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YogiBear



Registered: 08/24/19
Posts: 845
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: footpath]
#26374824 - 12/11/19 11:00 AM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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meaculpaUIO


Registered: 08/26/19
Posts: 956
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: YogiBear]
#26375094 - 12/11/19 01:35 PM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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So they do come in uniform, mostly the same size and speed. Probably exceptions to this, but this makes me state that if you aint seeing 50 pins in day 1, you aint gonna get 50 pins in flus 1?
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
Loc: Van Isle
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: meaculpaUIO]
#26375109 - 12/11/19 01:43 PM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
meaculpaUIO said: So they do come in uniform, mostly the same size and speed. Probably exceptions to this, but this makes me state that if you aint seeing 50 pins in day 1, you aint gonna get 50 pins in flus 1?
Not always some times your first pinset will be your first couple flushes, some might sit dormant while your first flush grows or so.etimes they fill in




--------------------
  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
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iEnter
Stranger


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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: vertygo]
#26375495 - 12/11/19 04:33 PM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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From what I hear coir is more contam resistant as well. I'm looking forward to seeing where this goes
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WeKnow
Myconaut



Registered: 11/20/18
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Loc: Florida
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: iEnter]
#26376189 - 12/11/19 10:38 PM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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Using liquid culture, what is the inoculation tek? Same as spawn to coir substrate? As in inject the pasteurized coir in a jar or bag and seal? Iâm literally going to start experimenting with this tek this week. Got my curiosity piqued.
-------------------- Enjoy being alive, for you're a long time dead. --Scottish proverb
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shroomflow


Registered: 09/03/17
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Loc: PNW
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: meaculpaUIO]
#26376224 - 12/11/19 11:00 PM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
meaculpaUIO said: My coir shoebox/tub/whatever is pinning today, but the pinset doesn't look too promising.
I've been wondering, how do the canopy pinsets "come in" ?
Do they all show up neat and orderly in one go, or they progressively show up in a short amount of time
Superflushers; you know this
Ideal surface conditions, good genetics, and cloning. However, it is possible with MS as well; just more of a dice roll.
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SpunkyMonkey88
Stranger



Registered: 10/08/19
Posts: 1,331
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: Shroomerd00d]
#26376525 - 12/12/19 05:02 AM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Shroomerd00d said: The coir shouldn't be 'wet', field capacity is where you take a fistful, squeeze the fuck out of it until maybe a dribble or so comes out.
I thought once you squeeze as hard as possible a stream should come out for a very little bit...dribble for a little bit then when u squeeze harder a short spurt of a stream..
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SpunkyMonkey88
Stranger



Registered: 10/08/19
Posts: 1,331
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If you're using unsterilized coir why would you bother using a SAB?
Wouldn't the dirty coir transfer contams to the underside of the agar wedge?
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A.k.a
Stranger



Registered: 10/27/19
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Quote:
SpunkyMonkey88 said:
Quote:
Shroomerd00d said: The coir shouldn't be 'wet', field capacity is where you take a fistful, squeeze the fuck out of it until maybe a dribble or so comes out.
I thought once you squeeze as hard as possible a stream should come out for a very little bit...dribble for a little bit then when u squeeze harder a short spurt of a stream..
I think its anywhere between the two. When I started I squeezed it til only a drop or two came out, which was almost as hard as I could squeeze it, and it was way way too dry. Really itâs all about learning your grow space I think cuz I def get better results making it wetter than recommended but I have super low rh.
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LAGM2020     
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Nichrome
I'm a torso!



Registered: 12/17/18
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: A.k.a] 1
#26376820 - 12/12/19 09:15 AM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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Coir is mostly cellulose. Cellulose, a polysaccharide, is a food for fungi. It's been done before successfully but better results come from the same organisms grown on grain and spawned to coir or any other cellulose rich moist fluffy stuff.
Good job thinking outside the box.
-------------------- âBetter to be deprived of food for three days, than tea for one.â
Freedom is not the right to do as you please, but the liberty to do as you should. ~Emerson
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meaculpaUIO


Registered: 08/26/19
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: Nichrome]
#26377126 - 12/12/19 12:31 PM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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I just realized Ive been seeing his flushes from the best angle the all time, the flush is not like I first thought Hoping someone will do a canopy on coir to show that it will be done
Who will be the first
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meaculpaUIO


Registered: 08/26/19
Posts: 956
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: Nichrome]
#26377133 - 12/12/19 12:36 PM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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Very different myc behaviour on these two coir tubs fo sho:
(Unmodified, flipped lid recently, before that, closed)

(fruiting conditions from the start, filtered holes)
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feldman114
Stragler


Registered: 09/06/19
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: meaculpaUIO]
#26377135 - 12/12/19 12:39 PM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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Iâd like to see this done with some gravel mixed into the coir. Someone said something about grain helping, not just as a mute source, but also as solids that help anchor fruit. I think this makes sense and is rather easy to test.
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blackout


Registered: 07/16/00
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: cronicr]
#26377599 - 12/12/19 04:04 PM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
cronicr said: Pure coir fruits pretty poorly and in comparison is fucking expensive.
Quote:
cronicr said: So go right ahead and skip grain lol. Use the more expensive shit for less product.
This would not matter at all to many people -as you said "Depends on your goals ...if you want some mushrooms check it out.". A guy I know found it hilarious when I told him of people dismissing the "uncle bens" grows as people said it was so expensive compared to doing grains yourself. I did a single pouch of rice grow which cost 59cent (euros) and got 204.6g in the first flush. When shrooms were legal where I am that would have been just over 10 boxes, at âŦ15-20 each, when my "20g fresh box" costs pittance, many would not care if they could grow that for 1/10th the price. It would be like buying a bottle of vodka for âŦ20 and finding out you could make it for 6cent, or for 0.6cent with some more effort.
There is good reason my supermarket has a huge array of rice pouches, people are more than willing to pay for convenience, esp. if they are just cooking/growing for themselves and maybe a few friends. Of course if you are a supplier or restaurant you would consider cost, but I see restaurants buying in ready cut fresh french fries which cannot be cheap.
This is a post I made 4 years back
Quote:
blackout said:
Filtering LC to concentrate the myc and use to hydrate & grow unsterilized coir & BRF
Proposed idea is to make a large LC, like maybe even 25L in a homebrew fermentation or mashing bucket. These are readily available and can come with internal elements and holes in the lid which filters can be attached to. Most of my LCs are only boiled and do not contaminate.
Workman recommended just 0.1-0.5% sugars in LC. I find this works well. I would start my LC in a small jar, confirm it is clean and then add this to the 25L LC, sort of like a starter culture in brewing beer. 25L would need just 25-125g sugar to be 0.1-0.5%.
This weak sugar solution means there would be little residual sugar left over so not as susceptible to contams. But it could also be diluted further. Myc will naturally settle to the bottom of the fermenter, the top layer could be siphoned off and diluted with fresh water to the brim. This could be let settle again and be repeated, so now you have very little sugar left, it is more like a solution made from GLC or a LI depending on what terms you use. You could of course start with a higher sugar amount and do this dilution too.
Now get some dry coir and hydrate it. The coir can act as a filter for the LC. Pack the coir into a funnel, like a large soda bottle with the base cut off and pour the LC through it. Pretty clear water should run out with the myc being trapped in the coir. Now mix this sodden myc laiden coir into more dry coir and add water until at field capacity )or a little more). Now add some BRF and mix well. I would make fresh BRF from easy cook brown rice which has already had some heat treatment. The idea is there is so much myc that it would colonise fast not giving contams a chance to get a foothold. People see rapid colonization with regular LC but by concentrating it a lot it could be even faster and more contam resistant.
There may be other ways to filter it, like in muslin, or weed bubble bags or muslin bags. It could have the excess moisture squeezed out.
-I have not done any of this yet and would start with small scale first to see if it works at all, and figure out correct ratios. I have added dry BRF to feild capacity coir and added another 100ml/100g water per 100g BRF and microwaved it and it came out quite dry as the BRF absorbs the moisture, some say rice should be 180g water to 100g rice. If left uncooked I would expect it to soak up less though, so maybe get the coir to the right level and add 100ml water for each 100g BRF. If too prone to contams the coir and/or BRF may need further heat treatment but still may work with concentrated myc.
I never considered using coir on its own, as I was always led to believe grains were essential, all of RR's novelty bible grows etc had grains.
I did make a half assed attempt of that funneling method and it did not grow, I did not test the LC and am not sure if it was contaminated, the LC was also an experiment itself using peroxide so it might have been weakened.
The weak LC and dilution should get over the problem of the exposed agar wedges being prone to contams mentioned in this thread. If diluted repeatedly and decanted you could possibly even add a measured amount directly to dry untreated coir and just let it hydrate and grow. Coir could be prepared with a calculated amount of water to be below field capacity and then heat treated, and then the weak/clear/dilute LC could be added to that, in such a way that no straining is needed as you work out how much is needed.
More recently I did try mixing some mini PF cakes with a lot of coir, the idea was to colonise it similar to above but not to mix in anything until it was colonised, and then to mix in a pouch of sterile rice rather than untreated BRF, I did this but the PF cakes had not colonised the coir well and I am pretty sure it is fucked now.
Some years ago I tried mixing a chopped up fresh shroom and mixing it with coir and it did not work. I tried this again after reading this thread and it looks like it is starting to grow. I used a much smaller amount of coir to give it a better chance. I am not planning on adding rice to this one. If the coir grew out on its own I would be happy enough with that. I don't need much at all, and have been focusing on creating a foolproof method, which is not necessarily cheap. The chopped mushroom gets rid of the risk of exposed agar.
I would still go on to see how the added rice would turn out though.
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
Loc: Van Isle
Last seen: 2 years, 8 days
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: blackout]
#26377640 - 12/12/19 04:28 PM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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I know it wouldn't matter to some that's why I said go for it
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  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
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Solipsis
mĖļaĖļdĖļ disappointed scientist



Registered: 12/28/09
Posts: 3,398
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: cronicr]
#26377666 - 12/12/19 04:48 PM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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lol this is dumb either way..
if you go over the nutritional profiles this is just a stunt. idc if you get something out of it or get a chunk of agar to extend itself. Sorry, some experiments are simply tests and not based on any sort of solid hypothesis.
Explain to me what sort of macro nutrient would ever be worthwhile to a cube and you get my attention. (then lets put it aside the yield)
But i mean yeah if you wanna see if you can get something out (and also account for the agar or anything you happen to provide extra to deplete), sure its fun to explore the boundaries.
I explore(d) paper pellets which are cellulose and actually something cubes can break down but coir is a lot of lignin and *some* cellulose and micronutrients. It has its place but not as a substitute for coir either which I guess is meant to be something rather inert (although it slightly fails at that which is ok).
For me the lesson was to learn was what paper pellets are useful for and what they are not useful or a substitute for per se. Coir is hardly even worth the consideration i bet but if you do consider it, do it in the same way and understand it for what it is.
Besides, calling Discord bad / a lost cause is like calling the internet bad - don't generalize so much, there are many many different corners of a very wide spreaded thing. If you manage to access shitty servers that's on you. There is good and bad shit and the shroomery is not an exception. The "shroomery server" though is surely not meant to be representative of shroomery, you hope. Cause yeah thats a cesspool. Don't write off the whole platform because of that horrible xenophobe server plz.
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Nichrome
I'm a torso!



Registered: 12/17/18
Posts: 6,486
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: cronicr]
#26377756 - 12/12/19 05:58 PM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
cronicr said: I'll try find pics from our runs last year we did 3 types of manure and coir and tried straw but it contaminated.
Do you have a link to this thread? Or could you give me the nutshell breakdown in a private message or something?
-------------------- âBetter to be deprived of food for three days, than tea for one.â
Freedom is not the right to do as you please, but the liberty to do as you should. ~Emerson
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meaculpaUIO


Registered: 08/26/19
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: Nichrome]
#26380728 - 12/14/19 06:48 AM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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anyone else having some active coir colonizing or fruiting now?
What ratio of malt or brf should one add to coir? 10-20%?

why the big dingus so yellow
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: meaculpaUIO]
#26380820 - 12/14/19 07:43 AM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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Because of sad conditions
Same reason the mushrooms are so scarce too
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meaculpaUIO


Registered: 08/26/19
Posts: 956
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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Re: Coco Coir ONLY, start to finish [Re: bodhisatta]
#26380876 - 12/14/19 08:23 AM (4 years, 1 month ago) |
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okay, nice to know - ive been away two days so no misting for them
the only choice I know can do different, is mist more
I live 300 meter above sea level, indoor climate is pretty dry
Edited by meaculpaUIO (12/14/19 08:34 AM)
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