|
shorn253
Stranger
Registered: 04/24/18
Posts: 34
Last seen: 2 years, 6 months
|
Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs
#26346698 - 11/26/19 12:48 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
I've regularly been getting around one pound dry per 64 qt monotub, however the price of horticultural gypsum is rather steep. If I could pull similar weight and potency without using gypsum, I would prefer this. I've heard it's pretty important for calcium, sulfur and ph buffering and have heard claims that it increases yields by over twenty percent. My results have been great but i have yet to try a tub without gypsum and am hoping someone can chime in about how necessary it is.
|
feldman114
Stragler


Registered: 09/06/19
Posts: 3,365
Loc: Bravos
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: shorn253]
#26346710 - 11/26/19 12:54 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Who says gypsum increases yield by 20%? Seems like a pretty wild claim...
I do straight coir, get about 30-35g dry per quart of spawn. How much spawn do you use per tub? How much coir/gypsum? How thick is your sub?
An lb dry from one tub sounds crey. Awesome job.
|
mycopiss
Stranger
Registered: 06/01/19
Posts: 352
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: feldman114]
#26346720 - 11/26/19 01:00 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
1 lb per tub? are you using Agar? this is a total of how many flushes?
I dont think the gypsum matters much, take Bods teks for example, all he uses is 100% coir and gets full canopies.
|
cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
Loc: Van Isle
Last seen: 2 years, 8 days
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: feldman114]
#26346806 - 11/26/19 01:39 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
feldman114 said: Who says gypsum increases yield by 20%? Seems like a pretty wild claim...
I do straight coir, get about 30-35g dry per quart of spawn. How much spawn do you use per tub? How much coir/gypsum? How thick is your sub?
An lb dry from one tub sounds crey. Awesome job.
Been an industry standard number for gourmets for years
--------------------
  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
|
SpunkyMonkey88
Stranger



Registered: 10/08/19
Posts: 1,331
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: mycopiss]
#26346820 - 11/26/19 01:42 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
mycopiss said: 1 lb per tub? are you using Agar? this is a total of how many flushes?
I dont think the gypsum matters much, take Bods teks for example, all he uses is 100% coir and gets full canopies.
|
AyePlus
Stony Danza



Registered: 12/18/14
Posts: 3,393
Loc: Fairfield, Connecticut
|
|
How many flushes and how much spawn, 1lb dry isnt impossible but its definitely not numbers you can casually throw out there without any pics to back it up, lets see some proof homie!
Gypsum isnt gonna increase your yields by 20% I can guarantee that. And if youre really Hitting those numbers dont change a thing.
-------------------- Learn about breeding
  C10βs agar guide Good surface conditions = Good pinsets Read more, post less. π
π° πΌ π΄ π
π΄ π° πΌ π
π΄ π° πΌ π² π» πΈ π½ πΆ π
π
π° πΏ
|
feldman114
Stragler


Registered: 09/06/19
Posts: 3,365
Loc: Bravos
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: cronicr]
#26346834 - 11/26/19 01:50 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
cronicr said:
Quote:
feldman114 said: Who says gypsum increases yield by 20%? Seems like a pretty wild claim...
I do straight coir, get about 30-35g dry per quart of spawn. How much spawn do you use per tub? How much coir/gypsum? How thick is your sub?
An lb dry from one tub sounds crey. Awesome job.
Been an industry standard number for gourmets for years 
I donβt get it. Why isnβt adding gypsum standard practice than? Obv, I believe you, just stunned. I have a lot to learn I guess...
|
shorn253
Stranger
Registered: 04/24/18
Posts: 34
Last seen: 2 years, 6 months
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: feldman114]
#26346842 - 11/26/19 01:54 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
|
StygianKnight
A Mushroom

Registered: 03/12/12
Posts: 2,717
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: shorn253]
#26346845 - 11/26/19 01:56 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Of note, gypsum is not a PH buffer, at least not at the PHs we experience. People confuse it with lime, which is a PH buffer and the two are often added together in gardening.
|
feldman114
Stragler


Registered: 09/06/19
Posts: 3,365
Loc: Bravos
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: shorn253]
#26346854 - 11/26/19 02:02 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
shorn253 said: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25801786
I'll take the skepticism as a compliment
Well you didnβt mention the poop in your sub. Still pretty damn impressive yield! Gotta step my substrate game up
|
shorn253
Stranger
Registered: 04/24/18
Posts: 34
Last seen: 2 years, 6 months
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: feldman114]
#26346889 - 11/26/19 02:20 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
"Well you didn't mention the poop in your sub"...
Wow really dude? Can't just give credit, gotta make some excuse. I actually didn't mention any of the ingredients in my sub so your comment makes no sense. Did you think my sub was straight Gypsum? Lol. You simply assumed that my substrate was one ingredient for no reason at all. I don't get it. Anyway, thanks for the indirect props
Ps - I get the exact same weight without horse poop
Edited by shorn253 (11/26/19 02:22 PM)
|
feldman114
Stragler


Registered: 09/06/19
Posts: 3,365
Loc: Bravos
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: shorn253]
#26346903 - 11/26/19 02:32 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
shorn253 said: "Well you didn't mention the poop in your sub"...
Wow really dude? Can't just give credit, gotta make some excuse. I actually didn't mention any of the ingredients in my sub so your comment makes no sense. Did you think my sub was straight Gypsum? Lol. You simply assumed that my substrate was one ingredient for no reason at all. I don't get it. Anyway, thanks for the indirect props
Ps - I get the exact same weight without horse poop
I did give credit ya sour-patch kid...twice. And I never said your sub is 1 ingredient. Poo yields more than coir. Otherwise, why use it at all? You just like to complicate your grow op?
Jesus...this is what happens when you try to be nice around here nowadays?
|
bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: feldman114]
#26346933 - 11/26/19 02:53 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
While some gourmet farms probably do see a yield increase from gypsum remember they use spawn ratios 1:10 or lower. Considerably less spawn to substrate than we use. Grain has these minerals too we use far more grain and probably don't need gypsum as a supplement. Try it for yourself and see though. I would find 20% hard to believe even for a gourmet farm tho.
|
feldman114
Stragler


Registered: 09/06/19
Posts: 3,365
Loc: Bravos
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: bodhisatta]
#26346947 - 11/26/19 02:58 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
bodhisatta said: While some gourmet farms probably do see a yield increase from gypsum remember they use spawn ratios 1:10 or lower. Considerably less spawn to substrate than we use. Grain has these minerals too we use far more grain and probably don't need gypsum as a supplement. Try it for yourself and see though. I would find 20% hard to believe even for a gourmet farm tho.
Pff hahaha I have the worst luck. Literally pressed βorderβ on Amazon (5lb gypsum) then came back to this page.
|
StygianKnight
A Mushroom

Registered: 03/12/12
Posts: 2,717
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: feldman114]
#26346985 - 11/26/19 03:29 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Itβs not harmful and has been a common ingredient in the past. Once I get a few nice clones going I plan to use my current amount of gypsum to make some gypsum free/lite/heavy tubs to compare in a few different ways.
|
feldman114
Stragler


Registered: 09/06/19
Posts: 3,365
Loc: Bravos
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: StygianKnight]
#26347002 - 11/26/19 03:39 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
StygianKnight said: Itβs not harmful and has been a common ingredient in the past. Once I get a few nice clones going I plan to use my current amount of gypsum to make some gypsum free/lite/heavy tubs to compare in a few different ways.
Right but βnot harmfulβ and βadds 20% to yieldβ are very very different theories.
Post a link here when you get started on that comparison. I got 8 tubs and 2 shoeboxes of WBS & coir colonizing. Iβm gonna record the results and then do the same tubs, same ratios, but with gypsum. Iβll report back as well.
|
AyePlus
Stony Danza



Registered: 12/18/14
Posts: 3,393
Loc: Fairfield, Connecticut
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: StygianKnight]
#26347007 - 11/26/19 03:42 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Ok 15.3 from 7 qts is impressive af, and your average on those totes in very good ~ 13.75 is a great average, but to say you regularly get a lb per tub is an exaggeration. Iβm sure you can understand the skepticism when you say it offhand like that and then ask a question about gypsum, which is rarely used by any of the TCβs and largely considered unnecessary.
Hope you cloned from that tub, you hit the MS lottery.
Like Bod said with high spawn rates adding any supplements are generally a waste, and with your manure mix Iβd say even more so.
Keep killin it homie, try some side by sides but I doubt youβll notice much difference if any. .
@feldman if you have a clone or isolate that test means something, but ideally itβd be run concurrently instead of consecutively
-------------------- Learn about breeding
  C10βs agar guide Good surface conditions = Good pinsets Read more, post less. π
π° πΌ π΄ π
π΄ π° πΌ π
π΄ π° πΌ π² π» πΈ π½ πΆ π
π
π° πΏ
|
feldman114
Stragler


Registered: 09/06/19
Posts: 3,365
Loc: Bravos
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: AyePlus]
#26347074 - 11/26/19 04:18 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Even with MS, my yields never vary THAT much. Not by 20%. But yeah these are MS. I guess I can do 4 & 4 side-by-side on the next go-around. Iβm one transfer away from confirming I have a monoculture, so Iβll have enough isolate spawn in like mid-December. ...Gotta pin a note to my fridge or something lol doubt this thread will stay active for a month.
|
bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: feldman114]
#26347090 - 11/26/19 04:30 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Before anyone does a side by side that will be taken seriously you should establish the fact you can achieve not only reliable results but predictable results too. Once you're that dialed in will you actually potentially be able to measure or notice a difference anyway
|
shorn253
Stranger
Registered: 04/24/18
Posts: 34
Last seen: 2 years, 6 months
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: bodhisatta]
#26347180 - 11/26/19 05:11 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
2 things - that exact post/harvest yielded an average of 16.8 oz per tub after 2 more flushes. The post was made out of excitement upon seeing the first flushes but those subs pushed out more fruit afterwards and I got nearly 17 oz per tub.. I could go back and edit the post but I really don't care at this point. Some subs put up to 7 flushes and I've had 18 oz from one tub since that post.
Also not sure why we're assuming this is my only grow since that post? I've tweaked a couple things and regularly get alittle over a lb per tub now with all flushes. So no I did not exaggerate, if anything I understated. Finding it hilarious how people still don't believe me.
|
cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
Loc: Van Isle
Last seen: 2 years, 8 days
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: bodhisatta]
#26347211 - 11/26/19 05:33 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
bodhisatta said: While some gourmet farms probably do see a yield increase from gypsum remember they use spawn ratios 1:10 or lower. Considerably less spawn to substrate than we use. Grain has these minerals too we use far more grain and probably don't need gypsum as a supplement. Try it for yourself and see though. I would find 20% hard to believe even for a gourmet farm tho.
Exactly our spawn rates make additives pretty useless and I believe it's more of an up to 20%. They mostly talk about thicker meatier fruits with gypsum but with cubes I've never noticed and diff but I like it in my grains and casing layers
--------------------
  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
|
AyePlus
Stony Danza



Registered: 12/18/14
Posts: 3,393
Loc: Fairfield, Connecticut
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: cronicr]
#26347276 - 11/26/19 06:11 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Never said I didnt believe, just that your numbers are far north of average, and claims like that need to be backed up. I didnt assume anything just made statements based on the data available. Most people only go 2-3 flushes before tossing subs so why would I expect any different from you?
Thats why I asked how much spawn and how many flushes. My tubs are 45 wt and I use 4 qts spawn to 6 qts sub, I also only go for 2 flushes, so I never get close to those numbers per tote, but per qt of spawn my overall yield is similar. Sure I could milk another flush or two but Iβd rather toss and start a new one
Like I said, hope you got a clone so you can keep repeating that success. Its not the average result.
Regardless of all that.., gypsum aint gonna give you a 20% increase in yield and I stand by that 100%
-------------------- Learn about breeding
  C10βs agar guide Good surface conditions = Good pinsets Read more, post less. π
π° πΌ π΄ π
π΄ π° πΌ π
π΄ π° πΌ π² π» πΈ π½ πΆ π
π
π° πΏ
|
cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
Loc: Van Isle
Last seen: 2 years, 8 days
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: AyePlus]
#26347289 - 11/26/19 06:18 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
AyePlus said: Never said I didnt believe, just that your numbers are far north of average, and claims like that need to be backed up. I didnt assume anything just made statements based on the data available. Most people only go 2-3 flushes before tossing subs so why would I expect any different from you?
Thats why I asked how much spawn and how many flushes. My tubs are 45 wt and I use 4 qts spawn to 6 qts sub, I also only go for 2 flushes, so I never get close to those numbers per tote, but per qt of spawn my overall yield is similar. Sure I could milk another flush or two but Iβd rather toss and start a new one
Like I said, hope you got a clone so you can keep repeating that success. Its not the average result.
Regardless of all that.., gypsum aint gonna give you a 20% increase in yield and I stand by that 100%
My bad fam I didn't even read most replies I was at work but I was just stating where the 20% number stems from
--------------------
  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
|
YogiBear



Registered: 08/24/19
Posts: 845
|
Re: Gypsum vs no Gypsum for monotubs [Re: bodhisatta]
#26347294 - 11/26/19 06:20 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
shorn253 said: I've regularly been getting around one pound dry per 64 qt monotub, however the price of horticultural gypsum is rather steep. If I could pull similar weight and potency without using gypsum, I would prefer this. I've heard it's pretty important for calcium, sulfur and ph buffering and have heard claims that it increases yields by over twenty percent. My results have been great but i have yet to try a tub without gypsum and am hoping someone can chime in about how necessary it is.
Quote:
bodhisatta said: While some gourmet farms probably do see a yield increase from gypsum remember they use spawn ratios 1:10 or lower. Considerably less spawn to substrate than we use. Grain has these minerals too we use far more grain and probably don't need gypsum as a supplement. Try it for yourself and see though. I would find 20% hard to believe even for a gourmet farm tho.
I use 2% gypsum by weight of coco. See my signature but remember it doesnt really do much. I just had tones laying around so I am using it up then back to 100% coco.
|
|