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OfflinePTreeDish
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Do you go to therapy?
    #26512618 - 03/02/20 10:53 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I work in the field of mental health and am curious to hear from this community what their experiences are, if any, from seeing a professional therapist.

Have you or do you go to a therapist? What philosophy (trauma, ERD, CBT, etc) does your therapist employ? How did you find your therapist? What does it cost you?

I should say that I am a huge advocate of folks seeing a mental health professional, but the field is still rife with issues that end up hurting a lot of people. Some of what I do for a living is involved in helping folks find the right kind of help to avoid these kinds of issues. Would be great to hear your thoughts.


Edited by PTreeDish (03/03/20 01:53 PM)


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: PTreeDish] * 1
    #26512833 - 03/02/20 01:01 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

rife with issues;
daughter is therapist
have seen couples counsellor years ago
we did talk therapy and home exercises such as looking in eachothers' eyes.


--------------------
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OfflinePTreeDish
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: redgreenvines] * 1
    #26513356 - 03/02/20 06:14 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Thanks for sharing your experiences. I'm sorry you've had so many issues - def. isn't uncommon. I hope you and your family are in a better place overall now.  :hug:


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InvisibleEternalCowabunga
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: PTreeDish] * 1
    #26513410 - 03/02/20 06:40 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I've been in talk therapy for 3 years now.
It's impossible to do without allowing yourself to be vulnerable in front of someone. That was the hardest part but it was also very simple. Nobody knows why talk therapy works but somehow it does.. not everyone needs it. I needed it because I've been traumatized over and over again and I've struggled greatly with guilt/shame and other complexes. Even after 3 years, there are still things to re-explore and maybe frame in a different way or just come to terms with what happened.

Being vulnerable with a therapist has helped me be vulnerable with other people. Not everyone, mind you, but people who are close to me. I used to just shut down, dissociate and turn to drugs and booze. I've realized, if I can talk about it, and share it, I don't have to carry the burden myself.

But for sure shop around if you don't trust or like your therapist. If you don't feel like you're being really listened to and listened to non-judgmentally then find a better one. It's expensive too... I was lucky to find someone who didn't cost much ($50 a session). Usually in my city a therapist will cost anywhere from 100 to 175 a session.


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OfflinePTreeDish
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: EternalCowabunga] * 2
    #26513500 - 03/02/20 07:38 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Thank you for being vulnerable here to us internet strangers and sharing a part of your own deeply personal journey.

There is a lot of evidence as to why talk therapy works and this is central to my field of study: Interpersonal Neurobiology. We look at the biological basis for how the brain heals itself and how we can take all of the science from physics, philosophy, chemistry, etc and apply them towards a unified model of understanding the brain. Our interpersonal relationships (connections/experiences with others) are foundational to creating our subjective sense of well-being.

A healthy attachment with another, often a trained therapist, is powerful tool for personal growth and development - especially for those of us who didn't have parents to model healthy relationships and establish healthy emotional regulatory controls in our early brains. I could talk about why and how way more than folks are probably interested.

Anyway, I'm glad to hear you are taking care of yourself and cultivating some positive relationships in your life! You are most certainly not alone on your journey my friend.


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OfflineMr. D Green
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26513528 - 03/02/20 07:59 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

The best therapist is thy self, the biggest issue with therapy these days is the therapist...no one knows you better then you; no one can better I then I..


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OfflinePTreeDish
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: Mr. D Green]
    #26513534 - 03/02/20 08:02 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

A therapists goal shouldn't be to tell you more about yourself. Rather, a good therapist will serve, among other things, as an objective guide that helps you reveal more about yourself that wouldn't be possible from your subjective internal world.


Edited by PTreeDish (03/02/20 08:03 PM)


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OfflineMr. D Green
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26513557 - 03/02/20 08:25 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

PTreeDish said:
A therapists goal shouldn't be to tell you more about yourself. Rather, a good therapist will serve, among other things, as an objective guide that helps you reveal more about yourself that wouldn't be possible from your subjective internal world.




For starters, your subconscious is the guide that helps you reveal more about yourself...one example..dreams..

Lastly; your subjective internal world?? You act as if it is impossible to view different perspectives other then your own..
I mean sure, there are people out there that walk around with their heads shoved up their own ass, but even them; eventually figure things out..the hard way. Which is what they deserve..


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InvisibleDividedQuantumM
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: Mr. D Green] * 1
    #26513558 - 03/02/20 08:25 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Mr. D Green said:
The best therapist is thy self, the biggest issue with therapy these days is the therapist...no one knows you better then you; no one can better I then I..





No one is worse at analyzing oneself than oneself.


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Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici


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OfflineMr. D Green
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #26513595 - 03/02/20 08:52 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Does the word incompetent mean anything to you? You watch the tv and the tv says you can do many things..things like ride a bike or even become a computer programmer...but tv no say you can help your self..tv say you must go to place and have another human tell you what is good and bad for you, let alone how to do basic actions; such as thinking for yourself...


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OfflinePTreeDish
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: Mr. D Green]
    #26513613 - 03/02/20 09:02 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I don't think therapy is the solution for everyone or an escape from thinking for yourself. If anything, better understanding yourself helps you think more clearly.

But the way you talk about it, I'm wondering if you don't just distrust other people in general with your feelings? If that's how you feel, I wonder what your life experiences must have been to create these feelings. I have nothing but empathy and kindness for you because if what I just said rings true, I can only imagine how difficult life must have been for you and how alone you must have been the whole time.


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26513691 - 03/02/20 10:19 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

PTreeDish said:
I work in the field of mental health and ...

I should say that I am a huge advocate of folks seeing a mental health professional, but the field is still ripe with issues that end up hurting a lot of people. Some of what I do for a living is involved in helping folks find the right kind of help to avoid these kinds of issues. Would be great to hear your thoughts.




Have your heard of "Childhood Emotional Neglect" and do you have an opinion on this diagnosis and treatment?

info is here:  https://drjonicewebb.com/?awt_a=B68A&awt_l=6tMb4&awt_m=3dlkfaOQUnG838A

.  And yes, long ago, in the past, I have worked with therapies using the connected breath.


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OfflinePTreeDish
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: laughingdog]
    #26513772 - 03/02/20 11:23 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I don't have any direct experience with this Dr or her approach, but I can offer an opinion for whatever that's worth based on what I'm seeing from the website.

It's certainly a much different paradigm than what is taught in my field of research, Interpersonal Neurobiology (IPNB). This Dr. has done an excellent job of creating a marketable label for a spectrum of trauma-related behaviors and has done a fine job at monetizing its solution - even recruiting other therapists to the cause.

Maybe her program works, maybe it doesn't. It's not the perspective or approach IPNB-informed therapy takes; though, there is certainly some overlap in the subject matter. Then again, IPNB is a peer-reviewed scientific framework for understanding how the brain works and it doesn't prescribe nice packaged solutions to sell to the client. It recognizes that trauma is always formed in the context of a relationship(s) and so is the process of healing (since we cannot heal trauma in isolation).

I'm skeptical of therapists who's websites, in my subjective opinion, are more focused on selling products/services than actually connecting with and helping those in need. But I am definitely biased and I am not a doctor.


Edited by PTreeDish (03/02/20 11:43 PM)


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: PTreeDish] * 1
    #26513796 - 03/02/20 11:50 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

PTreeDish said:
....

It's certainly a much different paradigm than what is taught in my field of research, Interpersonal Neurobiology (IPNB). ..... IPNB-informed therapy takes; though, there is certainly some overlap in the subject matter. Then again, IPNB is a peer-reviewed scientific framework for understanding how the brain works ....

I'm skeptical of therapists who's websites, in my subjective opinion, are more focused on selling products/services than actually connecting with and helping those in need. But I am definitely biased and I am not a doctor.




"I'm skeptical of therapists who's websites, in my subjective opinion, are more focused on selling products/services than actually connecting ..." my thoughts too - thats why I asked.
Certainly describes, something many can relate to, though.

As regards :  "IPNB-informed therapy" perhaps you would tell me something about it, or suggest a decent internet link. "peer-reviewed scientific" sounds interesting.


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OfflinePTreeDish
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: laughingdog] * 1
    #26513818 - 03/03/20 12:25 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I thought about maybe making a separate post introducing folks to IPNB, but I want to proceed cautiously so as not to become the very thing I find to be dangerous or ill-advised.

IPNB is indeed a theory and model for understanding the mind, brain and relationships created by three folks, including Dr. Dan Siegel - a clinical professor of psychiatry at the UCLA School of Medicine and executive director of the Mindsight Institute.

It has many applications in understanding and treating mental health issues. Because it provides a framework for understanding the underlying mechanisms behind emotional resilience, healing and the role of relationships in the brain, it's application are wide-spread, extending to classrooms, the workplace (my specialty) and beyond.

If we know what a healthy subjectively happy brain looks like physiologically and we know what psychological processes can be employed to move the brain towards those physical states, then that means we can change ourselves and that's not just powerful, it's hopeful. Much of what IPNB teaches, we sort of all feel is obvious and what we all kind of already intrinsically know - the framework just does a good job at providing a language for talking about these ideas and then backing them up with real science. As a skeptic, I am reassured by the fact that IPNB self-admits it is limited and prone to change as our understanding of the mind, brain, consciousness and all other related science continue to evolve.

There is a book series called Norton Series on Interpersonal Neurobiology. In this series, I recommend the book "Being a brain-wise therapist: A Practical Guide to Interpersonal Neurobiology" for those who have a stronger than average intellectual curiosity in the subject matter.

It's quite approachable and takes you first though the parts of the brain, what they do, what we know, what we don't. It then moves into what we know about well-being and the differences in brains between healthy/not-healthy brains and then what we can do to change.

There's even a study that suggests the mere act of thinking about how the brain works can improve those who suffer greatly in their internal world. The theory is that many folks who have mental health issues often feel "broken" or "beyond repair" but when they learn about the science of the brain, how it "breaks" and what biological processes are involved in recovery, it can create new hope and open a new connection towards their own healing journey.

I'll try and find the study and link to it when I get a chance.

I just want to reiterate though that true emotional healing and well-being doesn't come from intellectual pursuits alone. No amount of learning or reading up on a topic will heal your wounds; for that, you need to have a healthy attachment and an unfolding set of experiences with a trusted and empathetic other.


Edited by PTreeDish (03/03/20 02:00 AM)


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Offlinethealienthatategod
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26513862 - 03/03/20 01:37 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

thanks for the info.

what do you think of alternative therapies like color therapy, movement-focused therapy, vision therapy?

what does the IPNB model say about these things?

as a child diagnosed as OCD and having selective mutism, i never responded well to traditional therapies. it was easier for me to notice how my brain felt different, and i responded, as someone put different colored scarves over me - than to be verbal.

what are some physiological characteristics of a healthy subjectively happy brain?


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26513978 - 03/03/20 05:19 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

does IPNB need to differentiate itself from other psychotherapy?
I have enjoyed the basic symbols and concrete approaches in Gestalt therapy since reading of Fritz Perls in the 60's.

it goes well with buddhism: contact, feelings, mind-forms
and with stream of consciousness,


--------------------
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OfflinePTreeDish
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26514582 - 03/03/20 01:07 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

IPNB isn't a form of psychotherapy itself. Rather, it's a framework for understanding and informing the underlying mechanisms for how the brain/mind works, its development, how it repairs itself, how experiences in our relationships shape the brain and describing the biological basis for subjective well-being.

In your case, you might accompany your current knowledge with IPNB and it might offer a perspective as to why and/or how various therapeutic approaches work or don't.


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OfflinePTreeDish
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: thealienthatategod]
    #26514625 - 03/03/20 01:39 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I don't have a lot of personal experiences with those forms of therapy and IPNB isn't designed to tell people which therapies work or don't. It seeks to educate people about the science of well-being and brain function so that folks can find the right therapy that best suits their needs and is supported by what we know about how trauma is formed and healed.

Quote:

as a child diagnosed as OCD and having selective mutism, i never responded well to traditional therapies. it was easier for me to notice how my brain felt different, and i responded, as someone put different colored scarves over me - than to be verbal.




Whew! What a burden to live with for so long. I hope you've been able to find a way to manage and haven't given up on improving how you feel. I feel for you and am with you in spirit on your healing journey.

IPNB asserts that many conditions like anxiety, OCD, etc are symptoms of a disintegrated brain in which certain portions of the brain are overactive and disconnected from other parts of the self.

One study demonstrated this using fMRI which shows concentrations of blood flow in the brain. For the group that self-reported a high degree of subjective well-being, their fMRI scans showed a more even distribution of blood flow throughout the entire brain.

When the same fMRI was administered to folks who were battling with some form of mental illness, such as anxiety, depression, etc. - the fMRI showed a statistically significant concentration of blood flow in one area of the brain - most often, it was the prefrontal cortex which we know is largely responsible for anticipating what might happen in the future.

The science seems to suggest that the brain favors a high degree of complex interconnectedness with itself (via neural networks) and that trauma and/or experiences, in lock step with genetics, appear to disintegrate these connections. The principle symptom of a disintegrated brain is rigidity, chaos or some combination of the two within a persons internal world and/or thought processes.

Folks who report a high degree of subjective well-being appear to be more interconnected with all of the facets of themselves and have developed the ability to more easily flow between those parts. When I say parts, I mean that we all have facets to ourselves (our artistic/creative self vs. our work self. vs. our caretaker self. vs our musician self. vs. our engineer self. vs our intellectual self. etc). And these parts of your self live in different physical locations within the neurological system.

Folks who have a high degree of subjective well-being also correlate with a high degree of emotional resilience, able to be with a variety of people in a variety of situations without being so emotionally triggered that they shut down and revert back to their internal world.

What I like about this framework is that it doesn't aim to define what happiness or well-being means for anyone beyond what biological commonalities are observed. We all know that happiness is a subjective feeling and what might be good for one person isn't necessarily what makes another person happy.

IPNB uses peer-reviewed academic studies to develop a model of the brain which suggest:
* The brain favors a high degree of interconnectedness with itself, desiring many complex neural connections to as many possible pathways.
* Well-being is highly correlated with the ability to more evenly distribute energy and blood flow throughout the brain and that issues affecting well-being arise when one or more parts of the brain become overactive and/or disconnected from other parts of the self. (as evident via fMRI scans of the brain)
* Mindfulness is an excellent tool for training the brain to increase interconnectedness within the self
* The brain is wired for interpersonal connections (duh - we all know we're social creatures) but there are physical characteristics in the brain, such as mirror neurons, which facilitate healing and growth and connectedness through empathetic and trusted relationships with another.

With this framework in mind, suddenly it makes sense why so many people turn to drugs because the chemicals can sort of calm down the overactive disintegrated parts of the brain that cause folks to suffer so much.

Where therapy comes into play is that by forming a trusting and empathetic relationship with the therapist, you can begin to explore, identify and connect with the experiences you had that might have first caused your mental health issues. By invoking those early neural pathways, you can begin to create new connections and associations with those early networks that are causing your issues. The deeper and more trusting your connection is with the therapist, the more profound the associations of empathy, healing, love and kindness are created alongside the old trauma. This is also exactly why I tell people that therapy is a process and you can't time-box it because it requires you develop a real attachment to one another (yes, the therapist also must be healthily attached to the patient for this to work) and that's not something you can control - just like you can't force someone you are dating to fall in love with you. It happens when it happens.

For many folks, it takes years to develop enough trust in their therapist that their psyche finally allows them to access formally very hidden and painful feelings that have shaped their brains.

Anyway, I hope this helps! Hugs for you all.


Edited by PTreeDish (03/03/20 01:47 PM)


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26515410 - 03/03/20 08:15 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

-  I was forced to see a psychologist a dozen times at age 13 but I never spoke to the man. My father was the source of my problem which became evident when he was asked to participate (1966).
-  My academic advisor died my first year of grad school. He was replaced by a man who had just returned from Zurich where he became a Jungian analyst - the only one in Maryland at the time (1983). We had informal analysis and I was his research assistant administering and hand-scoring 1000 MBTIs and he advised me writing a Jungian-oriented doctoral dissertation.
-  The second year of marriage my ex-wife we saw a "Christian psychiatrist" for marriage counseling (1983). (P.S., she is Borderline Personality Disordered and now in her last days of Alcoholic Dementia & malnutrition).
-  I began Jungian analysis in Miami and took extra clients from him to offset my fee (he took kickbacks). Then he died and I began with yet another Jungian, a female analyst until I was interviewed by the (former) Inter-Regional Society of Jungian Analysts. Every applicant from Miami interviewed in Memphis were rejected including me (1990). I ended with 8.5 years of Jungian analysis.
-  After my divorce I went into group counseling for half a year (1992). This was the last therapy I participated in as a recipient.

I have been licensed in Florida to practice psychotherapy since 1985. I received my first hypnotherapy training in 1989, which I have been conducting on a part-time basis up to the present (5-Path™ method).


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26515648 - 03/03/20 11:42 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

PTreeDish said:
....

I should say that I am a huge advocate of folks seeing a mental health professional, but the field is still rife with issues that end up hurting a lot of people. Some of what I do for a living is involved in helping folks find the right kind of help to avoid these kinds of issues. Would be great to hear your thoughts.




.    Recently watched, on Netflix, The film about Tony Robbins' huge seminars, titled: " I am not your Guru". It is very interesting, but at the end I really didn't know what to make of it. In some ways it seems similar to huge religious faith healing events.
.    Seems Tony got some of his chops from NLP, which is also odd in some ways. NLP must have made its founders both rich & famous, but is now listed as a pseudo science on wiki.
.  R. Bandler one of the founders is now not fat but actually obese, which is strange for someone who claims you can model anything. Yet his students (followers?) still seem overly respectful. Perhaps Erickson is turning over in his grave?
.    Anyway wondering if you've seen the film, and what you make of Tony & Bandler & NLP.


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InvisibleFerdinando
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: laughingdog]
    #26515733 - 03/04/20 01:48 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

therapy is dope as fuck

one meeting a week can mean wether one has it bad that week or ok

for psychiatric patients this can happen

when one is a psychiatric patient it is important to see a person from the commune like as part of a healt care thing

it's free in denmark

like high school and college and primary school

it's important to see someone seeing you and relating to you in a seemingly well meaning way

they look after you

self sabotage and mental illness comes from abandoning yourself and abondining the things you got to do to not become ill

it's very common sense

plants need water and air and sunlight

in the same way we need to not do drugs and meditate and do yoga and make art and have a job


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with our love with our love we could save the world


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: Ferdinando]
    #26515861 - 03/04/20 05:11 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

great update Ferdinando


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OfflinePTreeDish
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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: laughingdog]
    #26516348 - 03/04/20 11:42 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

laughingdog said:
Quote:

PTreeDish said:
....

I should say that I am a huge advocate of folks seeing a mental health professional, but the field is still rife with issues that end up hurting a lot of people. Some of what I do for a living is involved in helping folks find the right kind of help to avoid these kinds of issues. Would be great to hear your thoughts.




.    Recently watched, on Netflix, The film about Tony Robbins' huge seminars, titled: " I am not your Guru". It is very interesting, but at the end I really didn't know what to make of it. In some ways it seems similar to huge religious faith healing events.
.    Seems Tony got some of his chops from NLP, which is also odd in some ways. NLP must have made its founders both rich & famous, but is now listed as a pseudo science on wiki.
.  R. Bandler one of the founders is now not fat but actually obese, which is strange for someone who claims you can model anything. Yet his students (followers?) still seem overly respectful. Perhaps Erickson is turning over in his grave?
.    Anyway wondering if you've seen the film, and what you make of Tony & Bandler & NLP.





I've seen it and I have nothing against Tony Robbins or other motivational speakers. There's a market for them, but sadly, there are also many charlatans that promise if you just keep upgrading and buying into the next "level", you'll somehow get even closer to accomplishing your objectives.

These def. aren't therapy. As we discussed, true therapy involves a real relationship and being together as the experiences of life unfolds over time. You just can't get that from reading a motivation book or attending a seminar, etc.

I'm not saying don't do it, but know what those things are and set your expectations accordingly. Maybe you need some motivation or inspiration or to be connected with like-minded community. There's nothing wrong with that.

Millions of people watch Joel Osteen each week. But do I think watching Joel Osteen on TV or in-person (as I have done many times) is going to bring long-lasting change or healing to underlying trauma? The science suggests no because of what we know about how interpersonal relationships are key to changing the brain.


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OfflinePTreeDish
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: Ferdinando]
    #26516353 - 03/04/20 11:44 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Beautifully put. I always tell people we go to the gym to stay fit and work out our bodies, why don't we feel the same about brains / well-being / relationships?

Going to therapy is like going to the gym for our brains.


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26516458 - 03/04/20 12:49 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

PTreeDish said:
Quote:

laughingdog said:
Quote:

PTreeDish said:

.    R. Bandler one of the founders is [now beyond fat & actually] obese, which is strange for someone who claims you can model anything. Yet his students (followers?) still seem overly respectful. Perhaps Erickson is turning over in his grave?
.    Anyway wondering ... what you make of ... Bandler & NLP.
...  Perhaps Erickson is turning over in his grave?




I've seen it and I have nothing against Tony Robbins or other motivational speakers. There's a market for them,....
These def. aren't therapy. ....




.    I agree such huge events are not therapy. And thank you for addressing that point.
.    I still don't know what to make of NLP.
.    On the one hand, Tony does pull off some remarkable interactive moments in the movie.
.    Also NLP teachings & books about Erickson's use of language are fascinating and insightful.
.    Yet watching Bandler on Youtube, as he puts on more and more weight over the years ( to a point that is extremely unhealthy) and is never challenged on anything, from his students - ever; is really strange. As are the claims about what can be modeled.
.    I wonder if you have any further thoughts on these contradictory aspects, of NLP which (outside of Tony's enormous & expensive seminars), does claim to be a therapy, as well as being claimed to be a tool with other uses, that also explains much of our psychology.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: laughingdog] * 1
    #26516475 - 03/04/20 01:01 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I think there is no shortcut to reconnecting with one's body and what is happening.
even a very young child needs to be able to relax, and if this is not possible something must be done.

all the messiahs and their teachings are a sideshow with respect to what must be done. a practitioner of therapy has to be able to help calm down and help reconnect what has become loose. Any type of therapy has to do this minimally.


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OfflineMr. D Green
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26517366 - 03/04/20 08:38 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

PTreeDish said:
I don't think therapy is the solution for everyone or an escape from thinking for yourself. If anything, better understanding yourself helps you think more clearly.

But the way you talk about it, I'm wondering if you don't just distrust other people in general with your feelings? If that's how you feel, I wonder what your life experiences must have been to create these feelings. I have nothing but empathy and kindness for you because if what I just said rings true, I can only imagine how difficult life must have been for you and how alone you must have been the whole time.





On the contrary, distrusting other people with my feelings and knowing my self are too different things. The main concern with therapists are people like you..if all therapist were helpful, non egotistical people; then yes therapy would be a helpful process. Now back to my point, instead of considering the option that I am entirely open with myself; so open with myself. That I am able to read and interpret myself at a subconscious level. Meaning I am self efficient, an independent working gear if you may. So...instead you feel the need to make your self..meaning feed your ego, by trying to put your self above I; by saying I am unable to be open with my feelings to others around I. You think you can use false symphony and concern to portray good intentions..grow up.


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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: Mr. D Green]
    #26517444 - 03/04/20 09:15 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

The main concern with therapists are people like you



Can you explain what you mean?

I hear you; though, but I think your thinking is rigid on this topic, which is a symptom (and that's OK - no judgement here) of trauma - or if you don't like that word, life experiences which have disconnected the part of yourself, and it is there, that can trust and depend on other people. I'm not suggesting that you are, but as an example, diagnosed sociopaths are known to exhibit the same symptom in a spectrum of severity.

What you wrote implies because some therapist aren't helpful, then the whole practice has no value. I'm generally curious if that's also how you feel about relationships with other people in general? Just because some people betray us or hurt us doesn't mean everyone else we might meet in the future will do the same; however, the brain doesn't always feel that way. Our feelings and emotions emerge from our subconscious and we don't have control over them in the same way we do with conscious intellectual thought.

Quote:

That I am able to read and interpret myself at a subconscious level.




I get what you're trying to say, but I say to you, in the most kindest way, this is not what you are doing and the brain doesn't work that way. You cannot be mindful of what yourself is doing at a subconscious level because mindfulness is a conscious activity. Also, you can't make a fair assessment of yourself without comparing it to something else that might be better. And you can't do that without experiences and feedback from external relationships.

Quote:

Meaning I am self efficient, an independent working gear if you may.



I don't doubt that you are. Self-sufficient people are often born from an environment where they had no one they could rely on and so they develop an adaptation that basically says, "If I don't need anyone, they can't hurt me." And some of these people go on to accomplish great things in the material world (career, accomplishments, etc) but eventually, they realize no amount of money, power, esteem fills the innate desire of the mind to have meaningful trusting connections with others.

I know you don't know me and I don't know you, but what you say is resonating quite strongly with my heart. I'm very curious to know about you, your background, how your relationship with your parents is/was and what is life generally like for you.

Your self-reliant attitude, feeling that if you need to depend on someone else or rely on another, it's only from your ego (judgement / shame) are all signs of trauma that can and will lead eventually to emotional distress in your internal world (if they haven't already).

For what it is worth, you don't need to be alone in how you live your life and I am 100% positive that you can change that. There are levels of happiness you probably cannot imagine that await you as soon as you decide to work on healing whatever it is that is causing you to feel like you cannot rely or trust anyone else but yourself. Will it be easy? No way. You'll have to accept and tear down some really big walls that you've built to protect yourself and I'm guessing you had good reason to do so. It's a worthwhile fight friend.

I send nothing but kindness, positivity and care your way. I do hope it is OK that I'm saying this and I'm completely OK if you want to disagree. If you do ever desire to chat more about this, I welcome a PM.


Edited by PTreeDish (03/04/20 09:52 PM)


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OfflinePTreeDish
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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: laughingdog]
    #26517471 - 03/04/20 09:23 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

No, Tony isn't therapy. If he's claiming his seminars are therapy, which I doubt he is because that bring on some serious liability issues. I don't think he's a board-certified licensed therapist, but I could absolutely be wrong about that. Anyway, it's not therapy because of the relationship requirement as previously mentioned.

Quote:

Tony does pull off some remarkable interactive moments in the movie.




Absolutely, there's no denying he's good at what he does. Part of being a great leader, speaker, motivator is invoking an emotional experience with your audience. If your audience also happens to be searching for this, which I'd say most of his attendees are, then they are ripe for the pickin'. People are suffering and searching for anything that makes them feel inspired and hopeful. Tony has the ability to do that. But the effects are short-lived and ultimately won't address deeply seated emotional wounds that are likely to be the real underlying reasons for so many who seek out his seminar in the first place.

If I may ask, why is it so important to you that you decide on how you feel about NLP? I ask because it sounds like you have invested a bit of time and energy into learning about it. Let's say you come to the conclusion that you no longer feel about NLP the way you once used to, how would you feel about that if you don't mind me asking?

Re: the weight gain. I guess I would respond with, do you find it hard to trust people with visible flaws? I can totally understand the feeling of not wanting to trust an overweight fitness instructor, but I think I could trust an overweight therapist. Therapists are certainly not immune to the human experience and full of the same contradictions and wounds. I think what you must be implying is that if he hasn't addressed or worked through his issues with over-eating, then it's a little hard to trust the information he's giving about NLP?

I mean, that's a fair criticism. But if you don't think Tony Robbins or the many other professional therapists out there have these contradictions, that's def. not true. Many therapists are brought to the field because of their own healing journey. Some of the most best looking, successful, powerful, wealthy of my clients present the idea of perfection to the world, but their inner-world is an utter mess and they are miserable. You seem bright so I'm prob not saying anything you don't already know.

I know I wouldn't want a therapist who didn't have first-hand experience with the healing journey struggle. I'd venture the therapy would also fail because it would be difficult to establish a healthy attachment between the two and that's critical to effective therapy.



Edited by PTreeDish (03/04/20 09:42 PM)


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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26517483 - 03/04/20 09:27 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

A little tip for those who are seeking a new therapist and want a clue about whether or not they are worth their salt, ask them if they go to therapy themselves. Any good therapist will say that having their own therapist is a crucial part of their effectiveness with their clients.


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OfflineDarwin23
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26517681 - 03/04/20 11:00 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

So, I actually have had mostly negative experiences. In my early 20's I was seeing a therapist who was in her early 30's and whose husband was overseas with the military. I would vent about my shyness and inability to talk to girls and notice she was just staring at my chest and arms. One day, I told her I'd like to have a lot of kids and she said "So, do you use protection or do you just do it bare?" and when she said it she lifted her butt up off the chair as if to motion like if I was fucking her. I'm normally not too offended by that kind of thing but because it was clear she was never even listening and just seemed to want to fuck me, I left. Two weeks later, I swear this is true, she e-mailed me asking if I missed her.

Years later I had another young therapist. I didn't get vibes off of her but was struggling with paranoia (to her credit, she was the one that told me, that's paranoia not social anxiety). I told her I was always afraid of being seen as a potential stalker/rapist/murderer/child molester/creeper etc. One day, she asked me to explain the thoughts associated with it. I said "I worry about absurd things. For example, I'm wearing jeans today because I was afraid that if I wore joggers you might see something and then think I have a small penis and then judge me and mock me with the other therapists. I know that's absurd that you would even do that, but paranoia isn't rational." The next session she was being all cold and was like "That was very inappropriate and I feel it's my duty to re acknowledge the patient-therapist boundaries here." It almost escalated to an argument when I said "I explained that I'm constantly paranoid about being falsely judged for things and then you're judging me for something that clearly was not aimed at being flirty or crossing boundaries." Instead of taking the criticism she just crossed her arms and bounced her crossed legs giving me one word answers until I felt like I was there to make her feel better.


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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: Darwin23]
    #26517705 - 03/04/20 11:17 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Indeed many therapists don't have much self awareness. The best chiropractor I ever went to was not a chiropractor, but a massage therapist. Often such things are a matter of having a gift, & not of having a certification.


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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26517731 - 03/04/20 11:37 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

PTreeDish said:
....

Re: the weight gain. I guess I would respond with, do you find it hard to trust people with visible flaws? ...






.  Only if they tell other folks they can get rid of all their flaws, model and do anything to a high standard, start a movement, and make millions of dollars off them, while blatantly being so self sabotaging as to be shortening their own life expectancy.
.  Not really hard to understand. No need to look for hidden unconscious motivations, on my part here, as you seem to imply. Would you, (who say you  are a skeptic), simply ignore such facts, if you were curious about a therapy?
.    As i said some of the NLP material is good, and the contradictions seem a bit of a mystery.
.    I had thought that perhaps your being a mental health professional (particularly with your area of expertise), and NLP being largely based on perhaps the most famous and respected hypnotist ever, and NLP still being very much in the public eye after all these years, that you might have some familiarity, with the obvious contradictions & history surrounding it.


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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: laughingdog]
    #26517764 - 03/05/20 12:14 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

  • Only if they tell other folks they can get rid of all their flaws, model and do anything to a high standard, start a movement, and make millions of dollars off them, while blatantly being so self sabotaging as to be shortening their own life expectancy.
  • .  Not really hard to understand. No need to look for hidden unconscious motivations, on my part here, as you seem to imply. Would you, (who say you  are a skeptic), simply ignore such facts, if you were curious about a therapy?
  • .    As i said some of the NLP material is good, and the contradictions seem a bit of a mystery.
  • .    I had thought that perhaps your being a mental health professional (particularly with your area of expertise), and NLP being largely based on perhaps the most famous and respected hypnotist ever, and NLP still being very much in the public eye after all these years, that you might have some familiarity, with the obvious contradictions & history surrounding it.


If that's what this gentleman was doing, then of course, I don't support that or think it's healthy - whether its NLP he's preaching or anything else.

I have no intention or suspicions. I just wanted to know more about how you were feeling so I could best match my answer to what you're after.

Sorry, I don't have much experience with NLP directly. I'm aware of it, but it's not what I do and I never recommend it for what it's is worth.


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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26517809 - 03/05/20 01:15 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I was feeling baffled. After watching "I am not your Guru" and then seeing Bandler teaching in numerous videos on Youtube. He is certainly very smart, but like Marlin Brando, seems to be going through a strange process over which he has no control, while he teaches other people how to manipulate others and themselves. But as its not in your field of interest there is no point in pursing this matter.

How large is your list of options from which you select the best match?
And which varieties of therapy seem most effective to you?

"I'll try and find the study and link to it when I get a chance."
If you find a link you like re: Interpersonal Neurobiology, I'm still interested.


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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: laughingdog]
    #26517971 - 03/05/20 05:21 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

my strangeness is that I do not believe in the subconscious.
I do believe in consciousness, however, and in mind. I think that what most of us call subconscious is mind's ordinary associative process that elicits reflexive resonance from memory by stimuli.

I think therapy works when it makes connections for people that feel disconnected, but all psychology/psychiatry is still in infancy, and the DSM-5 is unworthy of the paper on which it is printed. It is still a science without a working scientific model or premise.


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OfflineSandala
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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26518152 - 03/05/20 07:56 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Very interesting conversation.

I had therapy when I was 11yo, I'd stole some money from my parents as part of a plan to run away from home, they weren't bothered about me wanting to run away from home, only that I'd stole money. The guy was useless, after a few weeks talk therapy stopped, didn't feel I'd got anywhere since he wasn't interested in why I wanted to leave home, only who was influencing me to steal money (the motive was purly to escape the toxic home environment). A few weeks later I thought things at home were improving, trust had started to build up again, then out of the blue this therapist turned up and all that trust was completely destroyed again.

I first tried to run away from home when I was about 5yo, My mother helped me pack a huge suitcase I couldn't even lift, I got to the end of the drive and sat there crying, while my mother watched from the window laughing.

I eventually got out and joined the Forces, the camaradarie and feeling part of something important with healthy interpersonal realtionships probably saved me from serious mental illness. That was 30yrs ago.

I developed an interest in psychology about 15 yrs ago, I'd noticed I had issues around certain types of people, after an altercation with a particulaly difficult customer someone explained he was a 'typical Narcissist' so I started reading about narcisissim. I became a bit of an expert on it, but it only served to set off more emotional alarm bells as I was hyper aware when someone displayed traits high on the Narc scale.

It wasn't until I'd gone through a particurly stressful couple of years, part of which was becomming the focus of grandiose Narc neighbour, that I developed depression and anxiety. I soon realised the lack of useful public health service (UK) treatment meant I had to focus on sorting it out myself, that's when I turned my focus back to my childhood and realised my Mother had been a covert narc, my father was co-dependant, and I was the scapegoat child to my 'golden child' sibling. No wonder i got fucked up.

Mindfulness meditation helps, tho I'm still working through some nebulous issues, anxiety has diminished, I live quite remote so getting out into the community once a week playing guitar for open mic nights has also helped reduce the depression, but something is still preventing me getting to sleep easily, even with guided meditation & sleep hypnosis tracks.

I read a lot about Psilocybin trials and the theraputic benefits achieved, which started me off on a new research path back on November, and here we are.

I've had two half hour sessions with a public health talk therapist, I'm booked in for a couple more sessions, but it looks like the pressure on the service means she has to triage her client list to focus on those in most need, and I don't think we're going to get very far in 3 sessions, especially when everything seems so rushed and she seems more focused on her watch.


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OfflineSandala
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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26518182 - 03/05/20 08:22 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
my strangeness is that I do not believe in the subconscious.
I do believe in consciousness, however, and in mind. I think that what most of us call subconscious is mind's ordinary associative process that elicits reflexive resonance from memory by stimuli.




That's an interesting view, I wouldn't say 'I don't believe in the subconscious' but what you said still resonates.

My current view is that there are 3 sperate parts to the 'mind' 1. the self, pure consciousness. 2. The ego, or self image; which is heavily influenced by 3. the subconcious, a 'library' of emotional reactions or their subconscious interpretation, based on flight/fight/freeze/fawn  response to outside influence, I think this is where architypes come in too, especially the early subconscious 'memories' formed before we had sufficient language or experience to properly understand or catagorize them, but these still have a strong influence on ego.

I think that's kinda what you said, but we have different labels/classificaitons.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: Sandala]
    #26518595 - 03/05/20 12:44 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

not really, but I get where you are coming from, In my model there is just mind.
subconscious has no place at all, the mind has memory; and evrything that happens in mind happens because of association, i.e. what happened together, and what is like unto something else that has already been experienced. More than one connection may be instrumental in a de3cision, and this may seem obscure, so the logical construct of subconscious is invoked to explain everything that is not obvious. In that way it is like god.

equally, ego has no place, the stream of consciousness needs no ego or subconscious to function, habits, however are the basis for all associative behavior. what is repeated becomes more strongly associated with the conditions in which it is repeated. more strongly linked.

what we call ego is usually just defensive habits.


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: Darwin23]
    #26518664 - 03/05/20 01:13 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

WOW! I'm sorry you had those experiences. I can relate. I had a Jungian analyst who was also a Catholic priest and a Gay man. His family was wealthy and they put him through training in Zurich. He held a prestigious position in the local Archdiocese. He eventually died of AIDS (ostensibly "prostate cancer" but it took him rapidly). HE wanted me, a straight man, to leave my wife and move in with him! He promised to send me to Zurich for training. And, he sent me therapy clients for my new practice (including seminarians) but he took kick-backs from me!

After he died I entered analysis with a female analyst during which time I had accrued enough analytical hours to interview for analytic training myself. When I, and everyone from my city was rejected for training I stopped analysis (which was $130 per session in 1990). I encountered that therapist a year or so later at a workshop and she wrapped her arms around me saying that she missed me.

I have always endeavored to be impeccably ethical with my clients with one exception, when I was only practicing for only one year. I had visited a female client in a hospital and gave her a peck on her cheek right in front of her attending cardiologist. But months later when we ended her therapy while we stood on the driveway in broad daylight I kissed her on her lips! She immediately recoiled and said "You kissed me!" at which I thought as fast as I could and quipped "Well, I didn't use my tongue." She seemed to relax and that was that. I never kissed another client but I had just begun to work full-time in junior high schools so that fact took care of further indiscretions. Once in a while a therapy client will reach out to hug me (Gay men included), but that's the extent of it. I have never flirted with a client since that one kiss in 1986.

Maintaining an impeccable reputation is not only valuable in itself but having worked with adolescents for 27 years sometimes brought attempts to attack me by angry parents. One, for example wrote my principal that I was doing sexual things with her 13 year old daughter. This was retribution for me having called Child and Family Services on the mother when her daughter showed me choke marks on her pale neck and said her mother tried to strangle her. The girl had choked herself! Some of her girlfriends came to me in the morning  before school began the next day to say that Karla's mom is trying to get me fired because they saw the mom writing the letter. Fortunately, my principal tossed the letter and the woman did not call the police (which they would have had to respond to even if for false reporting).

There was an adult court-mandated client who came on to me in a dark stairwell, a 14 year old girl who pushed me into a corner and said "I have needs," and a few other adolescents who either sprawled out on my desk, rolled around on the floor, tried to sit on my lap, or pressed up against me while I sat at the edge of a desk. A few discovered where I lived after they had moved onto high school, bypassed security and barged into my apartment. "15 will get you 30!" One remembered me and phoned me from a Central American country to see if I was available when she was 'of-age.' Flattering, she was coming to my city and wanted to hook-up, but I was engaged at the time. I have never violated my professional and personal ethics in the ensuing years but I have heard of all kinds of violations from people. In my state, a therapist can Never get with a former client sexually or risk losing his license. That differs in other states. BUT, I am married and now I'm married and old! :yesnod: Divorce is not good for me either. :wink:


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OfflinePTreeDish
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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: laughingdog]
    #26518668 - 03/05/20 01:13 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

laughingdog said:
I was feeling baffled. After watching "I am not your Guru" and then seeing Bandler teaching in numerous videos on Youtube. He is certainly very smart, but like Marlin Brando, seems to be going through a strange process over which he has no control, while he teaches other people how to manipulate others and themselves. But as its not in your field of interest there is no point in pursing this matter.

How large is your list of options from which you select the best match?
And which varieties of therapy seem most effective to you?

"I'll try and find the study and link to it when I get a chance."
If you find a link you like re: Interpersonal Neurobiology, I'm still interested.




Who said it isn't in my field of interest? I'm interested in hearing your thoughts, ideas and experiences which is why I opened the thread. My lack of knowledge or experience on a subject doesn't preclude my potential interest.

I don't have a "list" that I recommend. My work usually leads me towards helping certain people discover that therapy is an option to address deeper underlying issues that go beyond what I'm paid to do. As to whatever flavor of therapy they want to choose, that's up to them - who am I or anyone to say what will or won't work for people?

I try and educate them on what I know and have experienced with what the science says about how the brain works and heals itself, in addition to trying to embody the safe, trusting and empathetic, and non-judgmental relationship they should look for in whomever they seek out for help.

I hope that answers your question. It's really not in my purview to analyze and opine on the merits of all the approaches. Instead, I try my best to teach the science and my experiences, being open and honest about my own biases and faults, and then just try to be present with everything and everyone else.

OK - some studies. Thanks for reminding me because I almost forgot. There really are too many to mention but here are a few worth diving into.



There are many more and you might need a subscription to view a couple of these. My city library card grants me access to a trove of academic journals, so that may be an option to explore if needed.

I also highly recommend reading some of the books in the Norton Series on Interpersonal Neurobiology if you want to go deeper on your intellectual understanding.


Edited by PTreeDish (03/05/20 11:19 PM)


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26519016 - 03/05/20 04:11 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

can you explain why you include this sentence, which seems authoritive, '"Brains are complex systems that may be defined in mathematical terms. The math of this system indicates a natural push towards integration or a subjective sense of wholeness." - Dr. Dan Siegel, 1999 (The Developing Mind, Third Edition: How Relationships and the Brain Interact to Shape Who We Are)'

the natural push could be something in physics, but what would be an unnatural push, or is it natural because he is invoking 'wholistics' later on?

I was not aware that there is a mathematics of subjective senses, or wholeness, as in completeness or togetherness.
Certainly we have imaginary numbers, but the fuzzy edges of these words don't seem solid enough to hitch onto mathematical formulae.

I am aware of the value of therapy, but always disgruntled by alternative truths vaguely using the name of science or math for authority.


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OfflineSandala
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Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26519057 - 03/05/20 04:30 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
not really, but I get where you are coming from, In my model there is just mind.
subconscious has no place at all, the mind has memory; and evrything that happens in mind happens because of association, i.e. what happened together, and what is like unto something else that has already been experienced. More than one connection may be instrumental in a de3cision, and this may seem obscure, so the logical construct of subconscious is invoked to explain everything that is not obvious. In that way it is like god.

equally, ego has no place, the stream of consciousness needs no ego or subconscious to function, habits, however are the basis for all associative behavior. what is repeated becomes more strongly associated with the conditions in which it is repeated. more strongly linked.

what we call ego is usually just defensive habits.




Interesting stuff!

I dunno, there's a part of me I call self/pure consciousness that can kinda stand back and observe another part getting triggered, and more recently even step in to acknowledge the emotion before it's actioned, later I can meditate on it and kinda have a conversation between both parts, working out what triggered the emotion, I feel this work has helped control, or at least lesson the anxiety issue. I feel this 'self' part can also kinda stand back observing the streams of random thoughts wafting through as a kinda seperate entity.

I feel this fits the current model I'm working with so I'm sticking to it for now, always open to modify it with further experiences so it's always a work in progress.

San.


--------------------
My Noob Journal


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OfflinePTreeDish
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Registered: 04/22/18
Posts: 353
Last seen: 3 months, 15 days
Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26519090 - 03/05/20 04:49 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Sure thing. I think reading the chapter from where I found this information would provide more context and meaning. As for as authority, it's not a claim I'm personally making but one written by a clinical professor of psychiatry at the UCLA School of Medicine and executive director of the Mindsight Institute.

Here is what the book referencing this quote and related book says:

Quote:

"One particular principle of brain development guides this book. We know that brains are complex systems, according to the strict mathematical definition of the term. Although the concept of complexity has many facets, one aspect has particular meaning for our endeavor; The theory says that there is an intrinsic push toward integration, or the subjective experience of wholeness, in our neural circuitry...One way of talking about this push towards integration is that complex systems have an innate self-organizing capacity (Cicchett & Rogosch, 1997), and the pattern of that self-organizations involves a balance between processes of differentiation and linage (Siegel, 1999). In terms of our brains, this means that circuits develop their specialize functions in relative isolate, then join together to create (ideally) an increasingly encompassing, harmonious system. This two fold process is called integration." Being a Brain-Wise Therapist: A Practical Guide to Interpersonal Neurobiology, Bonnie Badenoch




Note: I added the link to "complex systems".


Edited by PTreeDish (03/05/20 04:56 PM)


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,828
Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: PTreeDish]
    #26519369 - 03/05/20 07:03 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Re:  'OK - some studies. Thanks for reminding me because I almost forgot. There really are too many to mention but here are a few worth diving into. '

Thanks for the links


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Invisiblesudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,798
Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: PTreeDish] * 1
    #26519753 - 03/05/20 10:31 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

My therapist employs listening and asking some general questions about my wellbeing. He then provides his views and recommendations on what benefits me.

Your only role is being honest. You're there to help yourself, with a therapist who can provide feedback for moving forward.

I am there to listen and do the same.


--------------------
I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.



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OfflineRJ Tubs 202
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Posts: 6,014
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Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: sudly]
    #26519852 - 03/06/20 01:06 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

sudly said:

Your only role is being honest. You're there to help yourself, with a therapist who can provide feedback for moving forward.




:thumbup:    I often tell my therapist when I don't want to be honest with her.

I've been seeing Jennifer for 7 years and if there's something I'm reluctant to talk to her about, it's a very important issue for me!


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Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
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Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: Do you go to therapy? & strangeness in the field [Re: Sandala]
    #26519950 - 03/06/20 04:10 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Sandala said:
Quote:

redgreenvines said:
not really, but I get where you are coming from, In my model there is just mind.
subconscious has no place at all, the mind has memory; and evrything that happens in mind happens because of association, i.e. what happened together, and what is like unto something else that has already been experienced. More than one connection may be instrumental in a de3cision, and this may seem obscure, so the logical construct of subconscious is invoked to explain everything that is not obvious. In that way it is like god.

equally, ego has no place, the stream of consciousness needs no ego or subconscious to function, habits, however are the basis for all associative behavior. what is repeated becomes more strongly associated with the conditions in which it is repeated. more strongly linked.

what we call ego is usually just defensive habits.




Interesting stuff!

I dunno, there's a part of me I call self/pure consciousness that can kinda stand back and observe another part getting triggered, and more recently even step in to acknowledge the emotion before it's actioned, later I can meditate on it and kinda have a conversation between both parts, working out what triggered the emotion, I feel this work has helped control, or at least lesson the anxiety issue. I feel this 'self' part can also kinda stand back observing the streams of random thoughts wafting through as a kinda seperate entity.

I feel this fits the current model I'm working with so I'm sticking to it for now, always open to modify it with further experiences so it's always a work in progress.

San.



If you have a system that works for you - great!
I am not interested in undermining your neatly role based deconstruction of your functional existence.

In yoga, there are chakras, not the same but also a proposition for health oriented work.

I consider both to be projected models, which is fine, just inaccurate.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


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Invisiblesudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,798
Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: RJ Tubs 202]
    #26521443 - 03/06/20 10:48 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

RJ Tubs 202 said:
Quote:

sudly said:

Your only role is being honest. You're there to help yourself, with a therapist who can provide feedback for moving forward.




:thumbup:    I often tell my therapist when I don't want to be honest with her.

I've been seeing Jennifer for 7 years and if there's something I'm reluctant to talk to her about, it's a very important issue for me!




I'm not saying to give them your KFC secret sauce recipe but to be open enough for them to have an idea of what you're going through.


--------------------
I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.



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Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
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Posts: 37,531
Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: sudly]
    #26521749 - 03/07/20 07:14 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

editing your therapy sounds very gamey to me

the opportunity for honesty is missed


--------------------
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Invisiblesudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,798
Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26522322 - 03/07/20 02:23 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

If someone is sexually or physically assaulted or they've gone through some sort of traumatic event they may not want to go into detail.

And if there are multiple issues, it might be okay to work on one at a time or?

I mean I don't think my therapist is there to cure me of everything and make me smile from ear to ear, but I do think they're there to listen to my woes and my triumphs and to tell me my options.


--------------------
I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.



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Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
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Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: Do you go to therapy? [Re: sudly]
    #26522341 - 03/07/20 02:40 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

so you think that your issues have no interconnection?

just as you did not get to choose your afflictions, you do not really get to choose what gets fixed first; this is not pick-up sticks, it is conditioned life.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


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