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Offlinefasidunlop
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Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields
    #26503279 - 02/25/20 02:15 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

This is quite frustrating, I put quite a lot of time, money and effort on this STB extraction project and for some reason it is just not working for me, giving some ridiculous yields to which I am puzzled...


1st STB Attempt:

500g Sodium Hydroxide added to 6.5L Tap H20

Whilst completely disolved but still warm, 500G of MHRB Powder is added, shaked thoroughly and left to sit for 1h. (Powder is Inner-Bark so supposed to be stronger than conventional MHRB powder as well)

1h later add 500ml Top quality Naphta.
Gently mixed and swirled (not shaked) for 1.5 minutes and allowed to sit and separate, then repeated for a total of 4-5 times.
Then pulled the absolute most of all naphta.
- Repeat process with new Naphta portions for a total of 4 pulls

Pull-jars left overnight in freezer, filtered with lab filter paper, rinsing jar an additional 2 times to get everything out and allowed to dry.


Yield: 1.8g - 0.36% (Dissapointing)
Aspect: Ultra white and clean.


2nd STB Attempt:

Same process but sodium hydroxide + water + MHRB powder mixture allowed to sit for 7 days rather than an hour before pulling, with ocassional shaking.

Last naphta pull allowed to sit for 2 days with ocassional swirling to get most out of it.

Yield: 1.9g - 0.38% (Equally dissapointing)
Aspect: Ultra white and clean.


3rd fix:

New research made me suspect too much Naphta might of been used for the pulls, making most yield dissolved and not crystalised on the freezer.
Luckily all naphta used in both attempts had been saved.

Evaporated half of it from all jars, leaving a ratio of 2:1 MHRB:Naphta
and left in freezer for 24 hours.

Yield: 0.1g - Negligible


How are people making 1-1.5% with STBs, where could I have gone wrong, I am puzzled...


Edited by fasidunlop (02/25/20 02:18 PM)


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OfflineLogicaL ChaosM
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields (moved) [Re: fasidunlop]
    #26503394 - 02/25/20 03:17 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

This thread was moved from The Pub.

Reason:
Better fit in TPE.


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Offlinesporecap
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields (moved) [Re: LogicaL Chaos] * 1
    #26503485 - 02/25/20 04:02 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Holy shit man you got some balls creating 6L of a highly caustic solution! I hope your container is fine and will never leak.

My first pulls were quite low yielding as well, and i was just gently stirring. Then started to roll/gently shake the jar and put it in a hot water bath and got more dmt on the 4th pull than on the three first combined. If you're not using finely powdered bark, emulsion should be now problem, so start shaking:super:


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Offlinefasidunlop
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields (moved) [Re: sporecap]
    #26505663 - 02/26/20 10:52 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

sporecap said:
Holy shit man you got some balls creating 6L of a highly caustic solution! I hope your container is fine and will never leak.
....




hahaha yeah man, not going to lie. Shaking that massive glass jar hugging it with my arms and squatting it feels a bit like russian roulette...

You know your % yield?


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OfflineBabylonRuleDem
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields [Re: fasidunlop] * 1
    #26505752 - 02/27/20 12:37 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

fasidunlop said:
Gently mixed and swirled (not shaked) for 1.5 minutes and allowed to sit and separate




Swirling? Like a glass of wine?

Try rolling the jug end over end (use 2- 1gal milk jugs, each will hold half of your 6.5L just fine). The naptha should not separate from the basified solution that quickly. Seems like your not getting the naptha dispersed in the solution well enough. Also using new naptha every pull hurts you rather than helps. The naptha needs to be super saturated to freeze parcip. By using new naptha each pull you were working against yourself.

Reuse the same naptha after you freeze precip. Pour it off back into your basified solution. No reason to waste more, the same stuff can be used for quite a few extractions.


Also this is precisely why it is wise to start with a small amount until you have the procedure down. Try 100g next time using natureboys tek here


Quote:

filtered with lab filter paper, rinsing jar an additional 2 times to get everything out and allowed to dry.




This is unnecessary. Try natureboys tek.


As for how to salvage what you have now... I would suggest using the dirty naptha you have (hopefully you saved it) and take 300ml and pull with that (if you seperate the base solution into 2- 1gal jugs then 150ml per jug). Then freeze precip. Use the same 300ml of naptha to pull again. And so on and so on until the yields drop off.

You may have weak bark, but I think it's more likely the procedure you used. Start with less next time and get the process down. Again natureboys tek here


--------------------
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OfflineLogicaL ChaosM
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields [Re: fasidunlop]
    #26505809 - 02/27/20 02:18 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

I would try add the Lye to the water-bark mixture. I feel like that would process the bark better/more efficiently. Also, i would recommend using a hot water bath while the Naptha is extracting the DMT from the solution.

As suggested, try doing smaller batches like 100grams. That way if u mess up, u dont waste a bunch of bark. Then once u get the technique figured out, THEN go up to 500grams and up.

Pepe the Frog has a really good DMT tek here. Check it out using the search engine.

All that being said, 1.8grams of white crystals from 500grams isnt that terrible. Youre definitely doing something right, just need to work on the procedure or try a different method :thumbup:


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OfflineSpearCaps
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields [Re: LogicaL Chaos] * 1
    #26506048 - 02/27/20 07:45 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Okay there are two different angles on how to improve your Tek:

1. Straight away one can see your base extraction is off.

Letting it sit for 1h is far too less time for the DMT Freebase to leave the plant (if you have time constrains, go A/B).
Likewise, 7 days is way too long and will create a gooey shit that contains not only the DMT, but all of the possible jungle spice.
Let the Base do its thing for about 1 day +- and then do your naptha pulls.


2. Insufficient mixing is often the source of all low yields.

If you don't get to mix your Base Solution and Solvent properly, the DMT cannot migrate to the naptha. Most low yields can be increased with better mixing.
Of course as you use STB and powedered bark, you need to consider emulsion, so mix slowly but for a long time. If you happen to get emulsion, it is not the end as you let it settle on your washing mashine for a day and it will be fine.


Some minor additions:
Using distilled water can help you, aswell as freeze precipricating for a longer time (min 36h) or even pre-evaping some solvent before the freeze precip.


And listen to Babylon and LogicaL and work with 100g quantities, untill you get your Tek straight.

Also if you continue to have problems with yields, look into salt teks. People have had good results by saturating the water with salt (makes cleaning necessary though)


--------------------
Outside of right and wrong is a place. There we'll meet.
- Sufi Wisdom


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OfflinePandemoon
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields [Re: fasidunlop]
    #26506238 - 02/27/20 10:02 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

fasidunlop said:
(Powder is Inner-Bark so supposed to be stronger than conventional MHRB powder as well)





It's not the innert, but the outer bark of the root that contains the highest ammounts of dmt. It's called rootbark for a reason.


Don't know what yu do wrong. Might be that your power is just not as potent as the common rootbark. :shrug:

-


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Offlinesporecap
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields (moved) [Re: fasidunlop]
    #26506373 - 02/27/20 11:42 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

fasidunlop said:
Quote:

sporecap said:
Holy shit man you got some balls creating 6L of a highly caustic solution! I hope your container is fine and will never leak.
....




hahaha yeah man, not going to lie. Shaking that massive glass jar hugging it with my arms and squatting it feels a bit like russian roulette...

You know your % yield?




These were my pulls when I tried it for the first time (only stirring):
1st pull

2nd pull:

3rd pull:

The overall yield was quite low, 0.2g of 50g MHRB combined.

Then I started shaking the jar and got this on the 4th or maybe even 5th pull

So much much more than before.

Now I get usually 1-1.5% with Natureboy's STB tek.
The others have already given more good advice, so keep it up and you will be successful.


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Offlinefasidunlop
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields [Re: BabylonRuleDem]
    #26510689 - 03/01/20 01:37 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

BabylonRuleDem said:


Swirling? Like a glass of wine?




Kind of yeah, but also tipping it over and progressively turning it around. Just not shaking it basically, to not risk any emulsion...

Quote:

BabylonRuleDem said:
Try rolling the jug end over end (use 2- 1gal milk jugs, each will hold half of your 6.5L just fine). The naptha should not separate from the basified solution that quickly. Seems like your not getting the naptha dispersed in the solution well enough. Also using new naptha every pull hurts you rather than helps. The naptha needs to be super saturated to freeze parcip. By using new naptha each pull you were working against yourself.

Reuse the same naptha after you freeze precip. Pour it off back into your basified solution. No reason to waste more, the same stuff can be used for quite a few extractions.


Also this is precisely why it is wise to start with a small amount until you have the procedure down. Try 100g next time using natureboys tek here


This is unnecessary. Try natureboys tek.


As for how to salvage what you have now... I would suggest using the dirty naptha you have (hopefully you saved it) and take 300ml and pull with that (if you seperate the base solution into 2- 1gal jugs then 150ml per jug). Then freeze precip. Use the same 300ml of naptha to pull again. And so on and so on until the yields drop off.

You may have weak bark, but I think it's more likely the procedure you used. Start with less next time and get the process down. Again natureboys tek here




Thank you for everything, I will check the tek out.

1-1.5% yields are attainable with an STB correct?


Edited by fasidunlop (03/01/20 01:58 AM)


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Offlinefasidunlop
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Registered: 02/09/20
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields [Re: Pandemoon]
    #26510696 - 03/01/20 01:43 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Pandemoon said:
Quote:

fasidunlop said:
(Powder is Inner-Bark so supposed to be stronger than conventional MHRB powder as well)





It's not the innert, but the outer bark of the root that contains the highest ammounts of dmt. It's called rootbark for a reason.


Don't know what yu do wrong. Might be that your power is just not as potent as the common rootbark. :shrug:

-




I don't think this is correct...


Edited by fasidunlop (03/01/20 01:44 AM)


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Offlinefasidunlop
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields [Re: SpearCaps]
    #26510706 - 03/01/20 01:55 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

SpearCaps said:
Okay there are two different angles on how to improve your Tek:

1. Straight away one can see your base extraction is off.

Letting it sit for 1h is far too less time for the DMT Freebase to leave the plant (if you have time constrains, go A/B).
Likewise, 7 days is way too long and will create a gooey shit that contains not only the DMT, but all of the possible jungle spice.
Let the Base do its thing for about 1 day +- and then do your naptha pulls.


2. Insufficient mixing is often the source of all low yields.

If you don't get to mix your Base Solution and Solvent properly, the DMT cannot migrate to the naptha. Most low yields can be increased with better mixing.
Of course as you use STB and powedered bark, you need to consider emulsion, so mix slowly but for a long time. If you happen to get emulsion, it is not the end as you let it settle on your washing mashine for a day and it will be fine.


Some minor additions:
Using distilled water can help you, aswell as freeze precipricating for a longer time (min 36h) or even pre-evaping some solvent before the freeze precip.


And listen to Babylon and LogicaL and work with 100g quantities, untill you get your Tek straight.

Also if you continue to have problems with yields, look into salt teks. People have had good results by saturating the water with salt (makes cleaning necessary though)





Thank you


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OfflineBabylonRuleDem
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields [Re: fasidunlop]
    #26510708 - 03/01/20 01:59 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

fasidunlop said:
Quote:

BabylonRuleDem said:


Swirling? Like a glass of wine?




Kind of yeah, but also tipping it over and progressively turning it around. Just not shaking it basically, to not risk any emulsion...





If emulsion does form a hot water bath and/or time will clear it up.

When using HDPE jugs (milk jugs) i get pretty rough with the rolling/shaking when i add the naptha. Have gotten emulsion a few times, but i just let it sit for a few days and it clears up.

When using glass I just roll. I wouldn't want the glass to shatter or drop it and get the caustic solution on myself and my surroundings. With milk jugs the fear is less so i shake those fuckers:lol:

Quote:

fasidunlop said:
Thank you for everything, I will check the tek out.

Heat is not needed right?
and 1-1.5% yields are attainable with an STB correct?




Nope heat is not needed. If you manage to form an emulsion it can be used, but is not necessary.

Yep 1%+ should be attainable, given that you have decent bark.

Just a suggestion for the future: Buy shredded bark or whole bark and shred it yourself. I personally hate working with powdered bark.


--------------------
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OfflinePandemoon
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields [Re: fasidunlop]
    #26510919 - 03/01/20 07:26 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

fasidunlop said:
Quote:

Pandemoon said:
Quote:

fasidunlop said:
(Powder is Inner-Bark so supposed to be stronger than conventional MHRB powder as well)





It's not the innert, but the outer bark of the root that contains the highest ammounts of dmt. It's called rootbark for a reason.


Don't know what yu do wrong. Might be that your power is just not as potent as the common rootbark. :shrug:

-




I don't think this is correct...




I repeat, the rootbark contains the highest ammounts of dmt (up to 2%) The whole root itself has only ~0.5 % alkaloids.

Don't know which bark you are using. "Inner bark". Inner rootbark? Inner stem bark?  The stem bark has about 0.03% dmt only, so stem bark is no option.

-


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OfflineSpearCaps
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields [Re: BabylonRuleDem]
    #26510964 - 03/01/20 08:02 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

BabylonRuleDem said:

When using HDPE jugs (milk jugs) i get pretty rough with the rolling/shaking when i add the naptha. Have gotten emulsion a few times, but i just let it sit for a few days and it clears up.






The consensus at the moment advises against using HDPE (and most plastics) as mixing containers.
It is not resistant against Naptha, Heptane, Hexane etc. and thus will contaminate your product with possibly toxic material.


--------------------
Outside of right and wrong is a place. There we'll meet.
- Sufi Wisdom


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OfflineLogicaL ChaosM
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields [Re: Pandemoon]
    #26511585 - 03/01/20 03:21 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

So the outer root bark is more potent than the inner root bark? I think I may currently have it backwards...


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Offlinesporecap
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Re: Help with STB DMT Extraction - Extremely Low Yields [Re: LogicaL Chaos]
    #26512762 - 03/02/20 12:25 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

The root consists of an outer layer, inner layer and core part. The outer layer and core do not contain DMT in significant quantities and are discarded, like described on the dmt-nexus
https://wiki.dmt-nexus.me/MHRB

If some seller advertises their MHRB as special because it's inner root bark, it's just nonsense. If they sell outer bark, it's a rip-off.


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