Home | Community | Message Board


This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   North Spore Cultivation Supplies   Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5  [ show all ]
Invisibledbreeze
Stranger
Registered: 06/03/19
Posts: 312
how would a infinite universe work?
    #26475273 - 02/08/20 10:40 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

so the double slit experiment says things like light can be particle or wave depending on how you look. whenn they set up the experiment to see particle thats what they got same for wave (if i am correct this says the universe itself is alive and knows we are looking.) So as we keep looking out to space i think reality will just make more and more space so we never see the end. The bigger the telescope the bigger the universe. Thats what i think it just keeps creating what is just out of reach. So this would mean technicly right now there is a edge we just cant see it. But as we are able to look deeper space would get deeper and we would never find the end. or is everything already made and truely infinite already what do you guys think??


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze]
    #26475467 - 02/08/20 01:09 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

infinitely hard to answer such a question, but maybe while the universe is infinite, the number of stars and the total mass of them is not infinite.
you could ask a big bang specialist about the total mass of the universe, and how dark matter fits in.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDividedQuantumM
Outer Head
Male User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/13
Posts: 9,818
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze]
    #26475499 - 02/08/20 01:20 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Some scientists feel that our universe is infinite, and some feel it is finite. We really have no idea. But one of the most striking hypotheses is that of the multiverse, which comes out of the math of quantum mechanics, inflation theory, string theory, M theory and others, and is generally accepted as legit by many physicists in the areas of quantum mechanics and cosmology.

In the multiverse, our universe is only one universe out of a possible infinity of other universes. Within this hypothesis, it is still not known whether our individual universe has a boundary or not. Some physicists feel the multiverse is probably infinite, and some calculations show that it is actually finite, with about 10^500 different universes. If not truly infinite, 1 with 500 zeroes after it is still, probably, big enough. Especially if each individual universe turns out to have infinite space.

All in all, an interesting topic that we really understand very little about, if anything at all.


--------------------
Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblelaughingdog
Stranger
 User Gallery
Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,828
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #26475659 - 02/08/20 02:56 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

As neither "the infinite" or infinity cannot be imagined, what possible difference could it make?
And any answer can only be a matter of belief.
In the case of prime numbers, it is supposed to be proven that they are infinite.
But of course being abstract they take up no space!!!
https://math.stackexchange.com/questions/272791/how-many-prime-numbers-are-known.

It is said: "the Tao that can be named, is not the 'Tao" (over 2000 years ago : 6th-century BC).
https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Tao
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tao_Te_Ching
In the same way, infinity is not a number.
By definition it has no limit or cannot be defined, as to define is to limit or objectify.
To attempt to answer the question, thus seems to me an exercise in futility, that ignores both the limitations of mind, and the existence of paradox.
The physical universe is presumed to be an object, and hence by de-finition must have a boundary.
Yet in spite of 'big bang theory' of course no one can really imagine a world, or  time before or without time. Like wise no one can imagine a place without space.

Seems to me we get a choice between enjoying a state of wonder in regards to the inexplicable amazing universe, or we can be fearful and so desperate for final answers that we accept some sort of religious dogma that promises final answers.

This didn't work out so well for the Heaven's Gate followers.
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Heaven%27s+Gate+followers&t=h_&ia=web


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblelaughingdog
Stranger
 User Gallery
Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,828
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze]
    #26475665 - 02/08/20 03:02 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

dbreeze said:
so the double slit experiment says things like light can be particle or wave depending on how you look.




Apparently that is an over simplification for nonscientists:

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=particles%2C+waves%2C+or+fields&t=h_&ia=web

for example

"When scientists talk to non-scientists about particle physics, they talk about the smallest building blocks of matter: what you get when you divide cells and molecules into tinier and tinier bits until you can’t divide them any more.

That’s one way of looking at things. But it’s not really the way things are, said Caltech theoretical physicist Sean Carroll in a lecture at Fermilab. And if physicists really want other people to appreciate the discovery of the Higgs boson, he said, it’s time to tell them the rest of the story.

“To understand what is going on, you actually need to give up a little bit on the notion of particles,” Carroll said in the June lecture.

Instead, think in terms of fields."...  rest of article here:

https://www.symmetrymagazine.org/article/july-2013/real-talk-everything-is-made-of-fields

also

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=feilds%2C+particles%2C+waves

-----------
Particles, Fields and The Future of Physics - A Lecture by Sean Carroll

'Sounds starts at 0:19. I recommend adding an annotation at the beginning, as 19 seconds may exceed the "patience threshold" of some users. '



Edited by laughingdog (02/09/20 12:08 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblelaughingdog
Stranger
 User Gallery
Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,828
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: laughingdog]
    #26476174 - 02/08/20 09:34 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

"Seems to me we get a choice between enjoying a state of wonder in regards to the inexplicable amazing universe, or we can be fearful and so desperate for final answers that we accept some sort of religious dogma that promises final answers."

and what is (the state of, or sense of) wonder?



Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMarkostheGnostic
Elder
Male User Gallery


Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida Flag
Last seen: 3 years, 2 days
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze]
    #26476266 - 02/08/20 11:14 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

The known universe is expanding and it seems to be accelerating according to cosmologists. The manifest universe is expanding into the not-yet existent. What does that mean? Maybe the universe is God's dream as they say in Vaishnava Hinduism. Now when one of our dream-egos in in a dreamscape, there is no boundary because the dreamscape is not a physical place it is purely psychic. Perhaps there is a correspondence between these concepts on cosmic scales of magnitude. If God is spirit [S]He is formless and without spacial or temporal extension, just like our dreams.

Now, whether consciousness, psyche is an equal aspect of the universe has been suggested by the psychologist C.G. Jung in collaboration with the physicist Wolfgang Pauli that physics and psyche are two sides of the same reality. They converge in human beings and really in all living creatures who are psychosomatic beings. Why not the very fabric of space-time also being self-aware although not self-created? The Creator or the universe goes by many names and concepts but Whomever It is (surely not Whatever It is because the Creator cannot be less sentient than It's creation), It/[S]He is eternal and IS when the universe was not yet.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #26476483 - 02/09/20 06:35 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

what scientist thinks it is not infinite?


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDividedQuantumM
Outer Head
Male User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/13
Posts: 9,818
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26476575 - 02/09/20 08:37 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Gosh, I don't have a source, but I've read a fair amount about it, and many cosmologists subscribe to the notion that the universe is bounded, and has a shape (but is expanding at the speed of light). Most calculations show it might be a toroid or torus. And, as I have said, there are several who feel it is unbounded and effectively infinite, all this in a multiverse that is infinite or at least transfinite.

As yet, there is not enough evidence to know which position is right, but both sides have many adherents.


--------------------
Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male


Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,230
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #26476602 - 02/09/20 08:59 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

They're 95% certain now the universe is flat (doesn't curve in on itself).

I think the majority consensus is that it's not infinite in 3d, but the source of it should be infinite.

Then again, the size of the universe can only be measured in relation to things inside of it, so I'm not sure size is relevant to the universe. Big or small? It's "big" compared to me. It's bigger than anything! :lol:


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDividedQuantumM
Outer Head
Male User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/13
Posts: 9,818
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Rahz]
    #26476612 - 02/09/20 09:02 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Yeah, either way it's big enough.


--------------------
Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleAsante
Mage
Male User Gallery

Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,795
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze]
    #26476622 - 02/09/20 09:07 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Imagine, you have an endless void that tends to form bubbles that degrade into stronger, smaller bubbles, until the smallest bubbles pop and void remains.

Now imagine that in this void, there's a phemomenon where at once you get a raging foam of bubbles in one spot, a big bang, that initially very rapidly and finally, very slowly, has its bubbles pop until void remains, through a Big Rip that bursts all bubbles.

Then you're there.

About the nature of all things, my Spirit Guide said this:






That's it.

Combine that and there you have your infinite universe.

But, it has consequences!

As my spirit guide puts it:


Quote:


THE END?

There is a beginning, and there is an end to all things. we grieve the loss of what we hold dear and go on until we, too, end.


But! What if this universe is eternal? What if all things that once begun and ended, will happen again in every possible way, forever?

Think about it! You would not just have one life, but you would have every possible life, in every possible way, forever!

That means that no matter what you lose, your keys, your friends, your life, it would all come back to you, forever.

Rather than a prisoner of circumstance, you are liberated into total freedom.

Even if the sun would explode, a new earth would be, life would form on it and you will be born again into every possible reality.

Be free! Be brave! Play! Work! Achieve! Love!

Not even all the nukes in the world can stop you!

YOU ARE ETERNAL!





So, don't fear the Reaper. Dont fear your bubble bursting. it will emerge anew.
YOU ARE THAT FOAMY VOID.




Not even all the nukes of the Earth can blow that away.



Want a quick primer on THE MAGNIFICENCE OF YOU?


Hold onto your hat!




--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
higher knowledge starts here


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Asante]
    #26476676 - 02/09/20 09:44 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

the extent of all matter in this infinite space, which is the universe, is finite but immense, however the space of the universe - which is all that there is, is infinite.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleAsante
Mage
Male User Gallery

Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,795
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26476699 - 02/09/20 10:01 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
the extent of all matter in this infinite space, which is the universe, is finite but immense, however the space of the universe - which is all that there is, is infinite.





I disagree.

Void is not absolute. An amount of energy is proportionate to an amount of void..

Thus, an infinite fireworks show of big bangs going off in every possible way, forever!

A finite amount of energy per big bang though.

A big bang is a particle which decays, like a neutron. It just happens to be a VERY BIG particle decaying into an IMMENSE number of particles and antiparticles. Its a bubble giving rise to a foam.




--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
higher knowledge starts here


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male


Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,230
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Asante]
    #26476733 - 02/09/20 10:22 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Something very similar, I tend to think of the universe dissolving. This idea came about due to something I read which states that space is a product of sub-atomic interactions. Gravity and space-time are related. Therefore, since everything radiates, eventually there will be no mass. No mass = no space = a singularity.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblelaughingdog
Stranger
 User Gallery
Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,828
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Rahz]
    #26476936 - 02/09/20 12:57 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

.    Seems to me, metaphysically speaking, the question, is based on the assumption, that "things" must either exist or not exist. But do numbers exist? They have no location or weight, or any measurable characteristics - except in relation to one another. Yet math seems to explain the most fundamental aspects of the physical world. The concept of infinity is even more abstract, and there are many! *
So infinities "exist" within the universe. Does this mean the universe must be infinite to contain them? And if they can be contained are they infinite?

* "...Thus the mathematical concept of infinity refines and extends the old philosophical concept, in particular by introducing infinitely many different sizes of infinite sets. Among the axioms of Zermelo–Fraenkel set theory, on which most of modern mathematics can be developed, is the axiom of infinity, which guarantees the existence of infinite sets.[2] ..."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infinity


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male


Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,230
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: laughingdog]
    #26476979 - 02/09/20 01:41 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

I suspect the universe can be described materialistically, and there is a finite quality to such observations but even in that case time makes it infinite. The end is the beginning.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblelaughingdog
Stranger
 User Gallery
Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,828
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Rahz]
    #26477009 - 02/09/20 02:10 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

.    In terms of our experience the universe, as we experience it, is incomprehensible, infinite, and inconceivable.
.  Consider all the thoughts in a day, all the sights, all the leaves on a single tree one sees, the sensations of every step one takes, the changing tastes of every bite of food one chews, the changing body from youth to old age eventually leading to death, changing desires, moods, feelings etc. 99.99...% of all this vanishes, almost immediately. And most of the rest fairly shortly thereafter.
.  Because our minds generalize, and we make up stories about ourselves and our lives, just as movies, comics, stories & dreams do---that is by making cuts from shot to shot (in movies), or frame to frame (comics), paragraphs & chapters (stories and books) and yet get caught up in emotions relating to the story line, we get the feeling that we have a continuous and real time grasp of what is going on.
.  But again like a movie made of still pictures, but run at 24 or 32 frames per second,
this notion is pure illusion. We focus on what we take to be important, and never miss the infinities we ignore.
.    Of course when tripping a bit more is revealed, and it feels amazing, but it is still only "a drop in the ocean", and we seemingly are still in "Plato's cave".
.    Since our own experiencing is on the one hand much richer than we can fathom intellectually, and on the other hand so limited in terms of what is actually continually happening, speculating on some supposed objective reality (that presumably also contains all subjective realities), seems a strange endeavor to me.


Edited by laughingdog (02/09/20 02:35 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: laughingdog]
    #26477681 - 02/09/20 09:41 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

so infinite then,  ok


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMarkostheGnostic
Elder
Male User Gallery


Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida Flag
Last seen: 3 years, 2 days
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: redgreenvines] * 1
    #26478630 - 02/10/20 01:48 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Not necessarily. "Infinite or finite. One of the presently unanswered questions about the universe is whether it is infinite or finite in extent." - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shape_of_the_universe The expanding universe is expanding into the unmanifest, the 'not yet.' There is no pre-existent infinite space 'beyond' the expanding horizon (some 13.8 billion lightyears from some unknown point of origination) into which the universe is expanding.  I will not pretend to understand non-Euclidean geometry or advanced calculus (I did rather poorly in Euclidean geometry and Calculus I). But I cannot help but wax metaphysical and metaphorical when discussing this. We cannot grasp this in imagination and our psyche generates a 'place-holder,' an image of empty, starless void beyond the expanding universe of galaxies to take the place of an incomprehensible Mystery.

Professional mathematicians are not exempt from such processes within the psyche so they take a stand on flat, positive, or negative curvatures and make an assumption about finite or infinite because even though they can formulate equations to express  age, size, and velocity, the boundary/edge is a transcendental problem that defies all logic for anyone, mathematicians included. Going backwards in time to the origin of space-time 10-43 seconds ago, the Big Bang event. The mind also cannot imagine being a singularity, a mathematical point. The mind must use spacial representations and a point cannot be imagined unless it is a point on a line, a plane, a sphere, etc. But according to cosmology space itself did not exist prior to the Big Bang (or, the biblical "Fiat Lux!" which I think is the same thing expressed in mythic language). The universe did not expand from a mathematical point to its current size/shape into a pre-existent void. The void grew from the singularity/point. But again, this defies imagination because we cannot comprehend zero-dimension.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinepacmanbreed
 User Gallery


Registered: 10/12/16
Posts: 3,659
Last seen: 1 year, 11 months
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze]
    #26478858 - 02/10/20 04:09 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Double slits Sound both finity and infinity to me. From macro(galaxy-universe(s)....) to micro/nano(atom-quark(s)....).

Not by ever expansion:
Very recently, high calibre international scientists were presenting evidences that contradicted the idea of Doppler and Hubble that Red Shift implies stars and galaxies are going farther from each other, therefore suggesting an ever expanding universe

So in an expanding Universe the most distant galaxies should have hundreds of times dimmer surface brightness than similar nearby galaxies, making them actually undetectable with present-day telescopes.

But that is not what observations show, as demonstrated by this new study published in the International Journal of Modern Physics D.

The scientists carefully compared the size and brightness of about a thousand nearby and extremely distant galaxies. They chose the most luminous spiral galaxies for comparisons, matching the average luminosity of the near and far samples.

Contrary to the prediction of the Big Bang theory, they found that the surface brightnesses of the near and far galaxies are identical.

These results are consistent with what would be expected from ordinary geometry if the Universe was not expanding, and are in contradiction with the drastic dimming of surface brightness predicted by the expanding Universe hypothesis.
http://www.sci-news.com/astronomy/science-universe-not-expanding-01940.html


but by a end-point/edge/finity, in an Infinitum(Alive fractal).



Edited by pacmanbreed (02/11/20 07:22 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineBrendanFlock
Stranger
Male

Registered: 06/01/13
Posts: 4,216
Last seen: 2 hours, 48 minutes
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: pacmanbreed] * 1
    #26479406 - 02/10/20 11:18 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Every time you observe something you naturally react to it.

So like whats the deal with frames of experience? Maybe the frames are real and interacting with you?

Like ideas are suits that have textures..


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineBrendanFlock
Stranger
Male

Registered: 06/01/13
Posts: 4,216
Last seen: 2 hours, 48 minutes
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: BrendanFlock] * 1
    #26479407 - 02/10/20 11:19 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Time is art!

When sewn together properly..

Being beyond time is true freedom!


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibledbreeze
Stranger
Registered: 06/03/19
Posts: 312
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: BrendanFlock] * 1
    #26479858 - 02/11/20 09:47 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Maybe "that wich is not" (shiva) is infinite and the material inside is expanding into that but expanding at such a rate that is quicker than we are discovering it...to me that is the most simple way to describe it....i personally dont know the science of it. even the big bang do we know for sure it happened?...isnt it that we think it happened because the universe is expanding scientist have argued over it expanding to nothing or collapsing down on itself what if it breathes (gets bigger for a while until the force pushing it out isnt enough then it colapses back a little then expands again.....essentially everything in life has a way of being "recycled" so why not the universe itself


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offliner00tcmplx
Stranger

Registered: 02/19/18
Posts: 419
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze] * 1
    #26480889 - 02/11/20 07:14 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

dbreeze said:
so the double slit experiment says things like light can be particle or wave depending on how you look. whenn they set up the experiment to see particle thats what they got same for wave (if i am correct this says the universe itself is alive and knows we are looking.) So as we keep looking out to space i think reality will just make more and more space so we never see the end. The bigger the telescope the bigger the universe. Thats what i think it just keeps creating what is just out of reach. So this would mean technicly right now there is a edge we just cant see it. But as we are able to look deeper space would get deeper and we would never find the end. or is everything already made and truely infinite already what do you guys think??




Infinite can just be considered as anything past the point that you can count and when you arrive at it, it increases again and again beyond your capture ad infinitum. Our galaxy is 1000 light years across. That means, even if you could  travel at the speed of light, it would take 1000 years to get to the other side. You'd be dead by then simply put.

Now consider that there are trillions of galaxies, some 1000 times bigger than ours...
What sensical basis beyond theoretical physicists trying to establish things about our universe does the concept of infinite even have any merit? How do you even establish concretely if there is an edge to the universe when you can't even travel across your own galaxy ....you literally can't which is why all of this is held in theoretical physics which is based on a slew of assumptions the average person takes for granted. At the center of our galaxy is a massive black hole. Still no word on what localized distortions this creates by MATTER of FACT science. For all we know, all of what we see could be a lensed bubble distortion from within our galaxy... Why? because we've never sent anything outside of it.. Not even in the least :

Our furthest telescopes have barely even escaped the bow shock bubble of our localized solar system orbiting the center of our galaxy :



I get the idea of human wonder and basking in and enjoying it but its good to ground this stuff every now and again.
It's also good to understand the limits of science and its theories and framings. A lot of it tbqh, is b.s


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optical_aberration

https://arxiv.org/pdf/1909.04401.pdf
Infinite this and that and for all we know were in a bubble with optical properties we haven't the slightest grasp of because that's all were using as data.. what we can see throughout the EM spectrum


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibledbreeze
Stranger
Registered: 06/03/19
Posts: 312
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: r00tcmplx]
    #26481678 - 02/12/20 09:58 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Well thats kinda my point.i think we can only see/measure so far out the universe is still being created things are still happening. my spiritual belief is everything including the universe itself is alive it knows we are loooking and creates more to look at as soon as we can see farther. Like i said that is a belief i have but many scientist are now talking about our universe as a simulation like real life matrix maybe its smart and acts like that we WILL NEVER get the big scope of everything cause as soon as we see that it builds more. So technicly i guess its finite but we cant see the edge and never will so thinking of it as infinte is ok. but if its finite whats outside of that is there a point where everything hits a literal wall. or does physicality run out meaning when you get to a certain point all the galaxies are behind you (but again we would never get there)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male


Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,230
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze]
    #26481710 - 02/12/20 10:19 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

We can see light from about 13.8 billion light years away. We have equipment to see further than that but there doesn't appear to be anything. This is generally said to be because the universe is only 13.8 billion years old and light from anything further hasn't had time to reach here.

This makes the visible universe about 28 billion light years across but because of expansion it's estimated the size of the visible universe now is much larger.

I don't know the evidence behind it but many cosmologists think the universe is actually about 7 trillion light years across. I have read up to 50 trillion but that was years ago and 7 trillion seems to be a more modern estimate.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offliner00tcmplx
Stranger

Registered: 02/19/18
Posts: 419
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze]
    #26482126 - 02/12/20 02:55 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

dbreeze said:
Well thats kinda my point.




Stick to it...

Quote:

dbreeze said:
i think we can only see/measure so far out the universe is still being created things are still happening. my spiritual belief is everything including the universe itself is alive it knows we are loooking and creates more to look at as soon as we can see farther.




And here's where things go off the rails. If I put a chair in a room. The chair is there. It doesn't care if you're looking at it or not. You can leave and come back a year later and the chair will be there. The universe isn't reacting to you beyond local interactions. Further, what you see is photons/EM being adsorbed and reflected. It doesn't care about your existence. It isn't reacting to you. As far as your eyes are concerned, it terminates on your retina. That's it. A healthy study of optics will serve you well here.



Quote:

dbreeze said:
Like i said that is a belief i have but many scientist are now talking about our universe as a simulation like real life matrix




This is what's known as pop-science and theoretical physics. It's literal shower-thoughts from educated people. Please don't take this stuff seriously as no one of a scientific pedigree does.

Quote:

dbreeze said:
maybe its smart and acts like that we WILL NEVER get the big scope of everything cause as soon as we see that it builds more.




Except this is not how light works. It interacts with things, is absorbed and re-emitted, this is what you see. A sea of water flowing around. The water, unless your hand is in the stream, doesn't react to you or interact with you. Light terminates on your retina. The universe isn't some game engine responding to your actions here on earth 1 billion light years away.


Quote:

dbreeze said:
So technicly i guess its finite but we cant see the edge and never will so thinking of it as infinte is ok.




It's ok to believe in anything. It's not ok to assert it as truth or anything beyond a belief. When I maintain a belief that is 'way out there'.. I spend time and effort to ground it and ultimately I maintain it in order to get somewhere. I have wild beliefs. However, every day I widdle away at them and ground them in a plausible reality. The concept of the universe reacting to you beyond physics was weighted down some time ago. People used to think you send beams out of your eyes that causes the universe to respond....

Quote:

dbreeze said:
but if its finite whats outside of that is there a point where everything hits a literal wall. or does physicality run out meaning when you get to a certain point all the galaxies are behind you (but again we would never get there)



Ultimately, until you reach that limit, it frankly does/doesn't exist nor does it matter. For theoretical physics, they are paid to explore the range of possibility and permutation of possibility but that isn't to say that 99% of it isn't foolishness. I maintain that the universe is both finite/infinite because neither belief gets me anything of value. The universe could be a simulation or it couldn't, unless you're able to exit it, you can't prove it. Until you hit a limit, it does/doesn't exist. As I said, infinite is literally anything past what you can measure/observe/quantify... And once you hit that limit, a new one will be present and so on and so forth.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offliner00tcmplx
Stranger

Registered: 02/19/18
Posts: 419
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Rahz]
    #26482136 - 02/12/20 03:00 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Rahz said:
We can see light from about 13.8 billion light years away.




This is a theory.

Quote:

Rahz said:
We have equipment to see further than that but there doesn't appear to be anything. This is generally said to be because the universe is only 13.8 billion years old and light from anything further hasn't had time to reach here.




This is a theory based on lots of other theories and assumptions.

Quote:

Rahz said:
This makes the visible universe about 28 billion light years across but because of expansion it's estimated the size of the visible universe now is much larger.




Yet another theory.

Quote:

Rahz said:
I don't know the evidence behind it but many cosmologists think the universe is actually about 7 trillion light years across. I have read up to 50 trillion but that was years ago and 7 trillion seems to be a more modern estimate.



A theory.

Fun and creative to think of it as fact. However, it's all conjecture and theory.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_lens
As there are no broadly established systems model from micro to macro that capture all phenomenon, we quite frankly don't know what were measuring or seeing at incredible distances. Instead, we have theoretical models based on even more theories that give us plausible ideas of what it is. As I said, we could be in one big limited bubble even within our own galaxy and everything out of it could be distorted. Meanwhile, there's this theory that we see things clearly outside of it and its 28 billion light years old.... Wrong : That's just a theory based on pretty loosely strung together theories. Good and great that someone put it together and put lots of work into it but still based on theory.

We know nothing about the significantly small or large nor of far away things.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male


Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,230
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: r00tcmplx]
    #26482473 - 02/12/20 06:37 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

It's theory, not established fact. There are issues that can complicate the answers but the evidence and science behind the simple answer is fairly sound. Besides, knowing or considering such things has no practical purpose. It is for fun. Fuel for the imagination.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblelaughingdog
Stranger
 User Gallery
Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,828
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Rahz]
    #26482664 - 02/12/20 08:07 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

What physicists are working on now
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=sean+carroll%2C+fields
especially this one which is fascinating:
"Particles, Fields and The Future of Physics" A Lecture by Sean Carroll
& more by him
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=sean+carroll

the joy of science and wonder, was a remarkable man:
Richard Feynman
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=feynman
the first two are great


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleYellow Pants
Male User Gallery

Registered: 05/14/17
Posts: 1,386
Loc: Flag
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: laughingdog]
    #26482718 - 02/12/20 08:27 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Condensed energy, substance, explodes and progresses (Big Bang), falls back into itself (torus and/or contraction), new condensed energy substance.  We go around.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offliner00tcmplx
Stranger

Registered: 02/19/18
Posts: 419
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Rahz]
    #26483907 - 02/13/20 03:04 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Rahz said:
It's theory, not established fact. There are issues that can complicate the answers but the evidence and science behind the simple answer is fairly sound. Besides, knowing or considering such things has no practical purpose. It is for fun. Fuel for the imagination.



Glad we concur. I agree 100% and treat it as such.. and the thing about that is once you've burnt out the mystery of a thing, you long and strive to create another. It's a ride that never ends. So, while I might critique anther's mystery as I have already done in my own personal life sufficiently to for instance call it flawed/incorrect/foolish, I indeed have some even farther off one I built atop it. Enough to say that ultimately say, we all believe in foolishness such to a degree that we take ourselves further beyond the mundane


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offliner00tcmplx
Stranger

Registered: 02/19/18
Posts: 419
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Yellow Pants]
    #26483909 - 02/13/20 03:05 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Yellow Pants said:
Condensed energy, substance, explodes and progresses (Big Bang), falls back into itself (torus and/or contraction), new condensed energy substance.  We go around.




As framed here :
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyclic_model

A form/idea I partially subscribe too


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleYellow Pants
Male User Gallery

Registered: 05/14/17
Posts: 1,386
Loc: Flag
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: r00tcmplx]
    #26484239 - 02/13/20 07:10 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

r00tcmplx said:
Quote:

Yellow Pants said:
Condensed energy, substance, explodes and progresses (Big Bang), falls back into itself (torus and/or contraction), new condensed energy substance.  We go around.




As framed here :
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyclic_model

A form/idea I partially subscribe too




No reason to subscribe fully.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offliner00tcmplx
Stranger

Registered: 02/19/18
Posts: 419
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Yellow Pants]
    #26484258 - 02/13/20 07:19 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Yellow Pants said:
Quote:

r00tcmplx said:
Quote:

Yellow Pants said:
Condensed energy, substance, explodes and progresses (Big Bang), falls back into itself (torus and/or contraction), new condensed energy substance.  We go around.




As framed here :
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyclic_model

A form/idea I partially subscribe too




No reason to subscribe fully.



Never is for ideation/imagination.
I maintain multiple theories .. some even contradict each other... Whatever gives me better ideas for my work.
I wish more people grasped this. Then again, when someone is married to or fully subscribed, it forms very good debates and can lead to good things. So, I always appreciate a good argument. So long as it is intelligible, which is hard to find.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinekitten6
hiker
Male
Registered: 05/13/19
Posts: 96
Loc: UK 0161
Last seen: 13 hours, 52 minutes
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze]
    #26484808 - 02/14/20 06:48 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

I don't think any of us are qualified to say anything in this matter. But i think its cool. Maybe it would be a kind of fractal that you can go infinitely deep into but the fractal has many dimensions, 8 dimensions maybe. An 8 dimensional shape, regular?.

That would be cool, because then there would be all kinds of proof for metaphysicals, and world convergence.  Things that dictate time. How do we even measure time? Do we even measure that?

Maybe that would mean that the stars do indeed dictate the course of causality. Astrology would be real, and phenomenons like alchemy and magic could be real. What do they call it? cabalistic? Hermetics? Are they the same thing? Who knows. Stars have the closest connection to the higher dimensions and where you are in terms of the stars dictates everything maybe?

Not much magical shit happening much at this point in time. Or maybe it does but we just don't know. We'd have to study the books of old written down in the ancient libraries of there was once a point where wisdom from the west and wisdom from the east converged. Now i think western wisdom has taken over and eastern wisdom is all but forgotten by most. Probably need to bring this into balance again maybe.

Scientists can have good look trying to figure the truth out I don't think they will ever succeed because the answer is already within us, it is within us all. We are nowhere near the truth and science is not going to bring us any closer, I think there was a point where we did know the truth but these days are lost in time. But maybe there are still survivors of this age. lets hope they still remember. 

Scientists will have times of great progression but this progression is in no means bringing us closer to truth, just how to manipulate the truth to our own benefit so we can fly around in aeroplanes and shit like who the fuck asked.

I think we are coming closer to the turning point where scientists will be overwhelmed by truth and have no idea how to interpret it. Once the meteorites start landing most people are gna be fucked.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: kitten6]
    #26484893 - 02/14/20 07:42 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

at the moment, I think Trump is suppressing all science by executive privilege, as well as suppressing other representations of truth/reality in the media, while paying big bucks to generate untruth customized to suit every type of character on Facebook.

forget the time space continuum, which remains complex for the brightest among the brightest. any basic facts at this particular time are being challenged and the crowds are being whooped into a kind of neo-nazi frenzy.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offliner00tcmplx
Stranger

Registered: 02/19/18
Posts: 419
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26485721 - 02/14/20 04:33 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
at the moment, I think Trump is suppressing all science by executive privilege, as well as suppressing other representations of truth/reality in the media, while paying big bucks to generate untruth customized to suit every type of character on Facebook.




Most science isn't science. Lately, it's been iterative B.S for funding and profit. It's been a lot of disinformation/misinformation. There's been lots of plagiarism. There's been lots of falsified data. There's been a lack of innovation or new ideas. There's been a lack of funding of truly innovative research. There's been corruption. There's been an echo chamber. There's been bureaucratic nonsense and gate keeping. Trump has nothing to do with this but any business person will tell you, when you have such broad spread waste/graft, cut the funding/pull the plug, let the chips fall where they may, and let it collapse and build something better from the dust after it settles. You can't suppress science, truth. No one has the power. No one stops anyone from publishing a paper. It's drop dead simple. The media especially mainstream media and social media are filled with lies because the average person couldn't be bothered to spend their precious time filtering it out and/or looking for the truth. Lies are easier. Sensationalist b.s captures people's attention and is more profitable. This was going on long before and will continue long after the idiot we have in office is gone. Part of the reason he was elected is because the average person in America is an idiot.


Please explain this chicken/egg paradox :
Quote:

redgreenvines said:
while paying big bucks to generate untruth customized to suit every type of character on Facebook.




What came first? the widespread business and practice or trump's usage of it towards his ends like every other clown ass in the west?


Quote:

redgreenvines said:
forget the time space continuum, which remains complex for the brightest among the brightest. any basic facts at this particular time are being challenged and the crowds are being whooped into a kind of neo-nazi frenzy.



Those with intelligence aren't forgetting, they are pursuing understanding in earnest even as the masses chow-down on dogfood media. Facts and truth don't change just because a swell of people decide to be idiots and center on idiocy. The gap simply grows between those with intelligence who can impact/build/create things and those that can't... and this is a self-willed result and not the fault of anyone else besides the individual who consumes junkfood. You can't challenge facts. They stand alone. You can create a big scene but only idiots will be attracted.



Quote:

redgreenvines said:
the crowds are being whooped into a kind of neo-nazi frenzy.




I've really enjoyed, as a black man online, when a white person calls me a neo-nazi.
Just goes to show the frantic disconnect people have with reality now-a-days.

Nothing occurs in a vacuum, if hate is fomented to a degree of absurdity and it is widespread, there likely is a root cause. If people play dumb about the root cause and try to obscure it, the problem just gets worst. Life is cyclical and zero sum. If you play stupid games, eventually you'll win a stupid prize. If you claim everything is everything and is fine and good eventually someone will use that logic to do something deplorable enough to challenge such logic. If you liberally abandon sound practices, you invite chaos. If you try to change society too fast, you will make mistakes, piss people off, and cause people to act against you. If you try to shove something down people's throats, they will react in kind. If you try to destroy traditional social values and demonize people who uphold them, you'll invite chaos and chaos leaders. Liberals are as much to blame as anyone as to why a chaotic candidate got put into office. The same holds for the historic precedence. Play stupid games and eventually you'll win a stupid prize. I don't doubt for a minute that humans who play these advanced games in society aren't aware of their actions. The universe and cosmos is simply answering/responding. Unless a persons considers them-self a God, no one is above the cosmic universe. You can challenge its natures and limits all you want. History defines what will result. Playing dumb when the cosmos answers back also doesn't change anything.

:heytheresexy:
Getting a special kick out of various factions of Human beings calling themselves masters of the Cosmos in modern times only to be crushed under far more transcendent orders and powers. It's especially hilarious when people craft false realities around themselves and their movements and pretend as though the cosmos/universe will conform.

The cosmos is the Koolaid man. It doesn't care about what fake walls you construct around yourself. It will always break through and show you what reality is.

You can't run. You can't hide and no wall is strong enough.

When you play stupid games against society and people, eventually they'll use your same games and tactics against you and on goes the sick cycle of universal suffering.


Edited by r00tcmplx (02/14/20 04:50 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: DividedQuantum] * 1
    #26485814 - 02/14/20 05:31 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

DividedQuantum said:
Gosh, I don't have a source, but I've read a fair amount about it, and many cosmologists subscribe to the notion that the universe is bounded, and has a shape (but is expanding at the speed of light). Most calculations show it might be a toroid or torus. And, as I have said, there are several who feel it is unbounded and effectively infinite, all this in a multiverse that is infinite or at least transfinite.

Infinity only exists, even in mathematics, because a path towards it exists which is less than infinite
As yet, there is not enough evidence to know which position is right, but both sides have many adherents.



What if infinity was something that seemed finite when observed but also seemed to be increasing at the maximum allowed speed for the observer. Just like any mathematical function it doesn't really matter until its observed/solved for some value. Because we perceive at all especially the fact we perceive time makes an expanding universe perhaps technically an infinite universe that appears to have bounds that expand as a function of time like its the X axis.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26485818 - 02/14/20 05:33 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Infinity only exists because there's a path to it made out of non infinite things


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblelaughingdog
Stranger
 User Gallery
Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,828
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26485846 - 02/14/20 05:53 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

is that so?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: laughingdog]
    #26485964 - 02/14/20 07:03 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Change my mind


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblelaughingdog
Stranger
 User Gallery
Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,828
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26486061 - 02/14/20 07:57 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

I love your reply
I will return the favor
change my mind
by clarifying what you mean by ' a path leading up to' & giving an example


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDividedQuantumM
Outer Head
Male User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/13
Posts: 9,818
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26486234 - 02/14/20 10:19 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:
Quote:

DividedQuantum said:
Gosh, I don't have a source, but I've read a fair amount about it, and many cosmologists subscribe to the notion that the universe is bounded, and has a shape (but is expanding at the speed of light). Most calculations show it might be a toroid or torus. And, as I have said, there are several who feel it is unbounded and effectively infinite, all this in a multiverse that is infinite or at least transfinite.

Infinity only exists, even in mathematics, because a path towards it exists which is less than infinite
As yet, there is not enough evidence to know which position is right, but both sides have many adherents.



What if infinity was something that seemed finite when observed but also seemed to be increasing at the maximum allowed speed for the observer. Just like any mathematical function it doesn't really matter until its observed/solved for some value. Because we perceive at all especially the fact we perceive time makes an expanding universe perhaps technically an infinite universe that appears to have bounds that expand as a function of time like its the X axis.





Yes, this is like limits in calculus, or even more specifically, the "transfinite" sets of Cantor. There are all sorts of finite infinities in mathematics, and to some extent also in nature. What you describe is probably one of them. For example, how many numbers are there between 1 and 2? The answer is: an infinite number. There is an infinite number of decimals in between one and two, yet one and two are only separated by a single integer. That stuff gets wild if you're interested in reading about it further. You make a good point.


--------------------
Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: laughingdog]
    #26486255 - 02/14/20 10:34 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

laughingdog said:
I love your reply
I will return the favor
change my mind
by clarifying what you mean by ' a path leading up to' & giving an example



Infinities are only found by paths that converge towards them.
asymptotes and limits are the physical manifestations of mathematics to describe these paths. Whether it's a series or function it's really a path to infinity. And anywhere before infinities that path can be integrated to give a finite values.

We can only say how big the universe is with respect to time. The universe doesn't really care about time only humans do. The "size of the universe" is everything from t=0 to t=∞

You need to ask the size of the universe at t=x and integrate from t=o to t=x to get the universe size at that given time.

Presumably time goes forever so at t=∞ the area of the universe would also be ∞
(In an expanding universe or assuming expansion)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26486262 - 02/14/20 10:45 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

I imagine the universe ending in a big crunch scenario with a " negative big bang" such that through t=0 to t=∞ there's a oscillating area with net 0 and during the inverse big bang it is like a mirror of our universe that cancels out the "zero point energy" of the universe field.

We perceive time but the universe does not. Everything happens immediately from t= 0 to ∞ so the "eventual" negative side of the oscillation cancels out the positive and the reason we exist is because literally nothing split apart into positive and negative equals.

But that may be some nutty idea too


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: r00tcmplx]
    #26486974 - 02/15/20 11:52 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

r00tcmplx said:
Quote:

redgreenvines said:
at the moment, I think Trump is suppressing all science by executive privilege, as well as suppressing other representations of truth/reality in the media, while paying big bucks to generate untruth customized to suit every type of character on Facebook.




Most science isn't science. ...



wrong, funded research may not be science, but science really is science, unless you are laying foundations for your own alternate truth.
Astonishingly Trump is inclined to revise weather warnings to his whim, and completely deny all environmental science and climate change.
Let us not start finding cracks in science to support and empower absolute buffoonery.

Quote:


Please explain this chicken/egg paradox :
Quote:

redgreenvines said:
while paying big bucks to generate untruth customized to suit every type of character on Facebook.




What came first? the widespread business and practice or trump's usage of it towards his ends like every other clown ass in the west?




targeting ads is one thing
ads that are lies are regulated under laws governing false advertising.
targeted political lies are not being governed as false advertising (even though they are an implementation of that same IT infrastructure).
the chicken is facebook's relationship with advertising that can be political (should that not also be covered by the same laws for false advertising?) and with twitter permitting lies if they are political.
the egg is on all of our  faces with that.
Quote:

...

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
the crowds are being whooped into a kind of neo-nazi frenzy.




I've really enjoyed, as a black man online, when a white person calls me a neo-nazi.
Just goes to show the frantic disconnect people have with reality now-a-days.
...



did you interpret that I was calling you a neo-Nazi, are you actually whooping it up for Trumpy wumpy?


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offliner00tcmplx
Stranger

Registered: 02/19/18
Posts: 419
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26487080 - 02/15/20 01:18 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
wrong, funded research may not be science, but science really is science, unless you are laying foundations for your own alternate truth.




When you speak of science, it is generally agreed upon that you're refunded to funded scientific research which is what you framed in your own commentary. With that being said, and being on the same page, the state of funded scientific research is in shambles and it has to do with over-funding and the bureaucracy, graft, and corruption therein not under-funding. Unfunded self-led science, of course, with less of these ailments indeed really is science as there are minimal detractors.

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
Astonishingly Trump is inclined to revise weather warnings to his whim, and completely deny all environmental science and climate change.
Let us not start finding cracks in science to support and empower absolute buffoonery.




I'm not even sure I want to get started on this topic as I rarely find people are personally, scientifically, and formally educated on the matter to speak intelligently on it. Echoing common themes and talking points doesn't mean any of them are correct. Trump is a clown in many ways but the state of funded scientific research is in the gutter and Over-funded not underfunded. Cutting funds to shenanigans is the first step in getting back to a proper baseline. 

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
targeting ads is one thing
ads that are lies are regulated under laws governing false advertising.




So, you're correctly saying that modern media, social media, and marketing firms push misinformation and b.s 24/7 ... and that industry worth hundreds of billions of dollars was present before trump got elected.. Namely, it was used by Obama for 8+ years setting a precedence. Correct.

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
did you interpret that I was calling you a neo-Nazi, are you actually whooping it up for Trumpy wumpy?




I called the very mention of nazi/neo-nazi to be absurd. I did so partially by referencing that I'm black but it is not discernible online so I've been called a neo-nazi/nazi hilariously a number of times. Trumpy wumpy? Also get called a trump supporter even though I never voted for him and think he's an idiot. Seems people have some serious hangups that cloud their ability to grasp reality... makes it hard to talk about something as complex as climate change intelligently especially as its likely something that requires a graduate degree in various feeder disciplines to even begin parsing the foundations intelligently. Yet, everyone has an opinion and thinks they're right simply because they're parroting mainstream media talking points that are proven to contain tons of lies/misinformation.

Yet, by referencing some 'expert' or something someone mentioned in main-stream media, Ah' the masses think they are in the right. How incredibly flawed our society.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: r00tcmplx]
    #26487148 - 02/15/20 02:10 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

It might be possible to have a conversation in real time with you , but this point for point is not working in my opinion, because we seem not to be getting eachothers' points:
a) science funding as well as military funding and medical research (which is not the same as science funding in general) all work at less efficiency than road building or house construction (which are also rife with graft or favoritism and politics).
the cost of exploratory ventures is high, but valuable, especially as it feeds back into education (which should also be funded) - no education leads to stupid people (like trump and trumpists). Arguing about science funding is not where I am coming from - but research is the tip of the spear for our developing world, and also for our recovering world as relates to getting the environment back in order.
b) Self directed science projects may or may not turn into science, though often a rogue thinker disassembles systems uniquely and puts them back together in new ways. I have not been talking about any of this.

I also have never looked at the Obama administration's use of social media, but I would not expect that it would use the principle of falsification in order to mobilize voters against each other. I am really surprised that you brought up that type of polarity yourself. Bringing up Obama's use of fake news in Facebook (without clear examples) not functional at this time, FAKE NEWS is pretty new on facebook which is pretty new in the world. It is as if you inserted it to make seem true (and that is an abuse of this forum, and of my time and attention).

When lying people intentionally polarize the public, they are treating all people as sub-human. like playing with static electricity to make shocks - that seems to be a poor way to spend money. I would prefer to waste money on scientific research, and waste it on the arts too, for that matter.

Apparently some people have excess of it and others don't.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offliner00tcmplx
Stranger

Registered: 02/19/18
Posts: 419
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26487226 - 02/15/20 03:05 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
It is as if you inserted it to make seem true (and that is an abuse of this forum, and of my time and attention).




I had a long, detailed, and informative reply written up but I'm going to do the smart thing and avoid replying.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblelaughingdog
Stranger
 User Gallery
Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,828
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26487701 - 02/15/20 10:23 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:
Quote:

laughingdog said:
I love your reply
I will return the favor
change my mind
by clarifying what you mean by ' a path leading up to' & giving an example



Infinities are only found by paths that converge towards them.
asymptotes and limits are the physical manifestations of mathematics to describe these paths. Whether it's a series or function it's really a path to infinity. And anywhere before infinities that path can be integrated to give a finite values.

We can only say how big the universe is with respect to time. The universe doesn't really care about time only humans do. The "size of the universe" is everything from t=0 to t=∞

You need to ask the size of the universe at t=x and integrate from t=o to t=x to get the universe size at that given time.

Presumably time goes forever so at t=∞ the area of the universe would also be ∞
(In an expanding universe or assuming expansion)




.  Frankly I have no idea what this means : "You need to ask the size of the universe at t=x and integrate from t=o to t=x to get the universe size at that given time."

.  Simple logic suggests that infinity is a sort of abstract concept for that, which by definition, can never be measured. In the case of numbers, which we say are infinite, the numbers are already an abstraction and the concept of infinity just adds more abstraction.
.  And abstractions neither exist nor do not exist. (Existence is only a characteristic of objects. As regards actions or verbs we realize they are temporary & do not have conventional permanence--thus we don't say "running" exists- because it can manifest & stop at anytime an animal chooses). Like wise one cannot say of infinity that it exists or does not.
.    So to say there is a path (of finite things) that lead to it, seems simply non-sensical to me.

The 4 negations point to a similar view

"LR
What Are the Four Negations?
...According to Mahayana Buddhism, any concepts we have about the basic nature of reality are incomplete, inaccurate, and in fact block our direct experience of things as they really are. The Middle Way (Madhyamaka) philosophy pioneered by the Indian Buddhist philosopher Nagarjuna (2nd–3rd century CE) uses reason to negate our mistaken concepts about reality. Take a pair of opposites, such as real and unreal. Madhyamaka logic looks at four possibilities—that things are either real, unreal, both, or neither—and refutes them in turn. So in this case, the four negations are: ... and it continues.... at:

https://www.lionsroar.com/what-are-the-four-negations/

and/or

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=4+negations+%2C+buddhism&t=h_&ia=web


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMr. D Green
Stranger
 User Gallery


Registered: 12/14/19
Posts: 179
Last seen: 2 years, 28 days
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze]
    #26494026 - 02/19/20 08:07 PM (3 years, 11 months ago)

recycling wasnt a human invention...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineOldnameforgotten
Traveler
Male User Gallery
Registered: 10/19/19
Posts: 956
Loc: Pilbara Australia Flag
Last seen: 2 years, 10 days
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Mr. D Green]
    #26494546 - 02/20/20 07:23 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

I've wondered what force draws on things to become less PSI.

Some kind of overflowing push..... but wouldnt it be a finite universe.... so an expansion of the universe in size but not in location..... and that expansion creates the pull that creates vacuum....

And IT ALL BOILS DOWN TO ...... why the fuck is it expanding..... where the fuck did it all come from.....

DAMNIT I want the fucking answers. FUCK YOU being born in this era. I want the answers NOW.

But obviously thats just grass is always greener. I'd be unhappy everywhere with any knowledge. Thats why humans rule the earth though.

How fucking HILARIOUS is all this shit? We are fucked everywhich way we look.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineBrendanFlock
Stranger
Male

Registered: 06/01/13
Posts: 4,216
Last seen: 2 hours, 48 minutes
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Oldnameforgotten]
    #26496360 - 02/21/20 02:02 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

So with each dot(unit) the full threshold becomes apparent.

The full threshold is an expansing infinity..


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblelaughingdog
Stranger
 User Gallery
Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,828
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: BrendanFlock]
    #26496820 - 02/21/20 10:50 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.

Albert Einstein"

.  If Einstein wasn't sure IF it was infinite and Buddha refused to answer the question (for good reasons), I wonder what benefit folks here, hope to derive from the time they invest, hoping to get, or prove, a definitive answer?

https://dhammakami.org/2018/08/26/what-are-the-ten-questions-that-the-buddha-did-not-answer/

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=questions+buddha+would+not+answer&t=h_&ia=web


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinexFrockx
Male User Gallery

Registered: 09/17/06
Posts: 10,455
Loc: Northeast
Last seen: 11 days, 6 hours
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze] * 1
    #26497991 - 02/22/20 05:38 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Like a circle. The last event is the same exact thing as the first. It all repeats itself the exact same way as the cycle repeats. When you die you are born again as yourself and life the exact same life. You have done exactly what you are doing right now an infinite number of times before you will do it an infinite number of times again.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: xFrockx]
    #26498000 - 02/22/20 06:02 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

wacky idea unless u r a groundhog


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineOldnameforgotten
Traveler
Male User Gallery
Registered: 10/19/19
Posts: 956
Loc: Pilbara Australia Flag
Last seen: 2 years, 10 days
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26498098 - 02/22/20 07:54 AM (3 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
wacky idea unless u r a groundhog




I GOT YOU BABE!


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineBrendanFlock
Stranger
Male

Registered: 06/01/13
Posts: 4,216
Last seen: 2 hours, 48 minutes
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Oldnameforgotten]
    #26499254 - 02/22/20 11:27 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

The idea that time doesn't end is both eternity and an infinite forward mechanism.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: BrendanFlock]
    #26499450 - 02/23/20 06:14 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)



--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePinkerton
Ultrasentient

Registered: 02/26/19
Posts: 3,127
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26499464 - 02/23/20 06:31 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Who are you, rgv?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Pinkerton]
    #26499542 - 02/23/20 08:18 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Nobody special, please do not obsess.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePainkiller
shaman and sorcerer
Male

Registered: 10/08/15
Posts: 1,059
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Last seen: 22 hours, 39 minutes
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze]
    #26500758 - 02/24/20 12:44 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

dbreeze said:
so the double slit experiment says things like light can be particle or wave depending on how you look. whenn they set up the experiment to see particle thats what they got same for wave (if i am correct this says the universe itself is alive and knows we are looking.) So as we keep looking out to space i think reality will just make more and more space so we never see the end. The bigger the telescope the bigger the universe. Thats what i think it just keeps creating what is just out of reach. So this would mean technicly right now there is a edge we just cant see it. But as we are able to look deeper space would get deeper and we would never find the end. or is everything already made and truely infinite already what do you guys think??



We create form from a single infinite potential consciousness which takes up all the space were anything can be done that I can think of except to hallucinate, cause or experience absolute death or split the universe into two or more truly separate things..

If someone were to keep going in one direction it would create more and more from the single infinite potential consciousness which takes up all space and never reach a limit.


Edited by Painkiller (12/25/21 03:26 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineOldnameforgotten
Traveler
Male User Gallery
Registered: 10/19/19
Posts: 956
Loc: Pilbara Australia Flag
Last seen: 2 years, 10 days
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Painkiller] * 1
    #26500779 - 02/24/20 01:13 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

It wouldnt be a straight line then.

This is a fundamental part of quantum physics. They invented the infinite curve calculation to compensate for it.

Only way your fractal dream could happen is if at the end of the universe you then teleported to the opposite side of it. But even then thats teleporting thats not a straight line.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePainkiller
shaman and sorcerer
Male

Registered: 10/08/15
Posts: 1,059
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Last seen: 22 hours, 39 minutes
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Oldnameforgotten] * 1
    #26500783 - 02/24/20 01:20 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Oldnameforgotten said:
It wouldnt be a straight line then.

This is a fundamental part of quantum physics. They invented the infinite curve calculation to compensate for it.

Only way your fractal dream could happen is if at the end of the universe you then teleported to the opposite side of it. But even then thats teleporting thats not a straight line.



I hear what you're saying. I thought about it and edited my post.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePainkiller
shaman and sorcerer
Male

Registered: 10/08/15
Posts: 1,059
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Last seen: 22 hours, 39 minutes
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Painkiller] * 1
    #26500789 - 02/24/20 01:27 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I'm watching this.... Pretty relevant.....



Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePainkiller
shaman and sorcerer
Male

Registered: 10/08/15
Posts: 1,059
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Last seen: 22 hours, 39 minutes
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze] * 1
    #26500793 - 02/24/20 01:35 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

What if the universe is all there is and there is no edge.......


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineOldnameforgotten
Traveler
Male User Gallery
Registered: 10/19/19
Posts: 956
Loc: Pilbara Australia Flag
Last seen: 2 years, 10 days
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Painkiller] * 1
    #26500827 - 02/24/20 02:32 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Painkiller said:
What if the universe is all there is and there is no edge.......




WE'RE TRAPPED!!!!! FUCK!!!! HELP US!!!!


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePainkiller
shaman and sorcerer
Male

Registered: 10/08/15
Posts: 1,059
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Last seen: 22 hours, 39 minutes
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Oldnameforgotten] * 1
    #26502499 - 02/25/20 01:23 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

My understanding is the universe is all life and that there is nothing outside of it. It's all there is.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibledbreeze
Stranger
Registered: 06/03/19
Posts: 312
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Painkiller] * 1
    #26502712 - 02/25/20 07:48 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Painkiller said:
My understanding is the universe is all life and that there is nothing outside of it. It's all there is.




One of my "experiences" was about how important life is and not because you can die but because life is all there is!

My belief is everything is alive in some way there are just differnt scales and dimensions (vibrations). what i think its going on is the void is infinite the void is the blank space that contains everything. Now there may be a limit to our matter universe meaning matter stops at a certain point to give way to the void...but the farther we look the more stuff it will create....creation and creator arent seperate and creation is not done its still going on. the deeper we look the more we will find. Now what if we get to the point where we see where all the matter ends and there is just the void. If you could travel across that void would you run into another bubble of a  matter universe?

I was listening to sadhguru and he said something like as we solve problems creation will make more like we thought a atom was the smallest thing now we discover quantum therory and things are smaller maybe when we figure that out creation will create something smaller. so we can never solve EVERYTHING because its still being created


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinethealienthatategod
retrovertigo
Female

Registered: 10/10/17
Posts: 2,642
Last seen: 4 months, 20 days
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze]
    #26503065 - 02/25/20 12:14 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

"There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here,
it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable.
There is another theory which states that this has already happened."  --Douglas Adams


the word point seems to suggest that it's the culmination of something

to reach a climax, there must be development

to have development there must be a process of experience

and that process needs an observer for it to take place.

what came first, the observer or the point?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: thealienthatategod]
    #26503712 - 02/25/20 05:54 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

The universe is a place where no matter where you look there has to be a rational explanation. This is why we live in the goldilocks zone. Why everything works perfectly. Science is like the worlds most primordial pathological lie. Every time we dig a new explanation comes up. We find a new particle to make sense of our experience. There's always going to be that next higgs boson. The size of the universe will be found to be exactly what it needs to be to have an observer in the first place.

Nothing at all really exists. A manifestation of pure imagination creates all that is real.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26503902 - 02/25/20 07:33 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:
...Nothing at all really exists. A manifestation of pure imagination creates all that is real.



I like the ring of that except for the overconfident use of the word "pure"


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleYellow Pants
Male User Gallery

Registered: 05/14/17
Posts: 1,386
Loc: Flag
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: redgreenvines] * 1
    #26503974 - 02/25/20 08:12 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

The world precedes the imagination.  Not sure I’m in line with all the hype the imagination gets.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Yellow Pants]
    #26503981 - 02/25/20 08:14 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

The only thing that exists is experience itself. Not the past


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: bodhisatta] * 1
    #26503984 - 02/25/20 08:16 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

There's no experiencer experiencing the experience there is only the experience. Experience is the culmination of the "entire universe"


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleYellow Pants
Male User Gallery

Registered: 05/14/17
Posts: 1,386
Loc: Flag
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26503998 - 02/25/20 08:26 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

All is one.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleFiery
Sword of Fire
Other User Gallery

Registered: 12/24/12
Posts: 36,574
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Yellow Pants]
    #26504285 - 02/26/20 01:52 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

All is not one
.


All is forever and thought son,
All is naught and like the wisdom,
of


listening,
and the wind.



Forever is not one. It is forever, son.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Yellow Pants]
    #26504403 - 02/26/20 06:01 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:
There's no experiencer experiencing the experience there is only the experience. Experience is the culmination of the "entire universe"



yup
Quote:

Yellow Pants said:
The world precedes the imagination.  Not sure I’m in line with all the hype the imagination gets.



pretty much


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePinkerton
Ultrasentient

Registered: 02/26/19
Posts: 3,127
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26504739 - 02/26/20 11:50 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I imagine a lot of things. Surely some of it's true but I guess most of it's delusion.

Can you help me out, rgv?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Pinkerton]
    #26504798 - 02/26/20 12:30 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

The world doesn't precede imagination/thought/consciousness.

The past exists in imagination only.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineBrendanFlock
Stranger
Male

Registered: 06/01/13
Posts: 4,216
Last seen: 2 hours, 48 minutes
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26505726 - 02/27/20 12:05 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

So if everything has a place we can call it an expanding universe.

Being on the cusp of the infinite.. which we define in this present moment.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineowerfull
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/01/18
Posts: 45
Last seen: 2 months, 8 days
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: BrendanFlock]
    #26505738 - 02/27/20 12:23 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Infinite as space and time? No, that's limited. Our Universe is not infinite however it is part of immaterial reality that exists in general and such reality if it does exist outside space and time - it has no beginning nor end.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Pinkerton]
    #26505874 - 02/27/20 04:52 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Pinkerton said:
I imagine a lot of things. Surely some of it's true but I guess most of it's delusion.

Can you help me out, rgv?



You can help yourself be more aware than you were.
This has nothing to do with me.
How you approach that is your contribution to the forum.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleYellow Pants
Male User Gallery

Registered: 05/14/17
Posts: 1,386
Loc: Flag
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26506783 - 02/27/20 04:08 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:
The world doesn't precede imagination/thought/consciousness.

The past exists in imagination only.




Science denier


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Yellow Pants]
    #26506899 - 02/27/20 05:25 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

how so?


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleYellow Pants
Male User Gallery

Registered: 05/14/17
Posts: 1,386
Loc: Flag
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26506931 - 02/27/20 05:41 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
how so?




Well, if “objectivity” is in order then you have to concede that the world made the brain that imagines, thinks, senses.  Consciousness, imo, is a bit more slippery and Bodhisatta would have to define for us. 

But to assert that the world doesn’t precede that which it created is phony, obviously.  Existentially, it’s a different analysis.


Edited by Yellow Pants (02/27/20 06:01 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,531
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: Yellow Pants] * 1
    #26507858 - 02/28/20 09:33 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

well that is pretty clear, except in the event that what precedes our experience of the world may be much different that what we experience:
eg. a black form may be approaching, and what definition may be only partial, so one person sees a back truck and another sees an elephant, because that is what they have become accustomed to expecting to come towards them from that direction.
In that way, especially since most of vision is partial, and filled in on the fly, the world preceding and the world that is experienced are disconnected. the preceding "reality" becomes demoted to a series of reference points and triggers.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblesudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,798
Re: how would a infinite universe work? [Re: dbreeze]
    #26508430 - 02/28/20 03:24 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)



--------------------
I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.



Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5  [ show all ]

Shop: PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   North Spore Cultivation Supplies   Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Singularity, Free Will, Infinite Dimensions...
( 1 2 all )
Joshua 6,381 30 04/12/02 03:47 PM
by skaMariaPastora
* Implications of the Big Bang Origin and Fate of the Universe
( 1 2 3 all )
Source 6,613 41 09/07/04 11:01 PM
by gettinjiggywithit
* Infinite universe? Or infinite God? Same thing actually?
( 1 2 3 all )
repemon 4,443 42 05/11/04 12:04 AM
by TheShroomHermit
* Existence preceeds essence NiamhNyx 2,234 18 11/08/07 08:34 PM
by NiamhNyx
* the infinite wheel
( 1 2 all )
Zekebomb 4,529 34 02/26/05 06:33 AM
by cybrbeast
* The Infinite Moment
( 1 2 all )
Great Scott 2,481 26 12/15/05 12:37 AM
by redgreenvines
* the god delusion
( 1 2 3 4 5 6 all )
KingOftheThing 8,693 107 10/24/06 05:19 PM
by cloudtop
* imagination is reality
( 1 2 3 all )
DoctorJ 3,306 56 05/22/06 02:02 PM
by redgreenvines

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Middleman, DividedQuantum
1,413 topic views. 2 members, 6 guests and 3 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.064 seconds spending 0.013 seconds on 14 queries.