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Kizzle
Misanthrope


Registered: 08/30/11
Posts: 9,865
Last seen: 1 day, 12 hours
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: Eminence]
#26579482 - 04/05/20 01:05 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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Eminence said: Did you just make that up? I haven't heard anyone say it's a plot to steal guns. Gun sales are on the rise, legal and illegal 
Not entirely. Go read the comments on Breitbart. I do it on occasion just to see what crazy stuff people are spewing.
"No....it is not happening. This is truly tragic. So many lost jobs over this panic."
"I'm steadily losing faith in this president. Seems he's engaging in the same fearmongering as little Fauci and these governors."
"wellll...........................ten years to global warming apocalypse has been a 30 year fail sooooo they needed something new NOW to stop those pesky sealed indictments from being opened."
"The global cabal did this on purpose...in 2019 Bill Gates had a mock pandemic...event 201 = agenda 21.all done by design for depopulation and micro chip every single on of us with a microchip. I hope President Trump is not part of this!"
"They are lying to you Mr. President!!! I still believe you when you said just last month that this was nothing more than a common flu and we have nothing to worry about!! Don't let the dem psuedo-scientists cloud your judgement!!!"
"80K DEATHS WORLD WIDE FROM FLU LAST YEAR. NO LOCK DOWN THEN. THIS IS A TOTAL SHAM TO BRING DOWN 45. START THE FREAKING USA UP AGAIN!! DEEP STATE U WILL FAIL!"
"The evil of socialism is showing itself.
In many European lands socialist governments are using the covid-19 hysteria as a cover to systematically cull the old and infirm.
The elderly are considered a burden on the state. Worse, they are an ideological threat. They anchor and stabilise families when the socialists hate families - they want you to depend on them and nobody else. They remind people of their cultural heritage and fill the heads of children with ideas of national identity when socialists want to deny such things exist as they swamp us with hostile cultures from abroad. Worst of all for the socialists, I suspect, is that secretly they feel that the elderly are immune to their lies and can see straight through to their malign intent.
Euthanasia laws have been rushed through in France, allowing the elderly to be murdered in their beds if it's deemed they are hindering treatment of younger and healthier patients. In Sweden the government has deliberately allowed covid-19 to spread in the general population and concealed the extent of the epidemic. Thus many (enough) old people have been infected by staff or visiting relatives long before any meaningful (and just token) steps were taken to protect them. We can also suspect that nursing homes are taking the opportunity to reduce the numbers of the less economically attractive residents.
For anyone with an elderly relative in care at the moment these are worrying times.
Our governments need to be told what they personally have to look forward to in their old age as a reward for these policies."
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CookieCrumbs
Fucked off to the pub


Registered: 12/10/11
Posts: 14,151
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: larry.fisherman]
#26579514 - 04/05/20 01:20 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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larry.fisherman said:
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InfiniteDreams said: I'm not sure what I'm supposed to be afraid of. This is a minor illness to 99% of people. For what seems to be multitudes of people it is so insignificant that it is not noticable.
Yet the horror stories continue. For some it is extremely dangerous. So the story shared above about Karen they say kidney failure. I have never once heard of this virus having anything to do with the kidneys. It is a respiratory issue. Karen was also carrying a few hundred extra pounds assuming that is her in the picture. Does the virus target the obese?
The kidney issues aren't new. The rest of what you just said is as speculative as anything else. The numbers don't mean as much as the impact on the healthcare system. Hospitals are getting overloaded. Why is that not enough? Are you just so above a humanitarian issue that you want to act smug about people making an effort?
This would be exactly why I changed my tune. If people could do their part to be safe and help protect others without being afraid for their own lives I would still be assuring everyone that you getting COVID19 in a way that makes you feel more than merely bad is statistically unlikely. And you're statistically much more likely to get into an accident on your way to the market.
But people can't take something seriously and do as they should while also understanding they aren't facing their imminent demise if they catch this thing.
I mean sure they might be but... that's generally true for alot of viruses that circulate. The fact that COVID unusually targets people isn't actually unusual. It's just that science has had decades to get get used to the fact that people get the virus that causes meningitis all the time. Only rarely does it turn into meningitis. They've identified the at risk group, youths, but truthfully anyone can get it at any time.
For the most part science ponders these things for a time, eventually realize the answer isn't forthcoming, and then conveniently ignore it.
In part because people start freaking out when they realize the world is full of microbes that may decide to seriously hurt them for no reason that we can decipher.
So for me it's 2 reasons to take COVID seriously:
1. We're already seriously damaging the economy and will likely be facing a global great depression. If we're doing all this we should be doing our part to try to make it worth it.
2. There IS so much we don't know. COVID could burn itself out or it could continue to circulate until everyone has been infected, all 7 billion of us. Those are really high numbers, the best we can do is try to spread them out over a decade so that they're not very much higher. There are several viruses that have behaved this way. And we've let them have their way before. We know from history how quickly something like this can overwhelm a population even if herd immunity is the ultimate solution. Even if the condition is treatable. More importantly... this is practice. These are plans we have to lay today to prepare for the inevitability of a wildly deadly pandemic like the spanish flu. Like the bubonic plague.
If people thinking this is it is the only way to get them to participate... I'm sorry you're ignorant but if we're not gonna change that then I guess I can't fault anyone for using it.
I was watching a small documentary on Youtube on the Spanish flu the other day and one of the comments was about people saying this is worse. I explained that they're wildly underestimating how deadly the spanish flu was and the conditions under which it killed. I explained that coronaviruses are not new, they are viruses that infect a number of animals and people. It infects most of us the form of a common cold.
Someone declared themselves an RN and said "the common cold is not a virus, they are not the same thing at all!" 
People seem to not understand that we really do live with these things, every waking moment. Many of us right now are infected with viruses that could make our lives suck alot. But they tend not to.
I was born with a gene that makes it really hard for me to fight strep throat, aka scarlet fever. This gene was alot more common before streptococcal had decades to circulate through the population and kill people like me. Interestingly scarlet fever is strep throat that gets out in the rest of the body. Without your body producing the antibodies that my body struggles to produce it often does escape the throat and get into other parts of the body where it causes staph infections, meningitis, toxic shock syndrome, puerperal fever (a common illness for women who just delivered a baby) and necrotizing fasciitis. Yeah that condition where the bacteria starts literally eating away your skin and all they can do is amputate...
Microbes are fucking terrifying.
But the good thing is the human race was built to live with them.
The bad thing is we also cultivate our genes. In the last decade scarlet fever has seen an unprecedented rise since antibiotics nearly eradicated it. Same old strep bacteria it's always been, but more people are reacting badly to it. You have individuals vulnerable to these infections that weren't dying from it. They live on to pass on their genes.
Mid 20th century humanity was very different from first quarter 21st century humanity.
We don't understand all that much about genetics either. It's a lottery for each every new pathogen that pops up. Are the antibodies our immune systems are good at producing effective against it? No one population is going to have the same genes so they're going to be good at producing different antibodies.
We have no idea how many people in North America are vulnerable to COVID19 because we know so little about it. And, truthfully, we don't know all that much about ourselves either.
It's hard to understand so much that you can't see. It's hard to understand something that has billions of variations. It's hard for the scientists, so I don't expect common people to understand. I know I don't understand the half of it. But I do wish that people would understand that these things exist. That they've always existed and always will exist.
It hasn't ended the world yet.
But it has given us some really bad times.
And that's what we're trying to avoid right now. Not spanish flu bad times, but probably scarlet fever bad times.
The fact that I can say those 2 things and people still think oh well the latter's not so bad, we got over it just fine... really makes me understand that there's probably no point.
Scarlet fever/strep throat killed millions and millions of people in the 1800s on into the 1900s... When we had much less than 1/5th the population and 1/10th the ability to travel... And arguably much hardier immune systems...
Why am I doing this...
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Free time is the only time
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CookieCrumbs
Fucked off to the pub


Registered: 12/10/11
Posts: 14,151
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: CookieCrumbs]
#26579516 - 04/05/20 01:21 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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Free time is the only time
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Ovoidhunter
Buttery Crescent



Registered: 09/17/16
Posts: 2,016
Last seen: 2 years, 9 months
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: koods]
#26579526 - 04/05/20 01:27 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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It's the perfect plan for China. Engineer the virus in a lab and study it. Introduce it to people who are around the wet market so nobody ask any questions or try to debate it. They get it under control before anyone else because they have advanced knowledge of it and are less susceptible. While their neighbors out west get ravaged by it and are also more susceptible because of certain science protein stuff I don't really know but whatever. Then their economy collapses and you swoop in with the final blow.
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cannabinated



Registered: 01/03/13
Posts: 14,743
Loc: Outside
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: CookieCrumbs]
#26579527 - 04/05/20 01:28 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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If they just called it by its real name, SARS 2, ppl would get the idea.
comparing it to a cold doesnt help at all tho.
10% of colds are mild coronaviruses, sure. But just cause viruses share the same machinery is irrelevant to the fact they have different targets and outcomes.
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InfiniteDreams


Registered: 10/25/19
Posts: 1,224
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: larry.fisherman]
#26579550 - 04/05/20 01:39 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
larry.fisherman said: I hate it when people make my response about having to desconstruct why their response was stupid. It's like I'm spending all this time just trying to get to my response, it turns in to an essay I don't want to write. It's a great way to get out of having a rational discussion actually, telling me I'm jumping to conclusions I never made. It actually makes you seem like the one in hysterics, you got butthurt because I said you seem smug. I'll even agree, the economy is more than bad, but who exactly is this "we"? Is it me, or you? No people just care about things, fear comes from love. There are always outliers and bad apples, if you're going to spend your time focusing on that then you're just mongering hate and bitterness. Just your way of coping with the situation. I'm sure there's a lot of ways to do that.. which ones are more abrasive?
Larry, you are focused on the negative. If it makes you feel better, I think your responses are stupid too.
You call me stupid, hysterical, butthurt, smug... You were the one who led in with the attack when I questioned the need for fear. Fear is not born of love, it is usually born of stupidity.
I have no hatred or bitterness, I believe that is just you projecting. Your argument is based around insulting me and making baseless assumptions.
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cannabinated



Registered: 01/03/13
Posts: 14,743
Loc: Outside
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: InfiniteDreams] 1
#26579561 - 04/05/20 01:48 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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you are spreading deadly mis info
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CookieCrumbs
Fucked off to the pub


Registered: 12/10/11
Posts: 14,151
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: cannabinated]
#26579566 - 04/05/20 01:51 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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cannabinated said: If they just called it by its real name, SARS 2, ppl would get the idea.
comparing it to a cold doesnt help at all tho.
10% of colds are mild coronaviruses, sure. But just cause viruses share the same machinery is irrelevant to the fact they have different targets and outcomes.
For sure and I've tried to be careful about giving that impression but people really just don't understand.
I agree that shorthanding it's proper name instead of calling it covid would probably help.
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Free time is the only time
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cannabinated



Registered: 01/03/13
Posts: 14,743
Loc: Outside
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: CookieCrumbs]
#26579570 - 04/05/20 01:52 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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i was talking @ ID about the deadly misinfo
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koods
Ribbit



Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 106,333
Loc: Maryland/DC Burbs
Last seen: 41 minutes, 58 seconds
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: Kizzle]
#26579596 - 04/05/20 02:07 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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Kizzle said:
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gopher said: Why does it take so long for a vaccine, cant they just harvest the virus from a sick person and like injure it so its not active, isnt that how vaccines used to be made?
Sure, making a vaccine is easy. Making a vaccine that demonstrably works and won't hurt people takes time, not to mention producing it on a large scale. There's potential for vaccines to actually hurt people so they have to be tested thoroughly.
They make new flu vaccines every year without clinical trials.
I feel like they could skip the efficacy phase if the safety phase works out and the participants have a good antibody load from the vaccine
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NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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Tripsurfer
Bring Back Asante!



Registered: 08/01/12
Posts: 7,129
Loc: West of Windward
Last seen: 4 months, 15 days
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: cannabinated]
#26579602 - 04/05/20 02:11 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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In Iceland they tested the highest percentage of people (not a huge number in total because of the small population) and 50% of COVID-19 positives reported zero symptoms
-------------------- Ach en wee ben ik de klos, met mijn boog schoot ik een albatros... A philosopher is a person who knows less and less about more and more, until he knows nothing about everything.

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koods
Ribbit



Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 106,333
Loc: Maryland/DC Burbs
Last seen: 41 minutes, 58 seconds
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: InfiniteDreams]
#26579604 - 04/05/20 02:11 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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InfiniteDreams said: I'm not sure what I'm supposed to be afraid of. This is a minor illness to 99% of people. For what seems to be multitudes of people it is so insignificant that it is not noticable
20% of cases are hospitalized. That’s not minor
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NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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PumpJackTeX
livin life



Registered: 05/26/08
Posts: 3,951
Loc: California
Last seen: 11 months, 16 days
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: koods]
#26579605 - 04/05/20 02:11 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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Denver Lockdown:
4/5/20
-------------------- Life. 2008 Ascension Energy | UFOs | 2021
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koods
Ribbit



Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 106,333
Loc: Maryland/DC Burbs
Last seen: 41 minutes, 58 seconds
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: Tripsurfer]
#26579609 - 04/05/20 02:12 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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Tripsurfer said: In Iceland they tested the highest percentage of people (not a huge number in total because of the small population) and 50% of COVID-19 positives reported zero symptoms
That’s not a significant amount. At most that would cut CFR rates in half.
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NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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koods
Ribbit



Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 106,333
Loc: Maryland/DC Burbs
Last seen: 41 minutes, 58 seconds
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: koods]
#26579613 - 04/05/20 02:13 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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I’ve talked to more of my neighbors today than I have in 20 years 🤦♂️
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NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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Kizzle
Misanthrope


Registered: 08/30/11
Posts: 9,865
Last seen: 1 day, 12 hours
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: Ovoidhunter]
#26579637 - 04/05/20 02:25 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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Ovoidhunter said: It's the perfect plan for China. Engineer the virus in a lab and study it. Introduce it to people who are around the wet market so nobody ask any questions or try to debate it. They get it under control before anyone else because they have advanced knowledge of it and are less susceptible. While their neighbors out west get ravaged by it and are also more susceptible because of certain science protein stuff I don't really know but whatever. Then their economy collapses and you swoop in with the final blow.
Of course this is just the practice run before the real pandemic starts 
Problem with this theory though is there really is no controlling a pandemic. Even countries that seem to have things relatively under control now like China and South Korea are still going to have massive consequences. Also China's economy is a huge part of the world economy so you can't destroy one without destroying the other.
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pirate-blues



Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 13,696
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: koods]
#26579644 - 04/05/20 02:28 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
koods said:
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InfiniteDreams said: I'm not sure what I'm supposed to be afraid of. This is a minor illness to 99% of people. For what seems to be multitudes of people it is so insignificant that it is not noticable
20% of cases are hospitalized. That’s not minor
And also for the last time, your idea of 'minor' and the CDC's idea of 'minor' are not the same. The risk of pneumonia and permanent damage is still very real for minor cases.
Not something I'd like to risk. And that's not even factoring in the fact that 1/5 people are going to have to be hospitalized. That's insanity. I don't know how you could look at that and not realize how serious this is.
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pirate-blues



Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 13,696
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: pirate-blues] 1
#26579650 - 04/05/20 02:33 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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p.s. if anyone is still looking for fruit and veggie seeds, ebay guaranteed me delivery by this Friday. Everything I tried to buy on Amazon wouldn't get here until June. No better time to have your own home grown produce!
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Shroomus
Stranger

Registered: 09/17/18
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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: Ovoidhunter]
#26579653 - 04/05/20 02:34 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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I pondered the China theory, but it seems that if they'd engineered it from bats it would have been possible to engineer and plant, for example, another avian-type virus from a native animal in another country and infect people there, maybe in a location with poor sanitation but plenty of travel throughout the west?
(Just to add, I've eaten too many edibles this weekend and so my critical thinking is likely way off at this moment in time )
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qman
Stranger

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Re: Viral Outbreak in China - COVID-19 aka. SARS-CoV-2 aka Wuhan Coronavirus 2020 [Re: Kizzle] 1
#26579656 - 04/05/20 02:35 PM (3 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Kizzle said:
Quote:
Ovoidhunter said: It's the perfect plan for China. Engineer the virus in a lab and study it. Introduce it to people who are around the wet market so nobody ask any questions or try to debate it. They get it under control before anyone else because they have advanced knowledge of it and are less susceptible. While their neighbors out west get ravaged by it and are also more susceptible because of certain science protein stuff I don't really know but whatever. Then their economy collapses and you swoop in with the final blow.
Of course this is just the practice run before the real pandemic starts 
Problem with this theory though is there really is no controlling a pandemic. Even countries that seem to have things relatively under control now like China and South Korea are still going to have massive consequences. Also China's economy is a huge part of the world economy so you can't destroy one without destroying the other.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/south-koreas-return-to-normal-interrupted-by-uptick-in-coronavirus-cases/ar-BB12bDaj
It's coming back in South Korea, that's highly discouraging.
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