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Offline5280feethigh
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: Blueberry Muffin]
    #28604808 - 12/31/23 04:05 PM (28 days, 2 hours ago)

I just figured flame sterilizing a needle and finding a relatively clean place to inject a jar or bag would be easier than working with agar and transferring it to grain for somebody who is completely new and just wants some mushrooms. And just curious why would you inject ms syringe into brf as opposed to grain?


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OfflineMycoSnailCarl
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: 5280feethigh]
    #28604894 - 12/31/23 05:09 PM (28 days, 1 hour ago)

Quote:

5280feethigh said:
I just figured flame sterilizing a needle and finding a relatively clean place to inject a jar or bag would be easier than working with agar and transferring it to grain for somebody who is completely new and just wants some mushrooms. And just curious why would you inject ms syringe into brf as opposed to grain?




Just get a liquid culture syringe from a trusted vendor—that’s much safer than mss and easy. Will work just fine until you want to learn agar.

Brown rice flour doesn’t allow the bacteria to move around and fuck shit up, grain does. Honestly pf tek might be the way to go for you given you don’t need tons of shrooms, but grain is dope. If you are gonna inject directly to train, use LC, and either install self-healing injection ports (easy) or open the lid on a SAB. You should use a SAB either way, but imo injection ports are easier when you’re starting either way.


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InvisibleWay
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: 5280feethigh]
    #28604910 - 12/31/23 05:15 PM (28 days, 1 hour ago)

Quote:

5280feethigh said:
I just figured flame sterilizing a needle and finding a relatively clean place to inject a jar or bag would be easier than working with agar and transferring it to grain for somebody who is completely new and just wants some mushrooms. And just curious why would you inject ms syringe into brf as opposed to grain?




Spores to grain is always a bad idea if you want a decent chance at actually getting mushrooms.

Like Myco said, the structure of BRF and verm doesn't allow the bacteria to spread as easily as the mycelium. That's why it's the only thing we recommend people use a spore syringe with other than agar.


--------------------

That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.


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OfflineRockinRobot
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: 5280feethigh]
    #28604955 - 12/31/23 05:41 PM (28 days, 1 hour ago)

Quote:

5280feethigh said:
I just figured flame sterilizing a needle and finding a relatively clean place to inject a jar or bag would be easier than working with agar and transferring it to grain for somebody who is completely new and just wants some mushrooms. And just curious why would you inject ms syringe into brf as opposed to grain?




The problem is that Spore syringes are not clean and most always contain some type of contamination. Although vendors do their best, the mushrooms themselves are not grown in a sterile environment therefore their spores can never be completely clean.


Can you shoot spores into grain and have it work? Yes, but more often than not you will just end up with mold.

So if you only need a few mushrooms then PF Tek is your best bet and lowest investment. Otherwise bite the bullet and learn agar (it really ain't hard).


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Offline5280feethigh
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: Way]
    #28604963 - 12/31/23 05:44 PM (28 days, 1 hour ago)

I have used spore syringes many many times in grain bags and grain jars and always have gotten mushrooms. I completely agree agar is a much better way to inoculate grain,but it most definitely isn't the only way,especially for someone that has no concept of mushroom growing.


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Offline5280feethigh
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: RockinRobot]
    #28604977 - 12/31/23 05:53 PM (28 days, 55 minutes ago)

I completely understand that.I always start with agar now but had many successful grows with no contam problems using spore syringes. I think people are usually at fault for the contam and not the syringes in a lot of cases. Either way,I think there are lots of ways to have successful grows without getting into agar at first. Agar work is a lot of fun now that I have a flow hood. But I wouldn't have wanted mess with it on my first grow.


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OfflineRockinRobot
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: 5280feethigh] * 2
    #28604989 - 12/31/23 05:57 PM (28 days, 50 minutes ago)

Quote:

5280feethigh said:
I have used spore syringes many many times in grain bags and grain jars and always have gotten mushrooms. I completely agree agar is a much better way to inoculate grain,but it most definitely isn't the only way,especially for someone that has no concept of mushroom growing.




No one said it was the only way. But peoples biggest investment in this hobby is time. And recommending shooting spores into grain for a newbie is just wrong. Nothing makes someone walk away faster than waiting 2 months and watching all your hard work turn green.

This is why we recommend PF Tek to newbies. It was designed to be more contamination resistant and doesn't even require a PC. You will get slightly lower yields but are almost guaranteed mushrooms.

Either way You do you but IMHO don't recommend bad practices to others.


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InvisibleWay
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: 5280feethigh]
    #28605007 - 12/31/23 06:10 PM (28 days, 38 minutes ago)

Quote:

5280feethigh said:
I have used spore syringes many many times in grain bags and grain jars and always have gotten mushrooms. I completely agree agar is a much better way to inoculate grain,but it most definitely isn't the only way,especially for someone that has no concept of mushroom growing.




Yeah, it works. So does Uncle Bens.

I might even be tempted to say that spores to grain works more often than not. But I'd also say that even when it "works" you end up with reduced yields due to bacteria a lot of the times.

But it is not a reliable way to get mushrooms and should not be recommended for beginners because of the high chance of failure compared to something like PF tek or using a clean agar wedge.

You got lucky. Out of the 6 all in one bags I started with, I got fruit out of 2 of them. They were all unhealthy.

I help new cultivators every day troubleshoot their grows. A bacterial or contaminated tub is 9/10 times inoculated with a spore syringe. Maybe some of that failure is a result of technique, but most of these people are using a SAB and flaming the needle it would appear.


--------------------

That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.


Edited by Way (12/31/23 06:16 PM)


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OfflineSan Pedro GirlS
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: NattyOrNice]
    #28605009 - 12/31/23 06:12 PM (28 days, 36 minutes ago)

Quote:

NattyOrNice said:
Oh yeah forgot to mention, the discoloration is bruising, from spraying directly on it, and the yellowing is also from too much water, i spray up in the air above it now and let the fine mist drop back down on it.


It seems to be growing over the yellow spots, it's like stained yellow from water if that makes sense, and thanks!  I hope it fruits too!  If nothing else I have learned a lot from this endeavor, and should do better next time.

=]

Which is looking like pf tek, and maybe gamble on knocking up a grain bag.  Speaking of, earlier in this thread everyone was using WBS for nats, is that best?  Millet?  How about red milo?  That AIO bag was rye berry grains and it took FOREVER to get going from a MS syringe.  I put too much in too, but yeah I don't know if Nat spores are best with rye.  Does anyone know what they thrive best on?  Thanks!




I think you pulled it out of the bag too soon. In your future grows, focus on improving your patience. A lot of this hobby involves just leaving shit alone. Many times our “help” just hurts.

Put it in a water tub and control humidity with air exchange instead of spraying it. You don’t want to risk matting that myc down. It’ll make its own surface moisture. Patiently wait for your knots/pins and good luck!👍


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OnlineAspectOfTheCreator
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: Way]
    #28605014 - 12/31/23 06:16 PM (28 days, 32 minutes ago)

Quote:

Way said:
Quote:

5280feethigh said:
I have used spore syringes many many times in grain bags and grain jars and always have gotten mushrooms. I completely agree agar is a much better way to inoculate grain,but it most definitely isn't the only way,especially for someone that has no concept of mushroom growing.




Yeah, it works. So does Uncle Bens.

I might even be tempted to say that spores to grain works more often than not. But I'd also say that even when it "works" you end up with reduced yields due to bacteria a lot of the times.

But it is not a reliable way to get mushrooms and should not be recommended for beginners because of the high chance of failure compared to something like PF tek or using a clean agar wedge.

You got lucky. Out of the 6 all in one bags I started with, I got fruit out of 2 of them. They were all unhealthy.

I help new cultivators every day troubleshoot their grows. A bacterial or contaminated tub is 9/10 times inoculated with a spore syringe.




I grew back when spore syringe to grain was the norm. Few were using agar. Most times I would get shrooms, but in retrospect the grows were always stunted compared to the grows now using agar now.


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InvisibleNattyOrNice
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread *DELETED* [Re: San Pedro Girl]
    #28605024 - 12/31/23 06:22 PM (28 days, 26 minutes ago)

Post deleted by NattyOrNice

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OfflineSan Pedro GirlS
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: NattyOrNice]
    #28605027 - 12/31/23 06:27 PM (28 days, 21 minutes ago)

Quote:

NattyOrNice said:
Quote:

San Pedro Girl said:


Put it in a water tub and control humidity with air exchange instead of spraying it. You don’t want to risk matting that myc down. It’ll make its own surface moisture. Patiently wait for your knots/pins and good luck!👍




How do I know if it's matted down?



I don't have a water tub, how does that look?  Can I leave it alone?  Should I check on it periodically and see if the surface is dry?

Thanks!



Try to find a trivet or something to elevate it a bit and then cover the bottom with water. Keep the top covered to preserve humidity.  If you can’t find something to elevate it, it’s still better to have the bottom covered in water. It will certainly dry out the way you have it.


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InvisibleNattyOrNice
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread *DELETED* [Re: San Pedro Girl] * 1
    #28605031 - 12/31/23 06:35 PM (28 days, 13 minutes ago)

Post deleted by NattyOrNice

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OfflineSan Pedro GirlS
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: NattyOrNice] * 1
    #28605042 - 12/31/23 06:41 PM (28 days, 7 minutes ago)

Quote:

NattyOrNice said:
Hey thanks you so much SPG!!  How's this look??





Can I finally leave it alone?!? 😃



Looks pretty good. Keep it around 19-23°C in the room if possible. Higher temps will just help the bacteria. Lower temps give the myc an advantage in this situation. Hopefully you’ll see some mushrooms soon!


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InvisibleNattyOrNice
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: San Pedro Girl]
    #28605052 - 12/31/23 06:56 PM (27 days, 23 hours ago)

Awesome, I'll set the temp to 70 degrees, thank you!!


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Offline5280feethigh
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: Way]
    #28605072 - 12/31/23 07:24 PM (27 days, 23 hours ago)

I completely agree with using agar 100%. I just see tons of people still having contam problems when they are new and have improper sterile technique using still air boxes. And yes I must have gotten very lucky because I had some awesome grows with massive yeilds from ms to grain.


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Invisiblemilkboy
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: 5280feethigh]
    #28605125 - 12/31/23 08:06 PM (27 days, 22 hours ago)

Quote:

5280feethigh said:
I completely agree with using agar 100%. I just see tons of people still having contam problems when they are new and have improper sterile technique using still air boxes. And yes I must have gotten very lucky because I had some awesome grows with massive yeilds from ms to grain.



That is a dangerous correlation to make and it is not baised on any meaningful data. You see noobs have issues with a sab because they are noobs. Just like if someone was inexperienced working with a laminar flow hood they would experience issues. You on the other hand will continue to experience intermittent issues, many which will not be able to accurately be identified because of your questionable practices.


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"Vires acquirit eundo"



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Offline5280feethigh
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: milkboy]
    #28605134 - 12/31/23 08:14 PM (27 days, 22 hours ago)

I have a flow hood and use agar to clone. Other than that I transfer g2g and haven't had contam problems in a long time. Read the back posts before you run your mouth.


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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: 5280feethigh]
    #28605144 - 12/31/23 08:21 PM (27 days, 22 hours ago)

Spores to grain is totally fine as long as you have a good syringe source.

If spores were inherently dirty then syringes would NEVER work and you’d see contamination constantly streaking prints to agar. This is all bullshit that has popped up recently.

Agar is better but (good) syringes are fine too. Sporeworks hasn’t been around for decades by selling dirty syringes that fail more often than not.


--------------------
LAGM2020


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Offline5280feethigh
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Re: The official Psilocybe natalensis thread [Re: A.k.a]
    #28605150 - 12/31/23 08:26 PM (27 days, 22 hours ago)

Thank you A.k.A that's whaere I got mine.


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