Home | Community | Message Board


This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals   Amanita Muscaria Store Amanita Extract   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Capsules   North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1 | 2 | Next >  [ show all ]
Offlinemudskippa
Stranger
Registered: 01/26/20
Posts: 16
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam?
    #26453681 - 01/26/20 02:40 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

Hey,

I joined to post a question. Could a low dosage of Amanita Muscaria be used as an alternative to diazepam?

My research shows that Muscimol is a specific agonist of the GABA-alpha2 receptor so it's very well targeted to relieve neurological distress, such as anxiety and pain.

I assume it wouldn't have as many drawbacks as diazepam, which is not well-targeted and can cause tolerance and addiction easily.

Would there be any reason why this might be a bad idea? Could it potentially be taken daily for long periods of time?

I was considering this to relieve symptoms of a neuropsychiatric disorder. (By the way, a "neuropsychiatric" just means neurological symptoms caused by stress or trauma rather than an organic neurological problem).

Many thanks.


Edited by mudskippa (01/26/20 02:49 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineft116
The one
Male


Registered: 05/22/17
Posts: 1,747
Last seen: 1 month, 27 days
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: mudskippa]
    #26453755 - 01/26/20 03:21 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

The answer I would say
Is no.
I have recently been experimenting
With flys and always gone
Into a stupor even on small doses.

They are very strong and
Should not be taken lightly.

Even in small amounts you
Get in touch with the spirit
Of this mushroom.

Just be careful.


--------------------


The mushrooms are great.
The mushrooms are fine.
Give me them with lashings of wine.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineft116
The one
Male


Registered: 05/22/17
Posts: 1,747
Last seen: 1 month, 27 days
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: ft116]
    #26453762 - 01/26/20 03:28 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

And watch out for nomes
And fairy’s!
🙈


--------------------


The mushrooms are great.
The mushrooms are fine.
Give me them with lashings of wine.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemudskippa
Stranger
Registered: 01/26/20
Posts: 16
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: ft116]
    #26453767 - 01/26/20 03:29 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

ft116 said:
The answer I would say
Is no.
I have recently been experimenting
With flys and always gone
Into a stupor even on small doses.

They are very strong and
Should not be taken lightly.

Even in small amounts you
Get in touch with the spirit
Of this mushroom.

Just be careful.




Thank you. I appreciate your reply. I just read your "Fly Aragic Trials" post. You took 4 caps? I wasn't thinking of anywhere near that amount for these purposes. I was thinking of really teeny dosages.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineft116
The one
Male


Registered: 05/22/17
Posts: 1,747
Last seen: 1 month, 27 days
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: mudskippa]
    #26453783 - 01/26/20 03:36 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

You might feel a very little
Off a micro dose.
I started with one small cap.
Thought it wasn’t working
So I ate three more.
God what an experience.

I guess you might feel a bit
Relaxed off a micro dose.

You could always experiment.
Just don’t over do it.

Happy ventures into the world
Of fly agaric.


--------------------


The mushrooms are great.
The mushrooms are fine.
Give me them with lashings of wine.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemudskippa
Stranger
Registered: 01/26/20
Posts: 16
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: ft116]
    #26453793 - 01/26/20 03:44 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

ft116 said:
You might feel a very little
Off a micro dose.
I started with one small cap.
Thought it wasn’t working
So I ate three more.
God what an experience.

I guess you might feel a bit
Relaxed off a micro dose.

You could always experiment.
Just don’t over do it.

Happy ventures into the world
Of fly agaric.




Thank you! Yes, that's basically exactly what I'm looking for, something to replicate 2-5mg of diazepam without the drawbacks. (And no gnomes or pixies :wink: )


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinedpsoffgrid
Stranger
Registered: 01/24/20
Posts: 6
Last seen: 3 years, 8 months
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: mudskippa]
    #26453824 - 01/26/20 04:16 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

Look up "Amanita dreamer" on you tube, she explains a ton.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offline330ci
the unenlightened =D

Registered: 11/22/19
Posts: 344
Last seen: 4 years, 18 hours
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: dpsoffgrid]
    #26453864 - 01/26/20 04:50 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

Shit gets so weird on them. I ate about a gram with some mdma and I was in a trance for like 8 hrs was a great experience but I can’t imagine taking these as a daily medication


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemudskippa
Stranger
Registered: 01/26/20
Posts: 16
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: dpsoffgrid]
    #26453874 - 01/26/20 05:01 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

dpsoffgrid said:
Look up "Amanita dreamer" on you tube, she explains a ton.




Thank you. I have actually watched a few of her vids while doing my research. She seems to be having mixed results and is using it for slightly different reasons.

I should point out that I don't take benzos or any other meds daily.

Diazepam is the only thing that actually helps my symptoms. But because I know about benzos, I only take it when I have to be 100% symptom-free (like if I'm going to a wedding).

So I take 5mg diazepam one day a month maximum and the rest of the time I struggle by feeling terrible and debilitated. That's why I'd like to find something I can take with no drawbacks. If diazepam wasn't a horrendous drug, I'd use that. But, as a recovering alcoholic who knows plenty about addiction, I'm not going there!


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemudskippa
Stranger
Registered: 01/26/20
Posts: 16
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: 330ci]
    #26453885 - 01/26/20 05:07 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

330ci said:
Shit gets so weird on them. I ate about a gram with some mdma and I was in a trance for like 8 hrs was a great experience but I can’t imagine taking these as a daily medication




Yeah, I have pretty specific reasons for thinking about it. And I would be talking about a tiny dose, like the equivalent of a normal dose of diazepam.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinedpsoffgrid
Stranger
Registered: 01/24/20
Posts: 6
Last seen: 3 years, 8 months
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: mudskippa]
    #26453896 - 01/26/20 05:13 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

mudskippa said:
Quote:

dpsoffgrid said:
Look up "Amanita dreamer" on you tube, she explains a ton.




Thank you. I have actually watched a few of her vids while doing my research. She seems to be having mixed results and is using it for slightly different reasons.

I should point out that I don't take benzos or any other meds daily.

Diazepam is the only thing that actually helps my symptoms. But because I know about benzos, I only take it when I have to be 100% symptom-free (like if I'm going to a wedding).

So I take 5mg diazepam one day a month maximum and the rest of the time I struggle by feeling terrible and debilitated. That's why I'd like to find something I can take with no drawbacks. If diazepam wasn't a horrendous drug, I'd use that. But, as a recovering alcoholic who knows plenty about addiction, I'm not going there!




Best thing I did was quite drinking!! I have no crazing at all for it, thank god! Only wish I would of done it years ago.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineSabnock
Be Your Own Shaman
Male

Registered: 01/02/14
Posts: 3,252
Last seen: 2 hours, 53 minutes
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: dpsoffgrid]
    #26453911 - 01/26/20 05:22 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

One thing you could perhaps try doing, if approaching Amanita's as a regular medication kinda thing, is adding some sort of admixture plant(s) or supplement(s) or essential oil(s) with it, in order to make things a bit more functional or add certain elements/aspects that would make things more to your liking or for the specific purpose you're wanting to take them for. Don't underestimate the power and potential of the synergy that can happen in combinations, combinations can change things up quite a bit compared to taking something by itself. As for what you could mix with it to make things more stable and medicinal, that's for you to research and explore, just find things you think that will mix well with it, and try it out, there's lots of room for experimentation with plant medicines. I myself, have only taken Amanita's a few times on their own (and with Cannabis and Tobacco), and i went for higher dosages of Amanita's but never really had much come out of them, but i hear they can be pretty powerful, but i've always wondered about it's potential medicinal properties or as an admixture to my Ayahuasca. So imo, it's worth a shot, just be cautious and do it in your free time until you find a good combination of things, then try using it as a functional medicine, don't wanna get too out there if you got something you need to do.


--------------------


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemudskippa
Stranger
Registered: 01/26/20
Posts: 16
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: dpsoffgrid]
    #26453932 - 01/26/20 05:32 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:


Best thing I did was quite drinking!! I have no crazing at all for it, thank god! Only wish I would of done it years ago.




Good for you mate. Yeah, I am sooo grateful alcohol is out of my life.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemudskippa
Stranger
Registered: 01/26/20
Posts: 16
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: Sabnock] * 1
    #26453944 - 01/26/20 05:46 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

Sabnock said:
One thing you could perhaps try doing, if approaching Amanita's as a regular medication kinda thing, is adding some sort of admixture plant(s) or supplement(s) or essential oil(s) with it, in order to make things a bit more functional or add certain elements/aspects that would make things more to your liking or for the specific purpose you're wanting to take them for. Don't underestimate the power and potential of the synergy that can happen in combinations, combinations can change things up quite a bit compared to taking something by itself. As for what you could mix with it to make things more stable and medicinal, that's for you to research and explore, just find things you think that will mix well with it, and try it out, there's lots of room for experimentation with plant medicines. I myself, have only taken Amanita's a few times on their own (and with Cannabis and Tobacco), and i went for higher dosages of Amanita's but never really had much come out of them, but i hear they can be pretty powerful, but i've always wondered about it's potential medicinal properties or as an admixture to my Ayahuasca. So imo, it's worth a shot, just be cautious and do it in your free time until you find a good combination of things, then try using it as a functional medicine, don't wanna get too out there if you got something you need to do.




Thank you. What a wonderfully thoughtful comment.

It's hard to find research that isn't behind a paywall that is specific enough to use for this, but I like your point.

The really amazing thing about Muscimol is that it is almost unique in its GABA-A2 utility. Most GABA agonists and analogs cover more receptors, which could lead to increased sedation, memory problems, downregulation etc. Or they push each other out of receptors. This is why I am so very interested in AM's potential. GABA-A2 seems to be an absolute goldmine target for problems like mine.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineSabnock
Be Your Own Shaman
Male

Registered: 01/02/14
Posts: 3,252
Last seen: 2 hours, 53 minutes
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: mudskippa]
    #26453980 - 01/26/20 06:07 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

Well by research i mean primarily like look into different plants, supplements, oils, etc, find some that look interesting, get ahold of some, mix them with a low dose of Amanita's and see how it goes. See what the plants/supplements/oils are good/useful for, maybe even look into some of the properties they have and what they do in the body/on the brain (if possible), find one's that seem interesting/worthwhile and go for it, see what comes of it. For the most part if i come across a plant or something that i hear good things about or that i come across through research or that is recommended to me, or i hear people talking about, i'll look at the wiki page for it for some basic info, and then i'll head on over to pubmed and skim through some abstracts or articles to see what's been found out about the plant, and if i find it interesting enough, i get some and just experiment around.


--------------------


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemudskippa
Stranger
Registered: 01/26/20
Posts: 16
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: Sabnock] * 1
    #26454001 - 01/26/20 06:22 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

Sabnock said:
Well by research i mean primarily like look into different plants, supplements, oils, etc, find some that look interesting, get ahold of some, mix them with a low dose of Amanita's and see how it goes. See what the plants/supplements/oils are good/useful for, maybe even look into some of the properties they have and what they do in the body/on the brain (if possible), find one's that seem interesting/worthwhile and go for it, see what comes of it. For the most part if i come across a plant or something that i hear good things about or that i come across through research or that is recommended to me, or i hear people talking about, i'll look at the wiki page for it for some basic info, and then i'll head on over to pubmed and skim through some abstracts or articles to see what's been found out about the plant, and if i find it interesting enough, i get some and just experiment around.




Yes, thank you, I'm doing that. I have been researching and experimenting with this for a while as I've been ill for 4-5 years.

It's a bit of a lonely road as most info doesn't get as specific as I need and no-one else seems to be researching this exact problem.

Pubmed is great, though you do kind of have to go into the articles properly as the research can be misleading if you just skim it. Not great when you have brain fog already like I do :wink:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineSabnock
Be Your Own Shaman
Male

Registered: 01/02/14
Posts: 3,252
Last seen: 2 hours, 53 minutes
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: mudskippa]
    #26454081 - 01/26/20 07:18 PM (4 years, 21 days ago)

True. Another good source for some info can be examine.com

But yeah, i found Mucuna extract (containing L-Dopa) to be good for brain fog and an increase in clearheadedness, Lemon EO (or pure Limonene) can also be good for clearheadedness, and if you're not against it, perhaps try like 2 to 3 Ibuprofen as brain fog can be due to inflammation. Probiotics may also be useful. Ginger or Peppermint may also be useful to try out. I really like Lemon Balm, but on it's own it's kinda mild but it does inhibit GABA-Transaminase so it can be useful for anxiety and relaxation, particularly with Entheogens. Another thing you may try doing, if you're not on contraindicated medications that is, is consuming like 2 grams of Syrian Rue seed powder in capsules, i've been dosing 2 grams for the last like 4 days or so and it does seem to have some pain relieving properties and other interesting properties.


--------------------


Edited by Sabnock (01/26/20 07:27 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineLophophora
A single drop in the ocean
 User Gallery

Registered: 08/22/18
Posts: 637
Last seen: 1 year, 4 months
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: Sabnock]
    #26454310 - 01/26/20 11:20 PM (4 years, 20 days ago)

I can say that muscimol is being used in hospital settings now as a last line anticonvulsant when status epilepticus has failed to respond to benzos and NMDA antagonists. Generally it's given via infusion directly to the brain though rather than oral or IV with great success however whether it would work for anxiolytic purposes I don't know, perhaps you'll have to test it out yourself and see what happens.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemudskippa
Stranger
Registered: 01/26/20
Posts: 16
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: Sabnock]
    #26454466 - 01/27/20 04:09 AM (4 years, 20 days ago)

I like Lemon Balm. There is a product called 'Melissa Dream' that contains Lemon Balm, Chamomile, L-theanine and Magnesium that is my first-level sleeping pill before I turn to anything pharmaceutical. I haven't tried taking a dose during the day, but I might. I love Ginger for nausea.

It's really interesting looking at functional treatments. I have tried many nootropics, plants, and herbs and rarely does anything work for me. It doesn't help that I am hypersensitive to everything now, which really does suggest I'm in glutamate overload territory. I also think my adrenals are burned not. Not in the way most people's are. Morning cortisol tests showed I had LOW cortisol, not high. This potentially explains why many anxiety or stress relief supplements are counterproductive.

Interestingly, the only other thing other than diazepam that I've had any symptom relief from is N-Acetyl-Cysteine. The first week I took it, I felt almost normal. My main symptoms are dizziness and head pressure, and on NAC, I recall being able to walk much further without dizziness. But afterwards, it totally stopped working and made me feel worse than ever. I will have to look up the functional mechanisms of NAC and maybe try that again once a week or something.




Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemudskippa
Stranger
Registered: 01/26/20
Posts: 16
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
Re: Low dose Amanita muscaria as a sub for Diazepam? [Re: Lophophora]
    #26454467 - 01/27/20 04:13 AM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Lophophora said:
I can say that muscimol is being used in hospital settings now as a last line anticonvulsant when status epilepticus has failed to respond to benzos and NMDA antagonists. Generally it's given via infusion directly to the brain though rather than oral or IV with great success however whether it would work for anxiolytic purposes I don't know, perhaps you'll have to test it out yourself and see what happens.




I looked that up in a buzz of excitement! Epilepsy meds are of interest to me. However, it's MuscADol they give to patients, not MuscIMol. Muscadol is a mix of caffeine, painkillers, and anti-histamines. I am actually looking at anti-histimines as a form of treatment though, so your post may be a "happy accident" that reminded me to look that up further. Thanks.


Edited by mudskippa (01/27/20 04:14 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1 | 2 | Next >  [ show all ]

Shop: Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals   Amanita Muscaria Store Amanita Extract   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Capsules   North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Amanita muscaria and Siberians dmc_ 1,256 1 11/14/04 08:16 PM
by Koala Koolio
* Confused with Amanita muscaria var. formosa... ownfive 2,365 3 10/25/04 02:14 AM
by Super_Blunt
* Amanita muscaria..worth it? monolith4 5,610 8 05/16/04 04:39 PM
by HoodedForestDwellr
* Amanita Muscarias...what's the deal? wizard597 4,343 12 12/22/03 05:28 PM
by Ravus
* Amanita muscaria Resin Extract , EAT? SMOKE? or What?
( 1 2 all )
orangejuice 65,427 28 07/31/11 05:00 AM
by Nocternalbutterfly
* Amanita muscaria question!!!! Hamurabi 2,619 8 11/07/02 06:04 AM
by egolesss
* Amanita Muscaria????????? hildbrandt 1,057 7 11/24/02 12:33 AM
by Xlea321
* Amanitas Muscaria NorseSuncrose 1,789 7 08/24/03 06:14 PM
by NorseSuncrose

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: psilocybinjunkie, Rose, mushboy, LogicaL Chaos, Northerner, bodhisatta
1,087 topic views. 1 members, 39 guests and 10 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.022 seconds spending 0.004 seconds on 14 queries.