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Buckomcdoogle
Atypical obsessive.


Registered: 11/27/19
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Methadone is EVIL
#26407833 - 12/30/19 01:55 PM (4 years, 30 days ago) |
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I had a few family members that were on methadone when I was a kid. They always told me its literally just a way for the government to control you. It is.
I only recently found out a few months back that Methadone was actually invented by the Nazis.
Blitzed: Nazis On Drugs (WW2 Documentary) | History Documentary | Reel Truth History
^Great doc btw
One of the dishwashers at my work is on 100+mg of methadone, and it really is just incredible how big opioid tolerance can become. He was saying he was taking suboxone, and got in a car wreck.
The hospital they took him to only had methadone, he was getting sick and took it Little did he realize......
Did you know, it binds to your opioid receptors, so if you take any other opioids with it you get really sick. Also, if you try to kick it the withdrawal is like 2 months. You can switch from suboxone to methadone, but not the other way around AAAAAAANNNNNND you have to go to the clinic every single day at 6:00am
If you ever want to travel or go anywhere, you have to make sure there is a clinic, they will never give you more than one dose.
I know people that just get a weeks worth of suboxone all at once.
It literally takes people years to taper down from those 100+mg scripts.
What an evil fucking system.
-------------------- "Nothing is more dangerous to your creativity than comfort and familiarity" "Nihilism is the most basic truth in existence, the only consistency throughout the world, and the universe is chaos and decay" "Logic leads to nihilism"
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TheFakeSunRa
Bitch Splitter



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It beats overdosing on fentanyl
No one wants to be addicted to anything but these people became junkies on their own
-------------------- [quote]Asante said: You constantly make posts thatr fling middle school insults at people you don't like mixed in with maladjusted psychopathic comments about wanting to beat up the other poster with a crowbar. You know how shit you are, you just don't give a fuck for precisely that reason. I disendorse you.[/quote]
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Buckomcdoogle
Atypical obsessive.


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It's never been more dangerous to be an addict.
-------------------- "Nothing is more dangerous to your creativity than comfort and familiarity" "Nihilism is the most basic truth in existence, the only consistency throughout the world, and the universe is chaos and decay" "Logic leads to nihilism"
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Near Dylan
Shitpost Artist


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I mean, it aint news. There is no pretty way to kick being a dope fiend except by never trying dope. Never really understood the tapering thing. I would rather go through a week of hell than just to sell my soul to another, more boring substance, knowing that I will just have to go through longer withdrawal anyway. Insanity.
They're not a slave to the 'government'. They are a slave to themselves.
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mndfreeze 
Shroomery Secret Service




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Your information is only partially correct, and the point of methadone is long term harm reduction and eventual quitting, something most addicts fail at when trying to rush it. Relapse rate is high when rushed, and overdose rate soars when people who rush through it relapse then take too much.
You also most definitely can switch back to subs from methadone, or any opiate. You just have to wait a whole whopping 24 hours to avoid POSSIBLE precipitated withdrawal. It's pretty common in the opiate scene for people to buy subs from others to use when they can't score their normal drug of choice.
Be careful posting this sort of garbage in this forum. We preach harm reduction here and knocking tried and true methods for getting off heroin or other street opiates doesn't follow those guidelines.
-------------------- Nothing says love like grannies prolapsed anus! quote]Urb said: I know... Its fucked up... Ill fix it minyana..[/quote]
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Hillbillyjohn


Registered: 11/13/15
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Re: Methadone is EVIL [Re: mndfreeze]
#26408518 - 12/30/19 09:49 PM (4 years, 29 days ago) |
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Almost none of that is true other than its just a gov sanctioned dealer but ppl only go daily at first you can get a month worth at once as long as you aren't using other drugs. And you can go back to subs just gotta wait for the naloxone to pass also it doesn't make anyone sick to take any other opiate on methadone just probably won't get high on it unless you do a lot then just fucking pass out. Peeps always going daily are new to it or won't stop fucking up but I'm not preaching for the shit it's just another monkey just won't go to jail for that one.
-------------------- https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24297804. Everything you need in one place read,follow,and fruit
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Buckomcdoogle
Atypical obsessive.


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I think what the guy was saying was he couldn't go back on suboxone because of insurance reasons.
It probably differs depending on what state your in.
Ive known of a few people who passed away mixing xanax and methadone, thinking it was safe cause its not an opioid.
The thing is though, id say a solid half of the opiate users I know started off using pills.
Now the demand is high and the black tar and counterfeit pills are largely filling that demand.
For someone who is straight laced and has never been high before, oxycodone is probably pretty mind blowing.
But yeah, its nothing new, the poppy has been enslaving people for millennia.
-------------------- "Nothing is more dangerous to your creativity than comfort and familiarity" "Nihilism is the most basic truth in existence, the only consistency throughout the world, and the universe is chaos and decay" "Logic leads to nihilism"
Edited by Buckomcdoogle (12/30/19 10:36 PM)
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Near Dylan
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Re: Methadone is EVIL [Re: mndfreeze] 1
#26408807 - 12/31/19 06:07 AM (4 years, 29 days ago) |
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Tried and true? I cannot think of a rehabilition method that has led to more regret, relapse, overdose, and dangerously miserable failure, than Methadone. The only thing tried and true about it is how unbelievably terrible it is as a rehabilitation tool. The fact that it is still around and actually dosed out to recovering addicts is nothing less than a prime example of the level of neglect that society has for the opiate crisis. Absolutely horrific method of kicking dope that almost always leads to the person being in a worse place than when they started. I would recommend every single method under the sun before I even think about methadone.
Harm reduction my ass. Recommending a recovering dope addict methadone is the worst disservice you can do to them.
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TheFakeSunRa
Bitch Splitter



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Re: Methadone is EVIL [Re: mndfreeze] 1
#26409036 - 12/31/19 09:39 AM (4 years, 29 days ago) |
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Quote:
Be careful posting this sort of garbage in this forum. We preach harm reduction here and knocking tried and true methods for getting off heroin or other street opiates doesn't follow those guidelines.
I think there should be heavier moderation on microdosing advice too. The science is far too natal for people with mental problems to start treating themselves with psychedelics.
I think at least mods could add a generic footnote to those posts stating there’s no consensus in the medical community and to tread cautiously.
-------------------- [quote]Asante said: You constantly make posts thatr fling middle school insults at people you don't like mixed in with maladjusted psychopathic comments about wanting to beat up the other poster with a crowbar. You know how shit you are, you just don't give a fuck for precisely that reason. I disendorse you.[/quote]
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Dark_Star
train driver pervading a desktop


Registered: 08/20/04
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Quote:
Near Dylan said: Tried and true? I cannot think of a rehabilition method that has led to more regret, relapse, overdose, and dangerously miserable failure, than Methadone. The only thing tried and true about it is how unbelievably terrible it is as a rehabilitation tool. The fact that it is still around and actually dosed out to recovering addicts is nothing less than a prime example of the level of neglect that society has for the opiate crisis. Absolutely horrific method of kicking dope that almost always leads to the person being in a worse place than when they started. I would recommend every single method under the sun before I even think about methadone.
Harm reduction my ass. Recommending a recovering dope addict methadone is the worst disservice you can do to them.
Same can be said for suboxone as well. Methadone & subs are definitely better than shooting dope when it comes to harm reduction. However it’s not recovery. As a harm reduction site we’d be remiss if we didn’t point that out. Using pharmaceuticals to try to dig out from a problem that was really made possible/into what it’s become, by the pharmaceutical industry itself...... Nah. Addiction medicine, much like mental health in general, is sorely lacking. We need some fresh ideas on how to tackle the problem, cause what we’ve been doing isn’t working.
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mndfreeze 
Shroomery Secret Service




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Quote:
Near Dylan said: Tried and true? I cannot think of a rehabilition method that has led to more regret, relapse, overdose, and dangerously miserable failure, than Methadone. The only thing tried and true about it is how unbelievably terrible it is as a rehabilitation tool. The fact that it is still around and actually dosed out to recovering addicts is nothing less than a prime example of the level of neglect that society has for the opiate crisis. Absolutely horrific method of kicking dope that almost always leads to the person being in a worse place than when they started. I would recommend every single method under the sun before I even think about methadone.
Harm reduction my ass. Recommending a recovering dope addict methadone is the worst disservice you can do to them.
By all means, detail your personal experience with it and back those opinions up with some source data. As someone who had actually done it, successfully, I can say the method works great and there is quite a lot of studies on its effectiveness.
-------------------- Nothing says love like grannies prolapsed anus! quote]Urb said: I know... Its fucked up... Ill fix it minyana..[/quote]
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Anonymous #1
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Re: Methadone is EVIL [Re: mndfreeze] 1
#26409203 - 12/31/19 11:43 AM (4 years, 29 days ago) |
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Long term tapering is effective but you need to want to stop doing dope or you’ll be an every day relapser/clincer
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Buckomcdoogle
Atypical obsessive.


Registered: 11/27/19
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Ive always been of the belief, getting clean is the easy part, staying clean is the hard part.
re learning how to cope with negative emotions, re learning how to be a normal healthy person. Forgetting that addict mentality of the first thought in your head when something goes badly "I just want to get wasted" Learning how to not crave a buzz
My uncle relapsed after 11 years sober, his roommate found him passed out in the bathroom.
Look at Philip Seymour Hoffman.
He was well known for being a long time sober, decides one day to go into his bathroom and stick a needle in his arm.
Me personally, Id rather kick for a week than get trapped in the system.
Rehab is for rich people, Its crazy how much people shell out for that shit.
There's definitely no 1 size fits all recovery.
Everyone is different and Everyone's habits are different and People use drugs for different reasons.
-------------------- "Nothing is more dangerous to your creativity than comfort and familiarity" "Nihilism is the most basic truth in existence, the only consistency throughout the world, and the universe is chaos and decay" "Logic leads to nihilism"
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Near Dylan
Shitpost Artist


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Re: Methadone is EVIL [Re: mndfreeze]
#26410253 - 01/01/20 12:35 AM (4 years, 28 days ago) |
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Just off the get-go I dont think I need to write a theorem paper to explain why swapping one rough withdrawal for another, longer withdrawal isnt really the most practical approach. Shit lasts weeks and weeks, Ive never been through it but Ive seen it first hand and it's mind blowing the length of time these people are in hell for something that was supposed to make kicking opiates easier. The 'taper' is ridiculous. Either hilariously long, or hell. Crazy how they still drag people through it.
Seems to have made it 100x harder to quit opiates and put everyone I knew who went on it in a significantly worse position than before, feeling trapped. One of them went back to dope for weeks just to kick it cold turkey after he realized it would just be easier than the methadone withdrawal, cuz he seemed to never get out of it. He was able to kick the habit after that and wouldnt shut up about how much of a scam methadone was, just the goverment finding a way to make a profit off of opiate addicts.
The other two just kept going on and off other BS maintenance programs that just dragged out their addictions longer and longer and longer and I watched them stagnate through life, too scared to go through dope withdrawal, but shit terrified to go through bupe or methadone withdrawal. Weeks turn to months, years. Didnt keep up with them, wouldnt be surprised if theyre still on some 'maintenance' crap to this very day. As tin foil and cheesy as it sounds, OP is right, they kinda just found a way to become your dealer. Why have him make the profit off your addiction when they could do it, and on the books too? Shit is a perfect dynamic. Of course they want you on it for like 6 months to a year and the laughable amount of time they have folks just draggeddd through this shit like dead horses. Why have all these junkies around not contributing to society when you can just vampire them for a year or so, and cross your fingers that they cant handle the shittier withdrawal so they come back for another 6 month round as a guaranteed return customer?
Never seen methadone not completely fuck someone in the ass, let alone help them. That, and it accounts for over a third of all opiate overdose deaths in the country and one of the most frequently found substance causing combination deaths. Shit is just a joke tbh. If you were able to quit dope through methadone, I would trust you to carry a 500 pound weight across a mile of hot coals and broken glass, cuz you are a trooper my man.
I quit heroin cold turkey but was only using it on and off like 9-10 months out of the year for like 2 years, never really fell fully into that junkie hole, so I cant really compare. Just had a really shitty week a couple times and soaked my bed sheets in sweat.
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TheFakeSunRa
Bitch Splitter



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I think the best thing they could do would be to legalize raw smokable unprocessed opium. Instead of taking pills for your fucked up back you could mix a little with your indica.
I’m not saying it’s not addictive or that it’s safe. I just think the more we fuck with mother nature the worse it gets.
-------------------- [quote]Asante said: You constantly make posts thatr fling middle school insults at people you don't like mixed in with maladjusted psychopathic comments about wanting to beat up the other poster with a crowbar. You know how shit you are, you just don't give a fuck for precisely that reason. I disendorse you.[/quote]
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Buckomcdoogle
Atypical obsessive.


Registered: 11/27/19
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Its weird to think for the majority of Americas History, you could walk into any pharmacy or drug store and buy tincture of opium.
-------------------- "Nothing is more dangerous to your creativity than comfort and familiarity" "Nihilism is the most basic truth in existence, the only consistency throughout the world, and the universe is chaos and decay" "Logic leads to nihilism"
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mndfreeze 
Shroomery Secret Service




Registered: 04/22/02
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Quote:
Near Dylan said: Just off the get-go I dont think I need to write a theorem paper to explain why swapping one rough withdrawal for another, longer withdrawal isnt really the most practical approach. Shit lasts weeks and weeks, Ive never been through it but Ive seen it first hand and it's mind blowing the length of time these people are in hell for something that was supposed to make kicking opiates easier. The 'taper' is ridiculous. Either hilariously long, or hell. Crazy how they still drag people through it.
Seems to have made it 100x harder to quit opiates and put everyone I knew who went on it in a significantly worse position than before, feeling trapped. One of them went back to dope for weeks just to kick it cold turkey after he realized it would just be easier than the methadone withdrawal, cuz he seemed to never get out of it. He was able to kick the habit after that and wouldnt shut up about how much of a scam methadone was, just the goverment finding a way to make a profit off of opiate addicts.
The other two just kept going on and off other BS maintenance programs that just dragged out their addictions longer and longer and longer and I watched them stagnate through life, too scared to go through dope withdrawal, but shit terrified to go through bupe or methadone withdrawal. Weeks turn to months, years. Didnt keep up with them, wouldnt be surprised if theyre still on some 'maintenance' crap to this very day. As tin foil and cheesy as it sounds, OP is right, they kinda just found a way to become your dealer. Why have him make the profit off your addiction when they could do it, and on the books too? Shit is a perfect dynamic. Of course they want you on it for like 6 months to a year and the laughable amount of time they have folks just draggeddd through this shit like dead horses. Why have all these junkies around not contributing to society when you can just vampire them for a year or so, and cross your fingers that they cant handle the shittier withdrawal so they come back for another 6 month round as a guaranteed return customer?
Never seen methadone not completely fuck someone in the ass, let alone help them. That, and it accounts for over a third of all opiate overdose deaths in the country and one of the most frequently found substance causing combination deaths. Shit is just a joke tbh. If you were able to quit dope through methadone, I would trust you to carry a 500 pound weight across a mile of hot coals and broken glass, cuz you are a trooper my man.
I quit heroin cold turkey but was only using it on and off like 9-10 months out of the year for like 2 years, never really fell fully into that junkie hole, so I cant really compare. Just had a really shitty week a couple times and soaked my bed sheets in sweat.
10 months isn't jack shit for using opiates. It really isn't. I "quit" oxy/morphine/hydromorphone/etc/etc/etc every few months, would get sick as hell for a few days, massive depression for another week or two and would inevitably score again NOT because of the physical withdrawal, but the long lasting, suicide inducing, mental hell that follows. I did more damage to my life when I was TRYING TO QUIT than I did when I was using, even when I switched to heroin. The physical shit is the easy part.
It took me YEARS to get addicted past just being a little sick then normal again btw, and I did a fuckload of oxy, and not even "off and on". Out of roughly 16ish years using opiates, the first few 'off and on' like you, shit didn't get really bad until much later on. Now, when you have some experience in a 10+ heavy opiate addiction, understand exactly what living hell that really entails and the massive amount of counseling/support/guidance needed (also included with your methadone clinic). Then perhaps your opinion will have a little weight, but until then you are spewing something you don't really understand and pushing people away from legitimate help when they need it is NOT what this forum is about. So basically, you have limited information as a source, no personal experience in the matter, and don't really seem to understand how addictions work for most people. No method will work for someone who DOESN'T WANT TO QUIT. It doesn't matter if its cold turkey, suboxone, methadone, ibogaine, hookers and blow, etc.
You have a lot of control over your methadone dose. Most people go to high numbers at first for multitude of reasons. I did it. I maxed out. You also can OPT to taper faster if you want too. I also did this, and guess, what, I failed at it and went right back to what the program recommended. I could have chosen to not max my dose out, start my taper earlier, get off sooner but I knew damn well that would just be a bandaid. Methadone clinics provide the opportunity for STABILITY. Getting your shit together outside of the opiates is the key to actually quitting. Once you start to get really stable, while still taking your methadone daily like a medicine and not like a 'fix' you will want to start going down, and you do it so slowly because methadone is strong and dropping too fast is definitely noticeable. You won't be full blown cold turkey sick, but you will be in a bad mood, depressed, etc if you try to drop too high of a dose too quickly, which then makes your fragile stability a risk of falling apart. Then, when you get to the very very very end, like the 5mg and under, you only go down 1mg at a time and you DEFINITELY STILL NOTICE IT. I tried to speed up my last 20mg from the recommended 3mg week to 5, and hot damn did my work suffer, my personal life suffered, my friends suffered and I contemplated more than once to highway speed into the guard rail to just end it. Went back to the slow proper method, as recommended by the doctors, No issues.
Once you fully get off, and I quit at 3mg, your body will take time to readjust to the real world. The longer you are on opiates of any kind, the longer it will be. Doesnt matter if you are a 10 year heroin addict who cold turkeys or a 10 year methadone clinic goer.
I spread my taper, by CHOICE, over about a 4 year period, 2 fuck ups that were my fault set me back quite a bit and I left the clinic methadone free almost exactly a year ago. I have pain issues and even with that I still don't crave opiates anymore. Mental state has been a sloooooooooowwwwwww recovery but it's happening. Stability and addressing the root issues for why someone is an addict is the only real solution. Anyone you know who is just playing the system is doing exactly that, and don't really want to quit. No different than how I bought a dudes month script of suboxone EVERY MONTH so he could go buy heroin and I had a fallback plan if I couldn't score when I was using. I could have (and tried) to quit with those suboxone numerous times and failed.
So please, you are welcome to an opinion on things, but do not dress them up as facts or first hand experience if you can't provide proper sources for your claims, but especially so if you haven't even walked the walk and don't fully understand the entire process.
-------------------- Nothing says love like grannies prolapsed anus! quote]Urb said: I know... Its fucked up... Ill fix it minyana..[/quote]
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mndfreeze 
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One more thing to address your 'swapping' of hard withdrawal drug for another. Have you ever been addicted to suboxone? Taken it long term? Guess what, its the same, some say even worse, than other opiates. It also is a long as fuck half life opiate like methadone and the half life is most of what makes one opiate harder on withdrawal than another.
substitution therapy is tried and true and is used all across the medical field for a huge array of medications and procedures. Methadone isn't the only drug they do this with, and addiction isn't the only disease they treat with substitution therapy.
For any current opiate users reading this thread. Seek help in a way that works for you when you are really ready to quit. Don't bandaid your shit. Don't try to rush the process. Subs can work great for some, and epic fail for others. Methadone works great for some, and fails for others. A good support network is key and addressing the real reasons you are using in the first place. Hell, you can try those overpriced detox centers where they knock you out for many thousands of dollars so you 'sleep' through most of the withdrawal, but when you wake up you might not be retching with vomit, but your mental state will absolutely be fucked and in the same state of mind you were in when you were using. Chances of relapse in these bandaid scenarios is insanely high.
When you're ready to quit, research all the methods available. DONT LIE TO YOURSELF about the reality of the situation. Build a legit, safe support network. Family, drug free friends, counselors, therapists, whatever you have available.
Ditch every single possible access point for you to score again, even if it means removing friends and social circles from your life. Real friends will understand, the rest are just garbage waiting to drag you back down the needle.
Enter your program of choice. Stick with it. Listen to your counselors. If you really want to quit, you can do it and they will help you do it safely and with the least amount of pain and suffering, both physically and mentally.
-------------------- Nothing says love like grannies prolapsed anus! quote]Urb said: I know... Its fucked up... Ill fix it minyana..[/quote]
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Near Dylan
Shitpost Artist


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Re: Methadone is EVIL [Re: mndfreeze]
#26411460 - 01/01/20 07:48 PM (4 years, 28 days ago) |
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Im not reading all that cuz from what I read it seems pretty clear you didnt read my post either lawl
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mndfreeze 
Shroomery Secret Service




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I read it. I'll tldr my response for you.
You dont have any experience with it and opinions from uneducated people are harmful to those looking for actual help. Don't be that guy.
-------------------- Nothing says love like grannies prolapsed anus! quote]Urb said: I know... Its fucked up... Ill fix it minyana..[/quote]
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JohnRainy
Stranger

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Re: Methadone is EVIL [Re: mndfreeze]
#26418508 - 01/05/20 10:26 PM (4 years, 23 days ago) |
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Ibogaine cures addiction with a single use and the addict will not even experience withdrawal symptoms.
It's the truth.
Look it up. I know it's hard to believe.
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mndfreeze 
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Re: Methadone is EVIL [Re: JohnRainy]
#26418537 - 01/05/20 10:57 PM (4 years, 23 days ago) |
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It also can be dangerous and deadly with some nasty side effects.
It's also schedule I in the US.
-------------------- Nothing says love like grannies prolapsed anus! quote]Urb said: I know... Its fucked up... Ill fix it minyana..[/quote]
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JohnRainy
Stranger

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Re: Methadone is EVIL [Re: mndfreeze]
#26419405 - 01/06/20 02:17 PM (4 years, 23 days ago) |
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Hardcore addiction is deadlier and more dangerous than ibogaine.
You have to be basically healthy to survive an ibogaine flood. It is a powerful drug alright.
Ive seen three people flood on it. 2 remained clean to this day and 1 fell back into crack/cocaine after a month of sobriety. She was in an unhealthy subculture where everyone she knows is an addict pretty much. But what was so amazing is she did not experience withdrawal. Normally, she would go into physical withdrawal after not having crack for less than a day.
They say it repairs the brain's inflamed receptors or whatever is the mechanism for physical withdrawal.
Im completely blown away by it. People need to know about this stuff. Many lives could be saved.
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