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Shop: Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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OfflineHagbardCeline
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Re: EXODUS: How do you explain the nation of Israel? [Re: saved7]
    #26587358 - 04/08/20 08:59 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Deflect much?

What the story implies is that the Bible is a piecemeal work of oral communications, that Exodus was likely embellished and not the self-proving story you claim because such super believers would not rebel so easily (see modern suicide bombers.)

On the other hand it makes perfect sense for the priest/elder class to manipulate the flock (as all religions do) by getting them to believe they alone have favor with God and doing his bidding (which even your own source claims to have been dictated to elite/elders) is the only way. To refuse means death.


--------------------
I keep it real because I think it is important that a highly esteemed individual such as myself keep it real lest they experience the dreaded spontaneous non-existance of no longer keeping it real. - Hagbard Celine


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Offlinesaved7
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Re: EXODUS: How do you explain the nation of Israel? [Re: HagbardCeline]
    #26588026 - 04/09/20 05:21 AM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

HagbardCeline said:
Deflect much?

What the story implies is that the Bible is a piecemeal work of oral communications, that Exodus was likely embellished and not the self-proving story you claim because such super believers would not rebel so easily (see modern suicide bombers.)





It wasn't a deflection at all.  And one of the conclusions we can draw is that many of the Isrealites were not "super believers" ...  They had to be dragged along kicking and screaming towards their salvation.  (Like I've mentioned elsewhere, one of the marks of authenticity of the story is just how embarassing and badly-behaved the protagonists of the story are portrayed.)

In the Exodus, Israel is saved again and again by God's miraculous intervention... and they all see it happen and participate in it.  And yet, a little while later we find them griping and moaning that it isn't enough and they'd rather be back in slavery in Egypt, (where at least they had a routine, and knew where they were going to eat and sleep every day.)  At this time, Israel was in the Wilderness.  It was a place of Testing, where Israel was constantly faced with the decision to either trust in God's salvation or let the worries and desires of the world pull them back into bondage. 

Put yourself there, in the Wilderness with Israel.  Every day, all your worldly senses are telling you you're going to die (no food, no water, powerful enemy nations circling around you, etc.) ... You are constantly faced with the decision of surrendering your livelihood to God based on faith that he will save and sustain you again and again... or on the other hand, giving in to your fears of the natural world and rebelling against an apparent suicide-mission led by Moses.

I think you feel like it is a deflection because of what I mentioned in my last post.  We, as modern 'rational' humans in the 21st century, like to pretend that we base our worldviews around facts and evidence.  We project ourselves onto the ancient Israelites and insist that such visible miracles would be all the proof we need.  But the reality is we have hardened hearts just like the Israelites.  God could demonstrate his presence directly before us, and the next day would find us griping and moaning and following our lusts, just as before.  The offensive truth here is that we don't really care about evidence as much as we pretend we do.  Evidence is not what guides our lives, it is our selfish hearts which rule us.  (Jesus is the answer to this problem, because he gives us new hearts.)


--------------------
"Who do you say that I am?"
- Jesus quoted in the Gospel of Matthew


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