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lavod
Seal Whisperer


Registered: 06/23/06
Posts: 5,440
Loc: Over the rainbow
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Re: Self Driving Cars? [Re: lavod]
#26465935 - 02/02/20 08:34 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
lavod said: As for non-Toyota minivans, Dodge Caravan(and the Chrysler/Plymouth offshoots) drivers are nearly as bad. I have no idea why people buy those to begin with. Perhaps they're just Toyotadopes who cant afford a Toyota. The Dodge Caravan is, in all my years ov driving, the vehicle i have seen broken down on the side ov the road more than any other. Transmissions, head gaskets, valve seals, piston rings, electrical problems, you name it. Horribly unreliable vehicles and it's been well documented for decades, yet people still buy them.
Responding to myself here, but i have to mention something. So after making this post earlier today i had to go into work for a few hours on my usual day off. I take 2 deliveries on my first run and on the way back to the shop what do i see? A broken down Dodge Caravan with its hood up by the side ov the road! Go figure!
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Ran-D



Registered: 12/19/10
Posts: 16,311
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Re: Self Driving Cars? [Re: lavod] 1
#26480812 - 02/11/20 06:31 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Newbie said: MY only issue with self driving cars is the programming on collision decisions. If your car senses an immediate threat ahead, but there are groups of pedestrians on both sides of you, how will the car react? What's the most ethical choice? Swerve into the least amount of people to protect the, "driver?" Someone has to program this shit.
It's a pretty big can of worms.
Some guy just died in his Tesla. Drove itself into a freeway barrier. Not sure why it's even news, because OF COURSE IT FUCKING DROVE ITSELF INTO THE BARRIER.
I've been saying from the beginning how dangerous this shit is. Driving a car is not just gas, brake, left turn, right turn. There are too many variables that can never be accounted for in a computer program. That's just reality, how the geniuses who design these things fail to realize that is beyond me.
The reason it upsets me is because it puts my families lives in danger. Why are these things legal without the public voting on it? That is a very serious question, because I don't think they should be.
We'll see how many people have to die before the public agrees.
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twighead
mͯó



Registered: 08/27/08
Posts: 29,556
Loc: Glenn Gould's Fuck Windmill
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Re: Self Driving Cars? [Re: Ran-D] 2
#26480823 - 02/11/20 06:39 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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How will you be able to justify human drivers when autonomous cause a lower rate of fatalities?
How many millions of people need to die in manually driven cars before it becomes clear something needs to be done? 
A self driving car can track every object in every direction around the car's momentum, heading, and react within a span of time that is impossible for a human.
No human can match those capabilities. We can only look in one direction at a time. I'd maybe take every driver on the road being an extremely skilled well measured driver over self driving- but we all know the average drivers are not.
The rate at which people drive drunk, distracted - is far higher than the rate at which those types of systems glitch, or make significant mistakes.
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Ran-D



Registered: 12/19/10
Posts: 16,311
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Re: Self Driving Cars? [Re: twighead] 1
#26480848 - 02/11/20 06:53 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
twighead said:
A self driving car can track every object in every direction around the car's momentum, heading, and react within a span of time that is impossible for a human.
Says who, the Tesla company?
And even this is dismissing how complex driving really is. Again, there is NO WAY to program the infinite variables that we encounter on the road every day.
The craziest part is people are paying tens of thousands of dollars to be guinea pigs for this untested technology.
Edited by Ran-D (02/11/20 06:57 PM)
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
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Re: Self Driving Cars? [Re: Ran-D] 1
#26481122 - 02/11/20 09:27 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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It won't be too long before they're orders of magnitude more safe than human drivers. Of course never perfect so there's always going to be someone on a soap box. But autonomous cars will be a mandate once they're clearly way safer than human drivers
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lavod
Seal Whisperer


Registered: 06/23/06
Posts: 5,440
Loc: Over the rainbow
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One ov the most accurate movie quotes ov all time is from Jurassic Park: "Life, uh, finds a way". Life finds a way to live. Life finds a way to fuck up. Life finds a way to die trusting itself to seemingly unassailable technology. And humans are a part ov life despite how much they tend to deprive themselves ov the responsibility. Thank you for your logic Ran-D. It's far more sound than that ov the self-driving car supporters. The 1950s had jets so people thought that there would be flying cars in a decade. This current endeavor for self-driving cars follows a similar overenthusiastic ideology and will ultimately end in the same outcome. Even UFOs have crashed for fucks sake, and i doubt it was the fault ov the aliens.
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twighead
mͯó



Registered: 08/27/08
Posts: 29,556
Loc: Glenn Gould's Fuck Windmill
Last seen: 44 minutes, 2 seconds
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Re: Self Driving Cars? [Re: Ran-D] 1
#26481223 - 02/11/20 11:23 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ran-D said:
Quote:
twighead said:
A self driving car can track every object in every direction around the car's momentum, heading, and react within a span of time that is impossible for a human.
Says who, the Tesla company?
And even this is dismissing how complex driving really is. Again, there is NO WAY to program the infinite variables that we encounter on the road every day.
The craziest part is people are paying tens of thousands of dollars to be guinea pigs for this untested technology.
Says like... any of the multiple companies working on these products. I mean, have you even looked at how they set up self-driving? Or are you just reacting out of fear without any actual research into the subject.
Mind you - Tesla's tech has a radar detecting objects within 550ft, front/side RCCB color filters, 3 front cameras focused on different ranges from close to 820 feet away, 4 cameras on each side with vision up to 300ft, 12 sonars, and a 300ft rear view camera.
How can a human compare to that? 
There aren't infinite variables for anything - and computers can already do incredibly complex tasks much better than you ever will hope to. Do you think in the military they have people tracking everything manually? Naw computers do that, and can shoot down a missile coming at you @ 5000mph with pinpoint accuracy. Humans can't compete with a properly tuned computer at mechanical/precision tasks and that's really just a fact at this point.
Back in even the 1980s they had stealth jets whose aerodynamics were so touchy they were literally unflyable by anything other than a fine-tuned computer... that technology has only progressed.
The main variables for driving? Speed, direction, and the speed and direction of other objects. It will have to make tough choices sometimes, and maybe not always the right one - but the same thing as a human no? There's almost always time to properly react to things on the road - if you're aware, and if there isn't it very very rarely is the driver/computers fault.
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twighead
mͯó



Registered: 08/27/08
Posts: 29,556
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Last seen: 44 minutes, 2 seconds
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Re: Self Driving Cars? [Re: lavod] 1
#26481224 - 02/11/20 11:24 PM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
lavod said: One ov the most accurate movie quotes ov all time is from Jurassic Park: "Life, uh, finds a way". Life finds a way to live. Life finds a way to fuck up. Life finds a way to die trusting itself to seemingly unassailable technology. And humans are a part ov life despite how much they tend to deprive themselves ov the responsibility. Thank you for your logic Ran-D. It's far more sound than that ov the self-driving car supporters. The 1950s had jets so people thought that there would be flying cars in a decade. This current endeavor for self-driving cars follows a similar overenthusiastic ideology and will ultimately end in the same outcome. Even UFOs have crashed for fucks sake, and i doubt it was the fault ov the aliens.
Yeah they'll fuck up sometimes, but we're talking about replacing a system that kills over a million people a year - so I think that fucking up a little is okay.
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Ran-D



Registered: 12/19/10
Posts: 16,311
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Re: Self Driving Cars? [Re: twighead]
#26481532 - 02/12/20 07:45 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
twighead said:
Quote:
Ran-D said:
Quote:
twighead said:
A self driving car can track every object in every direction around the car's momentum, heading, and react within a span of time that is impossible for a human.
Says who, the Tesla company?
And even this is dismissing how complex driving really is. Again, there is NO WAY to program the infinite variables that we encounter on the road every day.
The craziest part is people are paying tens of thousands of dollars to be guinea pigs for this untested technology.
Says like... any of the multiple companies working on these products.
The dead guy begs to differ. Apparently these sensors can sense everything except giant cement barriers that are probably programmed into the GPS as well. Weird, huh?
I spend A LOT of time on gnarly mountain roads. No way I'm ever trusting a computer with that. And if you doubt the amount of variables then honestly you must not spend much time on the road.
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Ran-D



Registered: 12/19/10
Posts: 16,311
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Re: Self Driving Cars? [Re: Ran-D]
#26481539 - 02/12/20 07:51 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Let's not forget computers can be destroyed by something as simple as a cup of water or even a porno website. Plus they constantly freeze and what not.
Just wait til your fancy cars start updating their software in traffic and one of em goes haywire and flies off the road or some shit.
Edited by Ran-D (02/12/20 07:56 AM)
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
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Re: Self Driving Cars? [Re: Ran-D] 1
#26481578 - 02/12/20 08:22 AM (3 years, 11 months ago) |
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Wont be long before automatic cars drive on mountain roads better than any human. Eventually a computer will hold the pikes peak hill climb record.
Flying cars isn't a good comparison. That would require air traffic control and everyone being a pilot. If we ever end up seeing flying cars it will be because of autonomous cars coming first
Eventually computers will make formula one drivers look like amateurs and will absolutely decimate a human record lap time in the same vehicle
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christopera
Stranger


Registered: 10/13/17
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We already have flying cars, they are called airplanes. Until we have a major breakthrough in flight technology our cars won't be flying. We simply don't have the engineering prowess to create a vehicle that flies safely and capably but also works well as a car.
I do agree that self driving cars will ultimate outperform humans in every way, especially because they will be capable of being operated without a bag of meat on board.
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