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InvisiblefahtsterM
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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: rumfor69]
    #26538899 - 03/16/20 03:46 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)



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Offlinerumfor69
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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: fahtster]
    #26539022 - 03/16/20 04:30 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Interesting view points. I'd never use hot or boiling water on room
Temp jars it will crack them, and it heats up too fast causing more
cracking. Seen this happen many times. Steam is air it's not different
than air. A cooker reading 15psi isn't different temperatures inside, its
just boiling water at a higher temperature cause pressure is pushing against
it.

Thermodynamics and heat exchange say a lot of that information isn't accurate.
But I find I always believe different things than most just
based on my knowledge of science. In my experiences i find myself rarely
to be wrong in application. Which usually leaves me confused about others
understandings. But hey dripping water on it and letting out steam isn't gonna
hurt anything either


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InvisibleTranscendingLife
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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: rumfor69]
    #26539028 - 03/16/20 04:34 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

The pressure gauges on PCs are geared gauges. They are not 100% accurate, even says it in the user manual.
The true gauge is the toggle weight, which should sputter once every minute or so to ensure you’re at the proper pressure.
Dripping water on the lid ensures that the top is the same temperature as the rest of the unit.


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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: TranscendingLife]
    #26539037 - 03/16/20 04:44 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I misspoke - 10 mins is the appropriate pre-weight steam time. Did not know about the water on lid test - cool. Will give this a try next go-round.


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Offlinerumfor69
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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26539137 - 03/16/20 06:05 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

No they're not 100% accurate but I think their tested tolerance is to
a +/- tenth of a percent or something so it's still very accurate to the
whole percentage the gauge is numbered in.


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InvisibleTranscendingLife
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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: rumfor69]
    #26539143 - 03/16/20 06:10 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

My AA says it’s at 14 PSI when the toggle weight won’t stop yelling at me at 15 PSI. :shrug:
Trust the weight not the gauge.


--------------------
AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
:sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop::wow:How I Do EVERYTHING:wow::sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop:
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth


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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: TranscendingLife]
    #26539151 - 03/16/20 06:15 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

The part about venting is also in the manual for the pressure cooker.  It isn't something made up here on this site.  Sorry, but gam gam didn't RTFM.

At least you never got botulism as a result.


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Offlinerumfor69
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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: InfiniteDreams]
    #26539160 - 03/16/20 06:18 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Gam gam lmao


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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: rumfor69]
    #26539165 - 03/16/20 06:22 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Yeah my AA reads 13-14 but it screams when at that area. I wonder if geared gauges don't react to elevation changes. Either way jar always come out 100-120 minuets clean. Depends on beer consumption that day.


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Offlinerumfor69
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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: Sockadin]
    #26539171 - 03/16/20 06:26 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Both my AA's the old one and the newer one don't jiggle till the gauges
say 15psi. Maybe slight elevation variations make that small difference.


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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: rumfor69]
    #26539293 - 03/16/20 07:39 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

FYI, I have the The All American 50X and it uses a control valve, which is what I think other folks are calling a "toggle" or "toggle weight" from the diff pc models and types. :shrug:

Per the manual for the 50x, sterilization requires the following:

Quote:

City altitude Steam Pressure Required
Sea level 15-17 psi
2000ft 16-18 psi
4000ft 17-19 psi
6000ft 18-20 psi
8000ft 19-21 psi
10,000ft 20-22 psi




Quote:

5. Open CONTROL VALVE (See Fig. 2) by placing valve lever in an upright position. The steam generated at the bottom of the sterilizer will travel around the outside of the container and then down through the material in the container to the bottom and force the air from the bottom of container up through the flexible air exhaust tube and out of the control valve.

It is important that the steam be permitted to escape vigorously from the unit for at least five-seven minutes, or until you see a continuous flow of steam.Then you may close the control valve. This process of permitting the steam to escape is called EXHAUSTING and is necessary to remove the air trapped in the unit. The greatest cause of sterilization failure is the trapping of air in the material being sterilized. Trapped air cannot escape. It is imperative that all trapped air be exhausted. With the control valve in the closed position (See Fig. 3), pressure will rise inside the sterilizer and will be indicated on the pressure gauge.




I knew I saw the 5 min somewhere...I usually do the wait for a steady flow of steam technique and it's g2g for closing the control valve. Timer starts when I hit 15 psi and I'll usually keep it near 20 for the full hour, then let cool in the cooker so it gets a little more on the way down.


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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: PTreeDish] * 1
    #26539308 - 03/16/20 07:49 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I sterilize at 20 PSI for 1.5 hours. 15 PSI @ 2 hours.
But always do the water test on the lid to ensure the entire unit is in fact at temperature.


--------------------
AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
:sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop::wow:How I Do EVERYTHING:wow::sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop:
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth


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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26539316 - 03/16/20 07:52 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Hmm I'm less than 800ft maybe that's why my gauge is accurate to my jiggler


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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: rumfor69]
    #26572989 - 04/02/20 10:32 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Jars have fully recovered from the car tire shaking! How's this look? Ready for G2G?



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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26573040 - 04/02/20 10:54 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Well thats the thing about pressure gauges... 

Let me just say this, I have installed thousand of pressure gauges in my life..  I was a clean room pipe fitter for years.

You can never trust a pressure gauge, even a supposedly calibrated one, for anything accurate.  The best you can do is slap a gauge that reads atmospheric pressure rather than just gauge pressure so you can at least visibly confirm what it thinks is PSIa.  You see where I am going with this?

Any shock to a gauge will result in it not being calibrated 100%, and we know how shipping works.


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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: PTreeDish] * 1
    #26573165 - 04/02/20 11:57 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

PTreeDish said:
Jars have fully recovered from the car tire shaking! How's this look? Ready for G2G?






:awethumb:

What do you mean recovered from the tire shaking?
Once the grains are fully colonized, they’re ready to go. You don’t need to break them up and see if they recover.
That just damages the mycelium network with extra shaking.


--------------------
AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
:sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop::wow:How I Do EVERYTHING:wow::sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop:
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth


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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: TranscendingLife]
    #26573179 - 04/02/20 12:05 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

What do you mean recovered from the tire shaking?




I mean that I took the same jars in the original post that had spots that looked like contam and I hit them against a car tire to try and break up the stuff that was stuck together. :smile: I don't have a bike tire like RR recommends in his video so I went with what I had. Had to use a tire because I just couldn't whack or shake these jars hard enough to break everything up.

Quote:

Once the grains are fully colonized, they’re ready to go. You don’t need to break them up and see if they recover.




Per the earlier posts and recommendations, I broke them up to try and address the questionable spots.

"Once the grains are fully colonized" - can you help define that further? I haven't been able to find much regarding what Rye Grass Seed jars look like fully colonized.

And I'll need to shake these jars again to break it up so I can transfer them to others jars. Right now, I could hold the jar upside down and the entire contents won't budge.


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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26573191 - 04/02/20 12:12 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Ok, cool. Just making sure the jar wasn’t 100% then shaken then recovered. That’s old info.

If it’s one solid clump like that in the jar, it’s 100%. Sometimes jars won’t look fully colonized because grains get pressed up against the side of the jar.
But they are colonized.

I use a stack of old phone books or thick magazines that I’ve duct taped together.
Hell, you can bang the jars on your hands, but it hurts after a few jars.


--------------------
AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
:sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop::wow:How I Do EVERYTHING:wow::sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop:
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth


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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: TranscendingLife]
    #26573215 - 04/02/20 12:30 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Yea, the jar was 100% shaken and recovered. Lesson learned for next time.

There was no way to just break up the questionable spots, unfortunately. That said, they recovered nicely - although, I'm sure I used up some of their energy in the process.

I'm telling you, I banged the crap out of these using my hand and it wasn't enough. The block of books is a good idea. I have plenty of those laying around.

Alright cool - so sounds like these jars are ready for another shaking and G2G. Weeeeeee.


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Re: How do my grain jars look? [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26603819 - 04/15/20 07:08 PM (3 years, 9 months ago)

Jars are making it over to shoeboxes and tubs as we speak.

Did 1 quart of spawn per shoebox w/ straight coir (no other additives). For the mono, 3 quarts. Wanted to do five but they weren't ready. Got another 1 or 2 tubs and 7 or 8 shoeboxes coming in a few days.

Testing 4 colonies (2 colonies x 2 varieties) grown from prints to agar.



Just leaving the lids on loose with the light on all day/night. Outside humidity is about 45% and temps range from 65-79F.


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