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OfflineLogicaL ChaosM
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Lighting Experiments? * 1
    #26587732 - 04/09/20 12:14 AM (4 years, 2 months ago)

Anyone ever experimented with different lighting conditions? For example, 12 hrs of light vs 8hrs of light vs 24 hrs of light? Or maybe even tried sunlight with extra lighting for "maximum" lighting?


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Invisiblemycorry
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: LogicaL Chaos] * 2
    #26588675 - 04/09/20 11:43 AM (4 years, 2 months ago)

I have tried light stressing a few times with little to show for it. I got the idea from an old Dotchi no Ryori cooking show where some mycologist was producing a special variety of portabellos by light stressing them for a few days then cutting off all light and restricting FAE for a day. It produced a specific concentration of flavor that was famous at the time(2004?). I tried something similar with cubes(250Watt 6500k CFL @12 inches away)  and it just made them taste stronger haha.

Elfstone's old posts where he claims that 453nm blue LED light is the optimal spectrum for mexicana has proven to be true for me. Whenever I use 453nm with mexicanas they stand up strait with none of the common curly stipe seen with the species.

My current setup is 100% about exotics and a big part of my strategy is to offer them everything they would possibly encounter in the wild. So, as part of this strategy I have made a light source that is a tad closer to sunlight. The setup is a 40W 2600k CFL, 40W 6500k CFL, 26W 453nm Reefbar LED all next to eachother and aimed at the room as a single light source. So far everything seems to be reacting well, even the commonly super curly galindoli's are growing more strait and upright.

As for potency difference, I would have no empirical way to test that and I do this stuff for the challenge anyways.


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OfflineMycoactive
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: mycorry] * 1
    #26590670 - 04/10/20 09:57 AM (4 years, 2 months ago)

For species that are seasonal, my hunch is that light cycle plays a role in fruitbody initiation. There are a lot of factors at play: increased rainfall, decreased temperature, increased debris, etc. Decreased hours of daylight is also a common factor, and I imagine that many species (but certainly not all) respond to specific light/dark cycles.

Most people who are cultivating actives are focused on Psilocybe cubensis, which is probably not as heavily dependent on light cycle as it's a tropical species. I'm trying out 10/14 for some of the seasonal species that I'm working with. I'll have to do 12/12 after this batch has fruited to compare results as I only have one growing area right now.

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OfflineLogicaL ChaosM
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: mycorry]
    #26590711 - 04/10/20 10:11 AM (4 years, 2 months ago)

Very cool! Stronger tasting cubes :lol:

Very interesting lighting set-up u have for those Mexicanas. Next level stuff :takingnotes:


By seasonal shrooms, do u mean like Ps cyans? I bet that species would benefit from a varied light cycle

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OfflineMycoactive
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: LogicaL Chaos] * 1
    #26590953 - 04/10/20 12:11 PM (4 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

LogicaL Chaos said:
By seasonal shrooms, do u mean like Ps cyans? I bet that species would benefit from a varied light cycle




Yup! A lot of active woodlovers fall into that category. I agree, I imagine they'd benefit from some sort of modified (i.e., non 12/12) light cycle at the fruiting stage, but as far as I can tell it's still an open question.

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OfflineSolipsis
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: Mycoactive] * 1
    #26601044 - 04/14/20 04:51 PM (4 years, 2 months ago)

I dont have a reference on hand right now (maybe later or something)

but i did read that they found that there is a "significant" oscillation between psilocin vs psilocybin ratio linked to light cycle.

Seeing as its standard to destroy a lot of the psilocin upon drying unless you are freeze-drying, it can very well mean its best to keep the light permanently on or off the couple days before harvest.

But stupid me, dont even remember whether thats light or dark. Surely you can google the data i'm inferring this from for yourself.

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Invisiblec10h12n2o
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: mycorry] * 1
    #26601241 - 04/14/20 06:25 PM (4 years, 2 months ago)

Great idea. Would love to see some experiments using isolates

Quote:

mycorry said:
I have tried light stressing a few times with little to show for it. I got the idea from an old Dotchi no Ryori cooking show where some mycologist was producing a special variety of portabellos by light stressing them for a few days then cutting off all light and restricting FAE for a day. It produced a specific concentration of flavor that was famous at the time(2004?). I tried something similar with cubes(250Watt 6500k CFL @12 inches away)  and it just made them taste stronger haha.

Elfstone's old posts where he claims that 453nm blue LED light is the optimal spectrum for mexicana has proven to be true for me. Whenever I use 453nm with mexicanas they stand up strait with none of the common curly stipe seen with the species.

My current setup is 100% about exotics and a big part of my strategy is to offer them everything they would possibly encounter in the wild. So, as part of this strategy I have made a light source that is a tad closer to sunlight. The setup is a 40W 2600k CFL, 40W 6500k CFL, 26W 453nm Reefbar LED all next to eachother and aimed at the room as a single light source. So far everything seems to be reacting well, even the commonly super curly galindoli's are growing more strait and upright.

As for potency difference, I would have no empirical way to test that and I do this stuff for the challenge anyways.




I havent tried 453nm lights, but I have great results with galindoi and tamps using just 6500k leds. Most of then always stand up fairly straight for me when I give em enough light



--------------------

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"Partial knowledge is more triumphant than complete knowledge; it takes things to be simpler than they are, and so makes its theory more popular and convincing."

"Convictions are more dangerous enemies of truth than lies"
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OfflineSolipsis
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: c10h12n2o] * 1
    #26604244 - 04/15/20 09:41 PM (4 years, 2 months ago)

As far as I know most mushrooms react to blue light, bordering a bit on *some UV and *some green and responding less to other colors. However there are species which react to red light.

I guess there has been some convergent evolution happening too and it probably depends on the habitat and how sunlight scatters and what wavelengths are left the most which i think tends to be blue.

6500K is pretty cold light so lots of blue.

I bought a very nice blue LED tube about 2 years ago because it would be flashy (and i think it increases cordycepin concentrations in C. militaris?) however looking at that light when i work near it makes me pretty loopy haha.

Yea pretty interesting:
Quote:


there were significant differences in cordycepin contents, adenosine contents, and mycelium growth caused by light wavelengths:
cordycepin, blue light > pink light > daylight, darkness, red light;
adenosine, red light > pink light, darkness, daylight, blue light;
and mycelium growth, red light > pink light, darkness, daylight > blue light.

In conclusion, light wavelength had a significant influence on production of mycelia, adenosine, and cordycepin, so lightening wavelength should be changed according to target products in the liquid culture of C. militaris.




Can't exactly explain the red light for mycelium growth but maybe it just tends to surface above ground in grassland pretty much without a lot of sunlight filtering.
But cordycepin i believe is thought to be produced to kill the caterpillar, then it would still be a bit buried / in underbrush?

I suspect these things may be categorically linked to life cycle / habitat conditions over time.

Seems difficult but cool to try and imagine the natural habitat of the species you grow and apply it to  light spectrum as well as substrate.

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OfflineLogicaL ChaosM
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: Solipsis]
    #26604306 - 04/15/20 10:16 PM (4 years, 2 months ago)

Very interesting results guys. Thanks! :takingnotes:

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OfflinePiggyPig
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: LogicaL Chaos] * 1
    #26605075 - 04/16/20 07:50 AM (4 years, 2 months ago)

Anyone every try shortening the light cycle from 24hrs? I've done this with cannabis and it works well. Instead of running 12/12, I ran 10/10 and shortened my fruiting time by ~20%. Essentially I would shorten a "day" from 24 to 20 hours. I wonder if this would have the same effect on shrooms?

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Invisiblemycorry
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: c10h12n2o] * 1
    #26605639 - 04/16/20 11:21 AM (4 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

c10h12n2o said:
Great idea. Would love to see some experiments using isolates

Quote:

mycorry said:
I have tried light stressing a few times with little to show for it. I got the idea from an old Dotchi no Ryori cooking show where some mycologist was producing a special variety of portabellos by light stressing them for a few days then cutting off all light and restricting FAE for a day. It produced a specific concentration of flavor that was famous at the time(2004?). I tried something similar with cubes(250Watt 6500k CFL @12 inches away)  and it just made them taste stronger haha.

Elfstone's old posts where he claims that 453nm blue LED light is the optimal spectrum for mexicana has proven to be true for me. Whenever I use 453nm with mexicanas they stand up strait with none of the common curly stipe seen with the species.

My current setup is 100% about exotics and a big part of my strategy is to offer them everything they would possibly encounter in the wild. So, as part of this strategy I have made a light source that is a tad closer to sunlight. The setup is a 40W 2600k CFL, 40W 6500k CFL, 26W 453nm Reefbar LED all next to eachother and aimed at the room as a single light source. So far everything seems to be reacting well, even the commonly super curly galindoli's are growing more strait and upright.

As for potency difference, I would have no empirical way to test that and I do this stuff for the challenge anyways.




I havent tried 453nm lights, but I have great results with galindoi and tamps using just 6500k leds. Most of then always stand up fairly straight for me when I give em enough light






:strokebeard:
OK SO, how the crap are you getting such a crazy pinset out of galindoi?! I only grew it out so I could print it for freebies but I was getting like 20 prints total per shoebox. That one flush of yours is like 4 full shoebox lifecycles worth of caps. And you aren't getting the rats nest of curly stipes like I used to with just 6500k. Is it a clone? Maybe my chosen culture is just crap, I have put minimal effort into this species.


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OfflineDredgeMyEyes
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: mycorry]
    #26605732 - 04/16/20 12:10 PM (4 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

mycorry said:
Quote:

c10h12n2o said:
Great idea. Would love to see some experiments using isolates

Quote:

mycorry said:
I have tried light stressing a few times with little to show for it. I got the idea from an old Dotchi no Ryori cooking show where some mycologist was producing a special variety of portabellos by light stressing them for a few days then cutting off all light and restricting FAE for a day. It produced a specific concentration of flavor that was famous at the time(2004?). I tried something similar with cubes(250Watt 6500k CFL @12 inches away)  and it just made them taste stronger haha.

Elfstone's old posts where he claims that 453nm blue LED light is the optimal spectrum for mexicana has proven to be true for me. Whenever I use 453nm with mexicanas they stand up strait with none of the common curly stipe seen with the species.

My current setup is 100% about exotics and a big part of my strategy is to offer them everything they would possibly encounter in the wild. So, as part of this strategy I have made a light source that is a tad closer to sunlight. The setup is a 40W 2600k CFL, 40W 6500k CFL, 26W 453nm Reefbar LED all next to eachother and aimed at the room as a single light source. So far everything seems to be reacting well, even the commonly super curly galindoli's are growing more strait and upright.

As for potency difference, I would have no empirical way to test that and I do this stuff for the challenge anyways.




I havent tried 453nm lights, but I have great results with galindoi and tamps using just 6500k leds. Most of then always stand up fairly straight for me when I give em enough light






:strokebeard:
OK SO, how the crap are you getting such a crazy pinset out of galindoi?! I only grew it out so I could print it for freebies but I was getting like 20 prints total per shoebox. That one flush of yours is like 4 full shoebox lifecycles worth of caps. And you aren't getting the rats nest of curly stipes like I used to with just 6500k. Is it a clone? Maybe my chosen culture is just crap, I have put minimal effort into this species.




Thanks for asking as I am also wondering the same thing!

I got some scraggly ass fruits that were unprintable and haven't tried again since.  Totaled 1 gram dry :rofl:

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Invisiblec10h12n2o
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: DredgeMyEyes] * 1
    #26606261 - 04/16/20 05:25 PM (4 years, 2 months ago)

With galindoi I never get good pinsets. Here are the 2 galindoi projects I have fruiting right now, already harvested about 20 fruits for printing. This is an isolate that makes great stones fast, like 6 days from inoc

Those other pics are from a tamp isolate .  Although from my discussion w cron, galindoi has recently been determined to be tampanesis in the PCR work allan Rockefeller has been doing

Here is my current galindoi and some bags exactly 1 mo old (quick stone isolate, same one fruiting) , and some jars of same culture about 3 weeks old. Bag stones are HUGE

All of these pics are the same galindoi "quick stones" isolate, also showing my lighting setup



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InvisibleAndyHinton


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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: DredgeMyEyes] * 1
    #26606345 - 04/16/20 05:58 PM (4 years, 2 months ago)

Interesting thread! Since melatonin, serotonin, and psilocybin are all based on tryptophan, it could be that light affects fungal metabolism. We already know that oxygen and temperature play a role, and that our own metabolism changes dramatically when we sleep re: tryptophan building.

Red light might help with vegetative growth, blue light with pinning. Blue light may be slightly irritating like harsh brightness of daylight, which is mostly blue. I've seen blue LED arrays advertised for seasonal affective disorder, mouth germ killing, wound sanitizing, etc.

I use a high-power 660/850 nm red/infrared LED array to heal scars. It causes mitochondria to make ATP at a faster rate. Good LEDs cost money. My red/infrared LED array cost $300, for example, and it's about the most powerful one available outside military, aerospace, etc.

If money weren't an issue, I'd use high-power red and blue LED arrays together on a reverse pomodoro schedule (25 min off, 5 min on; 25 min off, 10 min on). Along with a quality full-spectrum anti-depression light on steady for at least 12 hours a day. This last paragraph costs like $1,000 minimum.

Anyway, I keep a special stash of posts around for times like this. Lots of homeboys in this thread.

Quote:

anne halonium said:
each emitter 5 W.
factory rated, these are from aerospace industry, custom built for me.
patented power supply, presently unavailable commercially.

if you build these things, be careful, and use blue blocker glasses.



blue is 450nm , red is 680 nm.

LED is more advanced now than most realize.
my entire house is LED , and my entire grow has been LED for several yrs now.......
i would quit before i used other lights again.
and that goes for cacti and fungi.

alot of the conjecture here is comical to those of us with heavy LED experience.




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InvisibleAndyHinton


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Posts: 434
Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: AndyHinton] * 1
    #26632663 - 04/27/20 05:56 PM (4 years, 1 month ago)

Here's a quick mockup of what I'm talking about. This is about $425 worth of LEDs, and a good blue LED array would cost $200 more. If I were to build a lighted incubation room at scale, I'd leave out dedicated blue LEDs and spend the money on fans. At this power, LEDs give off quite a bit of heat. Keeping the circuits cool greatly extends the diodes' lifetimes.



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Invisiblec10h12n2o
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: AndyHinton] * 1
    #26632777 - 04/27/20 07:03 PM (4 years, 1 month ago)

I did an experiment with a prolifically fruiting tamp isolate. Usually I give them lots of light to get fully developed caps and a good pinset and vertical growth

This time I used low light after getting a good pinset, opaque lid, to keep them from developing and maturing, to see how long they would get

Well, they grew to over 12"!



--------------------

C10's Agar Guide + Tips and Tricks | c10's Flow Hood Build Guide


"Partial knowledge is more triumphant than complete knowledge; it takes things to be simpler than they are, and so makes its theory more popular and convincing."

"Convictions are more dangerous enemies of truth than lies"
― Friedrich Nietzsche

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Invisiblepanne cyanne
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: c10h12n2o] * 1
    #26633828 - 04/28/20 08:34 AM (4 years, 1 month ago)

ive always had the best grows with blue LED 420 to 450 nm .
usually in the 30 to 40 watt size range.

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Invisiblemycorry
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: c10h12n2o] * 1
    #26639991 - 04/30/20 09:27 PM (4 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

c10h12n2o said:
I did an experiment with a prolifically fruiting tamp isolate. Usually I give them lots of light to get fully developed caps and a good pinset and vertical growth

This time I used low light after getting a good pinset, opaque lid, to keep them from developing and maturing, to see how long they would get

Well, they grew to over 12"!







WTF?!

You discovered Psilocybe spaghettii

Incredible isolate! I have an ATL7 stone clone that puts out pins like mad but not half as good as your tamp isolate :wowz:

I wonder what about low light affected them in that way. :strokebeard:


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Invisiblec10h12n2o
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: mycorry] * 1
    #26640086 - 04/30/20 10:36 PM (4 years, 1 month ago)

Lol here is the same isolate w normal light. I noticed the fruits keep growing and never mature without good light, so i put an opaque lid on after i got a good pinset, just as an experiment. Got crazy lol




--------------------

C10's Agar Guide + Tips and Tricks | c10's Flow Hood Build Guide


"Partial knowledge is more triumphant than complete knowledge; it takes things to be simpler than they are, and so makes its theory more popular and convincing."

"Convictions are more dangerous enemies of truth than lies"
― Friedrich Nietzsche

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OfflineLogicaL ChaosM
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Re: Lighting Experiments? [Re: c10h12n2o]
    #26640141 - 04/30/20 11:17 PM (4 years, 1 month ago)

Wow! Thats crazy :lol:

Look at the difference the light quality makes. Like night and day (little pun there).

Ive seen similar "wavy" growth with light-deprived cubenis as well.

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