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OfflineDartho
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Registered: 01/02/20
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: wildernessjunkie]
    #26423617 - 01/08/20 09:04 PM (5 years, 10 days ago)

Thanks for the post!

I was only going to get spawn bags, and substrate, but this convinced me to get go ahead with the PC. Other articles convinced me to use agar. Now I've got everything I wasn't able to buy local on the way (spores, PC, agar, petri dishes, pyrex bottle w/ GL 45 cap).

I've been visualizing my entire process from agar to harvest every night as I go to bed lol, especially my sterile technique in the SAB.


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Dartho - Chaotic good 'Sith lord' elf from Elfwood, near Dreamland. Will force lightning tickle you until you pee your pants.

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Invisiblewildernessjunkie
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: Dartho]
    #26423827 - 01/09/20 01:14 AM (5 years, 9 days ago)

I need to post another couple of write ups on this subject. The first being, what to do if you have already bought that fucking kit. And the second, a cost analysis of what kind of price you would be looking at to just get the gear/supplies to do it right from the beginning.

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OfflineSirGalahad
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: wildernessjunkie]
    #26424955 - 01/09/20 03:43 PM (5 years, 9 days ago)

This is like the 1 post I wish I read..  oh well! I learned the hard way! Got my presto now.

I wont say the kits dont work.  But looking at what I spent for them vs what I spent on a pressure cooker/other supplies is nuts. Hopefully more people like me see this before it's too late!

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Invisiblewildernessjunkie
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: SirGalahad]
    #26451188 - 01/25/20 04:48 AM (4 years, 11 months ago)

:trolldance:

Time to bump it again....

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Invisiblewildernessjunkie
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: wildernessjunkie]
    #26483072 - 02/13/20 03:24 AM (4 years, 10 months ago)

Random reminder that kits are still junk.

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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: wildernessjunkie]
    #26491753 - 02/18/20 01:15 PM (4 years, 10 months ago)

As someone who knows little or nothing about growing, to the point that even the terminology I read on this site I don't quite understand yet, I have a question about this thread topic.

I created a thread about growing, and have gotten some great responses so far. I found this thread through a link offered me by one of the responses. So my main question with grow kits, assuming they are functional, can grow what they claim to grow, and are fast and easy, what's the problem? I get that many folks here are not just looking to "trip" and you want to encourage new people like me to learn, learn, learn, and read, read, read.

Hypothetically now, in case there is some site rule I am misunderstanding: what if someone isn't interested in becoming a growing hobbyist or efficianado? What if someone isn't interested in becoming competent at mushrooms in general, or has no desire to do anything but grow some shrooms (again hypthetically) that are better than they can get on the street...if they can even get them? Bearing in mind, in many places you can't buy them retail.

Important: Now if you tell me that the answer is that you can't do what I just described, then fair enough. If the goal of growing is far more nuanced and complicated, and the only way to do it is to become a serious, dedicated hobbyist, and do a lot of research, then that's a valid answer to my question, and I will accept it.

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OfflineMr.Wizard
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: LSA Woodrose]
    #26491778 - 02/18/20 01:35 PM (4 years, 10 months ago)

I think this is more a PSA about being aware of what you're actually purchasing - and what you actually need that is, and isn't in kits.

I wouldn't say that they ARE fast and easy, but that there is % of success. That success may come around quicker, but you're more likely to fail b/c doing it the long way teaches you how to fail less.

For your specific situation it may be viable to get some sort of kit. Either way, with this info you can now make a more informed decision for yourself.

Looking back at your post, all your questions can be answered with researching these forums. There are grow logs where you can see folk go from syringe/print, to fruit, with dates, and TEKs.

If you haven't bought anything yet I'd look at Bod's Easy AF way to get started by yourself with no pressure cooker, and the other links in my sig too :smile:

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Invisiblewildernessjunkie
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: Mr.Wizard]
    #26492152 - 02/18/20 05:22 PM (4 years, 10 months ago)

There are a lot of problems with the kits. Sometimes they work, a lot of times they fail.

The problems are that you will be overpaying for a lot of crap that is completely unnecessary. Go through that list and look at how much of it is useless and behind the times. You can go out and get everything that you need, and keep out the junk for roughly half the price. And in the process, have better materials that you can reuse.

For the beginner, its hard to dumb it down more than PF Tek. Which is basically what they are selling there.

Further, is when the kit goes bad. The guy that got the kit, just followed the directions, and doesn't really understand what they did, or why they did it. And then they come here to A CULTIVATION FORUM to diagnose and try and fix the problem. And half the time its too late anyway.

That kit doesn't make anything simpler or more convenient. It just markets to someone that doesn't know what they need, or what to do.

If you're hell bent on buying a kit, then no one will stop you. But as a cultivator, I cant endorse it.

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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: LSA Woodrose]
    #26492182 - 02/18/20 05:35 PM (4 years, 10 months ago)

Fair enough, wildernessjunkie and Mr.Wizard. I'm going to do a little more research. I am not leaning toward trying something that was explained to my in my thread called Shoebox method or something. I need to look this up online, which I am going to Google right now. There was one product from a Shroomery Sponsor that looked really cool, which is what made me want to buy a kit. The problem is, when I posted it in my thread in the other forum here, it got deleted by a mod, who explained to me why it was deleted. lol Then again, I'm not even sure it is a kit. It looks like one, though hahaha. Not sure if there is a place to ask a question like, "Is this X-Product from Y-Sponsor any good?" Because there is a possibility that what I think is a kit really isn't lol. Anyway, thanks again.

Moral of the story: No kits starting out. I just have to figure out how to use this Shoebox thingy, pf tek, or both.

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Invisiblewildernessjunkie
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: LSA Woodrose] * 1
    #26492194 - 02/18/20 05:45 PM (4 years, 10 months ago)

www.mushroomvideos.com

Watch those. They will give you a good primer on getting started. PF Tek is dead simple.

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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: wildernessjunkie]
    #26492225 - 02/18/20 06:01 PM (4 years, 10 months ago)

Holy crap! Why the hell didn't I think to use video walkthroughs for this, wildernessjunkie? Especially since I am an avid gamer (PS4, XBone, PC) and I use Youtube for walkthroughs for games all the freaking time. Plus I use Youtube for cooking videos and even some high end guitar leads that I am too lazy to learn by ear.

I'm watching now, but had to take a break because I need to work out. For some reason, I was reading stuff about the pf tek method and shoeboxes, but my brain just wasn't making the connection between the words on the various posts and physical reality. For some reason, there was a huge disconnect between reading and actually getting it. No matter how many times I read passages, it was just words on a page. It might as well have been another language. But seeing it on the video, I'm able to visualize the steps.

I am going to look for videos on shoeboxes as well, just to compare both methods in my head.

Thanks man!

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OfflineSardo
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: AyePlus]
    #26492266 - 02/18/20 06:23 PM (4 years, 10 months ago)

Thank you Wilderness Junkie for your generous and extensive post.

I have done question for you and the group here.

If I received rye berries bags for colonization about 10 days ago.

Do you and or the community think they are still good to colonize? They have been in a cool dark place the whole time.


--------------------
Not all who wander are lost.

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OfflineLSA Woodrose
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: Sardo]
    #26497704 - 02/21/20 08:48 PM (4 years, 10 months ago)

Well, I am definitely NOT going to be considering a grow kit. After watching those Pf Tek videos too many times to count, I can't come up with a single good reason to even think of a kit.

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OfflineLilMissMushroom
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: wildernessjunkie]
    #26708180 - 05/31/20 12:19 AM (4 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

wildernessjunkie said:
Warning: Wall of Text. Its not usually how I roll, but I cant think of another way to present this right now.

Its clear how these things are appealing. You've never grown shrooms before, and you don't really know where to start. Someone, somewhere points you toward a grow kit (Probably Midwest Grow Kits) and it appears to have everything you need included. It seems like "no brain-er", you can just buy that kit and get started immediately. But there are a lot of problems with these things that Im going to go over below.

Lets take a look at what you get in these things, and Im gonna put a link in here that is a non sponsor, hopefully I can get away with it because Im not endorsing the product but rather specifically advising against it. Here is the example Ill be referring to:

http://www.midwestgrowkits.com/comparison-chart.html

That is a comparison of the different products that they sell. Lets go through the components and see what we have:

- Container Size: The largest size they offer is 56 qt. Plenty big for a PF Tek grow, and one of the items in this kit that is reusable. Comparable 58 qt from Walmart for about $5

- Substrate jars:
Those jars shown are the wrong jars. We want the short wide mouth half pints for PF Tek. Those deeper jars have a long history of stalling before full colonization. Here are the correct jars from ACE Hardware for $13

- Thermometer with Hygrometer / Humidity Gauge: Nothing to link to here. This is totally unnecessary as long as you have a Proper Fruiting Chamber.

- Ultra fine premium Perlite: The coarser Perlite works better IME. And again, can be sourced locally from a garden shop or hardware store. Lowes has vermiculite for less than $5. If you build a monotub from the link above, you dont need the perlite.

- 110V 5000k Plug in Fluorescent Light: Again, not necessary. And the wrong product for the job. Ambient sunlight coming in through a window works just fine. If you did need the light, then it wouldn't be this one. Instead you would use a 6500k Spectrum not a 5000k. No link required because no additional light is required.

- LED Grow Light: Again, not needed. Now there are two different lights that we don"t need included. At least they are getting closer on the light spectrum at 6000K, but its still not the 6500k that is optimal. If you're going to use a tool, then use the right one for the job. Again no link required.

- Hospital Grade Gloves: These are easily found in every grocery store. Usually in the pharmacy section. Looks like there is a single pair of gloves in these kits. You can find an entire box of these for cheap. Heres a whole box on Amazon for $5.50

- Isopropyl Alcohol swabs: Again, wrong tool for the job. Dont ever wipe your needle with alcohol. Alcohol sanitizes, not a sterilizes. A flame is the only way to properly sterilize a needle tip. No link needed, because this item isn't necessary.

- Step by step instructions: Instructions....you want instructions...Here you go 1, 2 That should cover pretty much everything you'll need for quite a long time.

- Electric 50W adjustable heater: One more item that isn't needed. Ill go so far as to say that its likely to be detrimental to your grow. As long as you are comfortable walking around in a T shirt in your house, then your mushrooms will be fine. Adding heat encourages the growth of contamination more that the growth of cubensis. Leave incubation out of your grow completely unless you have a problem with really low temperatures in your house.

- Silicone Air hoses with built in HEPA filters: Yet one more extraneous item that isn't necessary. Fresh Air Exchange and humidity control should be inherent and passive if you have a fruiting chamber like in the link above.

- Electric air pump: Refer to what I just wrote one paragraph up. We don't need it.

- Electric 24 hour timer with 24 on/off settings per day: Don't need it. Remember that bit about the window and sunlight above? Unless you are in a place that has 24 hour long nights, it doesn't serve a purpose in an amateur grow.

- Hydroponic Humidifier: This may serve a purpose if you are trying to bump up the humidity in a green house. But for a tub, we don't need it. Assuming you used a fruiting chamber from the link above.

As you can see, there is a whole lot of things in that kit that we don't need to do an effective grow. It seems like a lot of the items in there are based on info that has been proven ineffective, and in some cases detrimental. And on top of all that, you aren't even provided with the supplies or equipment to refill your jars and do a second grow!

We have come a long way towards understanding in a very short amount of time in mycology.

So now that I've beat down your hopes of an easy, all inclusive, mail delivered kit that is going to produce huge amounts of mushrooms. Lets break it down and see what we actually need to do this right.

The standard grow for a new cultivator is usually the PF Tek. And I provided links up above for most of this already. So lets make a list:

This is a list of one time gear, its reusable. You only need to purchase once.

- 2 of the clear tubs, one will be a fruiting chamber, and the other will become a still air box (About $10 total)
- 2 bags of Perlite (About $10) and not necessary if you use a monotub.
- 1 Box of wide mouth half pint mason jars ($13)
- 1 Big ass pot, you probably already have on in your kitchen. Check a thrift store if not.

Total so far: $33 (Roughly)

This is a list of your consumable/disposable ingredients. You will need this for every grow.

- Spores (Check the Sponsor List for reliable products. The most inexpensive way to do obtain spores is to buy one of the "Their Choice" deals and mention you are a Shroomery member. This usually will get you your first spore syringe plus an additional freebie. Cost ($15 roughly).
- Vermiculite: You can find it on the shelf right next to the Perlite you bought above for about the same price ($5). One bag will do several grows.
- Grain Flour: Brown Rice Flour has always been the standard, but any grain will work. If you have a blender you can toss any grain that you find for cheap in and grind it to flour. One small bag of brown rice is about $3 locally here and will do several grows.

Total price of consumables: $23 (Roughly)

Take into account as well that the consumables are bought on a scale that allows several 12 jar PF Tek runs. That $23 does several grows, and you can now refill your own jars and you have the correct equipment on hand to replicate it at will. Learn to make spore prints and you can refill those syringes yourself and cut out the most expensive consumable.

Total cost for your first grow is about $56. Lets round it up to $60 and include a few cents worth for a lighter to sterilize your needle, plastic gloves and a shot of alcohol on them to sanitize. Its possible you already have those items in your bathroom.

For that cost, you have exactly what you need, no extraneous crap, no items that are detrimental to your grow, and you are set up to do subsequent grows without relying on a companies overpriced items for subsequent grows. Plus, its all scale-able. If you want, you can easily pick up more jars and another fruiting chamber.

The cheapest kit presented by that company linked above is $55 and is not refillable. The most expensive is $139 and is chocked full of crap that you don't need and can possibly derail your grow. And in the end, you really haven't learned half of what is available to you in the process of cultivation.




I came to this thread via one of your posts about microdosing and depression. I've got a grow kit and look to try it myself next time. This seems very informative. Xxx


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Offlinemrmazdarx9
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: LilMissMushroom]
    #26709615 - 05/31/20 05:26 PM (4 years, 7 months ago)

Its pretty easy, just decide which way you wanna go, PF being the easiest and most forgiving id reccomended that before stepping into grains agar etc, once your growing tubs of grain youll end up with more shrooms than you can handle so you need to decide if it worth going that route.
Speaking of my big bag of oats and petri dishes are here just waiting on my new PC (lostthe weight onthe old one and the one i saw on ebay was cheap and looked pretty good) agar LME and other shit i cant think of. Im finally gonna beable to grow out bogeymans KSSS print he sent me over a year ago plis a tub of AA and if theres enough left in the syringe to grow out on agar APE and to make a LC i can store.


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OfflineKalian
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: wildernessjunkie]
    #26760754 - 06/20/20 10:00 PM (4 years, 6 months ago)

Fair enough, but every time I read through this forum I get stressed because it seems so complicated. It's not my life's work or livelihood. Can you point to perhaps to video resources that are really clear, step by step?


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Fighting ignorance since 1973 (It’s taking longer than I thought!) WickrMe:KalianPrime

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OfflineSoccrates
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: Kalian]
    #26761906 - 06/21/20 12:16 AM (4 years, 6 months ago)

This shit is so simple, it's complicated. There's a million different ways to do it, because pretty much anything will work as long as it's clean. So then we start getting into 1,000,000 different options, which is just too fucking much.

Then, everyone thinks there way is best and tries to push that on you.

For the absolute simplest method, google "steven pollock rice cake technique". Except replace "colonized agar wedge" with "spore solution".

That's how I started, because I too felt the same way.

There's no other tek that beats the simplicity, or requires less effort. Yields won't be stellar, but sufficient, 5-10 grams each. It'll let you see how it works, and get a little stash to experiment.

That's my 2 cents, at least. Others will point you in there own direction. But ^^^that's the easiest way to get mushrooms.


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OfflineFun_Guy5387
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: Soccrates]
    #27309734 - 05/15/21 11:22 AM (3 years, 7 months ago)

After reading thread this I am more confused than ever. Basically the argument is that grow kits are bad, you must master one of the 10 million different teks, and become an expert. Not everyone has that much time. Instead I must drive all over creation in order to save some money and build my own kit.

What I don't understand is why does someone not make a proper kit with the things you need and none of the stuff you don't?

It would sell like hotcakes. Are there not any good kits out there?

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Invisiblestubb
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: Fun_Guy5387]
    #27309980 - 05/15/21 03:39 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

All over creation?  My local hardware store carries all of this stuff minus the flour.  For that I have to go across the parking lot to the grocery store. 
Plus you can just order than shit on the Internet.  Where the hell were you planning on driving to pick up a psilocybe mushroom growkit in the first place?

There probably are good kits.  But if you can't be bothered to do even just enough research to pull off PF tek, you're apt to fuck up a kit too.  :shrug:

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OfflineFun_Guy5387
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Re: So you're thinking about buying a grow kit? Read this. [Re: stubb]
    #27312525 - 05/17/21 12:49 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

Thank you for your tutorial on how to drive to the store, but that is not the question I was asking.

The question is, if all grow kits suck, why does someone not make a good grow kit, there is great demand and they would make a ton of money. It does not make sense.

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