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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: Sockadin]
    #26555945 - 03/24/20 08:44 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Sockadin said:
Woofwoof has a point you can do 12 and twelve. They will grow together slowly. It just means more Mycelium but it won't increase the BE of your grow.




What is BE?

And if I do 12 and 12, then I'm back to needing a second 70 Qt tub, not a 32 or 24 Qt, as Logical Chaos had reccommended.

Quote:

Sockadin said: I might have misunderstood the initial question. Can you fit all of the jars in the 70qrt tub? If so you are good to go. If not you will need another SGFC




Seriously, just look at the picture above, and you tell me. This is what I have been asking lol all day it seems like.


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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: Sockadin]
    #26555950 - 03/24/20 08:45 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Sockadin said:
They will help each other. Your mushrooms create a climate. The closer h
They are the better the climate.




OMG LMAO, you guys are killing me.

Okay, so we have 3 inches, 2 inches, 1 inch, and now the closer they are together the better.

Do I need to phone a friend? :shocked:


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OfflineSockadin
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: LSA Woodrose]
    #26555962 - 03/24/20 08:50 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Lol phone a friend.,

Your over thinking it again. Just birth them as close together as you can, and if you run out of room. Make a new SGFC. That's all, plus imagine trying to dunk and roll 24 cakes. That's crazy do 6-6-6-6 each a day apart.


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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: Sockadin]
    #26555979 - 03/24/20 09:02 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Sockadin said:
Lol phone a friend.,

Your over thinking it again.




Yeah, its kind of my thing. In my defense, however, I did kind of get 4 different answers from four different people, which understandably opened the door to some questions. :tongue2:

Quote:

Sockadin said:
Just birth them as close together as you can, and if you run out of room. Make a new SGFC. That's all,




Sounds like a plan. Plus, your way, I don't have to try and divine the exact sized tub I will need if I do need a second tub. Once I start birthing the cakes into the first 70 Qt SGFC, by the time I'm done, I should have a much better idea what size I would need, so I won't have to guess at it beforehand.

Quote:

Sockadin said:
plus imagine trying to dunk and roll 24 cakes. That's crazy do 6-6-6-6 each a day apart.




I could swear you and I had this conversation before, only it was about inoculating 24 cakes in one sitting, which if I remember correctly you said wasn't advisable, but I did anyway. Not worried about the work. Once I start, if I have to birth 24 cakes all at once, then so be it. However, as I was saying before, 6 or so of my cakes are REALLY lagging, so I think unlike inoculation, nature may take this particular choice away from me anyway, and I may have to wait to birth those last cakes.


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OfflineBabylon
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: LSA Woodrose]
    #26556285 - 03/25/20 02:08 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

LSA Woodrose said:
Quote:

Sockadin said:
Lol phone a friend.,

Your over thinking it again.




Yeah, its kind of my thing. In my defense, however, I did kind of get 4 different answers from four different people, which understandably opened the door to some questions. :tongue2:

Quote:

Sockadin said:
Just birth them as close together as you can, and if you run out of room. Make a new SGFC. That's all,




Sounds like a plan. Plus, your way, I don't have to try and divine the exact sized tub I will need if I do need a second tub. Once I start birthing the cakes into the first 70 Qt SGFC, by the time I'm done, I should have a much better idea what size I would need, so I won't have to guess at it beforehand.

Quote:

Sockadin said:
plus imagine trying to dunk and roll 24 cakes. That's crazy do 6-6-6-6 each a day apart.




I could swear you and I had this conversation before, only it was about inoculating 24 cakes in one sitting, which if I remember correctly you said wasn't advisable, but I did anyway. Not worried about the work. Once I start, if I have to birth 24 cakes all at once, then so be it. However, as I was saying before, 6 or so of my cakes are REALLY lagging, so I think unlike inoculation, nature may take this particular choice away from me anyway, and I may have to wait to birth those last cakes.




Keep an eye on the lagging ones when you birth them, contamination is a common cause of lagging, if they start growing mold get rid of them.


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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: Babylon]
    #26556399 - 03/25/20 06:13 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Babylon said:
Keep an eye on the lagging ones when you birth them, contamination is a common cause of lagging, if they start growing mold get rid of them.




Agreed. I also separated them a little this morning, moving the lagging ones are a little further away from the thriving jars. While I doubt mold would be transmitted from one jar to another, through the inoculation holes, you never know, and I would rather be on the safe side. Better to lose a jar or two than the whole crop.


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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: LSA Woodrose]
    #26561298 - 03/27/20 02:36 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Okay, so I may as well post an update now:

It is three weeks since my initial inoculation. To help maintain my tradition in this forum of over-thinking everything, I took all these pics at exactly 300: PM EST today, which is precisely 3 weeks (21 days) after my initial inoculation.

Time flies, huh?

Anyway, I am posting a crapload of pics at the bottom of this post, so you wan look at them at your leisure, if you want to give me some advice or tips or strategies, moving forward. I will reference the pics below and will label them so you aren't overwhelmed with pictures stuffed between text, passages, and questions.

I started with 24 jars, which is what I still have. I have basically subdivided my jars into THREE distinct groups based on colonization and such.


Note:
Before getting started, look at the very first photo, not part of a subgroup. I noticed that the colonization looks different in some jar. This is the most dramatic representation I could find. But, basically the white parts look slightly different. Notice in Pic #1 that half of what's showing is very cottony-white, while the other half, while still white, is a little bit darker? I'm honestly not sure if this has to do with deeper colonization or the fact that these MS syringes have different species' of mycelium in it. But in your minds, is this the former or the latter?


Note that I also DID NOT post pics of 24 jars. I tried to post a few pics that best represent the state the jars in that group seem to be in.


Group I: Thankfully, this has the single most jars in any of the three groups. See pics below labeled Group I. This group consists of 10 jars. All of them appear to be completely colonized to my eye. And, as a bonus, the bottoms of the jars also appear to be completely colonized to me. All 10 of the bottoms are all very similar to the bottom pic I posted for the pics in this group.


Group II: This group has 8 jars in it. 7 of 8 are completely colonized around the cylindrical part of the jar, but are missing very small amounts of colonization only on the very bottom. I posted several pics of the bottoms of jars so you can see what I mean. Notice that in one jar, its just a spec missing. However, in 6 of the jars, there are varying degrees between the bottom-colonizing I posted pics of.

Of note also (see the last two pics of this group) is that the final jar in this group actually has a slight amount of the circumference or cylinder un-colonized, which is continuous with the un-colonized part of the bottom. Its possible I should have put this jar into the final group below, but I decided it was closer to group II than to Group III.

Group III: Okay, these are the ones in varying states of lagging behind. This consists of the final 7 jars, and the colonizing is incredibly varied!


Important: and I would like your thoughts. My plan is to wait one or two days for Group II to catch up with Group I. Once it does, presumably this weekend, then I can 7 day clock the mycelium to consolidate its hold on all 18 jars! If I do that, I will birth 18 cakes at once, rinse them, soak them, dunk & roll, then put them into the SGFC.

Alternatively, I can start the 7 day consolidation clock today, then birth the first 10, which seem to be fully colonized now. Then start another clock then the other 8 fully colonize. So, in effect, that would give me two clocks for birthing and the dunk & roll, meaning I would birth 10 cakes next friday, and another 8 cakes on Sunday, or whatever 7 days from full colonizing is for those 8 cakes.

As for the final 7 cakes, I'm thinking I just need to play this by ear and see when they are ready? I suspect 2 of the 7 will be ready for "starting the 7 day clock" early to mid next week. 4 of the 5, I am guessing a few days to a week after that. And the final slowpoke jar....who knows, but whenever its ready. So in this scenario, I would stagger my birthing either way.



__________________________________________________________________________



Pictures:



Two Different Shades of White - Same jars:




Group I Pics - 10 jars that look fully colonized to me, both in main jar and bottoms of jars:






Group II Pics: 8 Jars in this group. All very similar to group I except the bottoms have very slight to slight areas of non-colonizing.














Group III Pics: This is the final 7 jars that are lagging behind. Bear in mind that there is the largest range of varying colonizing for different reasons in this group.

These are of TWO jars I did not inoculate until 03/12/20, for whatever reason. So I expect them to be lagging, since they weren't inoculated for 6 full days after the first inoculation on 03/06/20. Oddly enough, they are actually coming along quite well, and I suspect it will only be about 3-4 days before full colonization of these two. Obviously, I will wait to birth them. Notice the somewhat small areas of non-colonizing, with the rest of the 2 jars mostly colonized. So even though they are the expected 6 days or so behind, they seem to be doing well!






Bottom of 2nd 03/12/20 inoculated jar. The cylinder is 90-95% colonized




Now things get a little sticky:


These jars, about 4 of them, are lagging behind moderate to high-moderate:








Okay, final jar, and this is the real outlying weirdo! I was getting a little impatient, because this jar only had white growing from ONE, single inoculation point! So, 6 days ago, on 03/21, I heat-sterilized one of my syringes (the Costa Rica) and I inoculated the other three holes. This one is obviously waaaay behind the rest. Not even sure what the hell to do with this little guy. I don't think I should toss it. Your thoughts on a plan with this? Right now, my plan is basically wait and see what happens with it. Maybe I will birth it only when its finally ready, say probably in a few weeks, and stick it in whichever of my terrariums has the space?




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OfflineSockadin
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: LSA Woodrose] * 1
    #26561311 - 03/27/20 02:44 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

They all look really good.

You have a very nice plan to start the 7 days on the first group. Then when the second group finish start 7 days and the last group 7 days.


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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: Sockadin]
    #26561326 - 03/27/20 02:51 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Sockadin said:
They all look really good.

You have a very nice plan to start the 7 days on the first group. Then when the second group finish start 7 days and the last group 7 days.




Yeah, I was leaning toward that plan, to be honest. My thinking is that I start the 7 day clock at 3:00 PM EST today (an hour ago) then I birth those first 10 cakes next Friday afternoon. My guesstimate is that the second group of 7 jars will be fully colonized, say tomorrow or Sunday. If its Sunday, then I will birth those 7 cakes in 9 days, ie. the Sunday after this Sunday.

The third group has several question marks over them, so better to not be impatient. I may have to start that 7 day clock at three or four different points, and then birth the 7 after each of them.

This also may be a good thing for another reason. The more I look at things, the more I am convinced that the 70 Qt tub I made my current SGFC out of may only hold about 16 cakes. The advantage a staggered-birthing gives me is that I don't have to eyeball a second tub now. I can wait until birthing the first group of cakes next Friday and see how much room they take up. By the time I am ready for round two, I will probably have a very good idea how big of a second tub I need for my second SGFC.

I'm thinking I will probably need another 70 Qt, or at least a 60 Qt container, if my first SGFC only holds, say 14-16, and I need space for 8-10 more.


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OfflineSockadin
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: LSA Woodrose] * 1
    #26561333 - 03/27/20 02:54 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

You want them as close together as you can get them and also fill the tub.

Sounds like your rocking and rolling. I wouldn't worry about the last group being contaminated. They look fine, sometimes genetics or spore distribution can cause a colonization speed difference, just give them time and they will eventually catch up.


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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: Sockadin]
    #26561344 - 03/27/20 02:59 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Sockadin said:
You want them as close together as you can get them and also fill the tub.

Sounds like your rocking and rolling. I wouldn't worry about the last group being contaminated. They look fine, sometimes genetics or spore distribution can cause a colonization speed difference, just give them time and they will eventually catch up.




Thanks, brother! That's what I figured. Because I saw no black or green spots indicating contaminants I would recognize, like normal green-mold.

When you say as close as possible I want to make damned sure that I am leaving enough rooms for the pins and caps to grow unencumbered. My understanding, and please correct me if I'm wrong, is that a lot of growth comes from the sides of the cakes, as opposed to the tops, once they are in the SGFC? If so, my big question I am still now 100% sure of is, how close is too close? Stated another way, is there point where the proximity becomes too close and the growth of cakes will start to interfere with one another due to their proximity? If not, then I will simply place them an inch or so apart. BUT that really seems too close, at least to my n00b-brain.

lol sorry to overcomplicate again...nah, I'm really not sorry to overcomplicate. Its how I learn. :mushroom2:


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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: LSA Woodrose] * 1
    #26561349 - 03/27/20 03:01 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Depends on your scenario. If you want little to no maintenance do a monotub.

Group II pics number 5 and 6 down look off color and may be contaminated. Not sure if it’s the light but it looks off to me.


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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: eatyualive]
    #26561353 - 03/27/20 03:03 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

eatyualive said:
Depends on your scenario. If you want little to no maintenance do a monotub.




Not gonna happen.

I am a complete n00b on my first grow. So I am absolutely, intractably,  unequivocally committed to sticking with Pf Tek, beginning to end, without questioning or critiquing. Its because I am a n00b, and this is what I am learning now. After a couple of successful grows, I will happily entertain evolving my growing. But not now.


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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: eatyualive]
    #26561359 - 03/27/20 03:06 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

eatyualive said:

Group II pics number 5 and 6 down look off color and may be contaminated. Not sure if it’s the light but it looks off to me.




Yeah, I have been wondering about that myself. I'm pretty sure its just the lighting of the pics, though. I will look again, maybe take the pics again, just to be sure.


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Invisibleeatyualive
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: LSA Woodrose] * 1
    #26561373 - 03/27/20 03:13 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Keep an eye out. It might be the mycelia colonizing from behind. But off white isnt so good.


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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: eatyualive]
    #26561378 - 03/27/20 03:15 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

eatyualive said:
Keep an eye out. It might be the mycelia colonizing from behind. But off white isnt so good.




Yep, I totally agree! I started looking at that jar a little funny the day before yesterday. But I don’t know the difference between what healthy white looks like versus some sort of infiltration that I don’t want. So I’ll keep an eye out in the meantime. Worst case scenario, I lose one of the 24 jars, it’s not a big tragedy.


Edited by LSA Woodrose (03/27/20 03:48 PM)


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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: LSA Woodrose]
    #26562707 - 03/28/20 08:47 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Hey just a question while I wait for colonization and consolidation:

Is this a good brand or form of Vermiculite?

4 Cubic Feet Bag

Amazon has this huge bag for $36.90. I paid $11.96 for an 8 quart bag, which I seem to have used about half for the substrate. I forgot that I need to also account for the birthing of 24 cakes and the required dunk & roll. I am reasonably sure I will have enough verm left for all 24 cakes, but just in case, if I need to order more, this is the bag I'm looking at. 8 quarts is about .267 Cubic feet. So 4 Cubic Feet is about 120 quarts, which is about 15 times the amount for three times the price. This seems like a no-brainer to me, if I need to order more Verm.

Also, I have read that different granulations of verm are better or worse for PF Tek? I could be remembering wrong, but I think I remember reading that finer verm is not as good as more coarsely ground verm? Again, not sure if I am remembering this correctly.











Edit: Just as a side by side comparison, this is the Verm I purchased form Amazon, and what I used for my substrate jars. It is apparently a "finer" ground verm. As opposed to the 4 Cubic Foot bag above, that is listed as a "courser" ground. Thoughts on differences, if any?

8 Quart Fine Ground Verm



Edited by LSA Woodrose (03/28/20 08:52 AM)


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OfflineSockadin
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: LSA Woodrose]
    #26562716 - 03/28/20 08:51 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

You should have enough for the roll. It won't use as much as you think.

If you have both grades I use fine for the actual cake and course for the roll.


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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: Sockadin]
    #26562720 - 03/28/20 08:54 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Sockadin said:
You should have enough for the roll. It won't use as much as you think.

If you have both grades I use fine for the actual cake and course for the roll.




Interesting!

So should I go ahead and still use the finer ground I have for the roll? Or should I order the coarser ground now and save the original bag for future PF Tek grows?

Oh and as an aside, dude, you're totally awesome! You have been right on top of this forum, and answer my questions so amazingly fast, sometimes you make my head spin.


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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: I Need A Lot of Help to Start Cultivating Mushrooms - Total N00b Here! [Re: LSA Woodrose]
    #26565130 - 03/29/20 11:34 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Just a quick, over thinking question LOL. I started the 7-day clock on my first 10 jars on Friday. From my second group of 7 jars (see picture above), 3 or 4 are ready to start the 7-day clock, and the rest of that group will almost certainly be ready tomorrow. So I’m thinking for the sake of making it a little easier, starting the 7- day clock on all seven of these jars tomorrow morning instead of starting the countdown on half today, and the rest tomorrow. I think I remember reading somewhere, that waiting an extra day or two for consolidation, over the actual seven days, shouldn’t be a bad thing. Is this true?

Again, sorry to over complicate, but I want to be certain that I’m getting this right. I’m pretty sure I can start the clock on all 7 tomorrow, meaning 8 days of consolidation for the first few of that group. But I just want to make sure.


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