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r00tcmplx
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Registered: 02/19/18
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Re: The idea that the present moment is all that matters [Re: sudly]
#26469537 - 02/05/20 12:56 AM (4 years, 12 days ago) |
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When you come to grasp a more scientific understanding of reality and its complexities and relationships you see the grand mystery and magic in it. This leads you aware from muddying this with lessor concepts that are flawed.
A person says time travel and I know this to be physically impossible and absurd but I also realize something far mor fascinating and grand : Quantum physics.
A person says 'be present in the moment' and I know exactly how this works biologically and neurologically and its much more magical in this context to me at least. Something anyone can google for themselves and grasp and bask in but seemingly don't as older outdated beliefs are more accessible and fun? I have no clue. However, some things are clearly absurd as are some descriptors. I see no grand value in basking in ignorance especially when information is so easy to access including layman terms videos that take less than 5min to watch on youtube.
This however is the power of belief in the fun playground people construct and play around in their own heads. You are entitled to that but anyone with sense will cut you short when you start stating that this is the physical reality everyone else lives in.. No, that sometimes is just the cool place you like to bask in all resident to your head.
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sudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,951
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Re: The idea that the present moment is all that matters [Re: r00tcmplx]
#26470362 - 02/05/20 01:56 PM (4 years, 12 days ago) |
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Quote:
When you come to grasp a more scientific understanding of reality and its complexities and relationships you see;
I'm with you here, but beyond that, my version of this tale would be that, "When you come to grasp a more scientific understanding of reality and its complexities and relationships you see a whole dynamic system of interrelated events."
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I have a personal belief in reincarnation and thus a similar concept as you.
I'm one of the few that tend to defer from this concept.
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You die and your energy can do whatever it wants and everyone else and everything is still here doing its thing
If you look at the above from a viewpoint of a more scientific understanding, then wouldn't it make sense to be able to describe in detail what form that energy is exchanging in to. With everyone else and everything still here doing its thing
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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r00tcmplx
Stranger

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Re: The idea that the present moment is all that matters [Re: sudly]
#26470398 - 02/05/20 02:18 PM (4 years, 12 days ago) |
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Quote:
sudly said:
I'm with you here, but beyond that, my version of this tale would be that, "When you come to grasp a more scientific understanding of reality and its complexities and relationships you see a whole dynamic system of interrelated events."
And I would agree with this extended framing that you propose...Correct.
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sudly said:
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I have a personal belief in reincarnation and thus a similar concept as you.
I'm one of the few that tend to defer from this concept.
This is fine. It's one of many theories I maintain about the potential 'after-life' and maintain it as a beyond science framing/new scientific inquiry...I will readily admit it is a theory that is very unsubstantiated and thus am not married to it. It just provides me with workable ideas. The key I think is to admit this clearly and not stay loosely connected to the idea.
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sudly said:
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You die and your energy can do whatever it wants and everyone else and everything is still here doing its thing
If you look at the above from a viewpoint of a more scientific understanding, then wouldn't it make sense to be able to describe in detail what form that energy is exchanging in to. With everyone else and everything still here doing its thing
Sure, just look at a decomposition video and consider the compound->atomic and subatomic nature of things... How much 'memory' do these building blocks maintain of their interactions...
Birth and your physical body relates to sperm (code) meeting an egg (incubator). Matter and energy are structured progressively and boom out you come. You grow physically/etc by consuming matter/energy and experience/etc and this is life. You die and your matter/energy decompose and return back to the physical environment and from that there is now substance for something else to come about.
Loosely throw in : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_of_energy here.
Well, the only question then becomes how much structure is preserved of you and returned to the environment across your death/decomposition. This is where wild unsupported theories like reincarnation can be asserted loosely and where I entertain the thought. As to the very detailed scientific explanation on how this works 'behind the scenes', I am not at liberty to discuss this. However, I do a bit of active work probing it and a well established framework.
Also, alas.. not much beyond that is impacted by your dead body decomposing into the environment in an open field. My computer is still a computer. I am still me. My chair is still here, the sky is still blue, etc.
So yes, in plain scientific terms this can be framed as I have done.
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sudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,951
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Re: The idea that the present moment is all that matters [Re: r00tcmplx]
#26470544 - 02/05/20 03:48 PM (4 years, 11 days ago) |
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Where in that is room for reincarnation?
Workable ideas? But nothing solid..
Invertebrate communities and plant nutrients are parts of decomposition.
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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r00tcmplx
Stranger

Registered: 02/19/18
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Re: The idea that the present moment is all that matters [Re: sudly]
#26470615 - 02/05/20 04:22 PM (4 years, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
sudly said: Where in that is room for reincarnation?
Workable ideas? But nothing solid..
Invertebrate communities and plant nutrients are parts of decomposition.
Sexual reproduction directly passes on substantial code and structure. Physical decomposition does this in a more degraded and questionable form. And then there is a whole body of theory/ideation/unscience that I entertain For some of my work which I will not get into.
So, for all intents purposes : Workable ideas for actual work... It's just a concept and loosely established theory.. Nothing more and thus there isn't much to discuss beyond what I have disclosed.
Philosophy and soft sciences after-all get you nowhere beyond ideation which is why I quickly abandon it beyond forming ideas.
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sudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,951
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Re: The idea that the present moment is all that matters [Re: r00tcmplx]
#26473085 - 02/07/20 12:13 AM (4 years, 10 days ago) |
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Your answer to reincarnation is babies? Because if so fair enough, that's sounds like an honest attempt.
Decomposition has more to do with micro-nutrients, plant growth, invertebrate and bacterial communities.
You like the idea of unscience and you can't explain why?
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,706
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Re: The idea that the present moment is all that matters [Re: sudly]
#26473329 - 02/07/20 06:28 AM (4 years, 10 days ago) |
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reincarnation is a story I am less inclined to resist than a superbeing/god; however, the idea of incarnating the godstuff/mindstuff that we are, and that we return to just mindstuff/godstuff is appealing, but not on the level of thought or knowlede, nor as consciousness itself, but of some underlying dimensional thing that is unrelated to experience but somehowo related to light.
i know that's pretty vague, but I have no evidence of anything that fits together beyond that.
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Rahz
Alive Again



Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,248
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Re: The idea that the present moment is all that matters [Re: redgreenvines]
#26473721 - 02/07/20 10:52 AM (4 years, 10 days ago) |
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I think they are equally ridiculous. The best I can come up with is that the potential for life, consciousness and joy are eternal, an inherent quality of the universe and existence. How and why I do not know. The only statement that approaches reasonable is that it just is.
-------------------- rahz comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace "You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi
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laughingdog
Stranger

Registered: 03/14/04
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Re: The idea that the present moment is all that matters [Re: Rahz]
#26474049 - 02/07/20 02:31 PM (4 years, 10 days ago) |
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The big source, for belief in reincarnation, that millions ascribe to, is Hinduism. Historically this helped justify the horrible India caste system, which Buddha did not subscribe to, and Gandhi tried to dismantle. The Tibetan Buddhists are into it in a big way. Modern secular Buddhists, attempt to ignore it and secularize the practice. Thus there are different versions of the teaching of: dependent origination. Those who 'are into it' help 'past regression hypnotists' make a living.
Edited by laughingdog (02/07/20 03:06 PM)
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Rahz
Alive Again



Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,248
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Re: The idea that the present moment is all that matters [Re: laughingdog]
#26474081 - 02/07/20 02:49 PM (4 years, 10 days ago) |
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Reincarnation - the more things change, the more they stay the same.
Or - Caterpillar becomes a butterfly... as long as it's not eaten by a bird first. Plenty more where that one came from though.
-------------------- rahz comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace "You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi
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laughingdog
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Re: The idea that the present moment is all that matters [Re: Rahz] 1
#26474310 - 02/07/20 05:28 PM (4 years, 9 days ago) |
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Quote:
Rahz said: Reincarnation - the more things change, the more they stay the same. ...Plenty more where that one came from though....
Indeed 'Plenty more': "The Myth of Sisyphus " by Albert Camus (Author) and all that... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Myth_of_Sisyphus
" ... condemned to repeat forever the same meaningless task of pushing a boulder up a mountain, only to see it roll down again. ..."
Of course the Hindu concept of reincarnation, includes the idea, that things can always get worse, as its supposed to be a moral teaching, and ethically motivating.
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laughingdog
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Re: The idea that the present moment is all that matters [Re: laughingdog]
#26475446 - 02/08/20 12:56 PM (4 years, 9 days ago) |
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There are 2 well known science studies, of actual people, with opposite disorders, that may perhaps show the value of taking the middle path as regards this issue. Full articles and more are at the links:
https://www.newyorker.com/books/page-turner/the-mystery-of-s-the-man-with-an-impossible-memory
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=the+man+who+couldn%27t+forget&t=h_&ia=web
The Mystery of S., the Man with an Impossible Memory By Reed Johnson August 12, 2017  "The neuropsychologist Alexander Luria’s case study of Solomon Shereshevsky helped spark a myth about a man who could not forget. But the truth is more complicated.Illustration by Leigh Guldig" ...
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https://duckduckgo.com/?q=the+man+who+couldn%27t+remember&t=h_&ia=web
https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/article/corkin-hm-memory/
"The Man Who Couldn't Remember For five decades, neuroscientist Suzanne Corkin worked with Henry Gustav Molaison, a man known in the annals of science simply as H.M. She spent countless hours talking with him and testing him. She knew intimate details about his life, yet remarkably he could never remember who she was." ....
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Mr. D Green
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Re: The idea that the present moment is all that matters [Re: DividedQuantum] 1
#26494043 - 02/19/20 08:21 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Purely perspective, we are more evolved then most will acknowledge. I agree that the past and future is apart of what we are, but it is possible to disconnect from both entirely; thus becoming something other then our self's...in a sense..in theory..that is. The saying thinking outside the box..most do not understand what this truly means. It has to do with more then just thinking..
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