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Anonymous #26

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #24]
    #26502521 - 02/25/20 02:11 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #24 said:
Quote:

Anonymous #26 said:
Quote:

Anonymous #5 said:
Big profits are coming to an end




Ok, Stalin

Your Communism is showing





(just out of curiosity and not to do with healthcare debate here)

What do you feel about taxes in the form of dollar amount costs? Things like registration on your car for example.

You paying 120 dollars for that registration is a significantly higher percentage of your income than a billionaire. But is it not meant to be effectively a tax?





Back to the healthcare debate though. I feel like when I say I am pro-healthcare the people I am talking to immediately get the belief that I havent looked very deeply into my position. That I am a fool. Things like that. And I guess I am forced to clarify this.... even if it sounds arrogant. But then the problem is I sound arrogant for saying "I have done research. I am not a fool."

So the position you put someone in with that precursor guarantees you victory. Damned if I do damned if I dont. I'm either an idiot or a narcissist.




I simply believe that healthcare is a human right in 2020. We have the means to make people healthy when they are sick. I get that the 2020 rationale in american culture is that healthcare is something you have to work for. I reject that premise.

By the very nature of me thinking we have the means to make people healthy.... I of course also think it is affordable. I think it would also benefit society greatly in other ways outside of just keeping people healthy. You would free up lower classes to do whatever it is they want to do. More could go to school or open a business or travel the world.

And then youve got benefits for the middle class. Someone wouldnt be forced to pick shit job A over good job B because shit job A has the super deluxe healthcare plan. And then once in that position you wouldnt have to stay until medicare kicks in.




But again all of these are just caveats. The thing I believe to be true. I dont know how to say it more simply.


Just like firefighters should be free. Just like cops should be free. I believe healthcare should be free.




What you believe and what is reality are two very different things. I don't know how to say it more simply


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Anonymous #26

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #24]
    #26502524 - 02/25/20 02:21 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #24 said:
Quote:

Anonymous #26 said:
Quote:

Anonymous #5 said:
Big profits are coming to an end




Ok, Stalin

Your Communism is showing





(just out of curiosity and not to do with healthcare debate here)

What do you feel about taxes in the form of dollar amount costs? Things like registration on your car for example.

You paying 120 dollars for that registration is a significantly higher percentage of your income than a billionaire. But is it not meant to be effectively a tax?





Back to the healthcare debate though. I feel like when I say I am pro-healthcare the people I am talking to immediately get the belief that I havent looked very deeply into my position. That I am a fool. Things like that. And I guess I am forced to clarify this.... even if it sounds arrogant. But then the problem is I sound arrogant for saying "I have done research. I am not a fool."

So the position you put someone in with that precursor guarantees you victory. Damned if I do damned if I dont. I'm either an idiot or a narcissist.




I simply believe that healthcare is a human right in 2020. We have the means to make people healthy when they are sick. I get that the 2020 rationale in american culture is that healthcare is something you have to work for. I reject that premise.

By the very nature of me thinking we have the means to make people healthy.... I of course also think it is affordable. I think it would also benefit society greatly in other ways outside of just keeping people healthy. You would free up lower classes to do whatever it is they want to do. More could go to school or open a business or travel the world.

And then youve got benefits for the middle class. Someone wouldnt be forced to pick shit job A over good job B because shit job A has the super deluxe healthcare plan. And then once in that position you wouldnt have to stay until medicare kicks in.




But again all of these are just caveats. The thing I believe to be true. I dont know how to say it more simply.


Just like firefighters should be free. Just like cops should be free. I believe healthcare should be free.




I simply believe that free beer is a human right in 2020. We have the means to make beer when people are thirsty. I get that the 2020 rationale in American culture is that beer is something that I have to work for. I reject that premise.


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Anonymous #24

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #26]
    #26502545 - 02/25/20 03:00 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I bet that sounded really good in your head :wink:

You seem to be missing the crux of my rebuttal.



Cant you use this SAME line of rhetoric if Police weren't free and I was arguing to make them free?

"Wow you want police to be free? Next youll want free beer! What a dumbass! He just doesnt get it!"


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Anonymous #26

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #24]
    #26502556 - 02/25/20 03:58 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #24 said:
I bet that sounded really good in your head :wink:

You seem to be missing the crux of my rebuttal.



Cant you use this SAME line of rhetoric if Police weren't free and I was arguing to make them free?

"Wow you want police to be free? Next youll want free beer! What a dumbass! He just doesnt get it!"




Poor kid, you live in a fantasy world inside your head, completely separate from reality


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Anonymous #24

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #26]
    #26502557 - 02/25/20 04:00 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Okay? And how would we scientifically prove which of us is living in this fantasy world? Is it possible you are the one living in the fantasy world? Or is it just me that could possibly be in it?


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Anonymous #29

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #21]
    #26502749 - 02/25/20 08:22 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #21 said:
hunt or starve, survive or don't. learn a skill get a good job and pay for your own healthcare or die in a fucking ditch. it's survival of the fittest and if you can't make the cut then another man will wear your boots and fuck your wife.




Let’s see...
Highest min wage in the country is in NYC($15).
A shitty apartment will run you $1500.
Add phone, internet, electric, gas - that makes it $2,000.
$15x40h=600/week. Let’s say you’d pay only 15% in taxes (though reality is more like 20-30%) - you end up with $510/week or 2040 a month.

How much food, clothing, healthcare, etc. do you think $10/month buys?
How many in-demand skills can you learn for free?

———

Lowest minimum wage is in Louisiana ($7.25).
A shitty apartment will run you $700.
Add phone, internet, blah blah - that makes $1200.
$7.25x40h=$290/week. After 15% tax, that’s $1,116.50 a month

How much healthcare can you buy for -$83.50?


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Anonymous #18

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #29]
    #26503103 - 02/25/20 12:36 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

The USA is the RICHEST country on this planet. No country on this earth has more money than the USA. Don’t tell me we can’t afford health care for all. How many billions and trillions of dollars have we WASTED on multiple pointless wars on the Middle East. You are a liar if you say the USA can’t afford health care for all. Don’t you fucking DARE tell me the USA can’t afford health care for all.


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Anonymous #31

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #18]
    #26503134 - 02/25/20 12:54 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #18 said:
The USA is the RICHEST country on this planet. No country on this earth has more money than the USA. Don’t tell me we can’t afford health care for all. How many billions and trillions of dollars have we WASTED on multiple pointless wars on the Middle East. You are a liar if you say the USA can’t afford health care for all. Don’t you fucking DARE tell me the USA can’t afford health care for all.




The problem is that Bernie wants free everything and he believes fast food worker's deserve 15$ a hour. Those job's are for uneducated young people. As soon as you raise min wages up like that the prices on everything goes up! He also rants about assault weapons and how he's going to ban them. He rants about how we have military weapons but in reality fully automatic weapons aren't available to the public. He also rants about how we need background checks when we've ALWAYS had strict background checks! He claims he's going to give us free college and that he's some how going to tax wallstreet. You watch we'll be the ones paying for it! If we do end up paying for it we'll be throwing money down the drain because college has a 30% success rate. He just seems to talk out of his ass. He knows he's full of shit when it comes to guns and he knows he's full of shit when it comes to the 15$ a hour bullshit. He's just telling young people what they want to hear to get votes!


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Anonymous #31

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #31]
    #26503140 - 02/25/20 12:58 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I actually think universal healthcare is a good idea but some of his other ideas are absolutely horrible. He's not going to beat trump so it really doesn't matter..


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Anonymous #29

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #31]
    #26503157 - 02/25/20 01:02 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Haha that’s such a stupid argument against min wage...”min wage jobs are for uneducated young people. If we raise it, ALL prices will skyrocket.”...then why would prices rise so much lol?

Think about it. If minimum wage only applies to high school students and entry-level people, why would raising it cause such massive price changes?

Either a lot of people are working at minimum wage, or raising it won’t effect prices by much. You can’t have it both ways...if you use logic, that is


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Anonymous #31

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #29]
    #26503181 - 02/25/20 01:15 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #29 said:
Haha that’s such a stupid argument against min wage...”min wage jobs are for uneducated young people. If we raise it, ALL prices will skyrocket.”...then why would prices rise so much lol?

Think about it. If minimum wage only applies to high school students and entry-level people, why would raising it cause such massive price changes?

Either a lot of people are working at minimum wage, or raising it won’t effect prices by much. You can’t have it both ways...if you use logic, that is




Yes prices will go up! 15$ won't actually be 15$ anymore! It's common sense. What I should have said is that those jobs should be for young people! If you're over 25 and making min wage then it's time to stop being lazy and go get a skill! You're not supposed to raise a family working at McDonald's :lol:.. EMT'S, some cops, factory workers and many other important job's don't even make 15$ a hour! Do you really think a McDonald's worker deserves more than a EMT!? It's fucking ridiculous lol.


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Anonymous #29

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #31]
    #26503193 - 02/25/20 01:21 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

I think they both deserve a raise. It’s impossible to survive on the current min wage, as I showed in this thread. It’s impossible whether you live in NYC where McDonald’s workers already get $15/h, or in the lowers min-wage state, where they make $7.25.

Btw, I’m in Brooklyn and prices didn’t spike much after NYC raised the min wage from $8 to $15.


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Anonymous #31

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #29]
    #26503223 - 02/25/20 01:41 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #29 said:
I think they both deserve a raise. It’s impossible to survive on the current min wage, as I showed in this thread. It’s impossible whether you live in NYC where McDonald’s workers already get $15/h, or in the lowers min-wage state, where they make $7.25.

Btw, I’m in Brooklyn and prices didn’t spike much after NYC raised the min wage from $8 to $15.




Price's will go up if the whole country raises it! I'm not just saying that to be difficult, it's the truth! 15$ a hour isn't the same in Brooklyn as it is in Ohio. Min wage should be decided by the state not the federal government because the value of the dollar is different depending on where you live. You're not supposed to live off of min wage jobs! Min wage jobs are for people getting started without a skill! It will also harm a lot of small businesses.


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Anonymous #29

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #31]
    #26503252 - 02/25/20 01:58 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Ok, so imagine you’re poor. I know it’s impossible, but just try.

You graduated HS, and went to work. You start at min wage. Please outline how a McDonalds worker can gain in-demand skills in this situation.
Remember, you’re poor. You can’t go to college, you have no spare time except the weekend, and your current job doesn’t allow you to save any (as I already showed).

Go


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Anonymous #31

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #29]
    #26503283 - 02/25/20 02:20 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #29 said:
Ok, so imagine you’re poor. I know it’s impossible, but just try.

You graduated HS, and went to work. You start at min wage. Please outline how a McDonalds worker can gain in-demand skills in this situation.
Remember, you’re poor. You can’t go to college, you have no spare time except the weekend, and your current job doesn’t allow you to save any (as I already showed).

Go




Take out 35k of student loans and go through the 9 month Hobart welding school. 25k for school and 10k to pay for rent and food. Get a part time job to help pay for extra shit. Learn how to pass x-ray welding tests. This should help you get into the 5 year pipefitters union apprenticeship. They pay for all your education and pay you good money. You finish the program and make more money than people with master degrees. I also know people that joined other trades that are making killer money. It just takes hard work and sacrifice! Most people are poor because they're lazy. You're supposed to apply for better jobs if you're working for min wage. There's a million different ways you can better yourself.


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Anonymous #29

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #31]
    #26503303 - 02/25/20 02:29 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Hahaha loans?
Cmon, at least try.

You’re poor, man. Ain’t no one giving you a 50k loan. Your credit is in the shitter and your income is minimum wage.

Million different ways to better yourself if you’re not at rock bottom...


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Anonymous #31

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #29]
    #26503314 - 02/25/20 02:33 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #29 said:
Hahaha loans?
Cmon, at least try.

You’re poor, man. Ain’t no one giving you a 50k loan. Your credit is in the shitter and your income is minimum wage.

Million different ways to better yourself if you’re not at rock bottom...




Are you high out of your mind? Do you realise how easy it is to get student loans! If what your saying is true then how did me and all of my friends get student loans right after high school? You're seriously just talking out of your ass.


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Anonymous #24

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #29]
    #26503321 - 02/25/20 02:42 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #29 said:
Hahaha loans?
Cmon, at least try.

You’re poor, man. Ain’t no one giving you a 50k loan. Your credit is in the shitter and your income is minimum wage.

Million different ways to better yourself if you’re not at rock bottom...




Liberal here. Not a republican and I'm very pro bernie. But I will say this point youre making isnt accurate on some levels.

A poor person can get the pellgrant for 2 years and go to a community college for free. If they are poor enough they can even get some extra money on top (not much). Plus they give student loans out to anyone with a heart beat. Its a HUGE scam. Even filing bankruptcy you cant get out of student loans. My mom left the country 15 years ago and is still paying her student loans. Literally from another country. Forcibly. Lol.

After that though if they follow everyone else and get a business admin degree they wont get anywhere. If they get a proper trade they can escape poverty. Most americans dont know though that they should get a trade. So we definitely need better direction and education. Really though this kind of a thing only comes from lineage so if your parents are shit and your families shit then youre gonna be shit too 90 percent of the time.


But this doesnt mean we shouldnt have healthcare for all. We still should. And higher education of all kinds should have some sort of public option available. Maybe a subpar option but atleast an option.


Public education is the craziest part for me when it comes to republicans. How can they defend Highschool and below but tell you youre a commy bastard for suggesting college lol?


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Anonymous #29

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #31]
    #26503330 - 02/25/20 02:46 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #31 said:
Quote:

Anonymous #29 said:
Hahaha loans?
Cmon, at least try.

You’re poor, man. Ain’t no one giving you a 50k loan. Your credit is in the shitter and your income is minimum wage.

Million different ways to better yourself if you’re not at rock bottom...




Are you high out of your mind? Do you realise how easy it is to get student loans! If what your saying is true then how did me and all of my friends get student loans right after high school? You're seriously just talking out of your ass.




You still had credit when you graduated HS? That just means you weren’t poor. I’m asking you to pretend.

I tried getting a student loan at 24 and was denied🤷🏻‍♂️ Too much credit card debt.

Whatever happened to “a million ways” to get out from rock bottom? Are they all different grants and loans? Cause that’s still just 1 way.


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Anonymous #24

Re: I hate liberals [Re: Anonymous #29]
    #26503337 - 02/25/20 02:49 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #29 said:
Quote:

Anonymous #31 said:
Quote:

Anonymous #29 said:
Hahaha loans?
Cmon, at least try.

You’re poor, man. Ain’t no one giving you a 50k loan. Your credit is in the shitter and your income is minimum wage.

Million different ways to better yourself if you’re not at rock bottom...




Are you high out of your mind? Do you realise how easy it is to get student loans! If what your saying is true then how did me and all of my friends get student loans right after high school? You're seriously just talking out of your ass.




You still had credit when you graduated HS? That just means you weren’t poor. I’m asking you to pretend.

I tried getting a student loan at 24 and was denied🤷🏻‍♂️ Too much credit card debt.

Whatever happened to “a million ways” to get out from rock bottom? Are they all different grants and loans? Cause that’s still just 1 way.





Pellgrant. It completely pays for 2 years of community college including some extra spending money. If youre really poor the spending money is as much as $1000 for each of the two years.

But this doesnt make you wrong about healthcare. Just about the college thing.


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