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LegionOfShroom


Registered: 02/13/17
Posts: 235
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Grains slow to finish
#26439133 - 01/17/20 07:23 PM (4 years, 30 days ago) |
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Greetings! 
I’ve got some jars that I’m a little concerned about. These jars are oats (Bod’s tek) inoculated with a small wedge of APE mycelium on 12/21

Seams like a lot of exposed grain still
I shook them about 2.5 days ago, they were at 95% colonization. I shook them to test for recovery and help the mycelium reach the last few grains. They bounced back within 24hrs but just seam really slow to fully capture the grains now. Makes me wonder if they’re fighting contams.
I’ve had quart jars colonize in under 3 weeks before in better conditions, I believe the slower growth overall is most likely just due to temps being on the cooler side and often fluctuating (70-73 degrees). I’m going to get an independent heater for the space to better regulate the temps soon.
Do they look ok? I’m just trying to understand if this is what a poor recovery looks like, or what’s going on.
Thanks!
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LegionOfShroom


Registered: 02/13/17
Posts: 235
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Also for comparison
Here is some oats prepared in the same batch, inoculated 12/21 with golden teacher mycelium wedge. Also shaken 2.5 days ago.

The mycelium seams to have enveloped the grains more completely here
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Eclipse3130
Servant of the Fungi



Registered: 10/06/13
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Probably have some bacteria going on, would make the most sense based on how long it's been and the way it looks. You can almost be 100% sure.
Wasn't completely sterile when inoculated, also grains are a little wet
-------------------- "In The Material World One seeks retirement and grows Old In The Magical World One seeks Enlightenment and grows Wiser In The Miraculous World One seeks nothing and grows Lighter As we all tread the Homeward Path we will explore many Realms And one day... we will all Realize that all experiences are Simply Different ways in which The All-That Is Perceives Itself"
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DNA_Trip
Stranger

Registered: 10/02/19
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Are you still planning on spawning these to bulk?
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DNA_Trip
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I have the same thing going on with mine right now also, I had started a thread about it a couple days ago.
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iwh678
Budget Mycologist



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Re: Grains slow to finish [Re: DNA_Trip]
#26439207 - 01/17/20 08:02 PM (4 years, 30 days ago) |
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All three of those jars you posted look bacterial legion. The third one isn't nearly as bad as those first two pics though.
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Eclipse3130
Servant of the Fungi



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Re: Grains slow to finish [Re: iwh678]
#26439296 - 01/17/20 09:23 PM (4 years, 30 days ago) |
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Yeah, when jars stall out and no sign of obvious discoloration of contamination is visible, it's almost always bacteria. Especially when those little wet spots the mycelium avoids, it almost always will take over at some point.
-------------------- "In The Material World One seeks retirement and grows Old In The Magical World One seeks Enlightenment and grows Wiser In The Miraculous World One seeks nothing and grows Lighter As we all tread the Homeward Path we will explore many Realms And one day... we will all Realize that all experiences are Simply Different ways in which The All-That Is Perceives Itself"
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DNA_Trip
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So it's not even worth trying to spawn it to my substrate? Won't get anything at all?
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LegionOfShroom


Registered: 02/13/17
Posts: 235
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Re: Grains slow to finish [Re: DNA_Trip]
#26439344 - 01/17/20 10:08 PM (4 years, 30 days ago) |
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Thanks for the input, that’s what I had assumed (bacteria and grains slightly too wet). In the 3rd pic I believe the “wet spot” may be a space where the grain was pressed against the glass so the mycelium couldn’t squeeze into that space. Seams common. Also maybe a symptom of grains being too wet.
If the mycelium won’t capture the grains fully I may not fruit them.... I’m on the fence about it. I don’t want contams proliferating in my grow space
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Eclipse3130
Servant of the Fungi



Registered: 10/06/13
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Based on their slow speed and lack of obvious full colonization of the grain, you will chance it spawning any further, and eventually that contam will take over
-------------------- "In The Material World One seeks retirement and grows Old In The Magical World One seeks Enlightenment and grows Wiser In The Miraculous World One seeks nothing and grows Lighter As we all tread the Homeward Path we will explore many Realms And one day... we will all Realize that all experiences are Simply Different ways in which The All-That Is Perceives Itself"
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AyePlus
Stony Danza



Registered: 12/18/14
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Dont g2g but I would soawn all of them to slightly dry bulk in shoeboxes. Definitely a bacterial infection in the top two, notice how thick and puffy the myc is where it is recovered? The first one is worse than second is, but both are pretty bad that thiccy mycelium is a bad sign.
The third one looks pretty good to me, maybe a tiny bit of bacteria, could probably g2g it and it would do ok but its not perfect. Oats are kinda tricky to tell because the myc doesnt really like to colomize the hull if theres any excess moisture, if the inoculation was perfect then this isnt an issue but excess moisture greatly increases bacterial issues, and the heat generated by a bacterial infection will cause more condensation.
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MH5109
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Re: Grains slow to finish [Re: AyePlus]
#26439433 - 01/17/20 11:37 PM (4 years, 30 days ago) |
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Or you could throw a little coir on top of the jars are fruit that way. Its technically a safer bet seeing as you arnt going to use more than a half cup of coir, vs a sb with 4 or 5 cups of coir. Then put a plastic bag over the hole and done, if they fruit congratulations if not well i guess you are out a half cup of coir. Better than the alternative.
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DNA_Trip
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My two jars I posted look way more colonized, but still look the way they do. I’m debating on still spawning them because I opened one up to take a smell and it smelled like fresh mushrooms and no weird smells. Am I running anything dangerous by trying to spawn them to bulk to see what happens?
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AyePlus
Stony Danza



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Re: Grains slow to finish [Re: DNA_Trip]
#26440056 - 01/18/20 11:19 AM (4 years, 30 days ago) |
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Nah, just do shoeboxes for each. Keep a hawk-eye on them and toss if they contam.
Bacterial spawn still fruits, usually only 1-2 flushes and not the highest B.E. Tho
Make the bul ka little on the dry side, better to have to mist with bacterial grains, can always bottom water later but overly wet will stall it out and trich will forsure win the battle.
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DNA_Trip
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Re: Grains slow to finish [Re: AyePlus]
#26440087 - 01/18/20 11:37 AM (4 years, 30 days ago) |
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Why do you recommend doing two different shoeboxes for each? Usually I always two jars of spawn per shoebox. Is that going to cause a problem or something?
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A.k.a
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Re: Grains slow to finish [Re: DNA_Trip]
#26440092 - 01/18/20 11:39 AM (4 years, 30 days ago) |
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It’s just a putting all your eggs in one basket thing.
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LAGM2020     
Edited by A.k.a (01/18/20 12:23 PM)
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AyePlus
Stony Danza



Registered: 12/18/14
Posts: 3,393
Loc: Fairfield, Connecticut
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Re: Grains slow to finish [Re: A.k.a]
#26440143 - 01/18/20 12:16 PM (4 years, 30 days ago) |
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Theyre sketchy and if you spawn them together and one goes south you lose both.
You can mix them and hope for the best but your best odds are doing 1 in each and keeping soawn sub ratio close to 1:1
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DNA_Trip
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Re: Grains slow to finish [Re: AyePlus]
#26440312 - 01/18/20 02:17 PM (4 years, 30 days ago) |
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What do you mean by highest BE?
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DNA_Trip
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Re: Grains slow to finish [Re: AyePlus]
#26440359 - 01/18/20 02:47 PM (4 years, 30 days ago) |
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So just one quart of my mixed bulk substrate for each one? Usually I use verm, coir, and gypsum and use 2 quarts of spawn for each shoebox. Since this time is a little different you’re saying only use one quart of my mixed bulk substrate? A full quart or a myco quart like my jar? And what do you mean by highest BE?
Edited by DNA_Trip (01/18/20 02:49 PM)
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AyePlus
Stony Danza



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Loc: Fairfield, Connecticut
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Re: Grains slow to finish [Re: DNA_Trip]
#26440383 - 01/18/20 02:58 PM (4 years, 30 days ago) |
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BE: biological efficiency- how well a the organism can convert substrate into mushrooms. Usually measured as dry weight in to dry weight out, but alot of cubensis growers use wet weight of grain to dry weight mushrooms. Like when people say you should be yeilding a dry oz per lb of grain on first flush
I said close to 1:1 not exactly. I dont even measure coir I just add roughly the right amount.
You could go for a wider range like 1:2 but the longer it takes the myc to colonize the sub the more likely a contam will take hold so narrower speeds things up and gets you to fruiting faster.
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