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OfflineNorthernerM
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What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? * 3
    #26530259 - 03/12/20 04:20 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

In was checking in on Portugal today in the news seeing how decriminalization is going for them, swimmingly as one might expect. Then I saw the 2019 stats for US drug overdose deaths. It's literally more than half a million people dead in a single year! What the hell? This is an insane amount of healthy people to be getting knocked out.

What's going on my US cousins? How has this come to be?


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The nearest we ever come to knowing truth is when we are witness to paradox.


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OfflinetheRealrollforever
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: Northerner] * 3
    #26530261 - 03/12/20 04:26 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

It’s gnarley my dude.  Fentanyl left and center even people who want heroin are forced to use even more unsafe alternatives from shady sources.  People will continue to use drugs.  This war is literally just so the DEA and cops can have pensions and health care


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sunshine said:
The order has to be secret and no one is sure.


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: Northerner] * 8
    #26530274 - 03/12/20 04:52 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

My understanding is that the number of opioid addicts initially came to be so big because of doctors overprescribing, and then when that started to be cracked down on more the illegal market filled the void with fentanyl derivatives that ultimately came from China. And also the Chinese government probably wants revenge on the West for the Opium Wars. "The Pharmacist" on Netflix is a pretty good documentary on the "pill mill" phenomenon and how flagrant some doctors' prescribing was. At least the later parts of the show.


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OfflineLoaded Shaman
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: psi]
    #26530278 - 03/12/20 04:55 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

:whathesaid:


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"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one’s ignorance." — Confucius


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InvisibleDark_Star
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: psi] * 4
    #26530305 - 03/12/20 05:21 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Pretty much, although first people switched to heroin when they started cracking down. The fentanyl analogues came later.


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OfflineHeph333
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: Dark_Star] * 4
    #26530331 - 03/12/20 06:06 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

The food supply in the US is utter rubbish. The Standard American Diet is a perfect storm recipe for chronic inflammation. The 10 most prevalent diseases all have inflammation at their root. Consequently, as people age, chronic pain sets in. Our medical system has their heads buried in the sand & only do one thing for it all: drugs. They treat symptoms rather than causes. And often the "cure" is more destructive (long term) than the disease. But we're all about instant gratification, so it works for a while.


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InvisiblefeeversM
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: Heph333] * 4
    #26530376 - 03/12/20 07:11 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I had to do a pretty large-scale research project on this a few years back.

The conclusion was that prescriptions played a very small role in the current epidemic. In the time where overdoses rose 400%, the rate of prescriptions rose only 6% or so.

Basically there's always been an "epidemic", but now that the product is exponentially more potent (due to fentanyl) there are far more overdoses, which can't be hidden like addiction can. The one factor that changed significantly throughout the period was the amount of autopsies detecting fentanyl, which rose steadily.

Pharmaceutical companies are corrupt as hell, but ultimately there's a certain type of person who really wants to self medicate or likes the feeling of getting high and will always chase a better one, regardless of what drug they start on. Many of the stories of the high school football star who hurt his leg then got addicted to his meds then turned to heroin leave out the fact that the same kid loved smoking and drinking and dipping and robotripping and doing coke and/ or whatever else was around long before their injury.

We're a sick society, can't blame it all on the docs and pharma


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: feevers] * 2
    #26530537 - 03/12/20 09:10 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

feevers said:
The conclusion was that prescriptions played a very small role in the current epidemic. In the time where overdoses rose 400%, the rate of prescriptions rose only 6% or so.





OK but does that really refute the theory that many addicts were created when overprescribing was most rampant, and that many later turned to the illicit market (and deadlier drugs) when things started to be tightened up? Because if that was the case, you would not expect a large increase in prescriptions at the same time as the large increase in fentanyl derivative overdoses. If anything you would expect a relatively small increase or even a decrease.



What I see from this graph is a steady rise in prescription ODs over the the 00s while heroin and "other" remain minor contributors to OD deaths, then by about 2010 prescription ODs are flattening off and subsequently even decrease a bit while heroin ODs begin to climb, then in 2013 "other" takes off and by 2016 has overtaken the other two categories.


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OfflineLogicaL ChaosM
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: Northerner] * 2
    #26530539 - 03/12/20 09:11 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Its a drug conspiracy i tell ya!

Drug companies over prescribing potent opiates and downplaying the OD potentials of them. Its really fucked up! I blame u Big Pharma!

:baseballfuck:


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OfflineDilsnique
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: LogicaL Chaos] * 2
    #26530548 - 03/12/20 09:25 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Big Pharma in bed with Big Brother, and we are most valuable to Big Brother when we are sick and/or imprisoned.


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Invisiblecannabinated
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Registered: 01/03/13
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: Dilsnique]
    #26530581 - 03/12/20 09:46 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

its literally china doing opium warfare


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Invisiblecannabinated
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: cannabinated] * 1
    #26530582 - 03/12/20 09:47 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

legalization is the only path


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Invisibletyrannicalrex
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: Dilsnique] * 2
    #26530598 - 03/12/20 09:52 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I'm in pain management as a nurse. I am seeing some things 1st hand. Also the president declaring and "opiod crisis" didn't help either. They are also making people get only a certain amount of opiods in a certain amount of days. This is helping people cut down actually that need to. At the same time  it's fucking over patients who need the meds to simply function. They will never get better, they will never stop taking these meds. They never go over, and are always compliant. It's basically the rich people don't want to pay for the poor peoples meds, as usual. Plus all those RC's, and the fact the dark net has provided basement dealers with the machines to make slick pharma grade appearing meds, blister packs even!:eek:


Quote:

Dilsnique said:
Big Pharma in bed with Big Brother, and we are most valuable to Big Brother when we are sick and/or imprisoned.



I also agree with this.


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InvisiblefeeversM
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: psi] * 3
    #26530696 - 03/12/20 10:31 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

psi said:
Quote:

feevers said:
The conclusion was that prescriptions played a very small role in the current epidemic. In the time where overdoses rose 400%, the rate of prescriptions rose only 6% or so.





OK but does that really refute the theory that many addicts were created when overprescribing was most rampant, and that many later turned to the illicit market (and deadlier drugs) when things started to be tightened up? Because if that was the case, you would not expect a large increase in prescriptions at the same time as the large increase in fentanyl derivative overdoses. If anything you would expect a relatively small increase or even a decrease.



What I see from this graph is a steady rise in prescription ODs over the the 00s while heroin and "other" remain minor contributors to OD deaths, then by about 2010 prescription ODs are flattening off and subsequently even decrease a bit while heroin ODs begin to climb, then in 2013 "other" takes off and by 2016 has overtaken the other two categories.




Many people overdosing on prescription meds don't have a prescription. Many that did have prescriptions sought them out back when pill mills and candyman docs were rampant. Pills were easier to get than dope and could even be ordered from china by the case, theyre also societally a little less stigmatized, and sometimes even fully covered by insurance.

From the data IMO it really is the drug seeking behavior and the society/culture that created it, far more than the dealers or pharma companies


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OfflineDilsnique
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: feevers] * 1
    #26530706 - 03/12/20 10:34 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

feevers said:
From the data IMO it really is the drug seeking behavior and the society/culture that created it, far more than the dealers or pharma companies




I agree with this too.  People today need something to cope with or escape the turmoils and tensions of modern society.


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Invisiblecannabinated
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: feevers] * 2
    #26530713 - 03/12/20 10:36 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I dont think you can blame the users tho.

its the fake fent. kids are dropping like flies off of fake pills from china.

really wouldnt be happening with the sacklers in business


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OfflinetheRealrollforever
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: cannabinated]
    #26530731 - 03/12/20 10:43 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Fentanyl derivatives SUCK anyway


--------------------


sunshine said:
The order has to be secret and no one is sure.


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OfflineC12ShroomMan
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: psi] * 1
    #26530766 - 03/12/20 11:00 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

psi said:
My understanding is that the number of opioid addicts initially came to be so big because of doctors overprescribing, and then when that started to be cracked down on more the illegal market filled the void with fentanyl derivatives that ultimately came from China. And also the Chinese government probably wants revenge on the West for the Opium Wars. "The Pharmacist" on Netflix is a pretty good documentary on the "pill mill" phenomenon and how flagrant some doctors' prescribing was. At least the later parts of the show.




Now the people who need pain pills have a hard time getting them while all the abusing overdoses don't seem to have a problem. US best healthcare system. The only difference between dr and drug dealer is you have to pay 100+ just for the privilege to wait and see a doctor every month on top of the drug costs :smile:))


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Invisiblecannabinated
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: C12ShroomMan]
    #26530788 - 03/12/20 11:18 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Its probably an attempt to kill the underground drug economy and force ppl to buy weed and pills from the ruling class :mad2:


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: What the hell is going on in the US with opioids? [Re: feevers]
    #26530843 - 03/12/20 11:44 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

feevers said:
Many people overdosing on prescription meds don't have a prescription. Many that did have prescriptions sought them out back when pill mills and candyman docs were rampant. Pills were easier to get than dope and could even be ordered from china by the case, theyre also societally a little less stigmatized, and sometimes even fully covered by insurance.

From the data IMO it really is the drug seeking behavior and the society/culture that created it, far more than the dealers or pharma companies




OK but why did prescription overdose deaths rise so much from 2000 to 2010? A change drug seeking behavior or the society/culture independent of any increase in the supply or marketing of these drugs?


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