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InvisibleShamanBag
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Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? *DELETED*
    #26538371 - 03/16/20 11:00 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Post deleted by ShamanBag

Reason for deletion: covid19


Edited by ShamanBag (03/16/20 11:37 AM)


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OfflineSockadin
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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: ShamanBag]
    #26538378 - 03/16/20 11:06 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

If you are referring to PC and inoclute I would pitch them. Your brain will never let you live it down
If you see odd growth you will always question those jars.


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InvisibleShamanBag
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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: Sockadin]
    #26538389 - 03/16/20 11:11 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Sockadin said:
If you are referring to PC and inoclute I would pitch them. Your brain will never let you live it down
If you see odd growth you will always question those jars.




Yes I am referring to jars that will be inoculated after.  I've been wondering if I can do the same with jars that are already run through with mycelium but I suspect could be contaminated from the G2G process I used as well.  Pressure cook everything again and start over. 

Interestingly when I used to use oats I would dump the contaminated tubs in a spot in the yard and now that spot is filled with oat grass.  I would have thought pressure cooking would kill the seeds but apparently not.


Edited by ShamanBag (03/16/20 11:12 AM)


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InvisibleSpunkyMonkey88
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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: ShamanBag]
    #26538400 - 03/16/20 11:18 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Theoretically it could be fine, PCing is supposed to kill all of those contaminates anyway. Those grains were far from sterile before that mold took foot hold after hydration anyway, it’s just now it’s visible...

I would just make new ones but it could definitely work IMO


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Offlinejbgtaa
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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: SpunkyMonkey88]
    #26538411 - 03/16/20 11:24 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I mean you may get lucky but you’re missing the point.

They’re moldy because you either didn’t sterilize right or your filter is shitty. If you sterilize a jar correctly with proper filtration you should be able to leave it on a shelf without contaminating indefinitely. As long as it’s unopened. I’ve had jars sit for months at a time and never had them contaminate.

I wouldn’t do it. I’d reconsider how you let mold into the jar before trying to reuse them.


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InvisibleShamanBag
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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: jbgtaa] * 2
    #26538423 - 03/16/20 11:34 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Actually I think you missed the point.  The jars I'm referring to have not been sterilized.  They got moldy before I could get to them. 

I have been wondering ALSO about jars that were previously sterilized and inoculated G2G that I suspect are contaminated through the G2G process even though they are completely colonized with mycelium.  I just had a couple of tubs go bad before the first flush and I believe it happened during the G2G process.  I am planning to eliminate G2G for the time being and go with straight agar to bulk. 

Sorry that the post was confusing.  I edited the post to make it more clear since it was obviously poorly written and confusing.  My bad.


Edited by ShamanBag (03/16/20 11:38 AM)


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OfflineRandalf the Grey
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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: ShamanBag]
    #26538508 - 03/16/20 12:24 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I have wondered this. the only concern I would think would be either re-occurance of contams, or more importantly toxins left in the grain from the contams that could carry over to fruits. I don't know enough about that to have an answer. I do have some contamd jars I can try it out on though.


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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: Randalf the Grey]
    #26538846 - 03/16/20 03:25 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Interesting point about toxcins carring over. I still think your eliminating the know between sterlize grains.

If you have fresh grain and proper PC but get a contamination, it's in the agar.

But the same exact process with grain that got  moldy before PC cycle will leave a doubt in your head if you have an issue with that run.


Easier to remove the unknown unknown and make fresh grains.


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Offlinejcm4620
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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: Sockadin]
    #26538858 - 03/16/20 03:32 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

why even bother???? hell u can only get a 25lb bag of the shit literally cheaper than dirt just dump the shit and make new ones🤷🏼


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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: jcm4620]
    #26538994 - 03/16/20 04:20 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

If you cook puke or shit would you want to eat it? Neither does your mycelium. Shit in = shit out


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InvisibleSpunkyMonkey88
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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26539015 - 03/16/20 04:28 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:
If you cook puke or shit would you want to eat it? Neither does your mycelium. Shit in = shit out




Like I said... definitely wasn’t a good idea but if he PCd his jars right the mold should just be dead tissue


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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: SpunkyMonkey88]
    #26539619 - 03/16/20 10:41 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

There’s just no point. Get new grain and start over. Especially if it’s WBS, Walmart’s are still open and nobody is stocking up on bird seed.


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InvisiblefahtsterM
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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: Randalf the Grey]
    #26539710 - 03/16/20 11:50 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Randalf the Grey said:
I have wondered this. the only concern I would think would be either re-occurance of contams, or more importantly toxins left in the grain from the contams that could carry over to fruits. I don't know enough about that to have an answer. I do have some contamd jars I can try it out on though.




Ppl eat mushies from the wild all the time.. there’s definitely contamination around that myc.  This has been discussed before.  When I have more time, I’ll look for rr’s response if that helps calm ppl about it.  You can definitely re pc bacterial grains if you catch them within a few days.. I’ve done it.  There’s probably more bacterial in the grain before you pc the first time than the second and we don’t worry about those toxins. Do you eat meat?  Waaaaaaay more toxins in that shiat

While it’s true that if you do get contamination in your grain jars, you should figure out how that happened, but if you know what happened and have a new cleaner option for inoculate, just re pc the grain.

In example: I used GLC from rye that came from colonized jelly jars.  Usually I used 1 jelly jar to inoculate 3-6 qts and at the same time, I knocked up a couple (at least one) new jelly jar of rye at the same time to further the culture... well, I decided I would push my luck and try to recolonize the first jelly jar so I could do another extraction and knock up 3-6 more qts instead of just using a new jelly jar (this does work, but not every time).  Well, that first jelly jar went bacterial after the first extraction...  The water was cloudyish but glc is slightly cloudy to begin with so I wasn’t sure if it had gone bad.  So I paid close attention to to the qts after I knocked them up for signs of bacteria.  There was no growth after a few days and slight condensation built up at the inoculation points.. the glc has indeed gone bad.  I had a new jelly jar that wasn’t bacterial so I took the grain from the quarts and rinsed it again and threw the grain back in simmering water for 5-10 minutes to get it back to proper hydration and simply re pc’d and reinoculated.  Vola!  Healthy qts again

To all y’all saying just trash your work and start over... rye is expensive, homies... not to mention my hourly rate of work (if you have to ask, you can’t afford me).  In that situation, I’d be an idiot not to do it.

It should only be done if it’s caught soon enough.. if you wait until your whole jar is infected with bacteria, it’s gonna smell like shit when you re pc them and your grain will be mooshy

I just posted this in another thread, but it’s relevant here too.. this cake bin had every cakes’ inoc points trich out after 5ish days (similar situation as the jelly jars from above).  I usually made my cakes on the wetter side so I simply re pc’d the cakes and knocked them back up 


No one died.

Obviously this isn’t something that is going to be needed often... that’s the piont of fixing the flaws in your sterile technique, but if something does come up where you can refurbish contaminated jars into non contaminated jars and get away with it and save some money/time why the hell not?

Faht


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InvisibleShamanBag
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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26548861 - 03/21/20 12:47 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:
If you cook puke or shit would you want to eat it? Neither does your mycelium. Shit in = shit out




Mycelium literally grows on shit and mushrooms are known to grow and feed on all kinds of disugusting decayed matter.  So there's that.


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InvisibleShamanBag
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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: jbgtaa]
    #26548876 - 03/21/20 12:56 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Well I agree that WBS is cheap. Starting over may very well be the best bet. The point would be to save time more than anything else.  I could literally pop them in the pressure cooker again and inoculate rather than prepping new jars and having to prep grain.  My plan originally was to just start brand new but I figured I'd ask if anyone has tried this successfully.


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InvisibleShamanBag
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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: fahtster]
    #26548886 - 03/21/20 01:03 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

fahtster said:
Quote:

Randalf the Grey said:

Obviously this isn’t something that is going to be needed often... that’s the piont of fixing the flaws in your sterile technique, but if something does come up where you can refurbish contaminated jars into non contaminated jars and get away with it and save some money/time why the hell not?

Faht




Thanks..my thinking is in line with yours (especially the quoted part).  Saving money and time if it's possible and been done successfully.  Every aspect of this takes time and I don't want to waste any of it doing unsuccessful work.  If everybody chimed in and said "yes absolutely it's no problem. I've done it a million times."  Then I have just saved myself time and money.  But if it's a complete roll of the dice and I would likely have bad results then I wouldn't do it.  I couldn't possibly know unless I try or have tried it before or if I ask all of the fine knowledgeable people here what their experience is.


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InvisiblefahtsterM
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Re: Can you pressure cook contaminated WBS? [Re: ShamanBag]
    #26548955 - 03/21/20 01:39 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

The key to doing it successfully is catching it within a couple/few days.. the sooner you catch it, the less dehydrated your grains will be.  If you catch it in a few days, you can definitely just loosen the lid and throw it back in the pc.. don’t shake it up before hand.. you want the dirty inoculate near or touching the glass.. that’ll ensure that it gets sterilized.  If it’s a say a week (I wouldn’t go passed that) and you think the grains look like they’re in good enough condition to do it, then you may want to rehydrate the grain before the re-pc.

I’ve talked about this lots in the past and I think I even have a comparison pic to show you.. let me see if I can find it.

Ah yes here we go.  The jar on the left has been re-pc’d after about 3-4 days when no growth was seen from the inoculation points and the jar was sweating at those spots.. also cloudy water was observed on the bottom of the jar.  I simply loosened the lid and re-pc’d for 120 minutes and knocked the jar back up with clean inoculate.  You can see the color difference from the jar on the right which is healthy from the first round in the pc.  I think these are 2-3 days after a shake.



It can and has most definitely been done and works just fine

Faht


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