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r00tcmplx
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Re: Gurus and rules [Re: Kickle]
#26472183 - 02/06/20 02:35 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Kickle
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Re: Gurus and rules [Re: r00tcmplx]
#26472190 - 02/06/20 02:41 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Well if there's a market for it, that means they are giving people what they are after. I'm not about to shit on entrepreneurs. But I think that's an isolated market. You don't see that around here.
These are the Gurus around here
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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r00tcmplx
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Re: Gurus and rules [Re: Kickle]
#26472217 - 02/06/20 02:52 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Kickle said: Well if there's a market for it, that means they are giving people what they are after. I'm not about to shit on entrepreneurs. But I think that's an isolated market. You don't see that around here.
This is the Gurus around here
Nor am I thus why I describe it as a commercial market driven by supply/demand. In this particular case, its the demand side driving the dynamics. 'Isolated market'... It's present/prominent in any economically strenuous hell hole where people need occasional escapes, 'confessions', reorientation so they can get back on their brutal landscape on Monday (At least in the west). In other more balanced places, people find and strike a more personal balance with their environment and condition as it is more readily available. When you're making $250k+ a year fucking over the world 11-12 hours a day, yeah, you're going to need a little 'pick me up' or Guru whispering mantras in your ear to be able to sleep at night .. thus the environment led demand side. Same could be said of a more economically depressed environment and thus a heightened presence of religion/guruism. People looking for that escape from their environmental condition... Supply side meeting the naturally carved demand.
 Daddy is that you?
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Kickle
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Re: Gurus and rules [Re: r00tcmplx]
#26472243 - 02/06/20 03:10 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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I can't find a free version of the documentary "The Grammar of Happiness" but what's your take on what this guy says about his missionary travels to the Piraha tribe from the 8 minute mark to the 9 minute mark in the video
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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r00tcmplx
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Re: Gurus and rules [Re: Kickle]
#26472329 - 02/06/20 04:06 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Kickle said: I can't find a free version of the documentary "The Grammar of Happiness" but what's your take on what this guy says about his missionary travels to the Piraha tribe from the 8 minute mark to the 9 minute mark in the video
The west and 'western' empires have all been largely premised on a sense of superiority. Imperial/Colonial/conquering.... Declaring everything that they don't understand/that doesn't fit their narrative that goes against their superiority stories and narratives as savage/primitive.
That being said, there is nothing for anyone to feel inferior/superior about especially throughout history and civilization. Just about everyone has had an empire that accomplished great things. Thus, as the person did in the video, they learned something once they came to respect someone's path. Even converted from there's hilariously enough.
Happiness is what you make it. It is set upon by striking a balance within oneself and within their environment. It is possible to highlight the brutal details of this on a case by case basis without necessarily saying 'happiness is not arrived at here'. This would, more often than not, be a false statement.
Some people for instance achieve happiness under the guidance of a Guru/religion/etc. My point wasn't to suggest this is not the case. I have no basis for even stating that. My point was instead to highlight the brutal dynamics at play here. True enough, a tribe out in the wilderness immersed in their humanity and experience could quite clearly have more access to happiness than someone being grounded down in a modern society. It is indeed why such people go to such extremes to find their humanity/spirituality under the direction of a Guru.. It's because their environment and modern society has deprived them of it. So, the Guru that grants them this passage is invaluable. Whereas, in a less crucible/costly city.. A city closer to nature and humanity.. Ah', you wont find any Gurus because people get it. It's tangible and in front of their face. There are no modern barriers. They can reach out and grab it. A guru would be laughable in such a context... Even still, there will be a desire to gain access beyond one's station.. The human mind like to wonder about the unknown ... Things that give them access are held as valuable.
Two gurus meet in a room. Are they still Gurus or are they equals? But yeah, desert religions : Judiasm->Christianity->islam Are very tribal and imperial. They are very spirituality immature....
Which is why most gurus/spiritual guys center on far more evolved eastern religions. I myself matured/migrated past Christianity. I went through a phase of athiesm which was necessary to break the chains... I later cooled down and was able to look at it without much attachment. Around that time I found eastern religions/theology and practices therein frequently expressed by 'spiritual gurus'... I basked in them for a while but even eventually transcended them into more broad and open spirituality. I no longer needed a deep placeholder belief to drive me. I am fine with being a spec of dust and experiencing the great cosmos. I have wild cosmic beliefs/theories but I am ok just keeping them as such.
Thanks for the clip. It was pretty good and highlights the ignorance/arrogance of organized religion when actually faced with the realities of life.
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Kickle
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Re: Gurus and rules [Re: r00tcmplx]
#26472355 - 02/06/20 04:28 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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. Whereas, in a less crucible/costly city.. A city closer to nature and humanity.. Ah', you wont find any Gurus because people get it. It's tangible and in front of their face. There are no modern barriers. They can reach out and grab it.
^This That's where I live. I guess intellectually I know this is a great place but I think I'm sort of like that tribe. Maybe I don't realize just how much I am taking for granted. I just live in it.
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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r00tcmplx
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Re: Gurus and rules [Re: Kickle]
#26472407 - 02/06/20 05:01 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Kickle said: . Whereas, in a less crucible/costly city.. A city closer to nature and humanity.. Ah', you wont find any Gurus because people get it. It's tangible and in front of their face. There are no modern barriers. They can reach out and grab it.
^This That's where I live. I guess intellectually I know this is a great place but I think I'm sort of like that tribe. Maybe I don't realize just how much I am taking for granted. I just live in it.
Well indeed and I speak not from some enlightened path. Just more of experience and introspection. I actually lived in California for some time and am not native there. Where i'm from, there are no 'Gurus' either as it is a more balanced environment and not too expensive and thus people aren't driven that deeply by money or a struggle to get it such that they compromise themselves and have to be reoriented. After spending some time in California, the retreat/spiritual guidance/guru thing seemed to all make sense.. thus the strong language I used to frame it. The economic and social environment in California are enough to drive a person mad so I definitely can't knock someone consulting a Guru to gain guidance/perspective in that environment. I just wanted to highlight why it exists and the dynamics at play that cause it to be a phenomenon in some places and non-existent in others.
Trust me, when I got to Cali and saw the 'Tibetan prayer flags' everywhere and the zen/eastern mantra, I have to admit, I was asking myself what in the natural fuck were people smoking out there... As its anything but what the environment is like... Then you take note of the savage industry that runs California and then the retreats/spiritual camps/etc all start to make sense : It's the way people strike a balance with this extreme environment they have to survive/thrive in. If not, the environmental conditions are strong enough that they'll break a person for sure.
So, ah'... it's ultimately all about balance relative to one's environment. I got it by doing more outdoors stuff and partying and socializing. Others : hardcore guru + spiritual retreats.
Church/church/organized religion really isn't a big thing in Cali. So, you get more of that 'eastern' theology/spiritual scatter and in that comes enterprising Gurus as a gateway to the east.
And yea, like the people from that TED talk, if its readily available to you.. you just live in it and the environment, as its balanced, balances you. I wouldn't say you are taking this for granted as going to a crucible unbalanced city really isn't offering much beyond making it harder.. In a crucible city though, you gain perspective and confidence after dealing with such unbalance. You will indeed appreciate a more balanced environment and likely seek one after 5-10 years if you don't get caught up in the rat race.
So, ah :
Stellar album btw that captures this concept. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Suburbs
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Rahz
Alive Again



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Re: Gurus and rules [Re: Kickle]
#26472423 - 02/06/20 05:15 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Kickle said: Yeah I've heard their names. Reminds me of hearing Brad Pitt though. Sure some people will worship the dude but I'm not about to whip my dick out in protest. That might be what some of Brad's followers do when they see him tho 
Do Tolle and Adyashanti have rules that people follow?
Tolle does satang where he sits and talks and answers question, but mostly known for his books. No rules I suppose except to maintain some level of decorum. Everyone waits their turn to ask questions and he speaks softly... library atmosphere.
Adyashanti is similar, less known for his books and more for the retreats. I think it attracts a certain type of crowd, seekers but not necessarily worshipers. It's not for everybody but I think it's helpful for some.
These types of gurus focus on liberation, the end of seeking. They would consider it a success when someone stops giving them money.
-------------------- rahz comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace "You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi
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Kickle
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Re: Gurus and rules [Re: Rahz]
#26472444 - 02/06/20 05:35 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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lol the library atmosphere part cracked me up they sound alright to me but it might be interesting to see their reaction if someone did pull a whacky stunt
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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laughingdog
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Re: Gurus and rules [Re: Kickle]
#26474134 - 02/07/20 03:21 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Tolle and Adyashanti are pleasant types. There are also various frauds. The strangest was the Maharishi Mahesh Yogi whom the Beatles followed briefly. He started out seemingly normal, but later started to sell "yogic flying". And in the end the mantras were found to be dispensed by a simple algorithm, based on a person's age. (the info is on the web.) The group remains in business
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Kickle
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Well a few gurus every couple decades, even if scam artists, seems pretty low on the priority totem for things to rebel against IMO
And I like rebelling
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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laughingdog
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Re: Gurus and rules [Re: Kickle]
#26474683 - 02/07/20 08:50 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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redgreenvines
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Registered: 04/08/04
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I prefer the concept of teacher than guru, it is much the same, but more ad hoc, in that, any thing or situation can offer learning/teaching.
no thing or situation (or person) is ultimate perfection.
--------------------
_ 🧠 _
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sudly
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Good thing you said that because I was thinking you might make out for a guru at times, but I seem to have been somewhat mistaken.
While I agree with the first part, I'd like to know an imperfection behind the idea or concept of the Sun from a historical or modern or future perspective.
In the future I think the Sun just is, until it takes the form of a different kind of Sun.
I think that historically the Sun was considered as a god, especially in Aztec and Egyptian cultures.
And in modern times the Sun is the source of almost all plant life and there too; animal life.
P.s. There is also geothermal energy, consisting of mantle activity and tectonic movement etc.
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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Kickle
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Quote:
laughingdog said: it wasn't cheap either
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=yogic+flying&t=h_&iax=images&ia=images
but don't despair you can still buy in:
https://advanced.tm.org/vedic-experts.html
better use of money than gambling IMO which also promises to take you to new heights
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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laughingdog
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Re: Gurus and rules [Re: Kickle]
#26475406 - 02/08/20 12:28 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Kickle said:
Quote:
laughingdog said: it wasn't cheap either
[url=https://duckduckgo.com/?q=yogic+flying&t=h_&iax=images&ia=images]https://duckduckgo.com/?
better use of money than gambling IMO which also promises to take you to new heights
Hard to choose between two follies IMO , gambling often goes with drinking which is hard on the liver & brain, and believing in nonsense, also rots the brain, but both empty the pocket book.
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