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goatchild
mr noob


Registered: 10/31/19
Posts: 162
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Re: Very frustrated. Please advise [Re: Smartattack]
#26485519 - 02/14/20 01:59 PM (4 years, 2 days ago) |
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What if you make your own syringes? I did 3 recently. Was super careful and my jars seem ok so far. I guess the problem is even if we get super careful the spores can be infected right? And that would contaminate the syringe?
-------------------- "What stands in the way becomes the way."
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Igloomis
Ranger


Registered: 07/01/18
Posts: 101
Last seen: 1 year, 4 days
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Re: Very frustrated. Please advise [Re: feldman114]
#26485528 - 02/14/20 02:01 PM (4 years, 2 days ago) |
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Can someone please recommend a good step-by-step guide for agar tek?
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feldman114
Stragler


Registered: 09/06/19
Posts: 3,365
Loc: Bravos
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
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Re: Very frustrated. Please advise [Re: goatchild]
#26485531 - 02/14/20 02:03 PM (4 years, 2 days ago) |
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gizmo1



Registered: 06/15/11
Posts: 3,831
Loc: FREEDOM
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Re: Very frustrated. Please advise [Re: feldman114]
#26485538 - 02/14/20 02:06 PM (4 years, 2 days ago) |
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Quote:
feldman114 said: I think the Russian roulette analogy works best here. Cause, if I’m being honest, 4/5 times ms>grain will work...but that one time is gonna be a biiigity bitch.
I was kinda over the whole agar “fad” for a while, until I got a bunk syringe. 7 masters went to shit and I had empty monos waiting for spawn to colonize for weeks. Sooo not worth all the previous success.
Plus, you can’t clone well without agar, and cloning is a game-changer for anyone using ms>grain.
Let me start out by saying I AM NOT suggesting anyone do this, but I used to constantly clone straight to grain and never lost on this method. Now in my new growing space and seeing how often you can get contams on agar while cloning I couldn't suggest this method to anyone. I used to get pretty damn lucky cutting corners. Now I can strive for perfection and chances are I still may fail. Im becoming efficient in keeping my failure from getting in the way of my success though.
OP definitely learn to use agar its super simple and will help you out alot.
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InfiniteDreams


Registered: 10/25/19
Posts: 1,224
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Re: Very frustrated. Please advise [Re: Smartattack]
#26485616 - 02/14/20 03:05 PM (4 years, 2 days ago) |
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Quote:
What do you think is the likelihood of impurity in such a source?
This is biology, not chemistry. Spores are inherently contaminated. That is why agar is crucial, whether from print or syringe, it allows you to isolate clean growth before progressing.
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Igloomis
Ranger


Registered: 07/01/18
Posts: 101
Last seen: 1 year, 4 days
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Quote:
InfiniteDreams said:
Quote:
What do you think is the likelihood of impurity in such a source?
This is biology, not chemistry. Spores are inherently contaminated. That is why agar is crucial, whether from print or syringe, it allows you to isolate clean growth before progressing.
I'm going to do this soon.
It seems like one syringe can go a long way since you're expanding the mycelium via the agar surface, right? In general, how many petri dishes would you recommend preparing, and how many CCs of spore solution from a syringe per dish? Start with one or multiple parallel dishes? And how many generations from the first dish are typical before all contaminants are eliminated?
You can slice the mycelium-bearing agar with a sterile scalpel and drop it directly into the sterilized spawn jars, right?
I already have sterile petri dishes, agar, and malt dextrose.
It seems like once you've got this tek down cloning is a no-brainer next logical step.
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Igloomis
Ranger


Registered: 07/01/18
Posts: 101
Last seen: 1 year, 4 days
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Re: Very frustrated. Please advise [Re: feldman114]
#26485815 - 02/14/20 05:32 PM (4 years, 2 days ago) |
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Quote:
feldman114 said: ...cloning is a game-changer for anyone using ms>grain.
Dumb question. What is the ms in ms>grain?
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MushkingMulah360
Amateur Mycologist


Registered: 01/13/20
Posts: 184
Loc:
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
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Re: Very frustrated. Please advise [Re: Igloomis] 1
#26485896 - 02/14/20 06:24 PM (4 years, 2 days ago) |
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Multi spore
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Sir Pentinite
Stranger all the time.

Registered: 05/15/19
Posts: 525
Loc: ation Location Location
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Re: Very frustrated. Please advise [Re: Igloomis]
#26486024 - 02/14/20 07:33 PM (4 years, 2 days ago) |
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And it's called that because unless you have some specialized equipment, knowledge, and experience, you won't be working with a individual spores.
Quote:
Igloomis said:
It seems like one syringe can go a long way since you're expanding the mycelium via the agar surface, right?
Yep. After the first harvest you can start making spore prints and ditch the syringes altogether. It would be like collecting zucchini seeds from your own garden if one zucchini produced 10 year's worth of seeds.
Quote:
In general, how many petri dishes would you recommend preparing
500mL of prepped agar is enough for 20 or 25 petris (I forget how many are in a sleeve) of the 100x10mm size. I prefer to pour a whole sleeve and store the plates instead of trying to remelt unused agar.
Quote:
and how many CCs of spore solution from a syringe per dish?
One drop per plate is usually the easiest to do although it takes a lot less than that to get growth.
Quote:
Start with one or multiple parallel dishes?
Start with at least several in case there are few that either don't germinate or just grow mold or slime.
Quote:
And how many generations from the first dish are typical before all contaminants are eliminated?
That depends on how clean it was to begin with and how good your technique is. I'd say expect three transfers (four plates) at minimum.
Quote:
You can slice the mycelium-bearing agar with a sterile scalpel and drop it directly into the sterilized spawn jars, right?
Yes, a clean plate can be used to inoculate several jars. A clean jar can be used to inoculate several more jars via grain-to-grain (G2G) transfer.
Quote:
It seems like once you've got this tek down cloning is a no-brainer next logical step.
Exactly!
-------------------- "I thought to myself 'Boy, I'm sure glad there's nobody here to see this because this is exactly the sort of thing that gets people riled-up and they assume you're dying and that something has to be done. Where if you're alone, you know, you either come through it or you die, but in any case you avoid the fuss.'" - Terrence McKenna
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Igloomis
Ranger


Registered: 07/01/18
Posts: 101
Last seen: 1 year, 4 days
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You guys are awesome. Thank you so much!
It sounds like I need a serious change-up of my tek.
There is so MUCH info on this forum, will someone please direct me to a complete and updated step-by-step tek write-up?
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InfiniteDreams


Registered: 10/25/19
Posts: 1,224
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Re: Very frustrated. Please advise [Re: Igloomis] 1
#26486052 - 02/14/20 07:50 PM (4 years, 2 days ago) |
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Here is a great list of teks, you can follow the "Easy AF" series end to end:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24297804
If you are asking about agar specifically the link on that page is great, there are multiple great agar teks, but here is one: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21922023
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feldman114
Stragler


Registered: 09/06/19
Posts: 3,365
Loc: Bravos
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
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Re: Very frustrated. Please advise [Re: Igloomis]
#26486151 - 02/14/20 09:13 PM (4 years, 2 days ago) |
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Quote:
Igloomis said:
Quote:
InfiniteDreams said:
Quote:
What do you think is the likelihood of impurity in such a source?
This is biology, not chemistry. Spores are inherently contaminated. That is why agar is crucial, whether from print or syringe, it allows you to isolate clean growth before progressing.
I'm going to do this soon.
It seems like one syringe can go a long way since you're expanding the mycelium via the agar surface, right? In general, how many petri dishes would you recommend preparing, and how many CCs of spore solution from a syringe per dish? Start with one or multiple parallel dishes? And how many generations from the first dish are typical before all contaminants are eliminated?
You can slice the mycelium-bearing agar with a sterile scalpel and drop it directly into the sterilized spawn jars, right?
I already have sterile petri dishes, agar, and malt dextrose.
It seems like once you've got this tek down cloning is a no-brainer next logical step.
You can probably make 100 plates from 10cc of solution if you wanted. To inoculate, either put one drop of solution on the plate and streak - in a zigzag pattern using an inoculation loop - or, drip 2-3 drops on a sterilized q-tip and swab the agar surface.
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Igloomis
Ranger


Registered: 07/01/18
Posts: 101
Last seen: 1 year, 4 days
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Quote:
InfiniteDreams said: Here is a great list of teks, you can follow the "Easy AF" series end to end:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24297804
If you are asking about agar specifically the link on that page is great, there are multiple great agar teks, but here is one: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21922023
Thanks, ID. What about something more involved? I have a pressure cooker, monotubs, SAB, etc. Just need to get up to date with the latest procedures and materials.
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InfiniteDreams


Registered: 10/25/19
Posts: 1,224
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Re: Very frustrated. Please advise [Re: Igloomis]
#26486644 - 02/15/20 07:42 AM (4 years, 1 day ago) |
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Follow that first link, it is a list of links, and cover everything you mentioned. There is a guide just for how to PC. There is one just for setting up a SAB. There are ones for the agar step, the spawn step, the bulk step. It is end to end.
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,890
Loc: Milky way
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You can't sterilize with disinfectant you can only disinfect/sanitize with disinfectants. you can not sterilize a SAB.
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Igloomis
Ranger



Registered: 07/01/18
Posts: 101
Last seen: 1 year, 4 days
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Re: Very frustrated. Please advise [Re: bodhisatta] 2
#26507104 - 02/27/20 07:18 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Just a quick followup.
I dumped the tub with purchased pre-made bulk. It stalled and never recovered.
I soaked the other tub and I have a second flush but it's dribbling in gradually. I've harvested about 20g over several days, about a handful ripening each day. Weird.
I just picked up a 50 bag of oats and some new tubs, and I'm doing my first agar culture this weekend, so see y'all in the UnBodified Tub thread soon!
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LogicaL Chaos
Ascension Energy & Alien UFOs




Registered: 05/12/07
Posts: 69,595
Loc: The Inexpressible...
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Re: Very frustrated. Please advise [Re: Igloomis]
#26507145 - 02/27/20 07:52 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Igloomis
Ranger



Registered: 07/01/18
Posts: 101
Last seen: 1 year, 4 days
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Re: Very frustrated. Please advise [Re: LogicaL Chaos] 1
#26507935 - 02/28/20 10:26 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Thanks ISUFOs! I have since read several of those front to back. I read Bod's entire threads on the oats and unmodified tub Teks and that's what I'm doing now.
I apologize for starting a thread like this before I realized there are other good places to plug into existing conversations, but I really appreciate the great advice and encouragement.
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