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OfflineZenn
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Cold processed mushroom extraction. Edit: results.
    #26537728 - 03/16/20 12:53 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Thought I would just share my take on an extraction for 2. There may be similar or better methods already but i decided to put this one together from others like:
Lemon Tek (the acidic aspect),Stamets Blue Juice (the ice aspect), NRG Tek & Stamets MD protocol/stack (use of Niacin), alcohol extraction (use of 40% vodka).

So the idea for 2

100ml vodka (absolut Lime 40% ethanol 60% water)
400mg vitamin E (soluble powder 99% pure d-alpha tocopherol)
400mg niacin (vitamin B3. soluble powder)
2000mg ascorbic acid (vitamin c)
Citric acid (edit: guess approx 1000mg/1500mg)
60g fresh cubensis. (GT in this case)
Sodium hydroxide or sodium bicarbonate (for acidity regulator.)


Combine vitamins and citric acid with room temp or tepid vodka (aids solubility for the powders) in a blender cup. I aimed for a pH of roughly 2 to 3.
Once dissolved can put in freezer to chill. The powders may separate again a bit if left too cold to start with but dont separate as much in the fridge.
Once the vodka is good and frosty the fresh material can be added and then blitzed with the blender. Due to the vitamins C and E the fresh material doesn't turn blue so seem to avoid oxidation.
Blender cup then goes back to the freezer until at least the next day or 2. Occasionally shaken since the 40% doesn't freeze and stays liquid.
Blended liquid with frozen pulp is a sort of yellow colour. Almost like pineapple juice but not as bright. Nothing added to the "smoothie" had colour apart from the fresh material.
If left long enough the pulp will hold shape long enough to remove a frozen puck from the blender cup, which is left to thaw in a filter to collect the liquids. The pH will then be adjusted with acidity regulator  for pH closer to 6.

Progess: currently straining, so pictures or effect report are still to follow.

Thanks for looking :smile:


Edited by Zenn (03/17/20 09:13 AM)


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Offlinedk-1

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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26537754 - 03/16/20 01:36 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

what are the supplements for?


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OfflineDJ Ed
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26537760 - 03/16/20 01:41 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

You haven’t stated your weight of citric acid; given advice I’ve had from PrimalSoup, I estimate you’ll have used approx 1.5g citric acid to give a 1:40 ratio to the 60g cubensis?


--------------------
“It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.”
Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind

“The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.”
Terence McKenna



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OfflineZenn
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: DJ Ed]
    #26537773 - 03/16/20 02:08 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

dk-1 said:
what are the supplements for?




The vitamin C is ascorbic acid which has an acidity of pH almost 2. This and the citric acid act like lemon juice does in lemon tek which also has a pH level of about 2. If I remember the words correctly the acid pH is almost as high/low as stomach acid which is pH 1.5. The acidic environment is what converts the psilocybin into psilocin (Correct me if I'm wrong). Vit C is also an antioxidant just as Vitamin E is. They also work very well together to protect the against oxidation of cells. So this is why it doesn't turn blue.

The niacin/Vit B3 I believe aids the absobtion in the right pathways of the brain (again correct me if wrong. I did lots of homework from various sources) Paul Stamets has talked about the use of Niacin and it is also an active ingredient in 'NRG tek' which uses monster or rockstar.
Hope this helps :smile:


Quote:

DJ Ed said:
You haven’t stated your weight of citric acid; given advice I’ve had from PrimalSoup, I estimate you’ll have used approx 1.5g citric acid to give a 1:40 ratio to the 60g cubensis?




Is that the weight in combination with ascorbic acid? I used a combination of both to reach a pH of about 2 (going by the colour indicator pH test papers). I cant remember precisely the weight of the citric acid as my damn battery died. But had a little measuring scoop that is meant to be 0.5mg. So it was 2 or 3 little scoops so probably about 1.5g.

It will be divided into 2 small 50ml bottles once complete.


Edited by Zenn (03/16/20 02:11 AM)


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OfflineDJ Ed
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26537774 - 03/16/20 02:12 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I’m not sure as P.S. only talks about citric acid. I just use lemon juice, by eye! But it does sound like you know what you’re doing. If you do get the ratio correct, it can significantly potentiate the psilocybin and psilocin that you extract 👍🏻


--------------------
“It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.”
Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind

“The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.”
Terence McKenna



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OfflineZenn
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: DJ Ed]
    #26537782 - 03/16/20 02:20 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

DJ Ed said:
I’m not sure as P.S. only talks about citric acid. I just use lemon juice, by eye! But it does sound like you know what you’re doing. If you do get the ratio correct, it can significantly potentiate the psilocybin and psilocin that you extract ����




That's the plan. It's why I've added the acids to the liquid before adding the fresh materials.

If you just using lemon you are using citric acid and ascorbic acid hahaha :smile:

I tried fresh with fruit juices and was very pleased/surprised. Recently tried NRG tek with dried and was extremely surprised how fast and hard it hit, especially since I hadn't long eaten. I just did lots of research of peoples teks and I think I did find something similar to this but using heat instead. So I decided to try the low and slow approach with the freezer instead. On paper I think it has worked well but best proof will be the testing


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OfflineDJ Ed
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26537793 - 03/16/20 02:29 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Had lemon tea made from fresh on Friday; the come up was super fast, and the come down, very clean.

I’ve tried all sorts of differing ratios, all random and non-scientific. One extraction, a 3.8g dry B+ does felt like 15g! I also ran out of lemon juice a few months back, so soaked in orange juice - that was a different come up, quite a bit different from lemon.

So many variables here that all seem to have some kind of effect on the extraction.

When making the tea from fresh, by using the lemon juice I don’t need to add any further water, as the lemon stops the initial burning, after which the mushrooms will boil in their own water. The beauty with citric acid is you can weigh it out exactly. Gonna have to get some from a home brew shop, really cheap from those shops.......


--------------------
“It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.”
Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind

“The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.”
Terence McKenna



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OfflineZenn
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: DJ Ed]
    #26537798 - 03/16/20 02:44 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I definitely recommend using citric and/or ascorbic acid. I think orange juice has a pH of 3 or 4 so it's not quite as strong as lemon but still does the same sort of thing. ...ugh that just reminds me when I made a mistake once lol. Noob used fresh squeezed orange with fresh or dried, but a little too much. Added it to a cup of lentil soup. It maybe would have been nice if there wasnt so much orange as it cooled down the soup and it did not taste the best Haha.

Tbh I only have a very basic understanding of chemistry but I have a keenness for the practical work. Also what's partly inspired my research into extraction or other methods of ingestion is my partner cant do the tea. They have sensitive gag reflex. So far the best way he likes is capsules (poke holes in them) or stirring in powdered to a hot chocolate. He would have liked the NRG tek I think but it still has the matter of the pulp. So we shall see if this magic little shot will be a winner :laugh:


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OfflineZenn
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26537803 - 03/16/20 03:07 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Here is a picture of the mixture just out the freezer.


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OfflineDJ Ed
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26537814 - 03/16/20 03:18 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Yeah that’s quite a diffeeent colour from what I get. I’ve now got some fresh tea ice cubes, 27 x 0.75g each. Plan is to try them in a pina colada smoothie; your partner may be able to stomach that......



--------------------
“It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.”
Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind

“The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.”
Terence McKenna



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OfflineZenn
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: DJ Ed]
    #26537846 - 03/16/20 04:02 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Yeah I might try ice cubes at some point as I'd like to see the difference between this with vodka and a just ice water extraction.
Plus it's fun tinkering with this and finding other methods. Feel a little bit like Willy wonka or mad hatter haha.  I wanted to keep it to about 50ml max as can individually bottle the portions. It can then be mixed with pretty much anything someone wants to dilute it with or just taken neat on ice. I like the idea, and of ice cubes as that could be real refreshing when it's hot out :smile:

Will post pics once it's finished filtering and got it bottled.


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InvisibleSpunkyMonkey88
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn] * 1
    #26538388 - 03/16/20 11:11 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

You guys really think that all it takes to covert psilocybin into psilocin is lowering the ph of what ever it is in? That seems too simple, anything publicized about it?

I think ethanol extractions are truly amazing tho... extracting in everclear seems to completely change the experience, in a positive manner, IME...


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OfflineZenn
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: SpunkyMonkey88]
    #26538633 - 03/16/20 01:30 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Well, say you eat a bunch of fresh, they go into your stomach which is an acidic environment of about pH 1.5. So by using acids you can effectively skip that step of digestion (?)(correct me if I'm wrong, I'm pretty new to all this). Also from what I've read this method should extract by hydrolysis and dephosorylation (?)
I did find this that uses very similar methods but also uses heat and a few other things:

https://erowid.org/archive/rhodium/chemistry/psilocin.extraction.html


Also, here is a picture of the finished product :smile:



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InvisibleSpunkyMonkey88
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26538687 - 03/16/20 02:04 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Ya I don’t know... I mean the acidity is obviously a factor in digestion but I don’t know if that’s the only aspect responsible for the conversion of psilocybin tho.. that seems like a stretch but I am just speculating here..

It looks very “clean” (not much garbage in it)... it’s effective? How concentrated is it?


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OfflineZenn
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: SpunkyMonkey88]
    #26538987 - 03/16/20 04:17 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

How effective it is I'm not yet sure. So final result yet to be noted. And if I have done it right each small 50ml should hopefully be the equivalent of the 30g fresh. As for more specific numbers on concentration I'm not sure.


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InvisibleSpunkyMonkey88
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26539004 - 03/16/20 04:23 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Zenn said:
How effective it is I'm not yet sure. So final result yet to be noted. And if I have done it right each small 50ml should hopefully be the equivalent of the 30g fresh. As for more specific numbers on concentration I'm not sure.




Ohh ok so that’s about 3 dry grams per 50 mls... that’s why it’s so clear looking... I made my ethanol extract down to 1G per 1ML and it was pretty damn dark


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OfflineZenn
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: SpunkyMonkey88]
    #26540339 - 03/17/20 09:09 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Yeah :smile: I could have tried to evaporate it down. I kinda liked the idea of a little "potion" bottle, from the colour and how I feel today after testing last night, I'd call it liquid sunshine hahaha!
So the results:

My partner and I used a little fizzy mixer to have it as a drink. He hadn't eaten in some time, and I had eaten maybe an hour before so I thought it would be a good test to see the difference in onset time if any.
It seemed to take effect within half an our for both of us. Didn't seem to be much difference between onset time on a full or empty stomach.

The taste: very tangy/sour which I quite liked but I think I hadn't adjusted the acidity enough...actually I may have forgotten to haha. Oops. But very little if any taste of mushroom.

Effect: just before things started happening, I got real warm. Very warm actually but I attribute that to the flushing effect niacin can have. I also got a very mild pinking on my inner elbows/crooks? Like prickly heat, but again that is attributed to the niacin. My partner didn't feel that, so I am just a little sensitive to niacin. I may use less next time.
We have discussed how we both felt and we have agreed that it was about a level 2 to 3 at times kind of trip. Very pleasant, slightly different feel. No notable nausea. Some nice visual. And I had a brilliant sleep after. Feeling pretty damn good today.
So id say yeah the above ingredients may need a slight tweaking but that was a very successful experiment. I'd also like to see the difference between the use or dry and fresh for this, and to up the dosage a little. Perhaps will try this same method but with heat. Perhaps with a mixture of heat and cold. See what's most effective. But I'd say this could work well. Worked for me anyway Lol!


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InvisibleSpunkyMonkey88
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn] * 1
    #26540406 - 03/17/20 09:45 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Personally I would just stick to a simple ethanol extract with out the extra stuff... you can’t go wrong it’s seriously the cleanest experience you can imagine with fungus...


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OfflineZenn
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: SpunkyMonkey88]
    #26540483 - 03/17/20 10:23 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Well the vitamin C is a good thing to add at the very least since mushrooms can lower your immune system.
Technically this was an ethanol extraction, but with things added for extra benefits. It was very simple. Added shrooms to frozen vodka and blended, put it back in the freezer and filtered. I imagine the usual ethanol extraction is ground shrooms added to strong vodka or higher alcohol, heated gently or left for days, filtered, evaporated? They both seem just as simple to me :smile:


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InvisibleSpunkyMonkey88
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26540487 - 03/17/20 10:27 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Zenn said:
Well the vitamin C is a good thing to add at the very least since mushrooms can lower your immune system.
Technically this was an ethanol extraction, but with things added for extra benefits. It was very simple. Added shrooms to frozen vodka and blended, put it back in the freezer and filtered. I imagine the usual ethanol extraction is ground shrooms added to strong vodka or higher alcohol, heated gently or left for days, filtered, evaporated? They both seem just as simple to me :smile:




Ya no doubt they are both simple and both ways would work but I wouldn’t mess with adding vitamins to my extract... if you really feel u need the vitamins then take them that day a few hours before or after you trip IMHO


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OfflineZenn
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: SpunkyMonkey88]
    #26540574 - 03/17/20 11:12 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I don't see why it's a bad thing to add them when you can check the research that people have already done into the benefits of adding vitamin c or such. If anything they help give it a boost.
But you do you :smile: each to their own. I did the research first before I attempted this. Just wanted to give it a try. And will try it again aswel as many other methods no doubt.


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InvisibleSpunkyMonkey88
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26540767 - 03/17/20 01:06 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Zenn said:
I don't see why it's a bad thing to add them when you can check the research that people have already done into the benefits of adding vitamin c or such. If anything they help give it a boost.
But you do you :smile: each to their own. I did the research first before I attempted this. Just wanted to give it a try. And will try it again aswel as many other methods no doubt.




Well For one if you didn’t add any crap to it, you wouldn’t of had a flush of heat and prickly heat skin and it would taste better.... :shrug:

Not something I wanna be feeling while I’m tripping...


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OfflineZenn
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: SpunkyMonkey88]
    #26541151 - 03/17/20 04:41 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Alright lol. You can do the research yourself to find out the info, you might see why I did it.
Paul Stamets knows his stuff after all...
And I dont remember the taste being a problem. But good for you trying to make a problem where there isn't one. Just an experiment dude.


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OfflineDJ Ed
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26541164 - 03/17/20 04:46 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Zenn said:
Well the vitamin C is a good thing to add at the very least since mushrooms can lower your immune system.
Technically this was an ethanol extraction, but with things added for extra benefits. It was very simple. Added shrooms to frozen vodka and blended, put it back in the freezer and filtered. I imagine the usual ethanol extraction is ground shrooms added to strong vodka or higher alcohol, heated gently or left for days, filtered, evaporated? They both seem just as simple to me :smile:



I have to agree, I wouldn’t add the vitamins and stuff. I’ve tripped hundreds of times, and yeah next day I can feel pretty rough. That could be the wine afterwards, the dehydration, and the cannabis though. But I’ve never gotten ill. Take confidence, I have type 1 diabetes, so it would show up in me much easier than yourself. So don’t worry about the vita keeping you healthy, I reckon that’s a false goal.

Fresh is far superior to dried. That’s why (props again to PrimalSoup), from this moment on, at lest 90% of my harvests will be converted into lemon tea, nd frozen in ice cube trays. Best of all worlds, I reckon 👍🏻


--------------------
“It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.”
Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind

“The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.”
Terence McKenna



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InvisibleSpunkyMonkey88
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26541174 - 03/17/20 04:54 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Zenn said:
Alright lol. You can do the research yourself to find out the info, you might see why I did it.
Paul Stamets knows his stuff after all...
And I dont remember the taste being a problem. But good for you trying to make a problem where there isn't one. Just an experiment dude.



Not trying to offend  you bro just stating why I think it’d be better to just keep it simple...not taking a stab at you


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OfflineZenn
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: DJ Ed]
    #26541194 - 03/17/20 05:09 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

The ascorbic acid and citric acid ain't any different to using lemons though.... so say you leave out the niacin it's basically vodka and pure lemon juice.

Stopping the bluing was interesting effect of that. The fact it happened to be a vitamin and good for you (especially at the moment with Corona virus..) is just a plus.

As for the niacin I wanted to try Paul Stamets nootropic stack/the benefit the niacin has from that. The stack being:

psilocybe mushroom
Lions mane mushroom
Niacin

(I also have lions mane caps). So I definitely didn't add any "crap". If you dont want to try it you dont have to.
I was just trying a thing out. I already have the next experiment in the freezer, this time using about 7g or 8g dried and a couple small fresh. I let the vodka/powder sit in boiled water bath for like 5 mins before it went to the freezer.

To be fair I did say at the start of the post I know there will be other maybe better ways to do this. Put it this way i have aloooooooot of time on my hands and a curious mind so i often end up 'overcomplicating' things lol. Even in the kitchen hahaha.


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OfflineDJ Ed
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26541959 - 03/18/20 02:35 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Hey zenn, props to you for experimenting and sharing here.  And yes, the lemon juice has more than certainly helped my fight germs off after tripping. And :Paul Stamets, I have a lot of time for him and own a few of his (expensive) books!

I was just backing up the other dude, not saying you were wrong to experiment. Please carry on, and please keep coming back; it helps all of us 👍🏻


--------------------
“It’s like when you see a mountain lion,” he suggested. “If you run, it will chase you. So you must stand your ground.”
Michael Pollan: How To Change Your Mind

“The problem is not to find the answer, it’s to face the answer.”
Terence McKenna



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InvisibleSpunkyMonkey88
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn] * 1
    #26542075 - 03/18/20 06:22 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Zenn said:
The ascorbic acid and citric acid ain't any different to using lemons though.... so say you leave out the niacin it's basically vodka and pure lemon juice.

Stopping the bluing was interesting effect of that. The fact it happened to be a vitamin and good for you (especially at the moment with Corona virus..) is just a plus.

As for the niacin I wanted to try Paul Stamets nootropic stack/the benefit the niacin has from that. The stack being:

psilocybe mushroom
Lions mane mushroom
Niacin

(I also have lions mane caps). So I definitely didn't add any "crap". If you dont want to try it you dont have to.
I was just trying a thing out. I already have the next experiment in the freezer, this time using about 7g or 8g dried and a couple small fresh. I let the vodka/powder sit in boiled water bath for like 5 mins before it went to the freezer.

To be fair I did say at the start of the post I know there will be other maybe better ways to do this. Put it this way i have aloooooooot of time on my hands and a curious mind so i often end up 'overcomplicating' things lol. Even in the kitchen hahaha.




Like I said I was just stating why I thought it’d be better to just keep it simple without adding any vitamins/citric acid, you don’t need to get into the semantics of it... I just think ethanol extracts are an insanely “clean” trip and I personally wouldn’t wanna mess with that... I’m glad this works for you though.

And as far as Paul Stamets is concerned, there’s a lot of talk about him being a fraud... I won’t pretend to know the details but Bod is always talking about it.  Maybe someone else here could chime in with the details or where to find them...


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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: SpunkyMonkey88]
    #26542237 - 03/18/20 08:25 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

DJ Ed said:
Hey zenn, props to you for experimenting and sharing here.  And yes, the lemon juice has more than certainly helped my fight germs off after tripping. And :Paul Stamets, I have a lot of time for him and own a few of his (expensive) books!

I was just backing up the other dude, not saying you were wrong to experiment. Please carry on, and please keep coming back; it helps all of us 👍🏻




Thanks :smile: the main reason for sharing was the fact it was done in the freezer instead of with heat. The fact I added things I guess is just additional info.

Quote:

SpunkyMonkey88 said:
Quote:

Zenn said:
The ascorbic acid and citric acid ain't any different to using lemons though.... so say you leave out the niacin it's basically vodka and pure lemon juice.

Stopping the bluing was interesting effect of that. The fact it happened to be a vitamin and good for you (especially at the moment with Corona virus..) is just a plus.

As for the niacin I wanted to try Paul Stamets nootropic stack/the benefit the niacin has from that. The stack being:

psilocybe mushroom
Lions mane mushroom
Niacin

(I also have lions mane caps). So I definitely didn't add any "crap". If you dont want to try it you dont have to.
I was just trying a thing out. I already have the next experiment in the freezer, this time using about 7g or 8g dried and a couple small fresh. I let the vodka/powder sit in boiled water bath for like 5 mins before it went to the freezer.

To be fair I did say at the start of the post I know there will be other maybe better ways to do this. Put it this way i have aloooooooot of time on my hands and a curious mind so i often end up 'overcomplicating' things lol. Even in the kitchen hahaha.




Like I said I was just stating why I thought it’d be better to just keep it simple without adding any vitamins/citric acid, you don’t need to get into the semantics of it... I just think ethanol extracts are an insanely “clean” trip and I personally wouldn’t wanna mess with that... I’m glad this works for you though.

And as far as Paul Stamets is concerned, there’s a lot of talk about him being a fraud... I won’t pretend to know the details but Bod is always talking about it.  Maybe someone else here could chime in with the details or where to find them...




That's fair. Stamets and additives aside like I say above was mainly about the cold processing factor. So I may well try a normal ethanol extraction without the extras but in the freezer. When i can i want to experiment with many different ways of extraction and preservation.


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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26542380 - 03/18/20 09:57 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Zenn said:


That's fair. Stamets and additives aside like I say above was mainly about the cold processing factor. So I may well try a normal ethanol extraction without the extras but in the freezer. When i can i want to experiment with many different ways of extraction and preservation.




For sure you very well might be on to something with the cold extract... I’ve never heard of anyone doing it that way and the thought is intriguing! I wonder if doing it in that manner with everclear would help to make a cleaner tincture... like I wonder if letting them sit in the freezer with everclear for a week or two or three would still extract the same amount of actives but possibly avoid more of the other crap like sugars, starches and everything else...  Then  After it is filtered it could be reduced...

It’d be interesting to see two tinctures of equal concentration  side by side. One that was cold filtered and one that was steeped in a double boiler and see if there’s any noticeable improvement in clarity with the cold one... wish I had more fungus, I would totally wanna try this


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OfflineDJ Ed
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: SpunkyMonkey88]
    #26542386 - 03/18/20 10:01 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Just putting it out there, but “cold-filtered” beer is generally more expensive, and is used as a selling point 👍🏻


--------------------
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: DJ Ed]
    #26542555 - 03/18/20 11:47 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

SpunkyMonkey88 said:
Quote:

Zenn said:


That's fair. Stamets and additives aside like I say above was mainly about the cold processing factor. So I may well try a normal ethanol extraction without the extras but in the freezer. When i can i want to experiment with many different ways of extraction and preservation.




For sure you very well might be on to something with the cold extract... I’ve never heard of anyone doing it that way and the thought is intriguing! I wonder if doing it in that manner with everclear would help to make a cleaner tincture... like I wonder if letting them sit in the freezer with everclear for a week or two or three would still extract the same amount of actives but possibly avoid more of the other crap like sugars, starches and everything else...  Then  After it is filtered it could be reduced...

It’d be interesting to see two tinctures of equal concentration  side by side. One that was cold filtered and one that was steeped in a double boiler and see if there’s any noticeable improvement in clarity with the cold one... wish I had more fungus, I would totally wanna try this




Yeah it would be! I think the higher % alcohol used the longer that it should be left. My reasoning is because the actives are more soluble in water, but using something at least 40% doesn't freeze. The higher % may require longer to extract since it has less water (but I'm just spit balling).
Also when freezing fresh shrooms it ruptures the cell walls, and when defrosted they turn to mush. So by dropping them directly into freezing alcohol for at least 24 hours then left to defrost they will turn to mush but held in the alcohol as it does so. Could shake this and return it to the freezer once mixed. Eventually filter the matter from it and evaporate as per personal preference. In a study it was shown that freeze dried shrooms emitted a higher concentration in extract than that of dried and extracted shrooms.

As for with dry I'd maybe let the powder soak for a little bit to rehydrate before going into the freezer for however long? I've really enjoyed thinking about this

Quote:

DJ Ed said:
Just putting it out there, but “cold-filtered” beer is generally more expensive, and is used as a selling point 👍🏻





Totally. Same for cold brewed coffees and stuff too. Cold processing just takes longer but with the likes of coffee, it has a smoother taste and a stronger kick compared to heat processed coffee


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InvisiblecoAsTal
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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26542634 - 03/18/20 12:49 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

This is SpunkyMonkey88's thread that I am referencing for my intended use of an Everclear extraction this summer--
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26523717#26523717

Zenn, I wonder if it could be as simple as adding your selected supplements in capsule form on ingestion?

I'm sold on the linked ethanol extraction because 1) it's proven 100% effective and 2) It can be evaporated into a permanently liquid concentrate that will last indefinitely in the freezer and can be accurately dosed by a dropper.

I don't have the luxury of taking up all the space required for ice cubes-- nor would I ever trip often enough to warrant taking up that space for that long-- so if I can condense ounces of shrooms into  millilitres of liquid, preserving the active alks, it seems the best way to go for me.
But there's nothing stopping one from experimenting with alternate ways to get the magic out of the fungus

:cheers:


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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: coAsTal] * 1
    #26542647 - 03/18/20 12:59 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

coAsTal said:
This is SpunkyMonkey88's thread that I am referencing for my intended use of an Everclear extraction this summer--
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26523717#26523717

Zenn, I wonder if it could be as simple as adding your selected supplements in capsule form on ingestion?

I'm sold on the linked ethanol extraction because 1) it's proven 100% effective and 2) It can be evaporated into a permanently liquid concentrate that will last indefinitely in the freezer and can be accurately dosed by a dropper.

I don't have the luxury of taking up all the space required for ice cubes-- nor would I ever trip often enough to warrant taking up that space for that long-- so if I can condense ounces of shrooms into  millilitres of liquid, preserving the active alks, it seems the best way to go for me.
But there's nothing stopping one from experimenting with alternate ways to get the magic out of the fungus

:cheers:




I did consider the idea of a "eat me" capsule and a "drink me" bottle lol. And to be fair is what I was originally thinking. Same process as what I did with vodka and citric etc and just have the powdered other in cap. But I then wondered if it was possible to add all of them together and this was the result haha.

I am a huge fan of everclear extraction, as with RSO cannabis oil I've tinkered with before, and will likely try to do one eventually with mushroom. To be honest the 40% vodka was partly because of the water content but also that it was more affordable than the likes of everclear right now :P


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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: coAsTal] * 1
    #26543142 - 03/18/20 05:42 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

coAsTal said:
This is SpunkyMonkey88's thread that I am referencing for my intended use of an Everclear extraction this summer--
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26523717#26523717

Zenn, I wonder if it could be as simple as adding your selected supplements in capsule form on ingestion?

I'm sold on the linked ethanol extraction because 1) it's proven 100% effective and 2) It can be evaporated into a permanently liquid concentrate that will last indefinitely in the freezer and can be accurately dosed by a dropper.

I don't have the luxury of taking up all the space required for ice cubes-- nor would I ever trip often enough to warrant taking up that space for that long-- so if I can condense ounces of shrooms into  millilitres of liquid, preserving the active alks, it seems the best way to go for me.
But there's nothing stopping one from experimenting with alternate ways to get the magic out of the fungus

:cheers:



You list the same reasons as I had for trying a ethanol extract... I was hesitant at first so I just tried a 10 gram dose with the extract and after trying it I was completely sold... I went to the mart and got 2 more liters of everclear and made a tincture with the rest of them...

I have no regrets either because the shit is SO smooth! I love it! It is pretty damn dark tho...

In regards to what Zenn was saying about the water content... I’ve got this theory about that. I figure since the actives are very soluble in water but barely ethanol, I figure using high ABV alcohol like everclear would be just soluble enough to extract the actives but since there’s only 5% water it would help to avoid other water soluble “garbage “

I don’t know if there’s any validity to that hypothesis but all I can say is that an alcohol tincture feels WAY different from a water extract (tea)...


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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26543156 - 03/18/20 05:47 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Zenn said:
Quote:

coAsTal said:
This is SpunkyMonkey88's thread that I am referencing for my intended use of an Everclear extraction this summer--
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26523717#26523717

Zenn, I wonder if it could be as simple as adding your selected supplements in capsule form on ingestion?

I'm sold on the linked ethanol extraction because 1) it's proven 100% effective and 2) It can be evaporated into a permanently liquid concentrate that will last indefinitely in the freezer and can be accurately dosed by a dropper.

I don't have the luxury of taking up all the space required for ice cubes-- nor would I ever trip often enough to warrant taking up that space for that long-- so if I can condense ounces of shrooms into  millilitres of liquid, preserving the active alks, it seems the best way to go for me.
But there's nothing stopping one from experimenting with alternate ways to get the magic out of the fungus

:cheers:




I did consider the idea of a "eat me" capsule and a "drink me" bottle lol. And to be fair is what I was originally thinking. Same process as what I did with vodka and citric etc and just have the powdered other in cap. But I then wondered if it was possible to add all of them together and this was the result haha.

I am a huge fan of everclear extraction, as with RSO cannabis oil I've tinkered with before, and will likely try to do one eventually with mushroom. To be honest the 40% vodka was partly because of the water content but also that it was more affordable than the likes of everclear right now :P




If cost was your only motivation for using vodka you could just buy a bottle of everclear and dilute it with a liter of water unless vodka is less than half the price of everclear...

I just figure that if im gonna do an alcohol extract I want as little water in it as possible (to be effective) while doing the extract otherwise your basically just making tea with some alcohol added to it... like your still extracting a lot of the same stuff as you would by just boiling fungus in water...


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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: SpunkyMonkey88]
    #26543711 - 03/18/20 11:37 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Yeah I get what you're saying about the everclear. I have to get that online or that spyrytus? Polish vodka that is about the same strength as everclear. Before I settled on 40% I was trying to think of what different % could work the best. Then the fact that actives are more water soluble I decided to go for a lower %. Ideally I'd have liked maybe 60 to 80% and had thought about getting 95% to dilute. Which I think I will be doing. I've caught an experimental bug hahaha.
Well funny you should say about the lower content being like tea with alcohol in it. In my research I found a reddit post that was someone doing blue juice, just the ice in a jar. Someone replied to that with what they said was a more full extraction and I guess this was one of the main ideas behind what I wanted to try:

https://amp.reddit.com/r/shrooms/comments/b3q8s0/paul_stamets_cold_water_extraction/

The top comment on that post is what took my interest away from blue juice a bit. (If it's ok to share links for reddit)


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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: Zenn]
    #26544030 - 03/19/20 07:15 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

By Law of Nature, anything said on Reddit is < anything said on the Shroomery


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Re: Cold processed mushroom extraction. [Re: coAsTal]
    #26544059 - 03/19/20 07:35 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Perhaps it is. But it made me curious about other such methods which I tried to research and did find bits from various sources including here. One in particular was on here I think it was a chemistry student asking a question. Or an equation.... (goes to find it...)

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/10352763

There were others from here too
I cant rightly remember all the sources I found with similar info to some of the links I've shared, but all of it is very interesting reading.

I know that acid/base type extractions are used quite a lot for other things too. And essentially  ascorbic/citric acid and bicarbonate of soda or other could be used for this even if not commonly used (I'm still fairly new to the world of extractions so forgive me if I lack more chemical knowledge).


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