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morrowasted
Worldwide Stepper


Registered: 10/30/09
Posts: 31,377
Loc: House of Mirrors
Last seen: 3 days, 23 hours
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Re: Viral outbreak in China [Re: susurrador] 5
#26601783 - 04/14/20 11:08 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
But you'll never be as healthy as someone who consumes mainly animals and their byproducts and little plant matter.
this is not only horseshit, it is dangerous to advocate for a high fat low fiber diet, especially in the midst of a viral pandemic whose complications are known to be exacerbated by hyperlipidemia and hypergylecmia. if you ever receive a real education in healthcare you will feel embarrassed for having said it. I really really do not want to argue with you, so if you choose to say anything else obtuse and stupid, I won't validate it with further responses. For the sake of the health of the people on this forum consider keeping your mouth shut. Sincerely, a guy who isn't a vegan but who has actually had to take nutrition courses and who regularly has to provide patient teaching about diet modifications for improved health outcomes, and who also coincidentally happens to have lost 80lbs of fat and kept it off for 4 years while maintaining a high carbohydrate, high fiber, low fat diet.
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Eminence



Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,623
Loc: Richmond, VA
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Re: Viral outbreak in China [Re: susurrador]
#26601786 - 04/14/20 11:12 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Some vegan women end up having to eat meat again just to be able to have children. Not a good sign.
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Eminence



Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,623
Loc: Richmond, VA
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You're talking about fat loss and maintenance? Nobody says you can't lose fat and keep it off on a high carb diet. I've tried so many styles of eating for weight lifting and high fat/protein low carb was by far the easiest way to lose fat and keep it off because you don't feel as hungry throughout the day, but high carb is good for gaining strength because of the extra quick energy though.
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morrowasted
Worldwide Stepper


Registered: 10/30/09
Posts: 31,377
Loc: House of Mirrors
Last seen: 3 days, 23 hours
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Re: Viral outbreak in China [Re: Eminence] 1
#26601801 - 04/14/20 11:27 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Some vegan women end up having to eat meat again just to be able to have children. Not a good sign.
A much greater percentage of people who eat meat die of heart disease.
I am talking about being a healthy person. The kind of person who is resilient to disease and health deterioration.
Optimal health involves getting a very large percentage of your calories from vegetables, fruits, and whole grains.
Study after study shows that fiber and various toxic compounds found exclusively in plants protect against the development of metabolic syndrome, cancer, and abdominal obesity by inducing physiological stresses through pathways like mTOR and the sirtuins.
Study after study positively correlates high consumption of fat and meat and processed sugar with the aforementioned things.
These are established facts in the medical textbooks. If you would like to choose to follow some blogger instead, that is your prerogative. All I can tell you is that I have seen over... and over... and over again, firsthand, the effects of patients ignoring the doctors' advice.
You're welcome to do so as well, and I'll genuinely be keeping my fingers crossed that I never cross your path in a professional capacity. Good luck to all and good night.
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susurrador
Psychedelic Cowboy


Registered: 03/31/19
Posts: 1,432
Loc: SW US
Last seen: 10 months, 6 hours
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Re: Viral outbreak in China [Re: morrowasted] 1
#26601803 - 04/14/20 11:29 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
morrowasted said:
Quote:
But you'll never be as healthy as someone who consumes mainly animals and their byproducts and little plant matter.
this is not only horseshit, it is dangerous to advocate for a high fat low fiber diet, especially in the midst of a viral pandemic whose complications are known to be exacerbated by hyperlipidemia and hypergylecmia. if you ever receive a real education in healthcare you will feel embarrassed for having said it. I really really do not want to argue with you, so if you choose to say anything else obtuse and stupid, I won't validate it with further responses. For the sake of the health of the people on this forum consider keeping your mouth shut. Sincerely, a guy who isn't a vegan but who has actually had to take nutrition courses and who regularly has to provide patient teaching about diet modifications for improved health outcomes, and who also coincidentally happens to have lost 80lbs of fat and kept it off for 4 years while maintaining a high carbohydrate, high fiber, low fat diet.
I don't need your validation and I have no desire to learn the latest nonsense the healthcare world is spewing about food. An industry based on treating symptoms with drugs knows nothing about food.
Non animal foods are second rate and is why poor people throughout history got the porridge and the not so poor people ate animals and their products. Which continues today.
People have known forever that animals are superior food and the earliest advances in human technology were based on killing and dismantling animals.
People that think they're outsmarting nature are the real danger to public health.
Edit- high fat and meat consumption ONLY has negative impact on health when combined with carbs and sugar... plant based products. So if you think it is the meat and fat you're wrong. You can eat only animals and be very healthy. You can't eat only carbs and sugar and be very healthy.
-------------------- "If it doesn't work, you can always hit him with it."
Edited by susurrador (04/14/20 11:32 PM)
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Eminence



Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,623
Loc: Richmond, VA
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Hasn't there been multiple studies recently showing that fat doesn't cause heart disease though? Has there actually been any studies of heavy meat eaters in comparison to vegans? Everything I've ever heard about seems to have been talking about people who follow standard western diets which include meat AND bread and sugar. Do you think someone eating something like, for example, eggs and organ meats and raw diary with some greens and berries or nuts would be unhealthy compared to someone who only eats fruits and vegetables? Is there a difference between store bought mass produced meat and wild meat? Most meat I buy is from this small farm up the street, and I hunt every now and then.
Honestly if you were to show me undeniable proof that my diet is unhealthy for me, I still probably wouldn't change it because mentally and physically I feel much better than when I ate high carb, especially vegan.
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Edited by Eminence (04/15/20 12:04 AM)
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susurrador
Psychedelic Cowboy


Registered: 03/31/19
Posts: 1,432
Loc: SW US
Last seen: 10 months, 6 hours
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Re: Viral outbreak in China [Re: Eminence]
#26601816 - 04/14/20 11:43 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Look up carnivore diet and ketogenic diets.
There's a guy on IG that goes by carnivoreMD. He's got a lot to say and an interesting story on the topic.
Slowdownfarmstead on IG as well have the right idea.
-------------------- "If it doesn't work, you can always hit him with it."
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Eminence



Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,623
Loc: Richmond, VA
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Re: Viral outbreak in China [Re: susurrador]
#26601822 - 04/14/20 11:48 PM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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I've known all about carnivore and keto for a while. I don't follow anyone online about it and I don't even really put in an effort to eat keto, my favorite foods just happen to fall in line with it. Ribeye, eggs, and asparagus was dinner tonight. Felt fuckin fantastic on carnivore but it's too much commitment when you're around other people and like things like spinach and peppers and onions etc. like I do.
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The Blind Ass
Bodhi



Registered: 08/16/16
Posts: 26,657
Loc: The Primordial Mind
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Re: Viral outbreak in China [Re: Eminence] 1
#26601905 - 04/15/20 01:33 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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The lifestyles that lead to some of some of the most dangerous comorbidities when infected with covid19 are too easily taken for granted in the modern world.
-------------------- Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps
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Baby_Hitler
Errorist




Registered: 03/06/02
Posts: 27,587
Loc: To the limit!
Last seen: 9 hours, 20 minutes
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CAN I GET A SUMMARY OF ALL THE NON-DUMB SHIT FROM THE LAST TEN PAGES? i AM AN *ESSENTIAL*WORKER AND DO NOT HAVE TIME FOR BULLSHIT.
Where we at on the Quercetin? Should I plant Lovage, or what?
Buckwheat?
-------------------- Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ (•_•) <) )~ ANTIFA / \ \(•_•) ( (> SUPER / \ (•_•) <) )> SOLDIERS / \
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The Blind Ass
Bodhi



Registered: 08/16/16
Posts: 26,657
Loc: The Primordial Mind
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Can’t go wrong with buckwheat. Eat it, use it for pillow or mattress stuffing, stuff is fantastic.
-------------------- Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps
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ShroomerInTheRye
Clit Commander



Registered: 01/12/12
Posts: 13,036
Loc: Themyscira
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Re: Viral outbreak in China [Re: morrowasted] 1
#26602151 - 04/15/20 06:01 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Every time I've tried to go vegan or vegetarian, I've ended up in the hospital sick as shit. Believe me, I've tried because I hate eating meat.
Turns out, I have Crohn's Disease and I can't be a vegetarian. The small seeds in fruits and veggies can get caught in my intestines, and a person cannot survive solely on melons, potatoes, and yams.
You assume that just because a diet is meat heavy means that it's also fat heavy. It's not. I eat like a cat now...chicken, tuna, yogurt....high protein, low fat. Not only is my cholesterol down and I've lost weight, but I also don't have immense stomach problems and pain that require surgery.
Just saying...just because a diet is high protein doesn't mean it's high fat also.
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<-- Clicky Clicky
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Amanita86
OTD Keymaster


Registered: 09/26/12
Posts: 89,464
Loc: hades
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Re: Viral outbreak in China [Re: mushboy] 1
#26602155 - 04/15/20 06:06 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
mushboy said: i became sound on salvia. that was odd.

I would love to read that trip report if you ever put one together..
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Orange clock, pencil "They threw me off the hay truck about noon..."
*Mark 15:34  Gam zeh ya’avor...
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brk
Unless...



Registered: 04/10/14
Posts: 10,210
Loc: SA
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Oh shit that sucks. A friend of mine has crohns. The hospital contacted him about 3 weeks ago to strongly recommend he goes into home quarantine. They told him he's at a significantly increased risk of developing serious complications from covid. Stay safe.
-------------------- "To the young it gives a vision of the dead and gone. While the old receive a passion to survive, and the pattern picks the pockets of the palindrome, before the oscillating rhythm takes to flight..." - Rishloo

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MadMuncher
destroy weyerhauser



Registered: 10/27/12
Posts: 8,404
Loc: not in compliance
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good writer- https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vilhjalmur_Stefansson
Stefansson documented the fact that the Inuit diet consists of about 90% meat and fish; Inuit will often go 6 to 9 months a year eating nothing but meat and fish—what might nowadays be perceived to be a 'zerocarb' / no-carbohydrate diet. (The diet technically contains a very low amount of carbohydates as the fresh fish that the Inuit eat would have contained a small amount of glycogen.) He found that he and his fellow explorers of European, Negro, and South Sea Islands descent were also perfectly healthy on such a diet.
Some years after his first experience with the Inuit (known as Eskimos in Stefansson's time), Dr. Stefansson returned to the Arctic with a colleague, Dr. Karsten Anderson, to carry out research for the American Museum of Natural History. They were supplied with every necessity including a year's supply of 'civilised' food. This they declined, electing instead to live off the land. In the end, the one-year project stretched to four years, during which time the two men ate only the meat they could kill and the fish they could catch in the Canadian Arctic. Neither of the two men suffered any adverse after-effects from their four-year experiment. It was evident to Stefansson, as it had been to William Banting, that the body could function perfectly well, remain healthy, vigorous and slender if it used a diet in which as much food was eaten as the body required, only carbohydrate was restricted and the total number of calories was ignored.[19]
While there was considerable skepticism when Stefansson reported his findings about the viability of an exclusively meat diet, his claims have been borne out in later studies and analyses.[20] In multiple studies, it was shown that the Inuit diet is a ketogenic diet. While the Inuit diet derives a percentage of its calories from the glycogen found in the raw meats, the native Inuit eat a diet of primarily stewed (boiled) fish and meats while occasionally eating raw fish.[21][22][23] To combat erroneous conventional beliefs about diet, Stefansson and his fellow explorer Karsten Anderson agreed to undertake a study to demonstrate that they could eat a 100% meat diet in a closely observed laboratory setting for the first several weeks. For the rest of an entire year, paid observers followed them to ensure dietary compliance. The book The Unseen Power: Public Relations states that Pendelton Dudley, once considered the "dean of public relations", convinced the American Meat Institute to fund this study.[24]
The results were published, and Anderson had developed glycosuria during this time, which is normally associated with untreated diabetes. But unlike the pathology of diabetes, in this particular study, glucosuria was present in Anderson for 4 days and coincided only with the giving of a 100 gm of glucose for a tolerance test and with the first 3 days of his pneumonia, where he received fluids and a diet rich in carbohydrate. Once that situation resolved, the glucosuria disappeared.[25]
At the researchers' request, Stefansson was asked to eat lean meat only. Stefansson noted that in the North, very lean meat sometimes produced "digestive disturbances". Whereas Stefansson's prior experience was that lean meat would lead to illness after the second or third fatless week, Stefansson developed nausea and diarrhea on the third day at Bellevue. Stefansson attributes the fast onset of illness due to the usually lean meat that he was served versus the fattier caribou meat he consumed previously.[26] After eating fatty meat, he fully recovered in two days. However, the initial disturbance was followed by "a period of persistent constipation lasting 10 days".[27]
There were no deficiency problems; the two men remained perfectly healthy; their bowels remained normal, except that their stools were smaller and did not smell. Stefansson's gingivitis disappeared by the end of the experiment although there was an increase in the deposit of tartar on his teeth. During this experiment his intake had varied between 2,000 and 3,100 calories per day and he derived, by choice, an average of almost eighty percent of his energy from animal fat and almost twenty percent from protein.[19] Daily intake varied from 100-140 grams of protein, 200-300 grams of fat, and 7-12 grams of carbohydrates.
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amanita phalloides prints for trade $BanEnlil $IgnoreEnlil Spicemaster said: The stories. The words. The descriptions. Keep your list handy. 1234Go said: I bet you guys PM about me... Ban Lotto Wins: IIIII
Edited by MadMuncher (04/15/20 06:45 AM)
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InfiniteDreams


Registered: 10/25/19
Posts: 1,224
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Re: Viral outbreak in China [Re: Amanita86]
#26602170 - 04/15/20 06:24 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Come on now, veganism is unnatural.
No one is arguing to eat meat instead of plants. Eat both obviously.
Get your fiber and carbs from healthy plant sources. Get your protein mainly from animal sources. Healthy fat usually comes from plant sources.
And "meat" is highly variable. Big difference from lean sources vs fatty sources.
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ShroomerInTheRye
Clit Commander



Registered: 01/12/12
Posts: 13,036
Loc: Themyscira
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Re: Viral outbreak in China [Re: brk] 1
#26602174 - 04/15/20 06:26 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Thanks, brk. They say it’s an autoimmune disorder, but I don’t understand that. It just hurts to eat and poop most of the time.
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<-- Clicky Clicky
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gopher
Coffee Bean Extraordinaire



Registered: 11/22/17
Posts: 12,999
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 1 hour, 53 minutes
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Quote:
morrowasted said: Study after study positively correlates high consumption of fat and meat and processed sugar with the aforementioned things.
you need a study where they take the hamburger and toss the buns and fries though, these carnivores get bloodwork, and it turns out pretty good except for cholesterol, but they argue cholesterol dosnt even matter
-------------------- For most of the normies out there, an operating system is just a bootloader for Google Chrome. Since Disney has obtained tremendous value from the public domain, knows how important the public domain is, and is firmly determined to never contribute anything to it. My pronouns are He and Him, and my adjectives are Fat and Jazzy
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InfiniteDreams


Registered: 10/25/19
Posts: 1,224
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Re: Viral outbreak in China [Re: gopher]
#26602188 - 04/15/20 06:42 AM (3 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
gopher said:
Quote:
morrowasted said: Study after study positively correlates high consumption of fat and meat and processed sugar with the aforementioned things.
you need a study where they take the hamburger and toss the buns and fries though, these carnivores get bloodwork, and it turns out pretty good except for cholesterol, but they argue cholesterol dosnt even matter
Meat and processed sugar? Processed sugar is awful and comes from plants!
Meat encompasses protein and fat. Nothing wrong with meat as a protein source. Eating fatty meat is not recommended.
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gopher
Coffee Bean Extraordinaire



Registered: 11/22/17
Posts: 12,999
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 1 hour, 53 minutes
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the fat is where the vitamins are at though
-------------------- For most of the normies out there, an operating system is just a bootloader for Google Chrome. Since Disney has obtained tremendous value from the public domain, knows how important the public domain is, and is firmly determined to never contribute anything to it. My pronouns are He and Him, and my adjectives are Fat and Jazzy
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