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StonedApeAquarian
Stranger

Registered: 10/20/18
Posts: 15
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
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Why do I keep getting contams?
#26583429 - 04/07/20 08:14 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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I’ve lost a couple tubs: 1 monotub and 2 dubtubs. From what I’ve read, it’s harder for contams to take hold once the mycelium is fully colonized. I’ve been doing grain to grain transfers using WBS. All my jars have fully colonized with no signs of any contams, just strong healthy mycelium. I case using coco coir/vermiculite. To make my bulk substrate, i soak the mix in boiling water. I’m thinking maybe I should try to sterilize my substrate somehow ?? I never make it to fruiting. Once my tubs are almost fully colonized, I see contams growing and I have to toss them. Any ideas on what might be going wrong or what I can do to try to prevent it from happening next time?
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rumfor69
Bodhicitta Cultivator



Registered: 08/05/11
Posts: 6,767
Loc: In the Gills
Last seen: 21 minutes, 20 seconds
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What kinda contamination are you seeing in your almost fully colonized tubs?
What is your spawn to mix ratio?
Are you following a bucket tek for your coir/verm prep?
Is your coir/verm mix at the correct field capacity? (Hard squeeze and a little water trickles out then drips)
Typically contamination before the first flush is a problem with the jars
Are you using a clean culture from agar to make master jars or spore solution?
What is the lid setup on your jars?
What tub design are you using? (modified, unmodified)
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The_Brown_Wizard
what?



Registered: 12/27/19
Posts: 188
Loc: Southeastern Carpathians
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You need to pasteurize coir so that you only kill bad organisms and let the beneficial ones live, sterilizing it is actually bad because you are killing everything, thus making room for all the nasties to come in
If the contam doesn't seem to be too bad you can try to keep them and put to fruiting as some will still produce fruits, even if contaminated
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There's a weird fuck lurking in these woods
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rumfor69
Bodhicitta Cultivator



Registered: 08/05/11
Posts: 6,767
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I sterilize my coir/verm in an electric boiler steam box I built. 166°F for 8hrs. It's worked perfectly for years. That leave the "good things" by pasteurizing doesn't apply to coir/verm. It's heated up all to fuck when it's made and bricked.
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Sockadin



Registered: 01/03/10
Posts: 7,244
Last seen: 2 months, 20 days
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Re: Why do I keep getting contams? [Re: rumfor69]
#26583514 - 04/07/20 09:15 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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You can Sterilize, pasteurize, faux Pasteurize. Doesn't matter. I think the brand matters more. I prefer to Sterilize.
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The_Brown_Wizard
what?



Registered: 12/27/19
Posts: 188
Loc: Southeastern Carpathians
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Re: Why do I keep getting contams? [Re: rumfor69]
#26583539 - 04/07/20 09:26 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
rumfor69 said: I sterilize my coir/verm in an electric boiler steam box I built. 166°F for 8hrs.
Isn't keeping something at that temperature considered pasteurizing? "Sterilization is the probability that all bacteria, spores, fungi and viruses are killed or inactivated" That temp will not kill everything
Most (if not all) trusted cultivators on the shroomery seem to all agree that sterilizing bulk substrates is borderline bad
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There's a weird fuck lurking in these woods
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rumfor69
Bodhicitta Cultivator



Registered: 08/05/11
Posts: 6,767
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Last seen: 21 minutes, 20 seconds
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Once you start getting over 145°F area you're reaching sterilizing temperatures. Then it's just a matter of time extension to reach sterility. The same way a 2psi steel drum sterilizer can sterilize blocks of sawdust and woodchips even though it's not at pressure cooker temps. You just have to run it for longer.
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LadysKnight
Hello Ladies


Registered: 10/09/15
Posts: 1,670
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Quote:
StonedApeAquarian said: I’ve lost a couple tubs: 1 monotub and 2 dubtubs. From what I’ve read, it’s harder for contams to take hold once the mycelium is fully colonized. I’ve been doing grain to grain transfers using WBS. All my jars have fully colonized with no signs of any contams, just strong healthy mycelium. I case using coco coir/vermiculite. To make my bulk substrate, i soak the mix in boiling water. I’m thinking maybe I should try to sterilize my substrate somehow ?? I never make it to fruiting. Once my tubs are almost fully colonized, I see contams growing and I have to toss them. Any ideas on what might be going wrong or what I can do to try to prevent it from happening next time?
It's your spawn. Likely due to contaminated inoculate. Got plate pics?
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natedawgnow
Rocky mountain hood rat



Registered: 02/09/15
Posts: 8,939
Loc: ation
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Quote:
The_Brown_Wizard said:
Quote:
rumfor69 said: I sterilize my coir/verm in an electric boiler steam box I built. 166°F for 8hrs.
Isn't keeping something at that temperature considered pasteurizing? "Sterilization is the probability that all bacteria, spores, fungi and viruses are killed or inactivated" That temp will not kill everything
Most (if not all) trusted cultivators on the shroomery seem to all agree that sterilizing bulk substrates is borderline bad
That isn't true at all. If anything, all TCs agree that coir can be sterilized, partially sterilized, or even hydrated with cold water skipping any heat treatment whatsoever.
Ask any TC and they will say that if you use coir or coir+verm and your tub contammed then it was almost certainly your spawn that is to blame.
Don't necessarily believe that 100% myself but it is the commonly held belief on this forum
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The_Brown_Wizard
what?



Registered: 12/27/19
Posts: 188
Loc: Southeastern Carpathians
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Re: Why do I keep getting contams? [Re: natedawgnow]
#26583673 - 04/07/20 10:34 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
rumfor69 said: Once you start getting over 145°F area you're reaching sterilizing temperatures. Then it's just a matter of time extension to reach sterility.
I didn't know sterilizing like that was a thing ; it does make quite a lot of sense now
Quote:
natedawgnow said:
That isn't true at all. If anything, all TCs agree that coir can be sterilized, partially sterilized, or even hydrated with cold water skipping any heat treatment whatsoever.
After doing some digging on the forums I found TCs saying sterilizing is ok. (usually I saw they recommended pasteurizing )
well.. guess i was wrong as fuck
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There's a weird fuck lurking in these woods
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A.k.a
Stranger



Registered: 10/27/19
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Loc: Gaming the system
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With manure or other highly nutritious subs then sterilization is bad.
Coir doesn’t matter, it shouldn’t have beneficial microbes or any microbes in it.
I was paranoid with coir at first but I’ve never had just coir by itself go bad yet.
I always just pour boiling water in a bucket, but I’ve used cold water too no problem.
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LAGM2020     
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LadysKnight
Hello Ladies


Registered: 10/09/15
Posts: 1,670
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Re: Why do I keep getting contams? [Re: A.k.a]
#26583764 - 04/07/20 11:12 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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I've always wondered why people bother with the bucket. I put my coir in the pot with the water that just came to a boil, wait till cool, then add spawn to same pot and mix. One pot to rule them all.
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natedawgnow
Rocky mountain hood rat



Registered: 02/09/15
Posts: 8,939
Loc: ation
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Re: Why do I keep getting contams? [Re: LadysKnight]
#26583773 - 04/07/20 11:16 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Hard to use 1 pot when you're prepping 10 tubs at a time.
I just load 5 bricks in a 66qt at a time and boil 5 tubs worth of water and dump it in.
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rumfor69
Bodhicitta Cultivator



Registered: 08/05/11
Posts: 6,767
Loc: In the Gills
Last seen: 21 minutes, 20 seconds
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Re: Why do I keep getting contams? [Re: natedawgnow]
#26583796 - 04/07/20 11:29 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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I'm thinking about making one of these some day
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Sockadin



Registered: 01/03/10
Posts: 7,244
Last seen: 2 months, 20 days
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Re: Why do I keep getting contams? [Re: A.k.a]
#26583801 - 04/07/20 11:31 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Ha e You checked out Cronicr s in Pasteurize spawn run? It is interesting.sh shit and bugs.
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LadysKnight
Hello Ladies


Registered: 10/09/15
Posts: 1,670
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Re: Why do I keep getting contams? [Re: natedawgnow]
#26583873 - 04/07/20 12:04 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
natedawgnow said: Hard to use 1 pot when you're prepping 10 tubs at a time.
I just load 5 bricks in a 66qt at a time and boil 5 tubs worth of water and dump it in.
Yeah true. It's a 6gal pot, I've done as many as 7 tubs at a time, but typically shoot for 5.
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natedawgnow
Rocky mountain hood rat



Registered: 02/09/15
Posts: 8,939
Loc: ation
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Re: Why do I keep getting contams? [Re: LadysKnight]
#26583903 - 04/07/20 12:18 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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7 full 66qt tubs at a time using a 6gal pot? How is that even possible the coir would for sure overflow that pot if you're putting bricks in it while water is boiling.
I can only fit one brick fully expanded in a 5gal bucket
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LadysKnight
Hello Ladies


Registered: 10/09/15
Posts: 1,670
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Re: Why do I keep getting contams? [Re: natedawgnow]
#26584035 - 04/07/20 01:28 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Sorry, no, I meant shoeboxes
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