrooms, LSA 
I rarely get nausea, though I vomited once. But that was from mixing with really strong cannabis! My “problem” symptoms are the excessive yawning, and the frequent urination! I’ll tend to go to the loo quite a few times on the come up, then it seems to slow down (a little bit ). I have been considering buying a camping toilet for the downstairs trip room, but on reflection, probably not the most sensible idea to have what is effectively a bucket of urine in your trip space 
I get the yawns, too, sometimes while tripping, but only when relaxing. If I decide to get on my bicycle or do some other trip-friendly activity, then I don't yawn at all. Unlike with LSD, which I remember from years ago being very speedy, I always half feel like I could go to sleep on shrooms and LSA from Woodrose of MG seeds.
Edit:
Quote:
DJ Ed said: I have been considering buying a camping toilet for the downstairs trip room, but on reflection, probably not the most sensible idea to have what is effectively a bucket of urine in your trip space 
Ewww.
That said, I got your trip-room toilet right here, bitch.
(Holy shit, that guy below looks both like an adult child AND a pedophile!)

Edited by LSA Woodrose (04/15/20 12:39 PM)
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Socrateshroom
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Everyone is different. Some get intense nausea from them. I never have (I always fast 6 or more hours before my trips, don’t know if that helps).
But it’s exactly as you’ve said. Experiment for the hell of it. You might find a particular method of ingestion you like better than the rest.
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LSA Woodrose
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Quote:
Socrateshroom said: Everyone is different. Some get intense nausea from them. I never have (I always fast 6 or more hours before my trips, don’t know if that helps).
Oh, I am absolutely, unequivocally certain that fasting mitigates, or eliminates completely, any nausea, and any greater-than-minor gastrointestinal discomfort. Now, I cannot prove that, of course. However, while these substances have not been studied exhaustively because of their schedule I status, I think that with all the studies on fasting and intermittent fasting, and all of the health benefits that go with it, I honestly don’t think it’s a big leap. I believe that not having food anywhere near your upper G.I. tract is going to be of profound benefit when ingesting all of these various organic compounds that cause vasoconstriction in the stomach and intestines.
Again, I can’t prove this, because these substances are not well studied, which by the way is very unfortunate, but that’s another conversation entirely. But I think my hypothesis is sound, at the very least.
Anybody who hasn’t tried fasting, and I don’t mean just for a couple of hours, I’m talking 12 or more hours preferably, I think you’ll find it incredibly beneficial in alleviating most or even all of the various gastrointestinal disturbances that are concomitant with all of these organic, psychedelic compounds across-the-board.
Quote:
Socrateshroom said: But it’s exactly as you’ve said. Experiment for the hell of it. You might find a particular method of ingestion you like better than the rest.
That’s the plan, brother!
Edited by LSA Woodrose (04/15/20 02:40 PM)
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DJ Ed
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What a great idea, LSA. I’m not sure what would be worse; my daughter walking in and seeing dad on his knees pissing in a bucket, or dad laid there in a nappy 
Oh and try the tea. Don’t use lemon juice, just water. I have never eaten mushrooms to trip, only different styles of tea, or smoothie. The come up can be fast, 20 mins to an hour and a half; and the trip can be short to long, 3 to 6 hours.
That’s perfect for me, though I tend to prefer towards the 6 hour mark than the 3
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26603435 - 04/15/20 04:39 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
DJ Ed said: What a great idea, LSA. I’m not sure what would be worse; my daughter walking in and seeing dad on his knees pissing in a bucket, or dad laid there in a nappy 
Best of luck with all your daughter's future therapy bills either way!
Quote:
DJ Ed said:Oh and try the tea. Don’t use lemon juice, just water. I have never eaten mushrooms to trip, only different styles of tea, or smoothie. The come up can be fast, 20 mins to an hour and a half; and the trip can be short to long, 3 to 6 hours.
That’s perfect for me, though I tend to prefer towards the 6 hour mark than the 3 
I will definitely try the tea within the coming weeks. First I want to do some test dosing to find my ideal dose and to test fresh and dry to try and see if I can determine how much, if any, potency loss I have gotten with drying.
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Enkidu
"No-Such-Person"


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Too much replies to read but wanted to share my experience
Ive never really noticed any tolerance with mushrooms
Ive dosed them two days in a row before
Multiple times in a week
Microdosed daily for a month with big doses thrown in
You can really do it however you want
They kinda self regulate imo
I would try 3g if i were you
Oh and as far as fresh and dry, i cant say i ever noticed much difference though some people say fresh were better or different for them
-------------------- Within You , Without You
      
Edited by Enkidu (04/15/20 05:13 PM)
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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Enkidu]
#26603644 - 04/15/20 06:08 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enkidu said: Too much replies to read but wanted to share my experience
Ive never really noticed any tolerance with mushrooms
Ive dosed them two days in a row before
Multiple times in a week
Microdosed daily for a month with big doses thrown in
You can really do it however you want
They kinda self regulate imo
Well your experiences with tolerance seems to be in the minority, but that doesn’t mean you aren’t correct either. I’ve heard what you said above expressed by people as well. I guess I’ll see soon enough, because I am experimenting right now, I’m looking forward to seeing how all this shakes out in terms of dosages, frequency, intensity, and such.
Quote:
Enkidu said: I would try 3g if i were you
Not going to happen, at least not this weekend.
If that’s the dosage I’m going to find that’s best suited to me, I’ll get there soon enough. I have the whole summer coming up to really mess around and experiment with this stuff. Just for now, I’m spacing all of my initial shrooms dosing one week apart, just until I figure out what my ideal dosage is. I am absolutely, unequivocally not going to rush this. If 2.5 g of dried in capsules is a little lower than my preference, then the next time, which will be the week after the Saturday, I’ll start at 3.0 g.
The Saturday that just passed, I ate 18 g of fresh, and after about an hour and a half, I ate another 5 g of fresh just to add to the experience. as expected, it was a little bit on the light side, but as I said, I’m in no hurry to find my ideal dose. I am going to have some capsules with me this Saturday, so I can always take a little bit more if I want it. Actually LOL 2.5 g this Saturday is a little higher than I had intended to go. My original intent was to do 2.2 g, and have a couple of capsules in reserve in case I wanted more after it started hitting me, but when I did my capsules after putting the dried into a coffee grinder they all ended up at 0.5 g each. So I will work in those increments for now.
Quote:
Enkidu said: Oh and as far as fresh and dry, i cant say i ever noticed much difference though some people say fresh were better or different for them
I guess I’ll find out soon enough what ends up being true for me in this regard.
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PrimalSoup
hyperspatial illuminations



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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: LSA Woodrose] 1
#26603761 - 04/15/20 06:45 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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If your grow was multispore there will be genetic differences between different fruits and even on the same fruit. So one could be very strong and one could be not so great. This makes it hard to set dosages unless you mix them all together - an advantage of tea.
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if you stand too close to the machine it'll start to eat youPrimal's simple tested teks and projects: Wheat Prep 2.0 Acidic Tea Tek Potency Project!
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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: PrimalSoup]
#26603849 - 04/15/20 07:16 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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PrimalSoup, another reason I am going slow with the dosages. I may be wrong, but I have a feeling that I’ll be getting somewhat consistent results. Keep in mind, that I’m not a connoisseur of shrooms. I’m sure that keeping the dosages decent, but not too high, will mean my worst case scenario will hopefully be an overly mild experience. Not the reverse LOL.
In the end, they’re all different strains of the same species. I may not know my ass from a hole in the ground, but hopefully there won’t be such a huge disparity between doses that I won’t be able to get any kind of a handle whatsoever on what to take and when. Otherwise I may have to just ditch these shrooms entirely and unfortunately stick with morning glory seeds and Hawaiian Woodrose seeds. I like shrooms a lot better, but at least LSA is predictable in terms of dose to response and effect. I don’t really need that kind a sword of Damocles over my head every time I take a handful of shrooms, to be quite honest. It’s just not worth it to me.
Edited by LSA Woodrose (04/15/20 07:23 PM)
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Socrateshroom
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Quote:
LSA Woodrose said: PrimalSoup, another reason I am going slow with the dosages. I may be wrong, but I have a feeling that I’ll be getting somewhat consistent results. Keep in mind, that I’m not a connoisseur of shrooms. I’m sure that keeping the dosages decent, but not too high, will mean my worst case scenario will hopefully be an overly mild experience. Not the reverse LOL.
In the end, they’re all different strains of the same species. I may not know my ass from a hole in the ground, but hopefully there won’t be such a huge disparity between doses that I won’t be able to get any kind of a handle whatsoever on what to take and when. Otherwise I may have to just ditch these shrooms entirely and unfortunately stick with morning glory seeds and Hawaiian Woodrose seeds. I like shrooms a lot better, but at least LSA is predictable in terms of dose to response and effect. I don’t really need that kind a sword of Damocles over my head every time I take a handful of shrooms, to be quite honest. It’s just not worth it to me.
If you grind up a whole batch and encapsulate, you’ll get pretty consistent doses. That’s the best way IMO and how I do it.
I just got lazy on my last batch and decided to leave em and eat them dry instead of making capsules.
Primal is right about potency variations in MS grows, however, I’ve yet to have any real major disparity when dosing the same amount of dry. Only once was the experience very underwhelming for a large dose. Every other time when I ate X grams, it always felt like X grams.
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Edited by Socrateshroom (04/15/20 08:02 PM)
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DJ Ed
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Hi LSA
If you want to compare comparative potency of dry versus fresh, I’d recommend homogenising the flush; dry half of the flush so that from the before and after drying weights, you will know the water cone]tent of the entire flush. You will then be able to work out the dry equivalent strength of the fresh doses. And if as PrimalSoup recommends makingntea (and freezing), and Socrateshroom grinding the dry and putting in capsules, you will have homogenised doses of both dry and fresh.
Hope that makes sense? DJ Ed
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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Pandemoon
Ἧeẍeᾐmeḭsṫeŗ ͛


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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26604572 - 04/16/20 01:05 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Yeah, homogenising batches is the key to accurate dosing. Each shroom can differ in potency which makes dosing whole shrooms a gambling.
I always grind my dried shrooms to a fine powder and make chocolates. The powder is then locked airtight and dark within the chocolate. I store them in the fridge but that's not necessary. The chocolate might turn white overtime in the fridge, but that's not bad and doesn't affect any potency. They are still good after years.
-
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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Pandemoon]
#26605689 - 04/16/20 11:49 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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To the point you three are bringing out about grinding up a batch and encapsulating, I definitely see the wisdom of that. In fact, I sort of accidentally stumbled onto this the other day when I did just that. I had a jar of about 40 grams of cracker dry shrooms from my Costa Rico batch. I grabbed a handful of random shrooms, totaling just over 6 grams and dumped them into my coffee grinder. I wanted 6, but I knew there would be a small amount of waste/loss in the powdering, transferring, and encapsulating, so I took 6.3. Worked out almost perfectly, since I was very careful with my precious powder. See the pic below. After I tared the unit, both for the weight of the empty gelatin capsules and the little glass dish they sit in, that's what I ended up with. Which is almost exactly 0.25 grams each capsule.
The only thing is that I'm not sure how much of a good sample I got. Meaning if I really wanted to know the relative potency, dose for dose, gram for gram, of all that was in that mason jar of dried, I think what you guys are suggesting is that I should have ground up all 40ish grams, then encapsulated all of that?
If so, I kind of agree.
Although, there is one reason I may have gotten a better sample than I think. All of those shrooms were from a big Costa Rico haul and randomly strewn into the dehydrator. Perhaps not as good as if I had simply ground up all 40 grams rather than just 6.3 grams grabbed off the pile.
Pandemoon, the chocolate thing sounds like a really good idea. But I'm not sure that would work for me. I always fast for a minumum of 8 to 12 hours before a trip. Even though the chocolate I would eat to get at the powdered shrooms inside is not like a huge meal, I really don't want any food in my system before a trip. Well other than the remnants of food in my lower colon that would only be gone with a 24 hour fast, give or take.
Here is an important question: How long will dried, powdered, encapsulated shrooms last in that form? I assume not as long as if one leaves them cracker-dry but intact?
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DJ Ed
Mushroom Engineer


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You need to get them in a sealed airtight container ASAP. And yes, you should grind the entire amount, or make tea from the entire amount, or 50:50 
There is nothing worse after sometimes months of preparation, to have randomised weak mushrooms that don’t get you to the goal...
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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Socrateshroom
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As DJ Ed said, to get a real homogenization, you need to grind up or tea the whole batch, otherwise you might have grabbed a strong handful, weak handful etc.
And my capsules batch is still going strong after a year so I’d say at least that much time if not more it’ll be good for. But, just as DJ Ed said, get those capsules in a glass airtight container with a food grade desiccant pack and keep it all in a cool dark place.
Edited by Socrateshroom (04/16/20 12:48 PM)
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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26605800 - 04/16/20 12:47 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
DJ Ed said: You need to get them in a sealed airtight container ASAP. And yes, you should grind the entire amount, or make tea from the entire amount, or 50:50 
There is nothing worse after sometimes months of preparation, to have randomised weak mushrooms that don’t get you to the goal...
Can I assume a mason jar is all right?
How long will they last if they are ground to powder, and put into a mason jar, which presumably is air tight? Versus how long for the dried, whole shrooms in another mason jar?
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LSA Woodrose
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Quote:
Socrateshroom said: As DJ Ed said, to get a real homogenization, you need to grind up or tea the whole batch, otherwise you might have grabbed a strong handful, weak handful etc.
And my capsules batch is still going strong after a year so I’d say at least that much time if not more it’ll be good for. But, just as DJ Ed said, get those capsules in a glass airtight container with a good grade desiccant pack and keep it all in a cool dark place.
LMAO You Ninja'd me, posting this like 30 seconds before I hit the "Continue" button.
Okay, great, I will grind up batches then. Great to know about the shelf life!
Oh I do have to wait before I start the megagrind-fest, though! I am still experimenting with dosing, and how much potency the dry is holding after 24 hours in the dehydrator. So what I intend to do is use the 6 grams I have in capsules over the next week or two. Once I determine that the drying didn't fuck me out of my shrooms, (like say I have a defective dehydrator) then I will start grinding and encapsulating whole batches.
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Socrateshroom
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Quote:
LSA Woodrose said:
Quote:
Socrateshroom said: As DJ Ed said, to get a real homogenization, you need to grind up or tea the whole batch, otherwise you might have grabbed a strong handful, weak handful etc.
And my capsules batch is still going strong after a year so I’d say at least that much time if not more it’ll be good for. But, just as DJ Ed said, get those capsules in a glass airtight container with a good grade desiccant pack and keep it all in a cool dark place.
LMAO You Ninja'd me, posting this like 30 seconds before I hit the "Continue" button.
Okay, great, I will grind up batches then. Great to know about the shelf life!
Oh I do have to wait before I start the megagrind-fest, though! I am still experimenting with dosing, and how much potency the dry is holding after 24 hours in the dehydrator. So what I intend to do is use the 6 grams I have in capsules over the next week or two. Once I determine that the drying didn't fuck me out of my shrooms, (like say I have a defective dehydrator) then I will start grinding and encapsulating whole batches. 
What’s wrong with your dehydrator?
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LSA Woodrose
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ROFLMAO, Socrateshroom!!
I wasn’t saying there’s something wrong with my dehydrator, I’m saying that I dehydrated that batch that went into the mason jar, and before I commit to using that same dehydrator for a lot more, I want to make sure that everything’s all right with what I dehydrated already LOL. When I eat a handful of those capsules I posted a picture of above, this weekend, I’ll have a better idea of what the potency is compared to the 18 g of fresh I ate last weekend. I’m sure my dehydrator is fine. But before I commit to using it again on another batch, I’m just sort of hedging my bet, that’s all.
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Enkidu
"No-Such-Person"


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The dehydrator itself doesn't make a difference. It either dried them or not
-------------------- Within You , Without You
      
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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Enkidu]
#26606258 - 04/16/20 05:23 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enkidu said: The dehydrator itself doesn't make a difference. It either dried them or not
I’m sure you’re right. However, I have heard a lot of opinions about these cheap, electric dehydrators when it comes to shrooms and the active ingredients. This is just my way of hedging my bet. I have a crap load of fresh in my refrigerator that are between one and three days old. And after I try a trip on what I’ve dried this weekend, just to be 100% sure, then I’ll start dehydrating everything else. Do I expect there to be a problem with the ones that I dried, and encapsulated? No, absolutely not. But I don’t think that I’m hurting myself by waiting another few days, to verify for myself that everything is OK with the batch I dried, considering that a lot of people seem to be divided about these electric dehydrator’s. Well maybe not a lot of people, but there does seem to be debates all over the Internet, and I’ve seen them in this forum as well. So, just waiting a few days seems like a rational plan to me. It’s not like they’re going to spoil in the fridge, they are very fresh still.
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Enkidu
"No-Such-Person"


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Oh, it didnt make much sense to me.
So many variables, not a proper experiment i reckon
You're not controlling in such a way you can make any claim on the effect the dehydrator had.
Making it pointless.
But by all means, continue.
-------------------- Within You , Without You
      
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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Enkidu]
#26606408 - 04/16/20 06:23 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enkidu said: Oh, it didnt make much sense to me.
So many variables, not a proper experiment i reckon
You're not controlling in such a way you can make any claim on the effect the dehydrator had.
Making it pointless.
But by all means, continue.
You’re completely taking me out of context. I’m not looking for absolute numbers, absolute dosages, absolute loss of psilocybin or psilosin. If I was then I would agree with you. I have one criteria for waiting to dry the rest of mushrooms. And it’s a valid, and objective, and reasonable one. All I’m looking to do, when I ingest them this weekend, and see if they effective, if so about how much. I am neither an expert, nor do I know enough to make determinations as per exact effects. My goal is to make sure that when I eat say nine or 10 capsules, to the tune of 2.25 or 2.5 g of dried, I just want to make sure they take affect in a satisfying way to me. If I take them and I get no effect, then something is seriously wrong. If I take them and get a decent effect then that’s good. If I take them and get a light affect, commensurate with a dosage that low, then that’s good as well. If I take them and I get a whopper of an effect, then that’s also good. I just want to make sure that I didn’t ruin my stash with the dehydrator, rendering them inert
I’m not quite sure why people aren’t understanding what I’m saying here, to be honest. You guys are acting like I’m trying to do some empirical, scientific study. I’m just looking to get a feel for what I’m left with after dehydrating. I’m not looking to get weight of active compounds down to the last nanogram LOL.
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Enkidu
"No-Such-Person"


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Not at all
I guess you dont get it
-------------------- Within You , Without You
      
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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Enkidu]
#26606476 - 04/16/20 06:59 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enkidu said: Not at all
I guess you dont get it
No, you’re the one that doesn’t get it. First you either misunderstood or intentionally misrepresented what I was saying. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you misunderstood me. The difference between you and I? I clarified. All you did was shoot out some half-concocted, non-answer, with no detail whatsoever to support your position, or explain what it is I’m supposedly not getting. LOL I really hope you’re just having a problem reading what I wrote above. And that you’re not doing this intentionally to try and win a silly argument.
But, please, explain to me what it is that you believe I don’t get. And then when you do I will demonstrate to you how all you’re doing is misrepresenting what I’m actually saying, and contorting it to what you think I’m saying.
Edited by LSA Woodrose (04/16/20 07:09 PM)
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Enkidu
"No-Such-Person"


Registered: 07/09/16
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So youre asking me to explain something you already determined is a misrepresentation ...?

Now you have your answer on why i didnt

The misunderstanding is one sided..
And arguing is a waste of time..
-------------------- Within You , Without You
      
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LSA Woodrose
Stranger

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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Enkidu]
#26606498 - 04/16/20 07:13 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enkidu said: So youre asking me to explain something you already determined is a misrepresentation ...?

Now you have your answer on why i didnt

The misunderstanding is one sided..
And arguing is a waste of time..
And once again you’ve shown that you have absolutely no position, or argument. You’re just speaking in double talk right now. Trying to acquit yourself of a position you simply cannot defend. Why not just either admit that you misunderstood me, or maybe you can explain to me how I’m getting it wrong? But you’re unable to, or unwilling to do that, which leads me back to the point that you’re right, this is a silly argument.
Not because arguments are silly, but because in this case you actually don’t have an argument. LOL
Seriously, give it a shot. Try to put a coherent thought that doesn’t involve a bunch of smiley’s and short, non-answers. Explain to me in detail, like I’m a five-year-old, exactly what it is that I’m wrong about. Or admit that you can’t do that. I don’t think I’m being unreasonable. I’m giving you the chance to explain how I’m wrong, something you have not even tried to do.
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Enkidu
"No-Such-Person"


Registered: 07/09/16
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Really bro...?
-------------------- Within You , Without You
      
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Enkidu
"No-Such-Person"


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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Enkidu]
#26606518 - 04/16/20 07:25 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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-------------------- Within You , Without You
      
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LSA Woodrose
Stranger

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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Enkidu]
#26606524 - 04/16/20 07:29 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enkidu said: Really bro...? 
Quote:
Enkidu said:
     
And this right here, is how I know you’re just trolling me. Because if somebody asked me to clarify my position because I was arguing with them the way you were with me, I would substantiate and support it as requested. But if this is the best you can do, it’s obvious you’re just trolling.
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Socrateshroom
сталкер


Registered: 09/05/18
Posts: 1,840
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LSA, Enkidu is just trying to help.
One issue is, if the handful you grabbed and dried is weak, you might assume it’s your dehydrator when, in reality, it may just be a few weak mushrooms since your batch isn’t homogenized.
I never had any problems with my dehydrator (so long as the mushroomed aren’t literally sitting on the heat source and getting cooked instead of dried).
I think you guys just misunderstood each other and you guys ended up spiraling in different directions.
We all just want to help you LSA It’s exciting to have more victims......err I mean members join us in our hobby
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LSA Woodrose
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See, Endiku? This is what I meant by defending or supporting or clarifying. Something Socrateshroom is willing to do. Its called a discussion.
Try it some time.
Quote:
Socrateshroom said: LSA, Enkidu is just trying to help.
One issue is, if the handful you grabbed and dried is weak, you might assume it’s your dehydrator when, in reality, it may just be a few weak mushrooms since your batch isn’t homogenized.
This is where I think you guys are taking me out of context or misunderstanding me. I already alluded to this very point in several posts. Which is why I was very clear when I said that I am NOT looking for exactness here when I test out the 6 grams I dried. I am well aware that I won't know for sure about true potency when I try this, because as I said already, my sample size was too small. As I also said, reading yours and DJ Ed's responses, I realized that I would have been better off grinding the whole batch of 40+ grams to get a more accurate sample size. That is NOT something I would ever dispute. I was, in fact, agreeing with you and he.
What I was saying, and I will clarify again, is this:
My ONLY criteria this weekend will be do they work at all, just in case a lot of those people all over the web, and some in this forum as well, are right and I am wrong. I am 90% sure that my dehydrator didn't destroy my shrooms. But since I have very fresh stuff now, I am going to wait, try some of the capsules, and make sure I trip off of them. Maybe they will be weaker than I expect, maybe they will be stronger, or maybe they will be just about exactly what I expect.
But if ANY of those three scenarios turn out true, then I will proceed with dehydrating everything, because I will know I didn't ruin the batch I already dried.
Quote:
Socrateshroom said: I never had any problems with my dehydrator (so long as the mushroomed aren’t literally sitting on the heat source and getting cooked instead of dried).
And I am quite sure my experience will be the same.
But I ask you, what harm is there in waiting another two days or so to start pouring everything into the dehydrator, just in case you or I are wrong? Which, again, I'm sure we're not, and I bet the dehydrator worked just fine.
Quote:
Socrateshroom said: I think you guys just misunderstood each other and you guys ended up spiraling in different directions.
Yeah, but at least you showed me the respect he refused to by engaging me and listening to me, hearing me out. He was basically borderline trolling. Well intentioned or not.
Quote:
Socrateshroom said: We all just want to help you LSA It’s exciting to have more victims......err I mean members join us in our hobby 
I know you are. I know MOST people here are sincere and trying to help.
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Socrateshroom
сталкер


Registered: 09/05/18
Posts: 1,840
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No harm in doing your way, just figured I’d point out because people often don’t understand how variable multispore Grows really can be. But we all have our own methods.
I imagine you’ll get effects within the expected range. Just make sure to take a significant enough dose to feel it (Although I’d say 0.5g is a threshold dose, I’d recommend 1-2g for testing. I always test new batches with 1.5g).
Ultimately, this is your journey. Do as you see fit. The fun is in putting the puzzle pieces together yourself.
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LSA Woodrose
Stranger

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Quote:
Socrateshroom said: No harm in doing your way, just figured I’d point out because people often don’t understand how variable multispore Grows really can be.
Oh, you guys even in my own grow thread, were incredibly good at driving this point home for me. Thanks to your admonishments, I understood this very well. I can also see it in the wacky, disparate, and insanely varied way my cakes are fruiting in my SGFC.
Quote:
Socrateshroom said: But we all have our own methods.
I imagine you’ll get effects within the expected range. Just make sure to take a significant enough dose to feel it (Although I’d say 0.5g is a threshold dose, I’d recommend 1-2g for testing. I always test new batches with 1.5g).
I took 17 grams of fresh to start with last Saturday and it was mild, as expected, and fun. I will probably up it by 5 grams (I mean .5 of dry) this weekend, to 2.25 grams of the capsules.
I am looking forward to the test!
Quote:
Socrateshroom said: Ultimately, this is your journey. Do as you see fit. The fun is in putting the puzzle pieces together yourself.
Thanks, brother!
And just to be clear, I am totally expecting to trip off of the 2.25 grams of dried. Because of the variety and randomness in MS, as you and others have pointed out, I am prepared for the unexpected. I just wanted to make sure of what I am already 90% sure of. That these dehydrators are both effective for drying shrooms and will not, as you put it, "cook my shrooms" dry. lol
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DJ Ed
Mushroom Engineer


Registered: 09/04/16
Posts: 2,326
Loc: UK
Last seen: 1 month, 28 days
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I toiled for ages buying a dehydrator, LSA. And when I finally took the plunge and dried my first harvest, I was gutted because the first trip was extremely disappointing. Waited two weeks and tried again, and had another really poor trip.
So it took me a while to conclude I actually had a completely duff flush, and that the dehydrator itself was sound!
Poor unlucky timing. Acid test though I’m trying some dried Mazatapec tonight, which will prove the dehydrator is sound, because I have had a trip from fresh ones from this flush, nd I know that wet they were very potent.
660g dried at 70 deg C in under 4 hours; 93.7% water content to cracker dry.
Good luck this weekend  DJ Ed
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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Enkidu
"No-Such-Person"


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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26607214 - 04/17/20 04:37 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Cause youre acting like a little kid throwing a fit and talking shit because i told you your idea on determining if your dehydrator works or not makes no sense. Because it doesnt.
-------------------- Within You , Without You
      
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Shr00mEater
Strange


Registered: 10/17/18
Posts: 985
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Enkidu]
#26607237 - 04/17/20 05:14 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enkidu said: Cause youre acting like a little kid throwing a fit and talking shit because i told you your idea on determining if your dehydrator works or not makes no sense. Because it doesnt.
So... fine. You’re right then, you won, I guess that matters.
Now go on and run back home and tell your mom how you whooped someone in an internet fight? She will be proud of you for putting this dope in his place. Maybe she can give you bonus points or a sloppy blowjob for your efforts here.

Seriously man. What’s the point of you hanging onto this? If he wants to test the dehydrator this way, do you really care if he has eliminated variables? Should he record the data and send it to you for review as well?
I cannot imagine that you actually care this much about someone’s anxiety over potency issues. However, I can easily imagine both of your egos are being tweaked a bit over this bickering.
Wait. I have an idea!
since, you both hate each other so much, and there is no possible way beyond this catastrophic disagreement and rude behavior.... maybe you should both block each other, that way you can protect your own delicate sensibilities from the others rampant ignorance and inconsiderate attitudes. 
Also, my apologies to anyone else who was reading thru this thread and then, like me, was suddenly reminded of how faggy people can be to each other on here.
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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Enkidu]
#26607246 - 04/17/20 05:21 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enkidu said: Cause youre acting like a little kid throwing a fit and talking shit because i told you your idea on determining if your dehydrator works or not makes no sense. Because it doesnt.
Yet you have still not provided ANY intelligible substantiation for what's wrong with my idea and my method for LMAO waiting a whole 2 days to dry my fresh. At least I am willing to clarify and bolster my position with more than just wild eyed one-liners and trolling someone else's thread as you are doing mine.
Why not just get lost or actually offer an argument for what you're saying, or demonstrate some sign that you truly did understand what I was saying. Go find another thread and argue there, please. Notice how everyone else is offering actual information and discourse?
Seriously, just go away or post something intelligent.
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Shr00mEater
Strange


Registered: 10/17/18
Posts: 985
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I thought this thread was about the timing between trips, not dehydrators?
I vote that we get a mod to close this off-topic trash pile. 
Edit: Quote:
Notice how everyone else is offering actual information and discourse?
Not me. My troll nose smelled blood in the water, and I didn’t want to miss any of the fun. 
My post above is for you too LSA, I typically enjoy reading both yours and Enkidus posts actually. But, i think you are both being jerky idiots right now.... and I promise, If you guys keep on going in public like this... I will too.
I am the third wheel that will annoy, distract and confuse this conversation until you guys hug and make up.
Also, I am not opposed to sliding up in your pms with nasty messages either. so watch out.
Yes, these are threats. Please take them as such and act like a decent person instead.
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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26607254 - 04/17/20 05:28 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
DJ Ed said: I toiled for ages buying a dehydrator, LSA. And when I finally took the plunge and dried my first harvest, I was gutted because the first trip was extremely disappointing. Waited two weeks and tried again, and had another really poor trip.
So it took me a while to conclude I actually had a completely duff flush, and that the dehydrator itself was sound!
Poor unlucky timing. Acid test though I’m trying some dried Mazatapec tonight, which will prove the dehydrator is sound, because I have had a trip from fresh ones from this flush, nd I know that wet they were very potent.
660g dried at 70 deg C in under 4 hours; 93.7% water content to cracker dry.
Good luck this weekend  DJ Ed
See, this is what I'm talking about. This is an actual position and actual information. Good information, by the way. Sorry you had such a bad experience with one of your flushes. There is actually another way I can test this if, say my trip this weekend is a bust. From what I'm reading, its relatively rare that shrooms just grow with little to no psilocybin/psilocyn content. But this I'm not sure of.
I have been drying for 24 hours, but next time I dry, I'll try for less time.
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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Shr00mEater]
#26607256 - 04/17/20 05:31 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Shr00mEater said: I thought this thread was about the timing between trips, not dehydrators?
It was, but it dovetailed into this when potency issues came up with regard to tripping multiple times. In truth, everyone else is discussing this issue intelligently with me, and giving me good advice. But one person just keeps trolling my thread, derailing it completely. Seriously, Endiku, with all due respect, find someone else to argue with. This topic itself is fine I think.
We can go back into talking about timing between trips, as I think I got all the information I need from pretty much everyone else on this side tangent.
Edit: By the way, I don't mind people arguing, debating, or disagreeing with me. You want to disagree with me? You think I'm wrong? Great. Sometimes debate can lead to greater truth. But at least offer discourse not trolling, is all I'm asking. (Not that you are trolling lol) Thankfully, most everyone in here has given good information, even those correcting me in this forum when I have been wrong. There's nothing wrong with him or you or others disagreeing with me or one another. But I asked in several times very cordially to clarify his position and point to precisely where I was getting it wrong. He refused and continued to troll.
Edited by LSA Woodrose (04/17/20 05:39 AM)
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DJ Ed
Mushroom Engineer


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Last seen: 1 month, 28 days
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For years, I fanned dried my harvests for about 5 days, hanging in racks, then moved to a large desiccant chamber for a few more days. This would take the relative humidity down to 10%. So this method never got them “cracker” dry, but clearly dry enough, because I have some 5 year old stocks in the freezer that are still sound.
But over a week drying in air is clearly losing potency, and is not very discreet (daughter almost 15 now, getting harder to hide). Dehydrator is one of the best gadgets I’ve bought; as I said, a full flush dried, without chopping up, in under 4 hours. The result are cracker dry mushrooms, that I can literally turn to powder between by fingers. By 4 hours, all stored in individual sealed bags with desiccant pouch in each, then all those put inside an airtight container with more desiccant, in the fridge.
Lock down boredom has set in now. And even though I have great methods for storing dry, and fresh - ice cubes, I’m going to have a go at an alcohol extraction. Gonna use up all my old freezer stocks.....
Mush love DJ Ed
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26607267 - 04/17/20 05:45 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
DJ Ed said: For years, I fanned dried my harvests for about 5 days, hanging in racks, then moved to a large desiccant chamber for a few more days. This would take the relative humidity down to 10%. So this method never got them “cracker” dry, but clearly dry enough, because I have some 5 year old stocks in the freezer that are still sound.
There are a lot of people who still use this method, from what I have read all over the web.
This is why I went down this rabbit hole in this thread. Many people are posting, even in this forum, that these dehydrators aren't effective and you lose potency. For the record, I DO NOT think that's the case. But I just figured I would try out holding off on drying a mere few days just to make absolute sure. I never said it was empirical or absolute.
And LMAO your sobering post about an entire flush being impotent was...well, sobering to say the very least, my friend.
Quote:
DJ Ed said: But over a week drying in air is clearly losing potency, and is not very discreet (daughter almost 15 now, getting harder to hide). Dehydrator is one of the best gadgets I’ve bought; as I said, a full flush dried, without chopping up, in under 4 hours. The result are cracker dry mushrooms, that I can literally turn to powder between by fingers. By 4 hours, all stored in individual sealed bags with desiccant pouch in each, then all those put inside an airtight container with more desiccant, in the fridge.
Like I said, next drying batch I will try 4 hours first, thanks so much for the tip!
Quote:
DJ Ed said: Lock down boredom has set in now. And even though I have great methods for storing dry, and fresh - ice cubes, I’m going to have a go at an alcohol extraction. Gonna use up all my old freezer stocks..... Mush love DJ Ed
Do you have fresh and dried on hand to eat?
I guess my takeaway from this, based on your post before last, is that even if it turns out my batch I dried is completely beat, that what you are saying is NOT to automatically blame the dehydrator and assume its faulty. Thanks!
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Shr00mEater
Strange


Registered: 10/17/18
Posts: 985
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It won’t be the dehydrator causing the potency loss. Tho, I am very understanding and in favor of a person testing things to find out for themselves.
If we are speaking of potency loss from the drying process... I think the method itself won’t matter much as the time period between harvest and fully dry. But, As you noted, some people are satisfied with air drying for a week. So, even then, it isn’t like ALL potency is lost by using less efficient methods.
If you have a whole run of bunk/superweak shrooms, it’s the genetics. Happens every once and awhile. #metoo
Question: how hot do you think the dehydrator would have to get to destroy the Psilocybin, or what do you think an appropriate minimum temp would be?
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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Shr00mEater]
#26607296 - 04/17/20 06:27 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Shr00mEater said: It won’t be the dehydrator causing the potency loss. Tho, I am very understanding and in favor of a person testing things to find out for themselves.
There is definitely a debate going on about this, to be honest. Although, it does seem like the vast majority of people in this forum and all over the web agree with you guys about these electric dehydrators being both highly effective and maintaining all or most of the potency. It seems like, if I had to guess, that of people debating this, maybe 75% or even more agree with you. So my instincts tell me that you are absolutely right.
Quote:
Shr00mEater said: If we are speaking of potency loss from the drying process... I think the method itself won’t matter much as the time period between harvest and fully dry. But, As you noted, some people are satisfied with air drying for a week. So, even then, it isn’t like ALL potency is lost by using less efficient methods.
I'm sure this is probably true. Also, there is another wrinkle, and please correct me if I'm wrong here. The proponents of drying with these dehydrators claim that it isn't the heat that destroys the psilocybin, but oxygen. If that's true, and I'm interpreting this correctly, then air drying may actually be a bad choice. Since the shrooms are exposed to a lot more oxygen while drying.
Quote:
Shr00mEater said: If you have a whole run of bunk/superweak shrooms, it’s the genetics. Happens every once and awhile. #metoo
lol Didn't know that the Shrooms culture had a Me Too movement. But, yeah, I take your point. As DJ Ed also said, even if I get a crap trip this weekends, I think what you guys are saying is that I should not blame the dehydrator, since its probably the genetics, and has nothing to do with the heat.
Quote:
Shr00mEater said: Question: how hot do you think the dehydrator would have to get to destroy the Psilocybin, or what do you think an appropriate minimum temp would be?
My dehydrator has only one setting, and from everything I can ascertain, its 173 or 177 degrees. lol I always forget which one. Anyway, from what I have read, and I could be waaay off here, is that psilocybin is not very heat labile. Meaning it will not break down with heat that low.
Many people also cite the fact that they make tea, and boiling water is at least 35 degrees hotter than these electric dehydrators. Where the heat supposedly hurts a little is that psilocyn is reputed to be a lot more heat labile, and is said to break down even with moderate heat.
Again, this is NOT me saying anything with authority. Its only what I have read.
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Shr00mEater
Strange


Registered: 10/17/18
Posts: 985
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Ah.... I just had an random thought.
And this is just speculation on my part. But, I am wondering if the folks who haven’t had good luck with dehydrators are actually getting them dry enough for longer term storage?
My first grow ever I used the oven to dry them, they stayed good and potent for about a year before I used them up. My second grow I bought a dehydrator and got them to what seemed like “cracker dry”, however, after about a week or so in the bag they were bendy again..... I didn’t do anything about it, and after a month or so, they were far less potent than the original doses. I was eating 6g just to get a mild trip. This could easily be counted up to genetic crapshoot and unlucky handfuls as well, they were multispore and I did not homogenize. But, it did cause me to worry more about residual moisture than heat.
So, I don’t really know if it’s connected scientifically, But, since then, I dry them super cracker dry, like obsessively dry. I will still put em in the oven at 200-220 for like 10-20 mins to try and drive off the last bits of moisture after using my cheapo dehydrator( should just upgrade ). Desiccant pack in each bag that’s put up for storage also.
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LSA Woodrose
Stranger

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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Shr00mEater]
#26607415 - 04/17/20 07:50 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Shr00mEater said: Ah.... I just had an random thought.
And this is just speculation on my part. But, I am wondering if the folks who haven’t had good luck with dehydrators are actually getting them dry enough for longer term storage?
I wondered that myself. When I was perusing this and many other sites and forums, I will say that in almost every thread or topic about these dehydrators, there was always at least one proponent of this method staunchly admonishing people to make certain their product is cracker-dry before putting the batch into storage. There always seems to be some very detailed descriptions of how to tell if they truly are dry enough. Although, given that a lot of people only sort of scan posts and threads, its very possible you are 100% correct, and people either don't bother researching this enough before slamming their shrooms on the trays, or they just scan the threads and posts and miss the part about times to dry on dehydrators and how to tell if they are dry.
Another thing, along the lines you brought up, is perhaps people are drying correctly but have very poor storage habits, and this could cause problems, particularly if the area they are stored in is more damp than they might realize.
Quote:
Shr00mEater said: My first grow ever I used the oven to dry them, they stayed good and potent for about a year before I used them up. My second grow I bought a dehydrator and got them to what seemed like “cracker dry”, however, after about a week or so in the bag they were bendy again..... I didn’t do anything about it, and after a month or so, they were far less potent than the original doses. I was eating 6g just to get a mild trip. This could easily be counted up to genetic crapshoot and unlucky handfuls as well, they were multispore and I did not homogenize. But, it did cause me to worry more about residual moisture than heat.
So, I don’t really know if it’s connected scientifically, But, since then, I dry them super cracker dry, like obsessively dry. I will still put em in the oven at 200-220 for like 10-20 mins to try and drive off the last bits of moisture after using my cheapo dehydrator( should just upgrade ). Desiccant pack in each bag that’s put up for storage also.
I use dessicants, too. I have a batch of 20 left from all my supplement/herbal powders I encapsulate and store. A lot of people from what I can see use an oven to dry, as you used to and still do, to sort of top off. I am seriously looking forward to seeing what a dose of about 2.25 (9 capsules) will do as far as effect this weekend. I decided to put off my Saturday (tomorrow) trip until Sunday. I love bicycle riding when I trip, and tomorrow is going to be very wet, while Sunday is going to be beautiful and sunny with temperatures about 10 degrees higher.
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DJ Ed
Mushroom Engineer


Registered: 09/04/16
Posts: 2,326
Loc: UK
Last seen: 1 month, 28 days
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It’s the form tht psilocybin and especially psilocin are in, that affects what temperatures they degrade at. Someone like PrimalSoup is much better qualified to comment on this, so I’ll not go into too much (incorrect) detail. But where we are talking making tea, or air drying mushrooms, you are looking at way over 200degC, 450degF before psilocin is affected.
Your dehydrator 1-off setting, LSA, is perfect; 170F equates to 70C, which is what I dry at. You’ll do an entire crop in 4 hours. It does have a fan going in it, your dehydrator, I presume?
Now folks, here is something I’m finding rather interesting on psilocin loss to oxygen. The shroomery Doseage calculator has a nominal figure for psilocin lost during drying set at 80%. So presumably when I used to air dry for a week, that’s where my 80% went to. But I’ve never noticed any loss of potency in my dried mushrooms. Now this is where it gets interesting; recently froze mushroom tea in ice cube trays. But when frozen I did not seal the ice cubes from oxygen. They had lost most of their potency in under two weeks in the freezer. Do you consider, that because the psilocin was frozen, it was MORE susceptible to oxygen? Weeksmafter thawing and pouring down the sink two flushes worth of Mazatapec tea, I’m still gob-smacked that I lost my frozen crops to oxygen 
Take care all DJ Ed
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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DJ Ed
Mushroom Engineer


Registered: 09/04/16
Posts: 2,326
Loc: UK
Last seen: 1 month, 28 days
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And here’s something else. I’m wondering if those people who dehydrated mushrooms, only to find them bendy again and degrading in under a week. I wonder if they stored the “cracker dry” mushrooms while they were still warm. Because if they did, upon cooling, water vapour would condense back on to the mushrooms, making them bendy.
I always wait for the mushrooms to cool to room temperature before moving them to bags and storing. And always use desiccant sachets in the baggies and tubs....
Just a thought fellas DJ Ed
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26607462 - 04/17/20 08:13 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
DJ Ed said: It’s the form tht psilocybin and especially psilocin are in, that affects what temperatures they degrade at. Someone like PrimalSoup is much better qualified to comment on this, so I’ll not go into too much (incorrect) detail. But where we are talking making tea, or air drying mushrooms, you are looking at way over 200degC, 450degF before psilocin is affected.
I haven't read the rest of both your posts yet, but I wanted to ask this first: to clarify, did you mean that you had to reach those temps before psilocybin is effected? Because my understanding, and correct me if I'm wrong, is that it isn't the psilocybin at temperatures below 450 degrees F that's degraded. Because it isn't as heat labile as psilocin. In my limited understanding, I believe that at temps even as low as our dehydrators, the psilocin is degraded, though nobody seems to know quite how much, whether its 100% gone of a smaller percentage lost.
(Okay, back to reading the rest of your posts)
Edited by LSA Woodrose (04/17/20 08:25 AM)
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DJ Ed
Mushroom Engineer


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I’ll let the experts confirm, but it’s not the heat that degrades the psilocin, it is the air. Not at the temperatures we are talking, anyway. Psilocybin is less affected by the air, so again talking approximations, you only lose about 20%.
Correction to my above post: you lose 50% psilocin and 20% psilocybin, during drying, to the air. Nothing is lost to the heat.
Hope this helps DJ Ed
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26607502 - 04/17/20 08:36 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
DJ Ed said: I’ll let the experts confirm, but it’s not the heat that degrades the psilocin, it is the air. Not at the temperatures we are talking, anyway. Psilocybin is less affected by the air, so again talking approximations, you only lose about 20%.
Correction to my above post: you lose 50% psilocin and 20% psilocybin, during drying, to the air. Nothing is lost to the heat.
Hope this helps DJ Ed
Ah okay, I wasn't aware of that. I thought you lost at least psilocin due to heat. Good info, thanks.
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Enkidu
"No-Such-Person"


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Bro your trip from the dried mushrooms in no way will have anything to do with the dehydrator itself or using a dehydrator to dry them.
Imo thats an important point which was worth me taking my time to say.
I thought you would realize and help you better understand wtf is going on.
Your reaponse indicated to me not to waste any more time, you didnt seem to get what i was saying or wanted to hear it. So i was ready to let it go "by all means, continue"
Idk wtf is with all the disrespectful shit or the condescending shit talking.
Not really my thing.
So thats it man.
The dehydrator itself and drying the mushrooms in it will not impact your experience which will be impacted in a much stronger way by other things...
I really dont like spending time doing shit like this. I have a full time job and a baby at home and no time as it is to waste arguing about why i said what i said.
Im not really one to troll.
You dry them in the dehydrator till they are cracker dry. Like a chip. If you bend it it should snap. No set time. Different mushrooms and the number in there will determine time.
Ive tripped at least 100 times and grown lbs of mushrooms. So idk, you can acknowledge me sharing my exp or not, idc.
You'll figure it out yourself i guess
-------------------- Within You , Without You
      
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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26607606 - 04/17/20 09:20 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
DJ Ed said: Your dehydrator 1-off setting, LSA, is perfect; 170F equates to 70C, which is what I dry at. You’ll do an entire crop in 4 hours. It does have a fan going in it, your dehydrator, I presume?
Yeah the consensus seems to be that the dehydrator I have is fine. Although, I seem to remember last week when I was drying that 4 hours was nowhere near enough. However, I may have been wrong. So when I start drying my current harvest(s) I will try seeing what they are like after 4 hours. It seems like most people recommend 24 hours with these things. The disparity between the times is definitely interesting, though.
Quote:
DJ Ed said: Now folks, here is something I’m finding rather interesting on psilocin loss to oxygen. The shroomery Doseage calculator has a nominal figure for psilocin lost during drying set at 80%. So presumably when I used to air dry for a week, that’s where my 80% went to. But I’ve never noticed any loss of potency in my dried mushrooms. Now this is where it gets interesting; recently froze mushroom tea in ice cube trays. But when frozen I did not seal the ice cubes from oxygen. They had lost most of their potency in under two weeks in the freezer. Do you consider, that because the psilocin was frozen, it was MORE susceptible to oxygen? Weeksmafter thawing and pouring down the sink two flushes worth of Mazatapec tea, I’m still gob-smacked that I lost my frozen crops to oxygen 
Yeah, that totally sucks, man! I'm surprised that so much of the active ingredients would be lost to Oxygen while frozen. That I had no idea.
Quote:
DJ Ed said: And here’s something else. I’m wondering if those people who dehydrated mushrooms, only to find them bendy again and degrading in under a week. I wonder if they stored the “cracker dry” mushrooms while they were still warm. Because if they did, upon cooling, water vapour would condense back on to the mushrooms, making them bendy.
I always wait for the mushrooms to cool to room temperature before moving them to bags and storing. And always use desiccant sachets in the baggies and tubs....
Just a thought fellas DJ Ed
Well that's an interesting thought I hadn't even considered. By the way, I put all my dried shrooms right into the mason jar as soon as they were done dehydrating. I think in the future, I will wait until they cool, as your premise sounds logical. Additionally, you are making me glad that I only did that with one mason jar's worth of dried. Basically a hair under an ounce.
I am pretty confident that I will eat them over time long before they deteriorate.
I am going to check my mason jar now and make sure they are still cracker dry in there!
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Shr00mEater
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Enkidu] 1
#26607608 - 04/17/20 09:20 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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See, LSA?
Enkidu apologized.
Now we can all sleep better tonight.
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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Shr00mEater]
#26607696 - 04/17/20 09:53 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Shr00mEater said: See, LSA?
Enkidu apologized.
Now we can all sleep better tonight.

Sorry for the off topic here, but ROFLMAO!!!!
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DJ Ed
Mushroom Engineer


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You use desiccant pouches, so I wouldn’t worry  Cheers DJ Ed
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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LSA Woodrose
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26607812 - 04/17/20 10:35 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
DJ Ed said: You use desiccant pouches, so I wouldn’t worry  Cheers DJ Ed
Agreed, but I took your earlier post to heart anyway, and I checked the bottle that has about 23 grams of dried Costa Rico left, after putting 6 grams into capsules. They were very dry. The caps powdered up with the slightest pressure, and the stems cracked easily like uber-dry twigs. So you're certainly right.
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PrimalSoup
hyperspatial illuminations



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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Shr00mEater]
#26608280 - 04/17/20 02:27 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Shr00mEater said: Ah.... I just had an random thought.
And this is just speculation on my part. But, I am wondering if the folks who haven’t had good luck with dehydrators are actually getting them dry enough for longer term storage?
My first grow ever I used the oven to dry them, they stayed good and potent for about a year before I used them up. My second grow I bought a dehydrator and got them to what seemed like “cracker dry”, however, after about a week or so in the bag they were bendy again..... I didn’t do anything about it, and after a month or so, they were far less potent than the original doses. I was eating 6g just to get a mild trip. This could easily be counted up to genetic crapshoot and unlucky handfuls as well, they were multispore and I did not homogenize. But, it did cause me to worry more about residual moisture than heat.
So, I don’t really know if it’s connected scientifically, But, since then, I dry them super cracker dry, like obsessively dry. I will still put em in the oven at 200-220 for like 10-20 mins to try and drive off the last bits of moisture after using my cheapo dehydrator( should just upgrade ). Desiccant pack in each bag that’s put up for storage also.
Basically, if you get all the water out and store them completely sealed off with minimal air they kept pretty much forever. But they absorb water from air so storage must keep it out. And if they aren't fully dry the oxidization proceeds to degrade the actives over time.
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if you stand too close to the machine it'll start to eat youPrimal's simple tested teks and projects: Wheat Prep 2.0 Acidic Tea Tek Potency Project!
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PrimalSoup
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26608315 - 04/17/20 02:41 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
DJ Ed said: But when frozen I did not seal the ice cubes from oxygen. They had lost most of their potency in under two weeks in the freezer.
Is it possible the freezer went through a defrost cycle or two, which would allow the ice cubes to melt? I have trouble seeing how frozen ice cubes, even exposed to constant frozen air, would suffer from anything more than gradually withering away. There shouldn't be any oxygen transmission into the bulk of the cubes. But I've never tried this, I'm still trying to figure out to set up a small-dose storage in the freezer without it being ridiculous. May just want to dry what I use for that...
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if you stand too close to the machine it'll start to eat youPrimal's simple tested teks and projects: Wheat Prep 2.0 Acidic Tea Tek Potency Project!
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DJ Ed
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: PrimalSoup] 1
#26609392 - 04/18/20 12:47 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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I don’t know, PrimalSoup, I’m particularly,stumped now. You see, last night, after a two week lay off to remove tolerance, I made lemon tea from 3.5g of my dried Mazatapec.
Time line is:
1st flush, 1kg. 400g made into tea and frozen. 600g dried in dehydrator and stored in bags in fridge. 55g made into fresh tea and drunk.
That first trip from 55g (which I calculated to be 3.1g dry) was amazing.
Two weeks later I had some ice cubes, but let them thaw and ended up with globules that didn’t make me trip.
The following week tried ice cubes from second flush, mixed in a pina colada smoothie. Took almost 4g. Nothing.
So last night 3.5g from dried first flush, which I knew was not that weak. This was the weakest trip yet, with no visuals, no waves, but I did get some nice sounding music, not heavenly, but nice.
I’m thinking whether to dose again tonight with some old GT or B+, to rule out some paranoid thoughts I’m having like my brain has changed and I can no longer trip!
Yep, pretty confused now.
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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LogicaL Chaos
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26610072 - 04/18/20 10:18 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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That's weird. I noticed some of my Mazatepaca grows were very weak. It was either quite potent or pretty weak, both ends of the spectrum. I feel with Mazatepeca, you definitely wanna try cloning to find that right fruit with strong potency.
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DJ Ed
Mushroom Engineer


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Quote:
LogicaL Chaos said: That's weird. I noticed some of my Mazatepaca grows were very weak. It was either quite potent or pretty weak, both ends of the spectrum. I feel with Mazatepeca, you definitely wanna try cloning to find that right fruit with strong potency.
Yeah, cheers, LC. I’ve got 3rd generation agar plates going from spore. I’ve got 2x LC from first multi spore syringe. And I’ve now got 2x LC of 3rd generation agar. My oats and rye have turned up. And I’ve ordered 2x spore syringe. PES Amazonian, and 1x random. I’m going to get them on agar while I have two more Mazatapec grows going. One from multi spore LC and one from 3rd gen LC.
Next going to powder up all the dried ,azatapec, and try an alcohol extraction with that. Apparently, you can re-dose and it strengthens the trip within 10 minutes; so even if they are weak mushrooms, the extract will do the job given enough 1ml drops 
And going to wait a week; but fortunately I’ve got two tubs of GT, Ecuador, and some B+ in the freezer that’s still sound
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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Notker
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed] 1
#26610877 - 04/18/20 03:43 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
DJ Ed said:
Two weeks later I had some ice cubes, but let them thaw and ended up with globules that didn’t make me trip.
Sorry for off-topic but I'm not sure my question is worth a new thread.
So I made myself a pretty nice Mushroom tea and stored it in the freezer.
 I told my friends about it, and they seemed eager to give it a try on the weekend.
So I expected in any case. I let the whole bottle thaw before and stored it in the fridge for the time, meanwhile they got afraid and pulled back. Now Its back in the freezer
So are you telling me it looses potency doing this?
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PrimalSoup
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Notker]
#26610908 - 04/18/20 03:58 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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No it doesn't. The only thing that happens to tea that gets thawed and refrozen like that IME is that it becomes increasingly vile. Doesn't seem to affect the potency though.
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if you stand too close to the machine it'll start to eat youPrimal's simple tested teks and projects: Wheat Prep 2.0 Acidic Tea Tek Potency Project!
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PrimalSoup
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: DJ Ed]
#26610911 - 04/18/20 04:00 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
DJ Ed said: I don’t know, PrimalSoup, I’m particularly,stumped now. You see, last night, after a two week lay off to remove tolerance, I made lemon tea from 3.5g of my dried Mazatapec.
Time line is:
1st flush, 1kg. 400g made into tea and frozen. 600g dried in dehydrator and stored in bags in fridge. 55g made into fresh tea and drunk.
That first trip from 55g (which I calculated to be 3.1g dry) was amazing.
Two weeks later I had some ice cubes, but let them thaw and ended up with globules that didn’t make me trip.
The following week tried ice cubes from second flush, mixed in a pina colada smoothie. Took almost 4g. Nothing.
So last night 3.5g from dried first flush, which I knew was not that weak. This was the weakest trip yet, with no visuals, no waves, but I did get some nice sounding music, not heavenly, but nice.
I’m thinking whether to dose again tonight with some old GT or B+, to rule out some paranoid thoughts I’m having like my brain has changed and I can no longer trip!
Yep, pretty confused now.
Well following the Holmesian approach:
You had one good trip with some of the fruits made into tea. Unless you homogenized everything before making that tea it would seem you lucked into more potent fruits for that one batch somehow. Sucks but I've never had my brain change so that I couldn't trip, only mushrooms of varying potency...
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if you stand too close to the machine it'll start to eat youPrimal's simple tested teks and projects: Wheat Prep 2.0 Acidic Tea Tek Potency Project!
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DJ Ed
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: PrimalSoup]
#26611970 - 04/19/20 02:38 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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You can think all sorts of weird thoughts, when you’re not tripping, but you’re tripping! I’m now convinced that the Mazatapec were generally weak; in fact, most people report they tend to be weaker than a typical cubensis. But 3.5g to basically get nothing is worrying, even for multi-spore. My previous harvest was from Golden Teacher. The fruits looked amazing and healthy, but were WEAK beyond belief. Threw the whole flush into the bin after 2 failed trips....
So I’m going to hedge my bets. 5kg oats and 25kg rye grain turned up yesterday! I have 3rd generation agar plates from the Mazatapec going; I have 2x Liquid Culture jars from the original multi-spore Mazatapec. And I now have 2x jars LC from the 3rd generation agar.
So I’m going to try a grow with MS LC, and a grow with 3rd gen LC. And in parallel, I have 2 MS spore syringes on their way this week: PES Amazonian, and 1x random. I’m going to get them to agar while the 2x Mazatapec grows are going. I will get some potent flushes to store as tea ice cubes......
Mush love DJ Ed
-------------------- “It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.” Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind “The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.” Terence McKenna

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LogicaL Chaos
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Re: Space Between Shroom Trips [Re: Notker]
#26611973 - 04/19/20 02:41 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Notker said:
Quote:
DJ Ed said:
Two weeks later I had some ice cubes, but let them thaw and ended up with globules that didn’t make me trip.
Sorry for off-topic but I'm not sure my question is worth a new thread.
So I made myself a pretty nice Mushroom tea and stored it in the freezer.
 I told my friends about it, and they seemed eager to give it a try on the weekend.
So I expected in any case. I let the whole bottle thaw before and stored it in the fridge for the time, meanwhile they got afraid and pulled back. Now Its back in the freezer
So are you telling me it looses potency doing this?
That's badass. I bet its still potent. I don't see why not as long as its still chilled. But yeah, best not to thaw it and refreeze it. Might have a bad effect, not totally sure yet.
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VanityKills
Lone Spore


Registered: 02/06/20
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Such a variable question. I've had care-free summers where tripping twice a week for a few months was completely appropriate. Wouldn't take those summers back. On the other hand, I've had times like this where I couldn't imagine even tripping once a month lol.
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