Home | Community | Message Board

Sporeworks
This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder

Jump to first unread post Pages: < Back | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | Next >  [ show all ]
Offlinekoods
Ribbit
Male User Gallery


Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 106,049
Loc: Maryland/DC Burbs
Last seen: 4 hours, 59 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #26423781 - 01/08/20 11:40 PM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Dude come on. Hillary Clinton is one of the most investigated people on earth. There has been no reluctance to investigate her. Manufacturing Clinton investigations was an electoral strategy pursued by the GOP Congress for a half decade before the 2016 election .


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
Stranger
Male User Gallery

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 32,557
Loc: California, US Flag
Last seen: 4 months, 21 days
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: JohnRainy]
    #26423783 - 01/08/20 11:41 PM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Agreed.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMetoo
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/13/18
Posts: 1,524
Last seen: 3 hours, 35 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: JohnRainy] * 1
    #26423800 - 01/09/20 12:07 AM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

JohnRainy said:
Why do you never address the facts of the case but always just say what republicans say, that it's only because the dems are out to get him?



This thread is focused on the constitutionality of the Dems effort to impeach Trump through a partisan motion (I should know - I have started it). From this angle the strength of evidence against him is irrelevant beyond a trivial observation it was not sufficient to convince a single Republican to support the impeachment push.

On the Trump 2020 thread which focuses on the next election I extensively discussed the merits of the abuse of power allegations against Trump. On 27/12 I even asked you, JohnRainy, some direct questions about the role of Bidens in the whole saga but, unless I missed your answers, you have ignored me


Edited by Metoo (01/09/20 12:19 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinekoods
Ribbit
Male User Gallery


Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 106,049
Loc: Maryland/DC Burbs
Last seen: 4 hours, 59 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Metoo]
    #26423804 - 01/09/20 12:30 AM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Except there is no requirement that impeachment be bipartisan. The entire question if an impeachment is unconstitutional is meaningless anyways since impeachment is not subject to judicial review.


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMetoo
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/13/18
Posts: 1,524
Last seen: 3 hours, 35 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: koods]
    #26423806 - 01/09/20 12:34 AM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Except there is no requirement that impeachment be bipartisan. The entire question if an impeachment is unconstitutional is meaningless anyways since impeachment is not subject to judicial review.



If you are considering the topic of this thread meaningless feel free to move on


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinekoods
Ribbit
Male User Gallery


Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 106,049
Loc: Maryland/DC Burbs
Last seen: 4 hours, 59 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Metoo]
    #26423814 - 01/09/20 12:47 AM (4 years, 20 days ago)

What I’m saying is, in practice, there is no such thing as an unconstitutional impeachment. Impeachment powers are completely reserved for the house and senate.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixon_v._United_States

Quote:

The court's decision was unanimous, but four separate opinions were published. The majority opinion, by Chief Justice William Rehnquist, held that the courts may not review the impeachment and trial of a federal officer because the Constitution reserves that function to a coordinate political branch. Article I, Section 3 of the Constitution gives the Senate the "sole power to try all impeachments." Because of the word sole it is clear that the judicial branch was not to be included. Furthermore, because the word try was originally understood to include factfinding committees, there was a textually demonstrable commitment to give broad discretion to the Senate in impeachments.

Furthermore the Framers believed that representatives of the people should try impeachments, and the Court was too small to justly try impeachments. Also, the judicial branch is "checked" by impeachments, so judicial involvement in impeachments might violate the doctrine of the separation of powers.

The Court further ruled that involving the judiciary would prevent finality without clear remedy and bias post-impeachment criminal or civil prosecutions, which the Constitution explicitly allows.




Edited by koods (01/09/20 12:52 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleTantrika
Miss Ann Thrope
Female


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/26/12
Posts: 17,138
Loc: Lashed to the pyre
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #26424004 - 01/09/20 06:08 AM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

JohnRainy said:
The ambassador testified that Trump tied a White House visit to the infamous investigation he was inappropriately trying to trigger...



I'm not saying the investigation wasn't political, but Biden certainly appears corrupt.  Is a president not allowed to go after corruption?  I don't know.




Do not doubt that Biden is corrupt and/or was corrupt in the Obama administration
but does he actually hold any sort of political office anymore, or has this been pursuit of a US citizen for corruption?

Do not expect him to get elected, so what is it that he is corrupting at this point?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
OTD God-King
 User Gallery


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,498
Loc: Uncanny Valley
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Metoo] * 3
    #26424071 - 01/09/20 07:27 AM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Metoo said:
Quote:

koods said:
Except there is no requirement that impeachment be bipartisan. The entire question if an impeachment is unconstitutional is meaningless anyways since impeachment is not subject to judicial review.



If you are considering the topic of this thread meaningless feel free to move on



He's not saying it's meaningless.  He's challenging the validity of your argument by attacking the premise.  Your premise is incorrect.

Assuming it was 100% partisan, that would not make it unconstitutional in any way.  You've yet to provide any authority whatsoever for the notion that the constitution requires bipartisanship for any purpose whatsoever.


--------------------
Censoring opposing views since 2014.

Ask an Attorney

Fuck the Amish


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
Stranger
Male User Gallery

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 32,557
Loc: California, US Flag
Last seen: 4 months, 21 days
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Tantrika] * 1
    #26424388 - 01/09/20 10:58 AM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Tantrika said:
Do not doubt that Biden is corrupt and/or was corrupt in the Obama administration
but does he actually hold any sort of political office anymore, or has this been pursuit of a US citizen for corruption?

Do not expect him to get elected, so what is it that he is corrupting at this point?



His corruption was using his office for personal gain.

People should know about that if he's running for President, and he's currently the leading Demcratic candidate.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMetoo
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/13/18
Posts: 1,524
Last seen: 3 hours, 35 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Enlil]
    #26424517 - 01/09/20 12:03 PM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

Metoo said:
Quote:

koods said:
Except there is no requirement that impeachment be bipartisan. The entire question if an impeachment is unconstitutional is meaningless anyways since impeachment is not subject to judicial review.



If you are considering the topic of this thread meaningless feel free to move on



He's not saying it's meaningless.  He's challenging the validity of your argument by attacking the premise. 




No. He said: "The entire question if an impeachment is unconstitutional is meaningless..." which challenges the relevance of the thread dedicated to assessing whether the Dems have abused their power by pursuing bipartisan impeachment.





Quote:

Enlil said:
Your premise is incorrect.

Assuming it was 100% partisan, that would not make it unconstitutional in any way.  You've yet to provide any authority whatsoever for the notion that the constitution requires bipartisanship for any purpose whatsoever.



The thread contributors have expressed a range of opinions on this and you are entitled to yours


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePsilynut2
Stranger

Registered: 04/28/17
Posts: 5,120
Last seen: 10 hours, 5 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Metoo] * 3
    #26424582 - 01/09/20 12:33 PM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Can you you quote the part of the constitution that requires the impeachment process to be a partisan  process  ? If not what he said isn’t an opinion , it’s a just fact you can’t dispute, and that makes this thread 10 pages of irrelevant bullshit .


--------------------


Edited by Psilynut2 (01/09/20 12:40 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMetoo
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/13/18
Posts: 1,524
Last seen: 3 hours, 35 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Psilynut2]
    #26424596 - 01/09/20 12:41 PM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Psilynut2 said:
Can you you quote the part of the constitution that requires the impeachment process to be a partisan  process  ? If not what he said isn’t an opinion , it’s a just fact you can’t dispute.



Please follow the discussion on the first few pages of this thread - you will find both personal opinions and links to articles written by lawyers, invoking the Federalist Papers as well as direct quotes from Alexander Hamilton.

No problem, pleased to be able to help :-).


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePsilynut2
Stranger

Registered: 04/28/17
Posts: 5,120
Last seen: 10 hours, 5 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Metoo]
    #26424604 - 01/09/20 12:44 PM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Are you going to quote the part of the constitution or not ?  Should be easy .


--------------------


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMetoo
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/13/18
Posts: 1,524
Last seen: 3 hours, 35 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Psilynut2] * 1
    #26424653 - 01/09/20 01:08 PM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Psilynut2 said:
Are you going to quote the part of the constitution or not ?  Should be easy .



Please put some effort into reviewing what has already been posted on this thread. It should sharpen your critical thinking so you are able to ask some more nuanced questions and not just one-liners.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePsilynut2
Stranger

Registered: 04/28/17
Posts: 5,120
Last seen: 10 hours, 5 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Metoo]
    #26424665 - 01/09/20 01:13 PM (4 years, 20 days ago)

I have , did someone else quote that part of the constitution ? Did I miss it ?  It’s really the only relevant question here .
It either says it or it doesn’t . Some guy saying I think it should be this way is meaningless .
  When someone gives you their opinion about the 2nd do you just agree or do you say where  in the hell does it say that whats so hard to understand about shall not be infringed ?


--------------------


Edited by Psilynut2 (01/09/20 01:18 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMetoo
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/13/18
Posts: 1,524
Last seen: 3 hours, 35 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Psilynut2]
    #26424688 - 01/09/20 01:23 PM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Psilynut2 said:
I have , did someone else quote that part of the constitution ? Did I miss it ?  It’s really the only relevant question here .
It either says it or it doesn’t . Some guy saying I think it should be this way is meaningless .
  When someone gives you their opinion about the 2nd do you just agree or do you say we’re in the hell does it say that what so hard to understand about shall not be infringed ?




Various contributors quoted from the Federalist Papers and directly Alexander Hamilton. Two of the linked articles written by lawyers claimed that, in the dynamic balance of power between the branches, the Fathers specifically did not allow for Presidents to be removed through an impeachment motion orchestrated by the opposition party contemporaneously holding numeric advantage in the House.

I do not understand the last sentence in your post above - please re-phrase.


Edited by Metoo (01/09/20 01:39 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePsilynut2
Stranger

Registered: 04/28/17
Posts: 5,120
Last seen: 10 hours, 5 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Metoo]
    #26424726 - 01/09/20 01:47 PM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Does the exact wording of the second amendment matter to you?


--------------------


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMetoo
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/13/18
Posts: 1,524
Last seen: 3 hours, 35 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Psilynut2]
    #26424744 - 01/09/20 01:54 PM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Psilynut2 said:
Does the exact wording of the second amendment matter to you?



Yes


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePsilynut2
Stranger

Registered: 04/28/17
Posts: 5,120
Last seen: 10 hours, 5 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Metoo]
    #26424815 - 01/09/20 02:19 PM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Then why don’t you care about the exact words relating to impeachment . There nothing that says the opposing party has to like it .


--------------------


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMetoo
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/13/18
Posts: 1,524
Last seen: 3 hours, 35 minutes
Re: The abuse of power which led to impeachment [Re: Psilynut2]
    #26424848 - 01/09/20 02:39 PM (4 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Psilynut2 said:
Then why don’t you care about the exact words relating to impeachment . There nothing that says the opposing party has to like it .



I do - along with the historical context like other writings of the Fathers etc. This is what helps establish the intent of any document.

I have answered a few of your questions so here is one for you. Where is the Constitution does it say that "abuse of power" or "obstruction of congress" are impeachable offenses? Please provide direct quotes featuring these exact terms in your response.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: < Back | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | Next >  [ show all ]

Shop: Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* An interview with Noam Chomsky
( 1 2 3 all )
Phred 3,957 46 09/16/04 10:25 AM
by Xlea321
* Noam Chomsky on the Drug War
( 1 2 all )
xnevermore 4,994 32 10/09/02 02:01 PM
by EchoVortex
* Is lying about the reason for a war an impeachable offense?
( 1 2 all )
LearyfanS 3,460 38 06/20/03 05:08 PM
by Anonymous
* Impeach Blair Xlea321 1,212 13 08/28/04 07:52 AM
by Xlea321
* Chomsky on the Drug War delian 1,995 10 08/25/01 07:56 PM
by headphone
* Noam Chomsky
( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 all )
spud 6,325 120 07/23/05 02:24 PM
by Phred
* Troops accused of prisoner abuse (warning: images within)
( 1 2 all )
Edame 3,420 39 05/04/04 12:06 PM
by Baby_Hitler
* Chomsky on how to get out
( 1 2 all )
Xlea321 2,037 32 05/14/04 08:15 PM
by luvdemshrooms

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Enlil, ballsalsa
3,428 topic views. 3 members, 1 guests and 4 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.028 seconds spending 0.008 seconds on 15 queries.