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meltdowner
Total Noob



Registered: 09/06/17
Posts: 1,457
Loc: New York City
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Re: Are Electoral Politics a Dead End? [Re: ballsalsa] 1
#26615873 - 04/20/20 05:21 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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I think the United States is doing great and is back on track. We really do have a fake news problem this country. That needs to be addressed before anything else.
-------------------- I'm a Lightweight. I like to eat like two caps at a time.
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
Stranger



Registered: 03/16/05
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Loc: California, US
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Re: Are Electoral Politics a Dead End? [Re: meltdowner] 2
#26615927 - 04/20/20 05:52 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
meltdowner said: We really do have a fake news problem this country. That needs to be addressed before anything else.
Big time. It would be easy to defeat Trump if not for all fake news against him, which actually ends up helping him as people begin to figure out that's the Dem's primary strategy.
We don't need fake news against Trump; there's more than enough bad stuff about him.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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meltdowner
Total Noob



Registered: 09/06/17
Posts: 1,457
Loc: New York City
Last seen: 6 months, 30 days
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Libel laws! Bring them back in a big way.
-------------------- I'm a Lightweight. I like to eat like two caps at a time.
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nooneman


Registered: 04/24/09
Posts: 14,555
Loc: Utah
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Re: Meet the new boss...same as the old boss [Re: ballsalsa] 1
#26616003 - 04/20/20 06:28 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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I don't think that democracy is dead or a dead end. In fact I think it's functioning about as well as it ever has.
Having said that, one alternative might be direct democracy. Just straight up have the people vote directly on everything. That might be even worse, but I think it'd be an interesting alternative/experiment to try. One of my favorite parts of certain states is that they allow the people to directly vote on legislation, and I generally think things end up pretty good when that happens. So full on direct democracy might be an interesting system to try.
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relic
of a bygone era


Registered: 10/14/14
Posts: 5,623
Loc: the right coast
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Re: Meet the new boss...same as the old boss [Re: nooneman] 1
#26617122 - 04/21/20 08:49 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Every state should have a system of ballot initiatives or the like.
It sucks living in a state that has nothing like referendums and ballot initiatives and watching as citizens of other states wield such power.
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Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,495
Loc: Uncanny Valley
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Re: Meet the new boss...same as the old boss [Re: relic]
#26617124 - 04/21/20 08:49 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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That's why God gave us Uhaul!
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
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relic
of a bygone era


Registered: 10/14/14
Posts: 5,623
Loc: the right coast
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Re: Meet the new boss...same as the old boss [Re: relic]
#26617178 - 04/21/20 09:15 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Thought about it for many years. So far we've decided to stay in VA and continue to fight for legislative changes here.
Cannabis decriminalization is one such legislative change that is as close as can be to becoming law without formally being so yet.
The smartest move would have been to give up on VA long ago, but that didnt happen and likely won't anytime soon.
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Kryptos
Stranger

Registered: 11/01/14
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Re: Meet the new boss...same as the old boss [Re: relic]
#26617391 - 04/21/20 10:30 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Va seems to be heading in the right direction now, at least. Hopefully it stays that way.
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panne cyanne
albino queen


Registered: 04/15/20
Posts: 145
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Re: Meet the new boss...same as the old boss [Re: Kryptos] 1
#26640080 - 04/30/20 10:34 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
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its a one party corporatocracy. one dollar is one vote.
everything else is theatre for the proles.
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Brian Jones
Club 27



Registered: 12/18/12
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Loc: attending Snake Church
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Re: Meet the new boss...same as the old boss [Re: relic] 2
#26640551 - 05/01/20 05:47 AM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
relic said: Every state should have a system of ballot initiatives or the like.
It sucks living in a state that has nothing like referendums and ballot initiatives and watching as citizens of other states wield such power.
Yes. That would be something at least.
It's arguably very impossible to get around the power of money in electoral politics. Our lesser evil politicians are bought and paid for too. You can get someone in power whose better on a couple issues, but favoring the super rich doesn't appear to be one of them.
-------------------- "The Rolling Stones will break up over Brian Jones' dead body" John Lennon I don't want no commies in my car. No Christians either. The worst thing about corruption is that it works so well,
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Kryptos
Stranger

Registered: 11/01/14
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Re: Meet the new boss...same as the old boss [Re: Brian Jones] 1
#26640577 - 05/01/20 06:10 AM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
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I find myself subscribing to the cyclical theory of history more and more. We're in the wealth concentration and fuck everyone else part of the cycle.
I don't think accelerationists are necessarily someone that should be supported, but I have been considering what would be better for me, personally, more and more lately.
A widespread social collapse in the US over the next decade or so would likely work out pretty well as far as I'm concerned, considering my lifestyle and values.
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Loaded Shaman
Psychophysiologist



Registered: 03/02/15
Posts: 8,006
Loc: Now O'Clock
Last seen: 28 days, 2 hours
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Re: Are Electoral Politics a Dead End? [Re: Despica Bill] 1
#26645018 - 05/03/20 01:44 AM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Despica Bill said: Personally, I have a very hard time believing that the people who lobbied to get lunch breaks reduced to an unpaid 30 minutes would simply leave influential government positions up to us. This can be easily observed, as well. Pick three ranking people from any of our three governmental branches, and do a moment's research on their net worth. I've found that our government is overwhelmingly made up of people so ridiculously rich, they think that owning two multi-million-dollar houses qualifies as "dead broke" (Hillary Clinton), a million dollars is a "small loan" (Donald Trump), and a white suburban neighborhood with a median income of 100k qualifies as growing up in "The Bronx" (Ocasio-Cortez).
No, I don't think it's possible to vote the bums out, because the bums are electing themselves and each other. Our justice system only values the letter of the law, not the spirit. That puts lawyers and people who think like lawyers at the top of the food chain. So, even though there are a load of laws in place designed to prevent people from using their wealth to get elected...guess who finds a way around those rules through "lobbying"? Lawyers, and those who think like them.
There are basically two options left if we want to see things change. Direct action, or simply waiting for the collective populace to become reasonable...which will probably happen eventually, but I doubt either of us will be alive to see it.
Here's my two cents' worth of rant; capitalism has a dark side, just like every other economic system. Capitalism's demons manifest themselves as wealthy people who use their wealth to prevent other people from doing the same. Folks who made their fortunes off the stock markets regulating it to the point where they're the only ones who can continue to do it. People who made their money with real estate buying up every available entry-level property and then renting it out for more than the mortgage costs. Refusing to hire people without a college degree for anything but dead-end jobs, and then increasing the cost of education to the point that we have to go in debt for decades to get it...I could go on, but the long-story-short is this; we lost our right to control of our government as soon as we lost the will\ability to overthrow it. Which is exactly what the dudes who wrote the Constitution were trying so damn hard to prevent.
This is a top-level post, and as such, a rarity here on Shroomery. Welcome to Shroomery. You're going to do awesome here.
Only thing I'd like to add is that every system has people at the top trying to maintain some illusion of democracy/equality at the expense of everyone else.
--------------------
  "Real knowledge is to know the extent of one’s ignorance." — Confucius
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Buckomcdoogle
Atypical obsessive.


Registered: 11/27/19
Posts: 932
Last seen: 7 months, 21 days
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Re: Are Electoral Politics a Dead End? [Re: ballsalsa]
#26647100 - 05/03/20 10:08 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
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Not really, even the most unpopular people win with the right amount of money backing them.
Look at Mitch McConnell, hes been re-elected 5 times...
Theres no money like Marlboro money....
-------------------- "Nothing is more dangerous to your creativity than comfort and familiarity" "Nihilism is the most basic truth in existence, the only consistency throughout the world, and the universe is chaos and decay" "Logic leads to nihilism"
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Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,495
Loc: Uncanny Valley
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Re: Are Electoral Politics a Dead End? [Re: Buckomcdoogle]
#26647103 - 05/03/20 10:11 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
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Money doesn't buy elections.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
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Buckomcdoogle
Atypical obsessive.


Registered: 11/27/19
Posts: 932
Last seen: 7 months, 21 days
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Re: Are Electoral Politics a Dead End? [Re: Enlil] 2
#26647124 - 05/03/20 10:34 PM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
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Going up against unlimited money in an election is going up against unlimited airtime to discredit and smear you.
-------------------- "Nothing is more dangerous to your creativity than comfort and familiarity" "Nihilism is the most basic truth in existence, the only consistency throughout the world, and the universe is chaos and decay" "Logic leads to nihilism"
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Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,495
Loc: Uncanny Valley
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Re: Are Electoral Politics a Dead End? [Re: Buckomcdoogle]
#26647665 - 05/04/20 07:54 AM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
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There's no such thing as unlimited money
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
Stranger



Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 32,557
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Re: Are Electoral Politics a Dead End? [Re: Enlil]
#26647763 - 05/04/20 08:37 AM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
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Oooh, he got you with an unimportant technicality. Enlil LOVES to do that!
I guess you have to say something like Going up against big money in an election is going up against big airtime to discredit and smear you.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,495
Loc: Uncanny Valley
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I know you guys LOVE to hate on the rich, but time and again, it's been proven that money doesn't buy elections.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
Stranger



Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 32,557
Loc: California, US
Last seen: 4 months, 21 days
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Re: Are Electoral Politics a Dead End? [Re: Enlil]
#26647794 - 05/04/20 08:56 AM (3 years, 8 months ago) |
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It buys votes though.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,495
Loc: Uncanny Valley
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Not in the U.S.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
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